If you wanted a complete AR?

EchosGalahad · Jun 2, 2024

Say you had $3500 and wanted to get a complete AR with decent lpvo or eotech and magnifier combo.

12.5 barrel midlength gas system. 5.56

Ideally something that is currently available, high fit and finish/build quality.

I've been out of the AR world for too long.

Appreciate any and all suggestions.

Rio Precision Gunworks · Jun 2, 2024

If running a silencer, the 11.5 mid length gas Irregular Defense upper from Noveske is nice. If you run it without a silencer, you might have issues running .223 ammo. .556 should run though. With silencer, everything runs.

You’re always going to pay a little more for the noveske name, but I like them. You can get a chainsaw model for $1600 ish. The irregular defense upper gets price gouged a bit. But you’d still be under your budget with optics if you buy the upper and a “normal” noveske lower.

I’ll get an updated pic as the lower has been painted. But this rifle (minus the laser and silencer) would come in under your budget with an eotech and magnifier.

You’re going to get a lot of “build it yourself for much cheaper” responses. And they are valid. This is just the way I went for this particular rig.

ut755ln · Jun 2, 2024

Rio Precision Gunworks said:
If running a silencer, the 11.5 mid length gas Irregular Defense upper from Noveske is nice. If you run it without a silencer, you might have issues running .223 ammo. .556 should run though. With silencer, everything runs.

You’re always going to pay a little more for the noveske name, but I like them. You can get a chainsaw model for $1600 ish. The irregular defense upper gets price gouged a bit. But you’d still be under your budget with optics if you buy the upper and a “normal” noveske lower.

I’ll get an updated pic as the lower has been painted. But this rifle (minus the laser and silencer) would come in under your budget with an eotech and magnifier.

You’re going to get a lot of “build it yourself for much cheaper” responses. And they are valid. This is just the way I went for this particular rig.

View attachment 8430811

All I saw was the Raid X, nice flex

ut755ln · Jun 2, 2024

EchosGalahad said:
Say you had $3500 and wanted to get a complete AR with decent lpvo or eotech and magnifier combo.

12.5 barrel midlength gas system. 5.56

Ideally something that is currently available, high fit and finish/build quality.

I've been out of the AR world for too long.

Appreciate any and all suggestions.

9 Holes is about to release a review of the Geissele 14.5" URG-I Clone. It is extremely impressive and can be purchased from some of the hide vendors including Europtics.

I would go, LMT MARS L lower $800.
Geissele 14.5 URGI upper $1300.
Primary Arms PLX-C Variant 1-8 LPVO $1400

Aftermath · Jun 2, 2024

Radian builders kit

WindstormSCR · Jun 3, 2024

so you mean for $3300 after you pay uncle sam for the privilege of having a stock.....

or do a 14.5" as suggested above and P&W.

personally I'd lean towards the 14.5" upper because it will perform better with 77gr loads if you ever shoot it for accuracy, just make sure your barrel is 1:8 or 1:7 twist.

@ut755ln about hit the nail on the head though, the PA PLx line is great value for $ and I've rarely heard complaints about Geissele uppers.

mars-L is a little spendy for the lower, if you don't care about ambi controls you can get one of the Aero lowers which I have always found excellent to work with.

BCP · Jun 3, 2024

Probably the geissele 14.5. They retail for 1500-1700. Not too familiar with 12.5 complete offerings sorry, seems like everything is 10-11".

91Eunozs · Jun 3, 2024

$1K minimum for a decent can, plus $200 for a tax stamp…and time. Several flavors out there; leaving $2500 for gun, accessories, and an initial load out.

Maybe get a used LPVO and save a few bucks, or a new Vortex (decent for the $), but personally, my rule of thumb for rifle optics is to spend at least as much on the optic as you do on the rifle. For ~$1,250 I’d look at demo Night Force NXS or maybe a VCOG or Leupy Patrol optic. An Eotech + magnifier + mounts will run you ~ the same if you shop wisely or get lucky and can find something on sale. There are some damn good vendors here on the hide who can get you going in the right direction there.

Any of the higher end scopes are gonna blow your budget bigly.

With the remaining $1,250, I’d recommend buying a gently used higher-end rifle, or try to get the best components on sale over time and build your own.

Personally, I’d start with a decent receiver set and a good trigger (I’m partial to Trigger Tech single stage AR triggers right now, but Geissele’s go on sale pretty regularly), and then focus on acquiring the best barrel you can find…maybe get lucky with a sale. I’d budget at least $400 for a barrel.

I really like 12.5” for an AR barrel, but as someone else pointed out above, you‘ll need to run it as a pistol unless/until you SBR the lower receiver. Pretty easy process, but it takes time…and another $200 of course.

If you don't want/need to include a suppressor in your budget, it gets a lot easier, but I’d still roll my own. I like the Geissele URG upper and MARS lower combo mentioned above, but for $2K(ish) you can get a decent Noveske, etc. pretty much ready to go. I’d also check out Aero Precision’s new Pro receiver set/components; we’ve had several Aero uppers and lowers in use out at the ranch over the years with no issues whatsoever.

Good luck!

Ape_Factory · Jun 3, 2024

If you want a piston setup, POF sells a 12.5” upper that’s pretty bad ass. I own one and it’s like hitting the easy button. Extremely robust. Went 2000+ rounds continuous auto fire and 10,000 rounds in semi auto in two different meltdown tests. After it cooled iff in the full auto test, it was still 100% functional.

RUTGERS95 · Jun 3, 2024

ut755ln said:
9 Holes is about to release a review of the Geissele 14.5" URG-I Clone. It is extremely impressive and can be purchased from some of the hide vendors including Europtics.

I would go, LMT MARS L lower $800.
Geissele 14.5 URGI upper $1300.
Primary Arms PLX-C Variant 1-8 LPVO $1400

was not impressed with the accuracy, even from rack ammo

that said, the reviews on the G barrels have not been stellar so would pass on that

who the fk buys a 1400 PA optic with razors and the like out there?

Ape_Factory · Jun 3, 2024

RUTGERS95 said:
who the fk buys a 2800 razors with PA PLxC's and the like out there?

FIFY. You obviously haven't used the new PLxC's.

ut755ln · Jun 3, 2024

RUTGERS95 said:
was not impressed with the accuracy, even from rack ammo

that said, the reviews on the G barrels have not been stellar so would pass on that

who the fk buys a 1400 PA optic with razors and the like out there?

I think your information is dated. IMO Geissele has really stepped up their overall quality. I think that you are really wrong about the PA PLX series. The 1-6 Vortex is bigger heavier and not as good in almost any comparable way to the 1-8 PLX. PA is releasing a new version any day with the Nova reticle. It is as bright or brighter then the Vortex, glass just as good, shorter, lighter and with 8x on the top end for the same price.

MO Fugga · Jun 3, 2024

Maxim PDX-SD. Two stamp. Still need to buy an optic.

the monk · Jun 4, 2024

EchosGalahad said:
Say you had $3500 and wanted to get a complete AR with decent lpvo or eotech and magnifier combo.

12.5 barrel midlength gas system. 5.56

Ideally something that is currently available, high fit and finish/build quality.

I've been out of the AR world for too long.

Appreciate any and all suggestions.

What is it for?

ut755ln · Jun 4, 2024

Ape_Factory said:
If you want a piston setup, POF sells a 12.5” upper that’s pretty bad ass. I own one and it’s like hitting the easy button. Extremely robust. Went 2000+ rounds continuous auto fire and 10,000 rounds in semi auto in two different meltdown tests. After it cooled iff in the full auto test, it was still 100% functional.View attachment 8431318

Your rifle looks great

EchosGalahad · Jun 4, 2024

the monk said:
What is it for?

People

in all seriousness get out of dodge kinda setup. Out to 300 yards, manueveable, fast.

farwest · Jun 5, 2024

I have great had great success with rock river arms. Excellent quality, fair price, guaranteed accuracy on many models. Great customer support.

MO Fugga · Jun 5, 2024

farwest said:
I have great had great success with rock river arms. Excellent quality, fair price, guaranteed accuracy on many models. Great customer support.

Their .458 Socom is excellent.

J-Ham · Jun 5, 2024

Ape_Factory said:
If you want a piston setup, POF sells a 12.5” upper that’s pretty bad ass. I own one and it’s like hitting the easy button. Extremely robust. Went 2000+ rounds continuous auto fire and 10,000 rounds in semi auto in two different meltdown tests. After it cooled iff in the full auto test, it was still 100% functional.View attachment 8431318

Can we talk about your scope caps for a second... Can I get that style for all my rifles? Haha

Honestly, I'd be pretty happy with an aluminum or plastic cap that simply screws into the end of the scope... Not sure what to do on the ocular end of the scope though.

the monk · Jun 6, 2024

EchosGalahad said:
People in all seriousness get out of dodge kinda setup. Out to 300 yards, manueveable, fast.

12.5 is a size that does not get a ton of love in full buildouts. Because of that, I would build my own. Gather all the parts, send them off to Steve at Citizen Arms, and have him build it for you—citizenarms.com. He made me a phenomenal sub-MOA Hodge build that I love. I can't say enough good things about Steve and Citizen Arms.

Barrel, for midlength, I would go with the Sionics 12.5 mid - https://sionicsweaponsystems.com/lawenforcement/sionics-12-5-barrel/
- For Carbine I would go with Criterion Core - https://bevanballisticsolutions.com/product/criterion-core-223-wylde-carbine-length-gas/
Rail can be whatever you prefer; I am a big fan of the URX 4, SOLGW rails, or Hodge rails.
BCG I would do the Sonics NP3
For the Lower I would go with a SOLGW Forward Controls Design AMBI Stripped Lower Receiver - https://www.interstateguns.com/solgw-fcd-ambi-billet-lower-rec-fcd-ambi-lr.html

Everything Else other than furniture I would leave to Steve

EASY BUTTON - Or pick up a Hodge 12.5 upper - https://www.bigtexordnance.com/product/hdsi-contract-overrun-12-5-mod-1-complete-upper/ (2 in stock time of writing)

EchosGalahad · Jun 6, 2024

Appreciate all the responses gentlemen.

FWoo45 · Jun 6, 2024

I don't put budgets on builds and I try to prescribe to the idea that I should be spending as much on an optic as the rest of the rifle. I like to roll my own and use Bartlein barrels in most and Geissele triggers in more. That said if I had roughly $1500 for a rifle after stamps and glass, BCM could be an easy button.

Kickin45 · Jun 6, 2024

KAC SR-15 and never look back

Ape_Factory · Jun 6, 2024

J-Ham said:
Can we talk about your scope caps for a second... Can I get that style for all my rifles? Haha

Honestly, I'd be pretty happy with an aluminum or plastic cap that simply screws into the end of the scope... Not sure what to do on the ocular end of the scope though.

www.onehundredconcepts.com. I have their rear cap now along with a light cap for the Cloud Defense Rein3 as well. Don't have any photos at the moment. They also make the silent QD strap connector at the front of the gun. Those are on back-order and I need two so please, none of you fuckers purchase any until I give the word. It's all 3D printed. On the cap, the way you install it, it's basically just flipped up and it sort of stops automatically due to the cord tension and has a built-in flash hider. It's pretty slick. Here are a few additional photos. I'll take a few other photos of the other caps tomorrow and post up. The rear cap keeps what's great about the PLxC, in that the tube disappears. I had the Vortex caps but the rear cap ruined that effect. It's a good system but not super cheap once all is said and done. "Accessorizing" can be a serious drain on the bank account if you own multiple rifles.

Other than the Magpul furniture, the only other mods worth mentioning are the Smoke Composites buffer tube, Velocity 4lb. single stage trigger and Unrivaled dead blow buffer which Husky turned me on to. She ain't light but it'll last if used hard. The only downside is you have to purchase the upper separately. Central Florida Gun & Tactical usually has them in stock. The POF Gen4 lower is one of the best ambidextrous lowers out there so you can buy either a fully-built lower (POF triggers are actually very good) or stripped and build it up with the components you want. The adjustable gas block has five settings including fully off, an option most don't have.

The housing for the Cloud Defense switch is M-Lock. I had to fudge it a bit to get it to work in that area of the POF rail. It's made by Driven Arms and there are several version available. Far lower profile than the stock Picatinny housing. Makes it much more ergonomic. With the way the POF rail has sort of a cutout side profile between the top pic and side m-lock, it gives it a valley to keep the switch out of the way but easily accessible. https://drivenarmsco.com/product/rein-switch-mlok-adapters-rsma/

More pics as promised.

Bluedog82 · Jun 15, 2024

PSA’s Sabre line is an excellent value. They don’t offer a 12.5 as far as I know, though. This particular rifle is a 14.5 with FN barrel and Geissele rail.

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