Night Vision IR Weaponlight Options

TheGerman

TheGerman

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Minuteman
    • Jan 25, 2010
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    the Westside
    #1
    I have a Surefire M951 with the IR filter but wanted to see what else was out there. While the light works, its something I wouldn't keep on my rifle unless I wanted to use it in conjunction with NV as an illuminator because its HUGE and hangs off the side of the rifle; there has to be something better than this with a slimmer profile that is a decent light with IR filter capability.

    What's out there?
     
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    #4
    TheGerman said:
    I have a Surefire M951 with the IR filter but wanted to see what else was out there. While the light works, its something I wouldn't keep on my rifle unless I wanted to use it in conjunction with NV as an illuminator because its HUGE and hangs off the side of the rifle; there has to be something better than this with a slimmer profile that is a decent light with IR filter capability.

    What's out there?
    Click to expand...

    One this to keep in mind about IR filters over Incandescents, they loose over (approx) 80% of the light itself making this the most inefficient way to use the light. Great for indoors and very short distances on the 951's you're talking about. Dedicated IR lights are just that and are the most efficient way to have an IR light.

    I would also look at possibly the Surefire smaller 620V here Surefire M620V ? Tactical Night Vision Company or the 952V as well. Surefire M952V ? Tactical Night Vision Company With that said, these IR lights are in the neighborhood of 200 yards and in effective range. If you need something longer range a dedicated IR light such as the Torch Pro or the LDI SPIR (BOTH legally eye safe and NOT a laser) may be an option for longer ranges out to 800 yards +.
     
    #6
    The Luna is a good option. Small, good distance and not as expensive as some of the others. Vic is also correct. It is all a trade off. Expense and size. I have a good SF and aLuna and am pleased with both. With all the good night optics out there you have got to have IR light avaulable now and then.

    A lot depends on what your need is. Mine is from about 250 and in for shooting.
     
    #7
    shooter6.5 said:
    The Luna is a good option. Small, good distance and not as expensive as some of the others. Vic is also correct. It is all a trade off. Expense and size. I have a good SF and aLuna and am pleased with both. With all the good night optics out there you have got to have IR light avaulable now and then.

    A lot depends on what your need is. Mine is from about 250 and in for shooting.
    Click to expand...

    Pretty much the same. 80% of the time this will be on a 16 inch carbine the rest it would be on my Mk12 Mod1; if I was looking at something for my M24A2 I'd look at the LDI SPIR. I have the M951 and as a simple light it has worked well at night and has stood up to some abuse, I just want to see what else is out there as the size of it really puts me off making it really a burden to lug around.

    What is the output difference between the 951 with the IR filter attached and 952V IR illuminator? I only see the 951 listed as 65 with the standard bulb and 120 with the upgraded bulb but as Vic said roughly 80% gets caught in the filter. So would this then be 120 lumens for the 952v versus 13 (20% of 65) and 24 (20% of 120)? Seems quite low but I'm sure there is some weird conversion for lumens to M/W.

    ETA - Are the M952V and the M620 the same light performance wise? They are both listed at 150 lumens/120MW for 1.8 and 8 hours. Are they just a different size where the 620 is more compact but have the same performance?
     
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    #9
    TheGerman said:
    Pretty much the same. 80% of the time this will be on a 16 inch carbine the rest it would be on my Mk12 Mod1; if I was looking at something for my M24A2 I'd look at the LDI SPIR. I have the M951 and as a simple light it has worked well at night and has stood up to some abuse, I just want to see what else is out there as the size of it really puts me off making it really a burden to lug around.

    What is the output difference between the 951 with the IR filter attached and 952V IR illuminator? I only see the 951 listed as 65 with the standard bulb and 120 with the upgraded bulb but as Vic said roughly 80% gets caught in the filter. So would this then be 120 lumens for the 952v versus 13 (20% of 65) and 24 (20% of 120)? Seems quite low but I'm sure there is some weird conversion for lumens to M/W.

    ETA - Are the M952V and the M620 the same light performance wise? They are both listed at 150 lumens/120MW for 1.8 and 8 hours. Are they just a different size where the 620 is more compact but have the same performance?
    Click to expand...

    The difference between a filtered light and a pure LED will be noticeable. I don't have exact lumen comparison scientific data, but there is a definite difference. I would certainly look into the V series SF lights. As for weight and size, the M620V is a bit smaller than the M952V out of the box. It is based on the Scout series lights. But, it does come with that giant SF throw lever mount which is almost bigger than the light itself. If you are looking for the most compact option, might I suggest a little DIY Surefire action:

    Start out with a Surefire M600C Light: Surefire M600C Scout Light ? Tactical Night Vision Company

    Remove the head

    Replace the head with the Surefire KM2 Conversion Head Surefire KM2 Conversion Head ? Tactical Night Vision Company
     
    #15
    clasky said:
    The difference between a filtered light and a pure LED will be noticeable. I don't have exact lumen comparison scientific data, but there is a definite difference. I would certainly look into the V series SF lights. As for weight and size, the M620V is a bit smaller than the M952V out of the box. It is based on the Scout series lights. But, it does come with that giant SF throw lever mount which is almost bigger than the light itself. If you are looking for the most compact option, might I suggest a little DIY Surefire action:

    Start out with a Surefire M600C Light: Surefire M600C Scout Light ? Tactical Night Vision Company

    Remove the head

    Replace the head with the Surefire KM2 Conversion Head Surefire KM2 Conversion Head ? Tactical Night Vision Company
    Click to expand...

    I did this with a grip light. I like it a LOT.

    I think I can put the IR filter to rest though. I hated 'em ten years ago and have used 'em since as just covers for the white lens on those lights. So I just went into a room, pitch black, not any light, NODs don't work. I used the filter and light, remembered why it sucked, then tried the IR illuminator built into the NODs. That worked a LOT better. Basically that 65 lumen weapon light only lights up a tiny area. The built in IR lights up the whole room, and it does a better job of it, brighter overall.
     
    #16
    I have a Surefire M720V and it is a little bigger than most but it makes up for it in performance. It's switchable from white light to IR and had a lock out so you cant have an ND. The IR has hi-med-lo settings so you can use it up close without blooming and then switch it to hi and pick out a rabbit at 200+ yards. The white light has the same hi-med-lo plus a strobe. You cant be a super cool bad ass operator without a strobe right?

    The M720V is expensive but what isn't these days that's high quality?
     
    #19
    I am running the surefire m620v and m720v. I also run a handheld V2 vampire light, a helmet mounted M1ir and have retrofitted several older lights with vampire heads.

    With the twist of the wrist, the light switches from white to IR light.

    The illumination is adequate to 100 yards.

    The 720v has a high and low setting.

    I recommend a dedicated ir LED light instead of a filtered incandescent.

    I have also been running a prototype LDI SPIR and D2. I can say the SPIR and the D2s illuminations are quite nice, but hey are Ir only. I find myself using the d2 or SPIR for longer meg illumination I.e. 100+ yards.
     
    #20
    Ended up with a Class 3 IR laser/illuminator. Works wonders :)

    I'm still curious about the 620v, but with the laser/illuminator I don't see much of a use for it besides providing white non-IR light.
     
    #24
    TheGerman said:
    Ended up with a Class 3 IR laser/illuminator. Works wonders :)

    I'm still curious about the 620v, but with the laser/illuminator I don't see much of a use for it besides providing white non-IR light.
    Click to expand...

    What did you end up with?

    When I run an A3 or a peq2a, I also run my vampire. The laser illuminator is focused at the expected engagement range and the vampire light is used for area illumination.
     
    #27
    I put in an order for the surefire mini scout m300v. 120 lumens visible and 100mw IR. It's not out yet, but hopefully as soon as they're released I'll have one to put on my rifle.

    Anybody 'in-the-biz' have any experience or info on it?
     
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    #28
    Wormydog1724 said:
    I put in an order for the surefire mini scout m300v. 120 lumens visible and 100mw IR. It's not out yet, but hopefully as soon as they're released I'll have one to put on my rifle.

    Anybody 'in-the-biz' have any experience or info on it?
    Click to expand...

    You bet, I've had one on my duty SBR. I've been working with Surefire on some feedback right after Shot Show. It's definitely lower power than the full size Vampire but the size is what most have been looking for especially when running SBR's and for folks wanting a lighter weight system. Getting approx. 75 yards with the Vis. beam and approx. 150 for the IR (true effective range). This one will fit the bill very nicely.

    The manipulation of the head to turn Vis to IR on this early production model is a bit tough to turn with gloves due to it's size. The production model we're told will have knurled edges or other grabby type edges to assist with this.

    Hope this helps.

    Vic
     
    #29
    I appreciate the info Vic.

    I have a PVS-14 but I'm new to the world of night vision, so bear with me please.

    When you say 75 yards with the visible beam, you're talking without the use of NV correct?
    Also I have a M300b on my SBR now, will it hurt my PVS-14 to use it as an illuminator for targets 100+ yards? I obviously don't want to use that light indoors as I imagine the bounce back off of walls surely isn't good for my PVS-14.

    Also, a little off topic but rather ask now while I'm typing then go to DBAL i2 thread. I have the newest model i2 with the hi and lo. When inside my shop and especially inside my house, the lo setting still seems too bright. Will that damage my PVS-14 if reflecting off a close object?

    Thanks again.
     
    #30
    Wormydog1724 said:
    I appreciate the info Vic.

    I have a PVS-14 but I'm new to the world of night vision, so bear with me please.

    When you say 75 yards with the visible beam, you're talking without the use of NV correct?
    Also I have a M300b on my SBR now, will it hurt my PVS-14 to use it as an illuminator for targets 100+ yards? I obviously don't want to use that light indoors as I imagine the bounce back off of walls surely isn't good for my PVS-14.

    Also, a little off topic but rather ask now while I'm typing then go to DBAL i2 thread. I have the newest model i2 with the hi and lo. When inside my shop and especially inside my house, the lo setting still seems too bright. Will that damage my PVS-14 if reflecting off a close object?

    Thanks again.
    Click to expand...

    Hi, no issue with the newbie dept., we try to educate where we can first. : -)

    Should have been more descriptive, but yes I am able to get a 75 yard throw on the visible light. Using the IR illuminator up close will not damage a tube in that respect with modern autogated power supplies. Training your PVS-14 on an bright lit object for an extended period of time could get a possible burn mark on your tube. But your talking very high light and keeping your PVS-14 trained on the object for several minutes.

    As for the I2, you should be fine, just remember not to keep your 14 trained on a close in object if you see this type of blooming effect. Once you get outside and your 25 yards away +, you will see no issue like this.

    Vic
     
    #31
    Awesome. That's pretty much what I gathered from searching and reading other threads, but thought I might as well ask while I have the attention of "the man". Lol.

    Thank you.
     
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