Remove PVD off Solus Action?

flyingfrog · Saturday at 2:23 PM

I've got a Solus action coated by PVD and a stainless barrel to go on it. Up till now I've always tried to stick with stainless machine finish and just be done with it. Didn't have that option w/the Solus action...so I'm wondering if anyone has ever removed the black PVD off the outside of an action like that? I don't want to mess with the inside or the bolt because of tolerances. Was thinking I could tape all of that off real good and maybe just blast it with baking soda or walnut shell to stay on the less abrasive end of the blasting spectrum. Then again the rail might end up a bit loose if I blast a few thousands of coating off the outside.

Hoping someone has experience with this sort of thing OR has already done it & either screwed it up and can tell me "NO SAVE YOURSELF" or the such?

IF YOU WANT TO SAVE YOURSELF SOME TIME (and not read JR1200W3 & I pissing in each other's Cheerios for what I hope is just fun)...

kl3309 wrote: The proper way to do this would be to disassemble, blast, machine/polish/lap, and re-assemble. If you're not willing to do that then pass it on to a pro refinisher.
I had some bad information on how PVD worked
308Pirate wrote:
how PVD coatings work. The workpiece being coated is not transformed in any way.

The material to be deposited as a coating onto the workpiece is vaporized in a plasma stream/flame. Said plasma stream deposits the coating onto the object being coated.

Removing the coating will need mechanical/abrasive action as you correctly guessed. The problem lies in that you don't know the thickness of the coating that you're removing and so you don't know if you've removed any of the base metal under the coating.

You're correct to not want to remove the coating from parts where fit is important but not for the reason you think. The fit between two parts is not necessarily affected by the dimensional tolerance of each part. Tolerances are allowed variations from a nominal dimension, are fixed by the design engineer, and are not known by you unless you have the manufacturing drawings for the parts in question. Besides nobody can change or alter tolerances. What you can do is change the actual dimensions of the mating parts which will affect how they fit together. Your actions may remove enough material to render one or more parts out of tolerance or the part may still be in tolerance because you didn't remove too much material. You will never know by feeling how the parts fit together.
Final outcome: "it's a dumb idea" but not for the reasons I was originally thinking. It's a lot of work and cost to remove such a coating. Most importantly because the coating is engineered into the product specifications it would be nearly impossible wo/the engineer drawings to know exactly what problems I could be introducing. Seems it would be far ahead to spend extra money to get a stainless Zermatt Arms TL3, SR3, or even Defiance Outcast (all give the remington 700 footprint w/savage barrel threads)

JR1200W3 · Sunday at 11:44 AM

Why would you intentionally remove a protective coating " to stick with stainless machine finish"? If you were to pay someone to DLC an action it would probably cost you a couple hundred dollars. And of the coatings you could choose to apply to an action the PVD coating is on the upper tier of coatings. The coating is one of the things that make the Solus a good value. It's not just that you're getting an aftermarket action for $600-700. It's the features it comes with. Like a high quality coating....

This is dumb. You would be devaluing the action. For misguided aesthetics. I don't think you understand the various coatings that custom action manufacturers use and how they play into their value and cost of those actions.

jrscott1982 · Sunday at 2:55 PM

I am a machinist/ Cnc Programmer who deals with a lot of different materials and surface treatments. The way I understand PVD is it’s not just a surface treatment. It actually penetrates the parent metal. To remove it you would have to remove material or possibly have it lasered off which I’m sure is expensive.

flyingfrog · Sunday at 3:16 PM

JR1200W3 said:
Why would you intentionally remove a protective coating " to stick with stainless machine finish"? If you were to pay someone to DLC an action it would probably cost you a couple hundred dollars. And of the coatings you could choose to apply to an action the PVD coating is on the upper tier of coatings. The coating is one of the things that make the Solus a good value. It's not just that you're getting an aftermarket action for $600-700. It's the features it comes with. Like a high quality coating....

This is dumb. You would be devaluing the action. For misguided aesthetics. I don't think you understand the various coatings that custom action manufacturers use and how they play into their value and cost of those actions.

I addressed why I would intentionally remove a coating, because I like stainless rifles.

There are many guns out there with stippling, wild graphics, and other aesthetic changes that don't add value or functionality and that is OK. We don't all need guns are the most efficient or cost effective. All guns don't need to suit everyone's personal taste or be deemed stupid.

While I appreciate your thoughts on how removing the coating will devalue the Solus action, comments like 'This is dumb' or 'misguided aesthetics' provide no actionable feedback and create a negative atmosphere. They fail to foster constructive dialogue, hinder collaboration, and undermine efforts to build a supportive and stronger 2A community. I didn't join Sniper's Hide to be berated but to learn from those who have more knowledge, experience, and the willingness to share it. I hope my thoughts on your response are received not as an attack on you but as possible pointers on how to foster better community in the future.

JR1200W3 · Sunday at 3:17 PM

flyingfrog said:
I addressed why I would intentionally remove a coating, because I like stainless rifles.

There are many guns out there with stippling, wild graphics, and other aesthetic changes that don't add value or functionality and that is OK. We don't all need guns are the most efficient or cost effective. All guns don't need to suit everyone's personal taste or be deemed stupid.

While I appreciate your thoughts on how removing the coating will devalue the Solus action, comments like 'This is dumb' or 'misguided aesthetics' provide no actionable feedback and create a negative atmosphere. They fail to foster constructive dialogue, hinder collaboration, and undermine efforts to build a supportive and stronger 2A community. I didn't join Sniper's Hide to be berated but to learn from those who have more knowledge, experience, and the willingness to share it. I hope my thoughts on your response are received not as an attack on you but as possible pointers on how to foster better community in the future.

No. It's a dumb idea.

kl3309 · Sunday at 3:21 PM

Blast with aluminum oxide or garnet.

flyingfrog · Sunday at 3:23 PM

jrscott1982 said:
I am a machinist/ Cnc Programmer who deals with a lot of different materials and surface treatments. The way I understand PVD is it’s not just a surface treatment. It actually penetrates the parent metal. To remove it you would have to remove material or possibly have it lasered off which I’m sure is expensive.

From my reading last night I believe you are correct, the top few thousands of material is like vaporized and then turned into the black color in a vacuum then it bonds back as the protective layer. Not like cerakote where it is simply baked on top per say. That was why I certainly didn't want to mess with the bolt or internals or that hopefully tighter than factory action just became sloppy and possibly dangerous.

With that in mind I'm leaning towards just leaving the components mixed and matched at first & if it really bothers me later I can take the barrel in and get it cerakoted to match or something like that. Besides we all know black guns are more scary than shinny pretty ones (as my wife calls the stainless ones)

I was hoping, but if I want stainless I better just sick with getting a custom action that starts off that way. Love the value of the Solus action even if it is just a tad better than a factory action. Some day I'll bite the bullet and go all in for one of the $1500 cream of the crop actions, but for my first custom action I wanted to keep it cost effective if possible. Fingers crossed.

flyingfrog · Sunday at 3:30 PM

JR1200W3 said:
No. It's a dumb idea.

I have to agree, but you just happen to be right "it is a dumb idea". Unfortunately it wasn't your concise argument that lead me to that conclusion. I can only hope that you don't interact with everyone as boldly in person as you do behind the cloak of a keyboard on the internet. Very grown up of you in your efforts to grow and build community so people know why things are "dumb" and not just because you say so. Please go away now, if you're pride will allow it.

JR1200W3 · Sunday at 3:33 PM

flyingfrog said:
I have to agree, but you just happen to be right "it is a dumb idea". Unfortunately it wasn't your concise argument that lead me to that conclusion. I can only hope that you don't interact with everyone as boldly in person as you do behind the cloak of a keyboard on the internet. Very grown up of you in your efforts to grow and build community so people know why things are "dumb" and not just because you say so. Please go away now, if you're pride will allow it.

Do you want people to tell you the truth or do you want emotional support? Diversity and Inclusion? Or transparency? What is more healthy for you in the long run?

ma smith · Sunday at 3:40 PM

Cheap and aesthetically pleasing...?

flyingfrog · Sunday at 3:40 PM

kl3309 said:
Blast with aluminum oxide or garnet.

Have you done this before? If so what pressure did you run & would a simple gravity feed hand held blaster be good enough to do the job. (again assuming a very careful sealing up of the internals and the action face)

If one were to blast with aluminum oxide or garnet, how much would that "blast away" Thinking about it, even loosing a few thousands on the action face would mess with the head spacing, not to mention it might take it out of square and result in less accuracy.

The PVD coating apparently is VERY THIN as per https://toolgrindcoat.com/pvd-solutions-2022-shot-show/ and I quote "PVD coatings are applied in extremely thin coating layers. PVD coating layers can be measured in nanometers and microns, or 0.0001 to 0.0002 inches in thickness. PVD coating dimensions will not change how your firearm components securely come together with standard clearances."

Useful in the thought process, but like I mentioned earlier I'm leaning stronger away from the idea of trying it the more I look into it and think thru the entire process and it's possible effects. I might be over thinking it, but man wouldn't it suck to take an 800 dollar action and make it about as good as 300 dollar factory gun? *gag*

flyingfrog · Sunday at 3:42 PM

ma smith said:
View attachment 8595903

Nothing so true has ever been presented in MEME format!!! LOVE IT!!!

flyingfrog · Sunday at 4:02 PM

JR1200W3 said:
Do you want people to tell you the truth or do you want emotional support? Diversity and Inclusion? Or transparency? What is more healthy for you in the long run?

You win, your opinion is the holy scripture of all truth. I bow before you sobbing in tears needing emotional support because you must not like me and don't like the diversity of stainless rifle actions. I'm fearful that you will not want to include me in your next range trip because of my shinny rifle action. Dude get a GRIP already. Your not helping the subject matter here.

The truth is always the best, but you haven't actually provided any. You've provided no truth other than what you conflate as truth that is your opinion. Just because someone has a thought that doesn't agree with your opinion doesn't mean it is a dumb idea. If you've never made a Solus action into a stainless finish and sold it, then how the heck do you know it would devalue it at all? You've not added anything to the subject matter and have only attacked me. Your attempt to "hurt my feelings" or make yourself feel more manly by passive aggressively asking if I need emotional support, diversity & inclusion falls on deaf ears because that word salad means nothing to anyone with the emotional maturity of more than a child. Once again all you've done is foster ill-will and the exact opposite of what forums are all about EVEN after I tried to agree with you that it is a dumb idea.

Two can play the "i've got to get the last word in" game. I'm sure you'll have to say one last thing just to make sure anyone who later reads this thread will know that I'm dumb and you're da man.

JR1200W3 · Sunday at 4:12 PM

flyingfrog said:
You win, your opinion is the holy scripture of all truth. I bow before you sobbing in tears needing emotional support because you must not like me and don't like the diversity of stainless rifle actions. I'm fearful that you will not want to include me in your next range trip because of my shinny rifle action. Dude get a GRIP already. Your not helping the subject matter here.

The truth is always the best, but you haven't actually provided any. You've provided no truth other than what you conflate as truth that is your opinion. Just because someone has a thought that doesn't agree with your opinion doesn't mean it is a dumb idea. If you've never made a Solus action into a stainless finish and sold it, then how the heck do you know it would devalue it at all? You've not added anything to the subject matter and have only attacked me. Your attempt to "hurt my feelings" or make yourself feel more manly by passive aggressively asking if I need emotional support, diversity & inclusion falls on deaf ears because that word salad means nothing to anyone with the emotional maturity of more than a child. Once again all you've done is foster ill-will and the exact opposite of what forums are all about EVEN after I tried to agree with you that it is a dumb idea.

Two can play the "i've got to get the last word in" game. I'm sure you'll have to say one last thing just to make sure anyone who later reads this thread will know that I'm dumb and you're da man.

Are you're feelings really that hurt that I told you it was a dumb idea?

Shoots 700's · Sunday at 5:08 PM

Here’s an idea sell the Solus and buy something in the raw.

Oh BTW removing it is a dumb idea

308pirate · Sunday at 5:29 PM

flyingfrog said:
From my reading last night I believe you are correct, the top few thousands of material is like vaporized and then turned into the black color in a vacuum then it bonds back as the protective layer.

That's not how PVD coatings work. The workpiece being coated is not transformed in any way.

The material to be deposited as a coating onto the workpiece is vaporized in a plasma stream/flame. Said plasma stream deposits the coating onto the object being coated.

Removing the coating will need mechanical/abrasive action as you correctly guessed. The problem lies in that you don't know the thickness of the coating that you're removing and so you don't know if you've removed any of the base metal under the coating.

You're correct to not want to remove the coating from parts where fit is important but not for the reason you think. The fit between two parts is not necessarily affected by the dimensional tolerance of each part. Tolerances are allowed variations from a nominal dimension, are fixed by the design engineer, and are not known by you unless you have the manufacturing drawings for the parts in question. Besides nobody can change or alter tolerances. What you can do is change the actual dimensions of the mating parts which will affect how they fit together. Your actions may remove enough material to render one or more parts out of tolerance or the part may still be in tolerance because you didn't remove too much material. You will never know by feeling how the parts fit together.

I wouldn't waste time and money on this personally but its not my rifle.

brazz04 · Sunday at 5:37 PM

JR1200W3 said:
Are you're feelings really that hurt that I told you it was a dumb idea?

Here's a better question, why do you care that he doesn't like your opinion. Who gives two fucks about the value of the action? It's his action, politely fuck off.

kl3309 · Sunday at 6:09 PM

flyingfrog said:
Have you done this before? If so what pressure did you run & would a simple gravity feed hand held blaster be good enough to do the job. (again assuming a very careful sealing up of the internals and the action face)

If one were to blast with aluminum oxide or garnet, how much would that "blast away" Thinking about it, even loosing a few thousands on the action face would mess with the head spacing, not to mention it might take it out of square and result in less accuracy.

The PVD coating apparently is VERY THIN as per https://toolgrindcoat.com/pvd-solutions-2022-shot-show/ and I quote "PVD coatings are applied in extremely thin coating layers. PVD coating layers can be measured in nanometers and microns, or 0.0001 to 0.0002 inches in thickness. PVD coating dimensions will not change how your firearm components securely come together with standard clearances."

Useful in the thought process, but like I mentioned earlier I'm leaning stronger away from the idea of trying it the more I look into it and think thru the entire process and it's possible effects. I might be over thinking it, but man wouldn't it suck to take an 800 dollar action and make it about as good as 300 dollar factory gun? *gag*

There is no measurement, you blast until you have a uniform finish.
The proper way to do this would be to disassemble, blast, machine/polish/lap, and re-assemble. If you're not willing to do that then pass it on to a pro refinisher.

FuhQ · Sunday at 6:39 PM

flyingfrog said:
I've got a Solus action coated by PVD and a stainless barrel to go on it. Up till now I've always tried to stick with stainless machine finish and just be done with it. Didn't have that option w/the Solus action...so I'm wondering if anyone has ever removed the black PVD off the outside of an action like that? I don't want to mess with the inside or the bolt because of tolerances. Was thinking I could tape all of that off real good and maybe just blast it with baking soda or walnut shell to stay on the less abrasive end of the blasting spectrum. Then again the rail might end up a bit loose if I blast a few thousands of coating off the outside.

Hoping someone has experience with this sort of thing OR has already done it & either screwed it up and can tell me "NO SAVE YOURSELF" or the such?

You might prefer all stainless rifles, but it's actually the most iconically classic custom rifle look to have a blued action, and a bright stainless barrel in an old 70's wooden Remington Varmint style stock.

JR1200W3 · Sunday at 7:23 PM

There's no accounting for taste.

That might seem like another critical and shitty thing to say, but there's two aspects to this. The pure subjectivity of aesthetics:what an individual prefers, and what is logical and sensible.

Perfect example: Black Collar Arms posted a video a couple of days ago of an Aero Solus they "built" for someone. It was in an Aero Solus chassis. They had cerakoted it in this loud, gaudy, over the top, battle worn American flag pattern. Action, chassis, and barrel. They cerakoted everything, including the inside of the action. It was thick. The owner of BCA posted a video of it talking about how the action was now sticky and didn't have the tolerances for the cerakote and was now going to have to remove the cerakote. In addition to a bedding/ chassis fitment issue, the bolt was dragging so bad it was near unusable.

So people's tastes are what they are. And they don't have to make sense. This is America. You can buy a Plymouth PT Cruiser, die your hair pink, and drive around with stickers that show your "identity group". Totally can. But sometimes, if you don't keep your preferences in check through critical thought, they can drive you to do insensible things that you will likely look back on as a mistake ( aka a dumb thing).

So now BCA is going to have to media blast the cerakote out of the inside of the action which is likely going to remove the PVD coating. A coating the action was designed to use. That not only protected the action from corrosion in humid areas(like Georgia). But also enhanced the feel and cycling of the action. All for some "taste". I'm imagining the guy going to a match with this over the top cerakote paint job and having all kinds of misfeeds and malfunctions, shooting 10% of the points, and feeling a little silly about how the gun looks when it can't even function correctly. He's going to look kind of dumb to people watching. Even if they don't say anything. If only someone could've talked him out of it in the first place. Since he didn't know better.

BCA took that video down. I looked for it to post here but it's gone. I wonder why they would've taken the video down?

Ty21 · Sunday at 7:44 PM

If you want a stainless steel action and don’t wanna spend a lot….you could always get a Mack bros or just sell the whole set up and get a defiance action.

JR1200W3 · Sunday at 7:50 PM

He doesn't have it. Undoubtedly waiting on it and trying to kill the time by thinking of the various things he can do with it.

Post in thread 'Aero Solus 223 bolt face' https://www.snipershide.com/shooting/threads/aero-solus-223-bolt-face.7230152/post-11968007

mheimer_45 · Sunday at 8:27 PM

Why not cerakote. Redneck chrome at its finest.

hlee · Sunday at 8:46 PM

flyingfrog · 2025-01-20T05:51:15-0500

308pirate said:
That's not how PVD coatings work. The workpiece being coated is not transformed in any way.

The material to be deposited as a coating onto the workpiece is vaporized in a plasma stream/flame. Said plasma stream deposits the coating onto the object being coated.

Removing the coating will need mechanical/abrasive action as you correctly guessed. The problem lies in that you don't know the thickness of the coating that you're removing and so you don't know if you've removed any of the base metal under the coating.

You're correct to not want to remove the coating from parts where fit is important but not for the reason you think. The fit between two parts is not necessarily affected by the dimensional tolerance of each part. Tolerances are allowed variations from a nominal dimension, are fixed by the design engineer, and are not known by you unless you have the manufacturing drawings for the parts in question. Besides nobody can change or alter tolerances. What you can do is change the actual dimensions of the mating parts which will affect how they fit together. Your actions may remove enough material to render one or more parts out of tolerance or the part may still be in tolerance because you didn't remove too much material. You will never know by feeling how the parts fit together.

I wouldn't waste time and money on this personally but its not my rifle.

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Remove PVD off Solus Action?

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