Leveling scopes…tools?

Gentleman4561 · Jan 11, 2025

I am always looking for a decrease in time and increase in consistency/precision when it comes to “work” in the gun room, and leveling scopes seem to have some room for improvement.

My general method is that I level my rifle on a bench (backyard range), then put scope in mount and level that to a plumb line while doing my best to make sure the rifle is also level. I feel like this leaves some room for error. I do feel better about it now that I have a send it level on my mounts, as it seems to be more precise than a bubble level.

A few issues I have seen: Hard to find a spot on a gun to put a level, scope caps are not always level to scope etc.

I bought one of the Arisaka wedge kits, but its typically useless as almost all of my scopes are in mounts that don’t have clearance or work with a tool like this.

My research has lead me to the SAP Final Scope Level and the Badger Dead Level.

Do you have one or either? What do you like or not like about it?

______________________

TLDR: Is a SAP Scope Level or Badger Dead Level worth buying?

chevy_man · Jan 12, 2025

You're already doing it right. Don't look for tools to make your life harder.

Old Man with Gun · Jan 12, 2025

I use a parallel bar set and make sure the bottom of the scope is parallel to the mount.

Pick a bar or bars so that with a slight twist you have good contact up and down. An exact fit may get stuck when you tighten rings, so a little play is good.

This ensures that when the scope is held level, it is exactly above the bore so vertical and horizontal movements are true.

If you use a scope level I use a plumb line so the level shows level when the scope reticle matches the plumb line..

Darryle · Jan 12, 2025

I have used the Arisaka style wedges, pin gauges and even an extra long feeler gauge set to level, then verify with a tripod and plump line.

Lately I just use the feeler gauges since I also use them to try to start the caps as evenly as possible. I installed a new scope last night and while most normally start at .032" gap, this one ended up at .020" to start.

Luckyshot · Jan 12, 2025

Gentleman4561 said:
TLDR: Is a SAP Scope Level or Badger Dead Level worth buying?

no. Eyeball the scope to the rifle, and use the flashlight method or a plumbob to match the bubble level to the reticle

This is both more precise, and less expensive

nocoolname · Jan 12, 2025

Darryle said:
I have used the Arisaka style wedges, pin gauges and even an extra long feeler gauge set to level, then verify with a tripod and plump line.

Lately I just use the feeler gauges since I also use them to try to start the caps as evenly as possible. I installed a new scope last night and while most normally start at .032" gap, this one ended up at .020" to start.

Same here, feeler gauges between scope and rail or bottom of mount, then use them to set the gap on the caps. I don't think the gap on the caps matter much, if any at all, but it looks nicer. After I set the rifle on a tripod and confirm with a plumb line hanging on the other end of the garage, then bore sight by eye. Box test after initial sight in confirms it all.

Sheldon N · Jan 12, 2025

Gentleman4561 said:
My general method is that I level my rifle on a bench (backyard range), then put scope in mount and level that to a plumb line while doing my best to make sure the rifle is also level. I feel like this leaves some room for error. I do feel better about it now that I have a send it level on my mounts, as it seems to be more precise than a bubble level.

The only thing that matters is that the bubble level matches up when the scope is aligned with the plumb line.

If your bubble level is attached to the pic rail of your gun, then all the other tools become irrelevant. You need to spin the scope in the rings until the reticle is in alignment with the plumb line, nothing else.

If the bubble level is attached to the scope tube and you've got the alignment matched up, then you have a bit of wiggle room in how the scope sits in relationship to the rifle. If you want it to be perfectly square to the rifle, I've found that a deck of playing cards works good as a way to fill the gap and make the scope base square to the pic rail.

1911hombre · Jan 12, 2025

Deck of cards. Done.

Old Man with Gun · Jan 12, 2025

Sheldon N said:
The only thing that matters is that the bubble level matches up when the scope is aligned with the plumb line.

If your bubble level is attached to the pic rail of your gun, then all the other tools become irrelevant. You need to spin the scope in the rings until the reticle is in alignment with the plumb line, nothing else.

If the bubble level is attached to the scope tube and you've got the alignment matched up, then you have a bit of wiggle room in how the scope sits in relationship to the rifle. If you want it to be perfectly square to the rifle, I've found that a deck of playing cards works good as a way to fill the gap and make the scope base square to the pic rail.

I mostly agree with this, but it sounds like the rifle to scope alignment isn't critical. if the scope isn't centered on the bore, then 10 mils adjustment might actually be 9.9 mils and a mil to two to the side.

I like the card trick.

Oldloser · Jan 12, 2025

Sheldon N said:
The only thing that matters is that the bubble level matches up when the scope is aligned with the plumb line.

If your bubble level is attached to the pic rail of your gun, then all the other tools become irrelevant. You need to spin the scope in the rings until the reticle is in alignment with the plumb line, nothing else.

If the bubble level is attached to the scope tube and you've got the alignment matched up, then you have a bit of wiggle room in how the scope sits in relationship to the rifle. If you want it to be perfectly square to the rifle, I've found that a deck of playing cards works good as a way to fill the gap and make the scope base square to the pic rail.

Yep. Pretty easy stuff.

I use a sphuhr mount that has a level in it. I put it on the gun and then put the scope as close as I can visually to level.

Then go the range and put a level line at the zero board with a carpenters level and a sharpie. Then get the gun level via the bubble on the mount and then level the scope to the level line at the zero board.

Nowadays I can do all this with my DFAT in the garage and then check at the range as above.

sloporsche · Jan 12, 2025

I spent days using carpenter and machinist levels even factoring gravitational waves [humor] ,after tightening down the top clamps i looked through the scope like i would at a target.....................i loosened them up turned the scope a touch then confirmed a week later it could put the meat on the table at 100 yards . It was kinda fun seeing how many levels did not agree to one another ,the carpenter ones being the worse ,80 year old + grandfathers machinist levels the best .

loboman7x57 · Jan 12, 2025

I use the Real Avid Level Right Pro. it's easy to use and it doesn't take very long to setup.

Level-Right® Pro

ACCURATE SCOPE MOUNTING MADE EASY A level reticle is critical to long range Accuracy. For longer shots a canted (or unlevel) reticle will pull or push the bullets trajectory off of vertical center. It gets worse the further the distance increases. A level scope means that the reticle...

realavid.com

USMC 308 · Jan 12, 2025

Arisaka Tool....if that doesn't work, Feeler Gauges. Even a deck of cards works if Feeler Gauges not handy. The hanging plumb line with multiple bubble levels will drive anyone insane and leave you questioning if you have it right!

Sheldon N · Jan 12, 2025

Old Man with Gun said:
I mostly agree with this, but it sounds like the rifle to scope alignment isn't critical. if the scope isn't centered on the bore, then 10 mils adjustment might actually be 9.9 mils and a mil to two to the side.

A bit of clarification on this...

Bubble level to scope reticle/tracking is crucial, making sure to level the scope when you shoot.

Scope centered over the bore is NOT crucial, and actually has a lot of flexibility. You can even have the gun slightly off axis if that suits your body position and helps you naturally align the gun to a position where the scope is level.

The scenario you mentioned (hitting low and off to the side) only happens when you have a scope that isn't level when shooting, not from the scope being off axis from the bore. That's why I think all these scope leveling gadgets are mainly a waste of money.

Nik H · Jan 12, 2025

Sheldon N said:
The scenario you mentioned (hitting low and off to the side) only happens when you have a scope that isn't level when shooting, not from the scope being off axis from the bore. That's why I think all these scope leveling gadgets are mainly a waste of money.

That is why I perform the final leveling adjustment when in position, aiming at a plumb line or other known vertically level structure.

Edsel · Jan 12, 2025

FORTUNATE IS HE WHOSE BUBBLE LEVELS ARE IN HARMONY WITH EACH OTHER

- Sun Tzu, at the signing of the Declaration of Independence, 1776

www.snipershide.com

The more (good) levels, the better.

A plumb line.

A nice flashlight.

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Leveling scopes…tools?

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