Nuts to butts Boys'! Best bolt action ever
- Thread starter Climate17
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I don't know about best, but my dad has a Colt Sauer, which has to be the strangest bolt gun I've ever seen. The barrel is held loosely in the threads, and clamped in place by a cross bolt that goes sideways through the integrated recoil lug. Head space is set by a peelable laminated shim washer. The three rear locking lugs are retractable, and the bolt operation is smoother than any custom I've had the pleasure of seeing. Absolutely bizarre rifle.
Sniper Rifle Systems - AE, AW, AX, AX50 & AICS Sniper Rifles | Accuracy International
You get what you pay for.
You get what you pay for.
You can tell it's the best because of the brake it needs. Optics are so good you can see Pluto on an overcast night.
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That's because any one who has heard it knows why! All that manly shit goes right out the window at 10 below.
For my money it's the Abolt. Simple and strong. Great trigger too. I love a 3-12 with fine cross hairs.
I'd also put the m24 in there.
So i'm guessing you were watching gay porn and decided to finish of the bottle of strawberry hill and jump on the internet........
Really, Abolt and M24 best bolt actions ever? The Abolt is merely ok, its a good action design but factory configurations are limited and aftermarket parts are almost non exsistant.
The M24 is built on a weak action design compared to a lot of others. To begin the action is cut from a piece of barstock and then machined out, because of this it is prone to warpage. Then the bolt handle is soldered on which is known to fail, and the extractor design is one of the weakest on the market. The safety is a trigger only safety so if the sear failed the gun would fire. This doesn't seem too common but its certainly possible with a lot of use. The bolt release is also pretty wimpy. These can all be addressed and most remington 700 type custom actions do except for the safety which can be upgraded to a 3 position winchester style safety with PT&G parts. Aftermarket support for the Remington is like what there is for the AR15 but its still a mediocre action. The custom clones are great actions though and are in a different league.
Look at the AI actions. They all have flutes and are very slick so they won't freeze up. They don't call them 'Arctic Warfare' for nothing.
There are serviceable rifles and actions, there is good, there is great, and then there is the best. What you're willing to pay for and need is entirely dependent on you.
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Agreed but if you look at an abolt and the out of the box accuracy you cant deny how good they are. custom rifle accuracy for 600.00 bucks give me a brake thats awesome! you know why the model 700 has so many after market parts 1. popularity 2. need . a standard model 700 needs help period but i think you covered that pretty well.
spindrift338 said Finnish Mosin with iron sights. Simo Hayha was the man.
I would have to agree. I'm asking about usage and employment. make a case for a rifle that has been used well not it's short comings compared to its modern peers.
Another one of those "best rifle" threads but "ohh I meant best for the money" type deals. There are plenty of rifles that will shoot great, however if you're telling me that an Abolt gets 1/4-1/2 MOA performance I've gotta say you're full of shit. I'm sure they shoot more than acceptable (they should for $800+) but "custom rifle accuracy" give me a damn break. A Remington or Savage has the same chance of being a shooter as a Abolt. If any of them shot as good as a custom rifle people wouldn't have customs built, or buy premium rifles. They'd drop them in a better stock or chassis and rock. You don't see any of the top shooters doing this, and for good reason.
Mosins are pieces of crap, there's a reason they're $100. The Finnish ones aren't a big improvement. They're clanky, the trigger sucks, the bolt lift sucks, the stock sucks, and they are inaccurate as hell. They may be tough and that's certainly a major aspect of a rifle and I'm sure in their day they were hi tech but these days a bottom of the line remington 770, savage axis, or ruger American will out perform it.
Just as a reference, AI has been at the top of the food chain for over 20 years. Sure they haven't been around as long as even the 700 but they have been at the top a long time and just won the PSR contract with the same basic platform with some improvements.
When you pay $3k + for a rifle wether its a custom made from quality parts and by a good smith or a premium battle rifle like the AI, TRG, Ballista, MSR, DTA, MRAD, and others, you're paying for more than a good group. You're paying for a rifle with a lot of R&D, quality, and features.
There are good rifles out there for $600 but they're aren't "the best bolt action ever". A rifles short comings are its problems which are preventing it from being a great rifle.
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K how come nobody has mentioned the Mauser 98? Until the 700 came out it was the go to action. Someone mentioned Mosin and I gotta say you are F#$%%^g High! Mauser was a better design than the Mosin, and way ahead of their time to the point that Springfield copied it, Winchester and Ruger tried to make their own improvements but kept the same overall ideas, and even certain key design features were copied on just about everything(including the 700) until designs like the AI/TRG/insert ultra high end brand here. Let's see how many actions on the market use the same basic 2-locking lug roughly 90 degree turn-bolt design? You can all thank Paul Mauser. But best ever? AI pretty much did it with the AW and has only made minor tweaks over the years to keep on top as "King Dick" in the bolt action world.
I'm not justifying anything. And I don't know that lobbying got them the contract. I'm pointing out that he was spreading false information that Accuracy International was awarded the contract.
Follow the conversation.
God, I love that video. Just had to say. I like "seeing your posts", for it!Before I go any further, and to be a "gentleman", is that your wife? Hats off to ya, if she is. On the "subject" TRG 42, in 300 Win Mag. Cause it "hits".
You can tell it's the best because of the brake it needs. Optics are so good you can see Pluto on an overcast night.
If that comes in 12ga., it's a buy! Only thing it needs now is a RAIL and that chainsaw grip from the other shotgun.
I don't know about best, but when I got my check and I was looking for an accurate long range rifle that wouldn't cost me $10,000+ up front, I put the HTI on order in .50 and .375CT (chassis in two payments, barrel paid for, suppressor started interim --kinda like layaway). I'd have gotten .408, but .375 will use Sierras for fodder. Anyway, the .408 Cheytac Intervention holds the record on the tightest group at distance, 16" at 1 mile. That's a point target. I'd say that is the true measure of a bolt gun. I decided to go with the Nightforce Beast because I don't think I can jam an SN-9 on it, though 40x in this case might be useful. Beast also has 120 mils of elevation, until I find better I'm going with it. I like USO scopes, love the TPAL, user friendly, they just do it for me and always have, but I have to go with Nightforce on this elevation.
I'm hoping this HTI in .375 will be close to the .408 performance with the slick machined bullets. I thought they made the .375 to outdo the .408? Anyway, it'll be MY premier bolt gun.
TRG42, AI rifles, particularly their .338's (longest kills). I looked into those. The Barrett's didn't impress me, nor did the lower end models. I thought of building a custom action, which may have been best.
Following has to do with semi's, but they are getting more relevant in the sniper sphere. Plus it sheds light on some of the above.
As for .mil shit, there are a lot of parameters that go into selection of a weapon, politics being just part of it, price another. If they chose the best, I wouldn't have trained SDM's with 4MOA spec. Colt M4's to take out 600m point targets. They'd have gotten us M110's instead, SR25 ECC's with 1-8x USO DFP scopes even better. And regular infantrymen would have gotten Noveske or similar, NOT Colt.
Ever seen the receipt for a .mil rifle? NIB Colt M4 with mag, sling and BFD: just over $600 in '01 or '02. I got to open my box and put my rack number on my own weapon and I kept that weapon like it was my own --never let me down, I only had one M4 issued the whole time I was in, even as a SAW gunner I kept that M4. This was w/o the rail, which they paid about $100 for and doesn't FF. Military can do better. Instead, they just "make do". Look at the XM107? It came with a Leupy scope NOT suitable for that weapon at ALL. Accuracy was shit for what they billed it to do. And when SDM's did complain in force, everyone got different shit: some got the M110's, many got modified M14's (which, to our chagrin, we couldn't get signed out! In storage since 50-60's, they had demil orders that had to be rescinded first!) Lots of soldiers bought their own uppers for SDM uppers, and some their own optics as well.
To show how bad it is at the unit level, I was sent to go down the street to buy a bunch of Olympic Arms shit to test out. It was thought they had some credibility due to the fact they tested our SOPMOD kit independently (which now makes me wonder about that). Total fucking fail from asshole to appetite, I won't go into it, but Oly wasn't interested in making weapons (or uppers, that was all we needed) that were up to par, and here I mean basic milspec at minimum, prefer above. But that was how desperate we were then.
I'd have to DOWNGRADE in order to get full army milspec on my .mil type weapons. Shit, even my NOD's, mount and helmet are better than what they issue. Military bolt guns have things to bring to the table, but "best" isn't one of them. Best all around perhaps, given the mission. Army just isn't interested in sub-MOA groups and tight groups past 1000m using the LR118, which is what they use.
Ergo, chances are the military sniper rifle isn't the best one available. It is the most suitable one available that can be made in numbers. Exception may be the AI rifles some Commonwealth countries use.
I'm hoping this HTI in .375 will be close to the .408 performance with the slick machined bullets. I thought they made the .375 to outdo the .408? Anyway, it'll be MY premier bolt gun.
TRG42, AI rifles, particularly their .338's (longest kills). I looked into those. The Barrett's didn't impress me, nor did the lower end models. I thought of building a custom action, which may have been best.
Following has to do with semi's, but they are getting more relevant in the sniper sphere. Plus it sheds light on some of the above.
As for .mil shit, there are a lot of parameters that go into selection of a weapon, politics being just part of it, price another. If they chose the best, I wouldn't have trained SDM's with 4MOA spec. Colt M4's to take out 600m point targets. They'd have gotten us M110's instead, SR25 ECC's with 1-8x USO DFP scopes even better. And regular infantrymen would have gotten Noveske or similar, NOT Colt.
Ever seen the receipt for a .mil rifle? NIB Colt M4 with mag, sling and BFD: just over $600 in '01 or '02. I got to open my box and put my rack number on my own weapon and I kept that weapon like it was my own --never let me down, I only had one M4 issued the whole time I was in, even as a SAW gunner I kept that M4. This was w/o the rail, which they paid about $100 for and doesn't FF. Military can do better. Instead, they just "make do". Look at the XM107? It came with a Leupy scope NOT suitable for that weapon at ALL. Accuracy was shit for what they billed it to do. And when SDM's did complain in force, everyone got different shit: some got the M110's, many got modified M14's (which, to our chagrin, we couldn't get signed out! In storage since 50-60's, they had demil orders that had to be rescinded first!) Lots of soldiers bought their own uppers for SDM uppers, and some their own optics as well.
To show how bad it is at the unit level, I was sent to go down the street to buy a bunch of Olympic Arms shit to test out. It was thought they had some credibility due to the fact they tested our SOPMOD kit independently (which now makes me wonder about that). Total fucking fail from asshole to appetite, I won't go into it, but Oly wasn't interested in making weapons (or uppers, that was all we needed) that were up to par, and here I mean basic milspec at minimum, prefer above. But that was how desperate we were then.
I'd have to DOWNGRADE in order to get full army milspec on my .mil type weapons. Shit, even my NOD's, mount and helmet are better than what they issue. Military bolt guns have things to bring to the table, but "best" isn't one of them. Best all around perhaps, given the mission. Army just isn't interested in sub-MOA groups and tight groups past 1000m using the LR118, which is what they use.
Ergo, chances are the military sniper rifle isn't the best one available. It is the most suitable one available that can be made in numbers. Exception may be the AI rifles some Commonwealth countries use.
Colt makes a "bolt rifle" Just came out. Some kind of "joint venture", with some body.Yeah, Cooper. Thanks. OK, It's not a colt....?
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It looks like just another R700 clone to me. Uses the same style trigger, maybe an upgraded extractor and side bolt release. I'd personally pass when there are other R700 clones on the market that have proven themselves. It would appear the ergonomics probably leave a bit to be desired too.
My AIAW with a AI 20 MOA mount, Atlas bipod and a Nightforce NXS 8-32X56 scope withe the MOAR reticle. My TRG 22 with the same optics a close 2nd.
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1903 Springfield. Sure, partly stolen from the German Mauser, but better than it too.
The thread title is messed up. In ANY context....
The thread title is messed up. In ANY context....
"Nuts to butts" is now incorporated into my personal vernacular. Guys at work are going to get sick of it real soon.
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