WW II, German Wehrmacht: 7 brothers killed in action

Jayjay1 · Jul 20, 2021

For those who saw the movie "The soldier James Ryan" and are interested in such history stories on the other sides as well.

Germany, the Wehrmacht, didn´t have that rule, that the last son among others must survive.

There was a German family, where seven sons from eight (the eightth one was taken out, because of an injury) were killed in warfare.
The familiy had 12 children, four daughters and eight sons.

It were children of the married couple Maria and Ludwig Voggenreiter from Vilshofen.

All of the seven have been killed between December 1941 and November 1943, in less than two years.
Five of them even between April and November 1943.

http://www.deutsche-ehrenmale.de/ehren/bayern/bilder/D-BY-PA-Vilshofen_15_2010.JPG

Duc · Jul 20, 2021

War SUCKS for those tasked to fight!

RUTGERS95 · Jul 20, 2021

my grandfather lost 3 brothers for the Wehrmacht and 2 for Uncle Sam. you read that right

fdkay · Jul 20, 2021

Don't really feel sorry that those Nazi's can't breed anymore.

c1steve · Jul 20, 2021

The German people had a lesson to learn, not to follow bad leaders despite their upbringing to follow the rules.

RUTGERS95 · Jul 20, 2021

are you guys kidding me? I guess a practical understanding of history is beyond your grasp? less than 5% of the country were party members. This country reveres FDR and what we experienced was like a Disney trip compared to Germany not to mention if you look at our current gov't, who is to say in 100yrs the same about us?

pure ignorance here

pick up a book and read about the conditions and then opine because if that happened here, we'd be sucking the balls of the Kamala, Oblunder etc etc and happily do so given how we just rolled over for a virus that is no more deadly than the fking flu

Maggot · Jul 20, 2021

Duc said:
War SUCKS for those tasked to fight!

War sucks for everyone except the military defense contractors.

W54/XM-388 · Jul 20, 2021

c1steve said:
The German people had a lesson to learn, not to follow bad leaders despite their upbringing to follow the rules.

The Germans didn't learn that lesson.
I'll bet if the government ordered them to help "escort" Jews to "safety places" for "their own protection", the police, military and most of the population would once again "Just Follow Orders," with their typical "Brain off just obey" stance.

Thumper580 · Jul 20, 2021

5% being party members...yes. However, the German populace as a whole were in rapture over Hitler. Revered him as a God. In my "limited" reading on Hitler, the German people during that time period I have yet to uncover any significant evidence of protest or outrage on Hitler's actions or the direction he was taking the country. Obviously, disgust and disenchantment didn't appear until the end.... SIRHR may want to chime in.

918v · Jul 20, 2021

W54/XM-388 said:
The Germans didn't learn that lesson.
I'll bet if the government ordered them to help "escort" Jews to "safety places" for "their own protection", the police, military and most of the population would once again "Just Follow Orders," with their typical "Brain off just obey" stance.

Just like here.

Kein Mitleid · Jul 20, 2021

Or any other populace for the most part. Every country that has gone to fascism, socialism or communism has done so with a small minority leading the way.

jbailey · Jul 20, 2021

Jayjay1 said:
All of the seven have been killed between December 1941 and November 1943, in less than two years.
Five of them even between April and November 1943.

Dec 41 to Nov 43... assume they were all killed on the Eastern Front? Maybe north Africa?

OP, any more information on this sad story (it is sad for the individuals involved, the mother and father, the sisters, any wives or children left behind)?

Jayjay1 · Jul 20, 2021

jbailey, yes, five of them killed on the Eastern front, mainly in Russia, one in Germany and one MIA (until today, so...).
The eightth son had an accident at work which smashed most of his right hand, so he was not accepted for the service.

There is a complete report about this on youtube, sadly it´s in German, it is called "The seven fallen brothers" .
But if you don´t start the movie, you will see a picture with their names, date of birth, date of death, and some with the places they were killed.
Under the German cross stands: "Pray for the fallen brothers"

Jayjay1 · Jul 20, 2021

fdkay said:
Don't really feel sorry that those Nazi's can't breed anymore.

You never have met a German or have been to Germany.
Otherwise you wouldn´t think like this.

I think inhere are a lot soldiers who have served side by side with Germans overseas.
Everyone of them would tell you the same.

Jayjay1 · Jul 20, 2021

c1steve said:
The German people had a lesson to learn, not to follow bad leaders despite their upbringing to follow the rules.

Yes, there is something to that.
I mean, any nation would be in danger to follow bad leaders, but the Germans are trained to believe, that they are bad and have no right to exist, which is crap, because you can´t inherit guilt.

It begins in primary school and ends in college, then it continues in the media and the politicians are praying the same all day long.

Of course the Germans did probably the biggest war crimes in human history in WW II.

But which nation didn´t?

And what has the current generation to do with it, 75 years after?
Do you feel guilty for Hiroshima or Nagasaki, the bombing of Dresden, where 100 of thousands of civilians were killed?
What about the killing through starvation at the Rheinwiesen, against unarmed and surrendered soldiers of the Wehrmacht?
Is there a monument for that in the USA, like it is for the holocaust in the heart of Berlin?

There is no good in a war, on no side.
"Under weapons, the laws are silent."

I don´t want to wash anybody clean, what the Germans did in WWII was inconceivably and horrifying.
But I think we should spread the dirt a bit more evenly, when we throw around with it.

seanh · Jul 20, 2021

W54/XM-388 said:
The Germans didn't learn that lesson.
I'll bet if the government ordered them to help "escort" Jews to "safety places" for "their own protection", the police, military and most of the population would once again "Just Follow Orders," with their typical "Brain off just obey" stance.

You just described the police here in this country.

jbailey · Jul 20, 2021

Jayjay1 said:
There is a complete report about this on youtube, sadly it´s in German, it is called "The seven fallen brothers" .

Vielen Dank! Ich verstehe Deutsch (immerhin ein bisschen).

MtnCreek · Jul 20, 2021

Destroying a nation with collective guilt and immigration worked well on germany. Now it's our turn.

JakeM · Jul 20, 2021

Jayjay1 said:
Yes, there is something to that.
I mean, any nation would be in danger to follow bad leaders, but the Germans are trained to believe, that they are bad and have no right to exist, which is crap, because you can´t inherit guilt.

It begins in primary school and ends in college, then it continues in the media and the politicians are praying the same all day long.

Of course the Germans did probably the biggest war crimes in human history in WW II.

But which nation didn´t?

And what has the current generation to do with it, 75 years after?
Do you feel guilty for Hiroshima or Nagasaki, the bombing of Dresden, where 100 of thousands of civilians were killed?
What about the killing through starvation at the Rheinwiesen, against unarmed and surrendered soldiers of the Wehrmacht?
Is there a monument for that in the USA, like it is for the holocaust in the heart of Berlin?

There is no good in a war, on no side.
"Under weapons, the laws are silent."

I don´t want to wash anybody clean, what the Germans did in WWII was inconceivably and horrifying.
But I think we should spread the dirt a bit more evenly, when we throw around with it.

Russia and Japan were worse than Germany. Dresden wasn’t a war crime, 100s of thousands didn’t die. It was about 26,000.

JakeM · Jul 20, 2021

Thumper580 said:
5% being party members...yes. However, the German populace as a whole were in rapture over Hitler. Revered him as a God. In my "limited" reading on Hitler, the German people during that time period I have yet to uncover any significant evidence of protest or outrage on Hitler's actions or the direction he was taking the country. Obviously, disgust and disenchantment didn't appear until the end.... SIRHR may want to chime in.

Probably because he pulled them from the gutter, as well as controlled all sources of information. They believed that invading Poland was right. On top of that, because England and France declared war on Germany first. Hitler was able to “point out” that going to war with the western allies was a just cause because they declared war first. Then when it came to the USA, we were already in a state of war with Germany. That’s why Germany’s declaration of war against the USA, reads more like a conformation of something that was already in place, rather than an attack. If you were a German in the same situation, you would have done exactly what they did.

Jayjay1 · Jul 20, 2021

MtnCreek said:
Destroying a nation with collective guilt and immigration worked well on germany. Now it's our turn.

That´s how I see it happening worldwide.

Jayjay1 · Jul 20, 2021

JakeM said:
Russia and Japan were worse than Germany. Dresden wasn’t a war crime, 100s of thousands didn’t die. It was about 26,000.

How isn´t killing masses of civilians a war crime?
Would you say the same, if New York, Washington or San Francisco would have been bombed as Dresden was?

How is killing thousands of civilians not a war crime, in which world?

And the hundreds of thousands were a summary.
But if tenth or hundreds of thousands doesn´t make in any better.

JakeM · Jul 20, 2021

Jayjay1 said:
How isn´t killing masses of civilians a war crime?
Would you say the same, if New York, Washington or San Francisco would have been bombed as Dresden was?

How is killing thousands of civilians not a war crime, in which world?

And the hundreds of thousands were a summary.
But if tenth or hundreds of thousands doesn´t make in any better.

Dresden was a major supply chain to the eastern front. There were about 40,000 German troops in the area, being supplied by the rail system in the city. It was a military target. Now on the other hand, US fighters did strafe civilians regularly at the end. There is also little to no mention of the rape perpetrated by the US army in France.

hollowoutadime · Jul 20, 2021

Sadly, that was "acceptable" then, much like Ebonics was in California in 1996.

Kein Mitleid · Jul 20, 2021

JakeM said:
Dresden was a major supply chain to the eastern front. There were about 40,000 German troops in the area, being supplied by the rail system in the city. It was a military target. Now on the other hand, US fighters did strafe civilians regularly at the end. There is also little to no mention of the rape perpetrated by the US army in France.

A total of 208 cases suggests that those individuals should be responsible for their own actions rather than those actions being foisted onto the entire US army.

Compare to the communists on the other front.

JakeM · Jul 20, 2021

Kein Mitleid said:
A total of 208 cases suggests that those individuals should be responsible for their own actions rather than those actions being foisted onto the entire US army.

Compare to the communists on the other front.

The estimate is 14,000 from 1941, to 1945. I am totally aware of what the Soviets did. That’s why I said they were worse than Germany. Same with the Japanese.

fdkay · Jul 20, 2021

Jayjay1 said:
You never have met a German or have been to Germany.
Otherwise you wouldn´t think like this.

I think inhere are a lot soldiers who have served side by side with Germans overseas.
Everyone of them would tell you the same.

I've met Germans. Guess who our primary enemy was in the European theater in WWII.
I don't shed tears when our enemies die.

MtnCreek · Jul 20, 2021

fdkay said:
I've met Germans. Guess who our primary enemy was in the European theater in WWII.
I don't shed tears when our enemies die.

USSR, but we backed the commie fucks.

sirhrmechanic · Jul 20, 2021

Too soon?

Actually I love Germany and the people there.

But it was hard times. Brought on by weak men… there is a saying there somewhere…

Sirhr

BurtGummer · Jul 21, 2021

Maggot said:
War sucks for everyone except the military defense contractors.

And politicians getting rich off the mic

BurtGummer · Jul 21, 2021

MtnCreek said:
USSR, but we backed the commie fucks.

Well we backed the muzzies in Kosovo. So some things never change

srtsam · Jul 21, 2021

Hitler did so much good for the country …..early on. the germans
liked America and the English. I thought I read a longtime ago Hitler hoped the americans would be allies. I think his ” humble” goal of resurrecting Germany and regaining lost ground and pride due to the Versailles quickly turned into grand delusions of world domination after realizing the world was unwilling to check him back into place and the superior tactics, training, weapons the Germans had developed. They learned from their mistakes in the first war. I think perhaps the syphillus had a lot to do with the later decisions such as Barbarossa and the final solution which were the nails in their coffin. once they committed there was no turning back. He literally unleashed hell on earth for so many millions.

Jayjay1 · Jul 22, 2021

Let´s just go back to the actual story.

Who can imagine losing seven childs in a 23 months time span.
Not dying through an accident or a disease, killed in war instead.

A child after a child after a child after a child after a child after a child after a child.

In just 23 months, the postman brings one letter after the other, how can you live on, how can you stand up in the morning, not having the biggest fear of the postman bringing in the next letter?
How can you survive such an ongoing nightmare?

I really can´t and dont want to imagine something like that.

tomcatmv · Jul 22, 2021

Jayjay1 said:
Let´s just go back to the actual story.

Who can imagine losing seven childs in a 23 months time span.
Not dying through an accident or a disease, killed in war instead.

A child after a child after a child after a child after a child after a child after a child.

In just 23 months, the postman brings one letter after the other, how can you live on, how can you stand up in the morning, not having the biggest fear of the postman bringing in the next letter?
How can you survive such an ongoing nightmare?

I really can´t and dont want to imagine something like that.

Agreed. We lost our youngest son when he was 17. Believe me, losing a child is a pain you never fully recover from.

Peloton · Jul 22, 2021

Kein Mitleid said:
Or any other populace for the most part. Every country that has gone to fascism, socialism or communism has done so with a small minority leading the way.

You mean like the USA is doing right now? Other than complaining about it here on the hide or to close friends, how much public protesting have we done? Just sayin’

W54/XM-388 · Jul 22, 2021

Peloton said:
You mean like the USA is doing right now? Other than complaining about it here on the hide or to close friends, how much public protesting have we done? Just sayin’

Lots of public protesting was done back in 2020 and early 2021 and it went nowhere.

Protesting isn't going to do any good when your enemies control all the mass means of communications and dominate the cultural / propaganda wars.

We got here by the "good" folks being to busy to fight in the trenches of education, culture, media etc over a century.

You are going to have to get back to the starting line of winning the fight in education, culture, media, communication etc, if you want to get anything done.

brianf · Jul 22, 2021

Jayjay1 said:
How isn´t killing masses of civilians a war crime?
Would you say the same, if New York, Washington or San Francisco would have been bombed as Dresden was?

How is killing thousands of civilians not a war crime, in which world?

And the hundreds of thousands were a summary.
But if tenth or hundreds of thousands doesn´t make in any better.

Im here for the seven brothers story not history and issues that happen during war

war is horrible, good young people die and the ones who live are broken for the rest of their lives

but comparing atrocities like the rape and pillage of eastern block countries/russia and jews in train cars can not be compared to ineffective and erroneous military plans which thought bombing population centers would slow the war machine

yet those same ideas then came back around when the atomic bomb was created and the unmitigated killing of civilians saved lives in general

there is a huge difference in the reasoning between tossing a grenade into 2-3 captured soldiers because your squad is already undermanned (like so many old timers talk about, even ones in my family) and lining up a town in poland and killing dozens at a time because of disobedience

and everyone in the "enemy army" isnt evil...

sister in laws family was warned by 2 "very young german boys" that they are taking the town tomorrow morning and they should leave now and leave everything behind (Ukraine) to travel fast.

RUTGERS95 · Jul 22, 2021

so easy to be an armchair qb

if we had the same resolve and determination to protect American lives first, we would have been in the ME for 10+yrs. Lay waste, repeat if necessary and fk public opinion!

sirhrmechanic · Jul 22, 2021

RUTGERS95 said:
so easy to be an armchair qb

if we had the same resolve and determination to protect American lives first, we would have been in the ME for 10 DAYS. waste, repeat if necessary and fk public opinion!

FIFY

Pax Americana should involve making sure no one wants to feel Our wrath. Setting examples is core to that.

Sirhr

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