Suppressors New to cans - by far my biggest surprise has been...

D

DownhillFromHere

Aim > Impact > Take a Nap
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Minuteman
Nov 30, 2017
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#1
Thanks (??) to @Rob01 and my adult son, I've been led into the world of suppressors. Nothing unexpected until...

... I discovered the SMELL.

After the first outing with son's new suppressor and it cooled off, we unscrewed it and put it back in its plastic box. Later, at my house, I took it out of the box and immediately noticed a sharp odor... what is that?.... sniffed the hub end of the can... yowza, the ammonia smell was VERY potent and burned my nose.

I got my own can (Rugged Alaskan 360) a couple weeks later, I found the same thing: Massive ammonia smell, after shooting ammo with a variety of single-base and double-base powders. I never smelled ammonia before in 60+ years of shooting shotgun, pistol, and rifle.

With his suppressor on a Tavor bullpup, he said the ammonia-laden gas wafting out of the action under his chin made him wheeze a bit.

This isn't a gripe. Just an observation. Surprised me quite a bit; I'd never heard of this before. And I'm aware that breathing this stuff as was happening with the Tavor is not a good thing.
 
#5
Interesting. Note that the smell is only apparent if I put the just-fired suppressor near my nose, or, in son's case, if he has his face down near the action of his Tavor and he's shooting.

Both cans are Rugged Alaskan 360s, primarily used on two different ARs but also on a Tavor, AK47, PCC, and a .223 bolt gun. The sharp amonia smell dissipates after a couple of hours, but lingers if the can is left sealed in its plastic box.

@Rob01 , when you bring your latest acquisition to Woody's, let me know.... now the door is open to comments about sniffing cans.
 
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#7
Edsel said:
Were you shooting Tulammo?

Or some other lower - budget ammunition?
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No. Vast majority of shooting so far has been .223/5.56x45 - reloads with H335 but also some Defender Ammunition 77 SMK, 75 Hornady BTHP. Also quite a bit of Federal and American Eagle factory XM193.

I want to say that Defender uses TAC or other Hodgdon powders but I'm not certain and at present I'm too lazy to call and find out.
 
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#10
Ok, keep the comments coming. I'll get to the range in next few days and pay specific attention to whether the ammonia presence is associated with my AR reloads (H335, 55gr ball / 69gr SMK) or one or more of the factory offerings. I'll also put it on my .223 bolt gun and run my current preferred load of N135 and 75gr ELDM... and even on my 9mm PCC loaded with 124gr HPs and black-powder-like Unique.

Y'all got me really curious about this.
 
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#12
H322, H335, 8202, AA2200, everything from 40gn 223 to 130gn 6.8, all shot with cans, and no sort of ammonia smell at all.

That said, AR gas is very bitter/acrid, so maybe it's just "translation error" between how different people perceive the same smell?
 
#19
DemonicLemming said:
That said, AR gas is very bitter/acrid, so maybe it's just "translation error" between how different people perceive the same smell?
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I'd bet $ it's ammonia... I remember from some college chemistry thing where ammonia gas was a byproduct. But AR versus bolt gun is a variable easy enough to check - next time I go out, I'll run the bolt rifle first and then [groan, bring on the comments] sniff the can.

In any event, I did a quick AI search of combustion chemistry of nitrocellulose (C6H7N3O11)n), the primary component of single-base smokeless powder. Ammonia (NH3) is simply not one of the byproducts. But formic acid is, and apparently it can be acrid in high enough concentrations. So maybe I'd lose the bet. Argh. Curiosity is rising.

GTOJOSH said:
I think he's trying to trick folks into going around the range asking "can I smell the openin oof your can?"
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Well if anybody wants to go around asking folks, have at it. You can even say I suggested you ask....

Kamerad said:
Do you clean with ammonia-containing solvent? Sweets 7.62, for example?
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Neither suppressor has been cleaned yet. just a couple hundred rounds through each.

6.5SH said:
Perhaps OP has a bit of MCS, given the nitrates in every gunpowder it might explain it.
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What is MCS? Like I said, I poked into combustion chemistry of nitrocellulose... see above.

spife7980 said:
Wash it out in the sink with soap and water and see if it does it the next time. It’s either just gunpowder smell or it’s manufacturing oils burning off.
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I've never encountered "gunpowder smell" like that in 60+ years of shooting or, as a kid, doing some pretty stupid things with gunpowder carefully collected from roll caps (it took 3 or 4 of us cutting caps with razor blades to get enough to do anything fun) or with smokeless powder obtained from... different places where adults left ammunition in outbuildings....
-----

Anyway, yeah, this phenomenon introduces a whole and entirely new reason for a range day: what does equipment smell like after shooting different kinds of ammo?? :geek:
 
#21
DownhillFromHere said:
I'd bet $ it's ammonia... I remember from some college chemistry thing where ammonia gas was a byproduct. But AR versus bolt gun is a variable easy enough to check - next time I go out, I'll run the bolt rifle first and then [groan, bring on the comments] sniff the can.

In any event, I did a quick AI search of combustion chemistry of nitrocellulose (C6H7N3O11)n), the primary component of single-base smokeless powder. Ammonia (NH3) is simply not one of the byproducts. But formic acid is, and apparently it can be acrid in high enough concentrations. So maybe I'd lose the bet. Argh. Curiosity is rising.


Well if anybody wants to go around asking folks, have at it. You can even say I suggested you ask....


Neither suppressor has been cleaned yet. just a couple hundred rounds through each.


What is MCS? Like I said, I poked into combustion chemistry of nitrocellulose... see above.


I've never encountered "gunpowder smell" like that in 60+ years of shooting or, as a kid, doing some pretty stupid things with gunpowder carefully collected from roll caps (it took 3 or 4 of us cutting caps with razor blades to get enough to do anything fun) or with smokeless powder obtained from... different places where adults left ammunition in outbuildings....
-----

Anyway, yeah, this phenomenon introduces a whole and entirely new reason for a range day: what does equipment smell like after shooting different kinds of ammo?? :geek:
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"Multiple Chemical Sensitivity", often exaggerated condition where someone is particularly sensitive to certain chemical odors like perfumes or new carpeting.
 
#23
I have never smelled anything like that from a can, even one taken off a recently fired gun with smoke still coming out of it.

When running higher round count drills on AR’s the gas blowing back in my face from the charging handle and ejection port will have a little sting to the eyes and a “sharp” kinda burning scent that can choke you up a little and make your eyes water. Thats kind of a known thing when shooting gassy AR’s though.
 
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#25
hlee said:
What do you use to clean your rifles? The only time I’ve ever smell ammonia while/after shooting was after cleaning with Wipe Out cleaner.
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Bore Tech C4. I may use Remington 40x on the first few inches of the barrel, but it gets thoroughly swabbed out with dry patches on a .22 cal jag, followed by ample C4 patches finished by at least two dry patches.
 
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