Rusting in Rimfire bores

Wodan · Jul 19, 2024

Reading postings that most don’t clean their Rimfire bores until 200-500 rounds
Looking at my hygrometer, it says 73 percent humidity, after rain it goes up to 80 plus percent.
Powder fouling is claimed to be hygroscopic.
Is it really a good idea to leave your Rimfire sitting fouled for weeks in a row in this sort of humid environment?
I just shot 75 rounds of SK long range ammo, through a clean bore. Clean/oil or leave it as is?
Please enlighten me, thank you for your input

JimTN · Jul 19, 2024

I'm in the camp of clean after every range trip, usually no oiled patch. I do inspect the bores 1-2x yr when I'm bored, think about it, but have never had a bore "rust up" with this process.

Dstoenner · Jul 19, 2024

If you have a chrome-moly steel barrel then what i do is go home and push 2 dry patches down the bore. Then i push a patch soaked with Kroil. Now you don’t have to worry and your next trip the barrel will still be seasoned.

Then when i think it is time i clean but I don’t worry in between. I live in NC and we have high humidity but I don’t think as high as you record

David

Fasteddie01 · Jul 19, 2024

I'm in the 'Clean Every Trip' club, using C4 then 90%+ Alcohol to remove any residual 'stuff', then a light oil unless I'm sure I'll be shooting in a day or two.

lariat · Jul 19, 2024

It’s an interesting question. Back in the day on Rinfirecentral the conventional wisdom was to clean it when accuracy dropped off and that the wax on the bullets prevented such. I personally haven’t seen any rusting older rifles. Newer ammo, I don’t know and haven’t checked. Probably should.

Shoots 700's · Jul 19, 2024

I always run a couple of patches with kroil and then a dry patch

epags · Jul 20, 2024

I keep my firearms in a safe that has a goldenrod (to reduce humidity) and none have ever rusted. Relative to my rimfire rifles, After each shoot I try, but not alway, to use Bore Tec Carbon Remover in the chamber to remove any starting carbon ring. Then pull a dampened (again with BT Carbon Remover) mop through the barrel to remove crud but not the wax buildup then followed with a couple dry patches to finish. Then back into the safe.

jbell · Jul 20, 2024

Chromoly rimfire bores can and will rust, I have seen it. I think it is going to happen as quickly as with centerfire as long as you are shooting waxed bullets fairly often (every few weeks). But it is best practice to clean and lightly oil any bore no matter of material (even stainless) and projectile.

MajorD · Jul 21, 2024

Religiously cleaning a rimfire bore is definitely counterproductive- after cleaning it will take 20 or in some cases more to settle down again. They are not as sensitive to rust as you think, but sure given enough humidity and neglect anythin* including stainless steel can rust. I have always been a traditional blue finish guy, and the only guns that ever rusted on me ( even when I lived in the northeast where it got rather humid) were my duck hunting shotguns,which pretty much lived dripping wet for days.

jbell · Jul 21, 2024

MajorD said:
Religiously cleaning a rimfire bore is definitely counterproductive- after cleaning it will take 20 or in some cases more to settle down again. They are not as sensitive to rust as you think, but sure given enough humidity and neglect anythin* including stainless steel can rust. I have always been a traditional blue finish guy, and the only guns that ever rusted on me ( even when I lived in the northeast where it got rather humid) were my duck hunting shotguns,which pretty much lived dripping wet for days.

If your barrel needs that many rounds to settle down there is something wrong with it. 3 to 5 rounds is it, same with switching ammo. There are a lot of myths out there about precision rimfire that have become “truths”.

Criver600 · Jul 21, 2024

Shot NRA Smallbore prone for years. Our mentor told us, "Don't need to clean unless your rifle gets wet" works for me. I have my first 22, Christmas present when I was 12, I'm 64. No rust, never been cleaned. Currently Running a RimX with 18,000+ rounds. It's been cleaned 3 times (it was soaked at a match once) borescope after each cleaning and I wondered why I bothered. (Lapua & SK ammo)
When I do clean: 3 wet patches Butches Bore Shine, brass brush 5 complete strokes from the breach, 3 wet patches, 2 dry borescope, looks like new. Good Shooting see you at the range.

Dstoenner · Jul 21, 2024

Criver600 said:
Shot NRA Smallbore prone for years. Our mentor told us, "Don't need to clean unless your rifle gets wet" works for me. I have my first 22, Christmas present when I was 12, I'm 64. No rust, never been cleaned. Currently Running a RimX with 18,000+ rounds. It's been cleaned 3 times (it was soaked at a match once) borescope after each cleaning and I wondered why I bothered. (Lapua & SK ammo)
When I do clean: 3 wet patches Butches Bore Shine, brass brush 5 complete strokes from the breach, 3 wet patches, 2 dry borescope, looks like new. Good Shooting see you at the range.

Not that i don’t believe you but how do you tell if the bore has any rust if you have never cleaned it in 52 years. The result of rust in both my 40x and 54 barrels looked black. It was the pits that gave it away but i only saw that after really cleaning the barrel.

Also your rim-x probably has a stainless steel barrel so it isn’t going to rust in normal conditions

David

Criver600 · Jul 21, 2024

You must have overlooked that I own and use a borescope.
If your rifle gets wet and you put it away chrome-moly will rust.

Dstoenner · Jul 21, 2024

I do too

Criver600 said:
You must have overlooked that I own and use a borescope.
If your rifle gets wet and you put it away chrome-moly will rust.

i do too but my observation was that if the bore was dirty I couldn’t tell if the bore was rusted because they all look alike.

Roddy B · Jul 21, 2024

Shoots 700's said:
I always run a couple of patches with kroil and then a dry patch

I do the same.

frustrated · Jul 21, 2024

I am a long time 22 rimfire shooter and shoot waxed ammo most of the time. I seldom clean as the wax on the bullets gives good protection. When I do cleaan a barrel I use paste wax now as a protectant. It has worked well on the outside of gun barrels for me since the mid sixties so it should do the same on the inside. My hobby for years was buying neglected and beat up 22 rifles to clean up and repair them to make a few bucks. I have never found a 22 barrel with internal rust but plenty with outside rust.

lariat · Jul 21, 2024

frustrated said:
I am a long time 22 rimfire shooter and shoot waxed ammo most of the time. I seldom clean as the wax on the bullets gives good protection. When I do cleaan a barrel I use paste wax now as a protectant. It has worked well on the outside of gun barrels for me since the mid sixties so it should do the same on the inside. My hobby for years was buying neglected and beat up 22 rifles to clean up and repair them to make a few bucks. I have never found a 22 barrel with internal rust but plenty with outside rust.

Which paste waxes have you used to good effect on the outside?

epags · Jul 21, 2024

jbell said:
If your barrel needs that many rounds to settle down there is something wrong with it. 3 to 5 rounds is it, same with switching ammo. There are a lot of myths out there about precision rimfire that have become “truths”.

And perhaps 3 to 5 rounds is one of them?

Can you please provide supporting proof?
Here is a procedure by a precision rifleman:

A Guide to .22LR Barrel Care for the Precision Rimfire Shooter - The Truth About Guns

By Gregory J. Roman As anyone involved in the shooting sports knows, precision rimfire is growing rapidly. The internet is full of tons of advice, good and bad, on how to perform better as a shooter. If there is one thing that my time at Vudoo has taught me, it’s that there is not much […]

www.thetruthaboutguns.com

epags · Jul 21, 2024

lariat said:
Which paste waxes have you used to good effect on the outside?

Just for the kicks, I am trying Renaissance Museum Wax.....why? I don't know since I have three or four different brands of paste waxes for furniture, metal and cars.

jbell · Jul 21, 2024

epags said:
And perhaps 3 to 5 rounds is one of them? Can you please provide supporting proof?
Here is a procedure by a precision rifleman:

A Guide to .22LR Barrel Care for the Precision Rimfire Shooter - The Truth About Guns

By Gregory J. Roman As anyone involved in the shooting sports knows, precision rimfire is growing rapidly. The internet is full of tons of advice, good and bad, on how to perform better as a shooter. If there is one thing that my time at Vudoo has taught me, it’s that there is not much […]

www.thetruthaboutguns.com

Go test it for yourself with a quality barrel and good chamber. I have confirmed it for myself thousands of times with I don't know how many barrels (well over 25-30) and all the premium match ammo that has been sold over the last 30 years.

The article you posted is about a barrel shooting at it's absolute peak not settling down from cleaning. There is a big difference.

Dstoenner · Jul 22, 2024

epags said:
Just for the kicks, I am trying Renaissance Museum Wax.....why? I don't know since I have three or four different brands of paste waxes for furniture, metal and cars.

Me too. It is great for my military rifles.

David

RTH1800 · Jul 22, 2024

I am no bench rest rimfire champion.
I have shoot the .22 RF at targets for decades. I have owned many dozen bolt action rifles. Bore scoped most of them. Seldom if ever encountered rust. Always credited the wax.
I will say I do not clean unless accuracy drops, the bore gets wet or once a year. Never had an issue that I know of.

Wodan · Jul 22, 2024

frustrated said:
I am a long time 22 rimfire shooter and shoot waxed ammo most of the time. I seldom clean as the wax on the bullets gives good protection. When I do cleaan a barrel I use paste wax now as a protectant. It has worked well on the outside of gun barrels for me since the mid sixties so it should do the same on the inside. My hobby for years was buying neglected and beat up 22 rifles to clean up and repair them to make a few bucks. I have never found a 22 barrel with internal rust but plenty with outside rust.

I guess the wax on the bullets form a protective coating

jbell · Jul 22, 2024

I have been pitting in a few Anschutz and one Sauer 22lr barrels that was definitely from rust. These were all Chromoly Barrels and all had a lot is rounds through them. I was not the original owner of any, so I don't know the history.

grauhanen · Jul 23, 2024

epags said:
nd perhaps 3 to 5 rounds is one of them? Can you please provide supporting proof?
Here is a procedure by a precision rifleman:

A Guide to .22LR Barrel Care for the Precision Rimfire Shooter - The Truth About Guns

By Gregory J. Roman As anyone involved in the shooting sports knows, precision rimfire is growing rapidly. The internet is full of tons of advice, good and bad, on how to perform better as a shooter. If there is one thing that my time at Vudoo has taught me, it’s that there is not much […]

www.thetruthaboutguns.com

The "precision rifleman" who authored that article also claims that his cleaning regimen itself will improve chronograph results. Of course that's nonsense because the ammo itself is responsible for chronograph results, not how the bore is cleaned.
_______________________

While chrome moly can rust, the most serious issue in terms of corrosion remains pitting, which is different from rusting.

In a barrel cleaning discussion far more reliable than that of Gregory J. Roman, Steven Boelter, author of Rifleman's Guide to Rimfire Ammunition, says that there are many issues involved in pitting. In Rifleman's Guide and an article "Rimfire Cleaning - Rimfire Research and Development" Boelter notes that the majority of pitting occurs on the bottom side of the bore (6 o'clock) and only up to the first ten inches from the chamber. This suggests that it's related to fouling. As Boelter summarizes a more detailed explanation,
"The abrasive wear from the primer material, impurities in the metal alloy failing faster than the surrounding material, and the addition of moisture in the barrel to further accelerate the oxidation of the impurities all contribute to the eventual death of the barrel in terms of accuracy."

308pirate · Jul 23, 2024

Wodan said:
Reading postings that most don’t clean their Rimfire bores until 200-500 rounds
Looking at my hygrometer, it says 73 percent humidity, after rain it goes up to 80 plus percent.
Powder fouling is claimed to be hygroscopic.
Is it really a good idea to leave your Rimfire sitting fouled for weeks in a row in this sort of humid environment?
I just shot 75 rounds of SK long range ammo, through a clean bore. Clean/oil or leave it as is?
Please enlighten me, thank you for your input

Maybe air condition your house?

jbell · Jul 23, 2024

grauhanen said:
The "precision rifleman" who authored that article also claims that his cleaning regimen itself will improve chronograph results. Of course that's nonsense because the ammo itself is responsible for chronograph results, not how the bore is cleaned.
_______________________

While chrome moly can rust, the most serious issue in terms of corrosion remains pitting, which is different from rusting.

In a barrel cleaning discussion far more reliable than that of Gregory J. Roman, Steven Boelter, author of Rifleman's Guide to Rimfire Ammunition, says that there are many issues involved in pitting. In Rifleman's Guide and an article "Rimfire Cleaning - Rimfire Research and Development" Boelter notes that the majority of pitting occurs on the bottom side of the bore (6 o'clock) and only up to the first ten inches from the chamber. This suggests that it's related to fouling. As Boelter summarizes a more detailed explanation,
"The abrasive wear from the primer material, impurities in the metal alloy failing faster than the surrounding material, and the addition of moisture in the barrel to further accelerate the oxidation of the impurities all contribute to the eventual death of the barrel in terms of accuracy."

I have seen a lot of both, pitting from rust looks very different than the 6 o'clock frosting / micro pitting from abrasion caused by rimfire ammo. Rust causes larger diameter, deeper, and usually isolated areas vs extremely small diameter and fairly evenly distributed micro pits

frustrated · Jul 23, 2024

lariat said:
Which paste waxes have you used to good effect on the outside?

I started with Johnson's paste wax back in the '60's and it solved my rust problems so I have never seen a need to change what works. It is now discontinued but I have enough to last the rest of my shooting days so that is what I will continue using. Min-Wax has basically the same product. There are more expensive options available but why change when something is doing what you want? Depending on usage I will apply wax once or twice a year on the outside of firearms. After each shooting session I started doing wipe downs with Pledge to clean and protect them and it has worked with no rust at all. A boat dealer clued me in about the anti-rust properties of Pledge over 20 years ago.

mark5pt56 · Jul 23, 2024

That pledge is pretty interesting! Not that I don't believe your experiences, I may try the wax on a blue Tikka, see how it goes and maybe use it on the SW41. Living in SE Florida, have to be mindful of these things. The one thing is, 74 AC into the hot garage or range and condensation is abundant! Normally I have a transition period to where I case it in the house so it's not abrupt. So far any oil works great. I've started using the Clenzoil as a protectant as it did extremely well in rust prevention test.

Fasteddie01 · Jul 23, 2024

RE 'humidity' I'd suggest at least a 'Goldenrod' in the gun cabinet. I run a deHumidifier in my bsmt, 24/7/365 and keep ca 40% year round. In Summer I'm dumping ca 2-gal per 3-days, due to humidity in this part of the country. Winters I only dump every couple weeks since the house is kept closed 'tighter'?
As I said I clean after every range trip, with C4 then Alcohol, then oil with Mobil-1. I save an ounce or so after oil changes, that bit goes a long way at 2-3 drops per cleaning. I do this process on my $100 Sav-64 and my $1500 CZ VMTR,and All those 'in-tweeners'. And similar on other calibers.

gillis2 · Jul 23, 2024

I generally store my rifles and my handguns with a last patch soaked in ballistol down the bore. Before using = 2 dry patches. Also my gun safe is kept around 40 to 45 % humidity.
Gilbert

softcock · Jul 23, 2024

lariat said:
It’s an interesting question. Back in the day on Rinfirecentral the conventional wisdom was to clean it when accuracy dropped off and that the wax on the bullets prevented such. I personally haven’t seen any rusting older rifles. Newer ammo, I don’t know and haven’t checked. Probably should.

Speaking of RimfireCentral . i just cleaned for the 1st time about month ago. A old rimfire technologies tension barrel that been on a 10/22 setup for probably close to 20 years .
Sometimes it even sits in safe winter months never fired. It never gets cleaned. It has 'only' had lubed lead down the bore since assembled new .
I stripped bore, and I was checking for a possible carbon ring with bore scope, and wanted to soak clean the suppressor. Bore Scope down that barrels bore looked like glass, like a brand new hand lapped bore.
.

BillZ · Jul 23, 2024

With the advent of ceramic coatings, Cerakote, ceramic car paint sealant and a lot of ceramic dry lubricants. In 2021 I decided to take a different path to protect my firearms, v22,v22s, 2 VQ Mambas and a VQ 10/22 CB from corrosion and for lubrication. I have been using ceramic car sealant (Nexgen) on the barrel, action outside, chassis and scope. The inside of the action where the bolt slides I coat with Dupont Dry Ceramic lubricant and also the surface of the bolt, with Anschutz Keramik inside the bolt and ejectors and HP grease on the bolt lugs. The inside of the barrel C4, chamber mop, VFG pellets and Anschutz Keramik. I clean after every range trip. Have not encountered any problems over the past three years. Cleaning has been much easier especially the barrel, breach and bolt face. I don’t have a borescope, can’t comment on the barrel condition inside, but I have not noticed any change in accuracy.

My logic: The ceramic sealant for cars does a great job protecting the paint of a car in a much harsher environment than my guns will ever encounter. Dry ceramic lubricants are excellent for any sliding surface. Keramik was developed by Anschutz for Biathlon rifles and has proven to be successful in cold harsh condition. Just my 2 cents

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