Four states in Northeast sign agreement to share gun data
Goal is to identify and arrest straw purchasers, dealers, traffickers and others.
justthenews.com
Curious as to your thoughts. Circumvention of gun laws?
So where do you think this is going?
- Thread starter rady
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justthenews.com
Curious as to your thoughts. Circumvention of gun laws?
Sounds like a money laundering scheme. Fleece the taxpayers of money under the guise of security.
They use the "war on drugs" as a model of how the program is going to work. That right there should stop the program. How's the "war on drugs" going?
They use the "war on drugs" as a model of how the program is going to work. That right there should stop the program. How's the "war on drugs" going?
NJ, Conn., NY & Penn.
It's symbolism over substance. But, It's probably a test case to see if holds water through the courts. Do it at the state level, work out any bugs before the Federal Gov't. tries something similiar.
But with the way the courts are now...it probably doesn't matter. Maybe it's just more overreach that will go un-challenged? There seems to be a wave of buraucracy crashing all around us so it might be just the next thing being imposed.
Whatever the case...they are lying about their intentions.
It's symbolism over substance. But, It's probably a test case to see if holds water through the courts. Do it at the state level, work out any bugs before the Federal Gov't. tries something similiar.
But with the way the courts are now...it probably doesn't matter. Maybe it's just more overreach that will go un-challenged? There seems to be a wave of buraucracy crashing all around us so it might be just the next thing being imposed.
Whatever the case...they are lying about their intentions.
The war on drugs made some people very rich.
Do not believe for a second that this is about stopping the "gun violence" because it is not. Violent crime could be stopped virtually overnight if criminals were locked up, instead we have activist prosecutors and judges that refuse to get these people off the streets.
It's a very small percentage of the population committing these crimes. Police arrest them, then the activists in the judicial system turn them back out just as quick as they came in. It could end tomorrow if the right actions are taken, but they won't be. We don't have a gun violence problem, we have an asshole problem in the court system. Fix that and crime rates drop as quick as the VP drops to her knees and sucks her way to the next job.
If anything, this is probably a 4-state fast and furious program to get more guns into more bad guys hands.
It's a very small percentage of the population committing these crimes. Police arrest them, then the activists in the judicial system turn them back out just as quick as they came in. It could end tomorrow if the right actions are taken, but they won't be. We don't have a gun violence problem, we have an asshole problem in the court system. Fix that and crime rates drop as quick as the VP drops to her knees and sucks her way to the next job.
If anything, this is probably a 4-state fast and furious program to get more guns into more bad guys hands.
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NWO, soros,Bloomberg, moms demand dicks, gabby gifford, who knows the truth these days....
Doc
Dr. Peter McCullough 'Therapeutic Nihilism And Untested Novel Therapies' | AAPS
Peter McCullough speaks at the 78th Annual Meeting of the Association of American Physicians and Surgeons on October 2, 2021.
rumble.com
I didn't think PA would be on the list but guess the blue wave is getting them.
"Violent crimes have surged nationwide amid the COVID-19 pandemic. Nationally, FBI data shows that violent crime increased 5.6% in 2020 from 2019, while murders and nonnegligent manslaughters increased 29.4%."
No shit, what do you think happens when thugs roam free? This has nothing to do with gun violence..
"Violent crimes have surged nationwide amid the COVID-19 pandemic. Nationally, FBI data shows that violent crime increased 5.6% in 2020 from 2019, while murders and nonnegligent manslaughters increased 29.4%."
No shit, what do you think happens when thugs roam free? This has nothing to do with gun violence..
eTrace apparently is something the ATF already has in operation that any law enforcement agency can use in the course of a criminal investigation. So this "agreement" between the 4 states seems somewhat redundant, unless they are just agreeing to cooperate with each other...which I assume they probably already do.
That eTrace is kinda scary...so if I buy and then sell a gun legally, and somewhere down the road someone commits a crime with it, my name pops up and I get snarled into that mess?
That eTrace is kinda scary...so if I buy and then sell a gun legally, and somewhere down the road someone commits a crime with it, my name pops up and I get snarled into that mess?
The call goes like this “did you own x, and who did you sell it to? Ok thanks” if you did a 4473 they already know you had it. They’re just looking for the end of the line. You aren’t getting “snarled” they’re confirming you don’t own it.eTrace apparently is something the ATF already has in operation that any law enforcement agency can use in the course of a criminal investigation. So this "agreement" between the 4 states seems somewhat redundant, unless they are just agreeing to cooperate with each other...which I assume they probably already do.
That eTrace is kinda scary...so if I buy and then sell a gun legally, and somewhere down the road someone commits a crime with it, my name pops up and I get snarled into that mess?
It’s like any other investigation they’re removing people from their list.
You have to face one fact that buying guns legally is the stupidest move possible in our ever turning communist surge and government over reach. Criminals don't have to go through the process of submitting a stool specimen to purchase a firearm. Criminals may not be smart but their 2A rights are never infringed upon unlike the legal gun owner.
Some would do well to read this.
They are trying to make criminals out of citizens by fiat.
R
I don't think you'll know you have broken a law. They are vaguely written and subjective, at best. They are open to interpretation and subject to selective enforcement based on which side SJW continuum you fall.
Maybe some of you guys are more in tune with these things than I, but does this sound like the beginnings of a national gun registry? I agree with Smitty above.
If there is a 4473 showing I sold it to someone else, why would they even bother with me? I have no clue who I sold any of my guns to, I don't keep a record of that, unless it's a rifle that I sold privately (legal here in PA). They already know it changed hands. The only person they should be questioning is the last owner of record.
You have a lot more faith than I do...just sayin'...
You don’t do 4473 for person to person sales here, hence the trace.
I don’t have faith in anyone, but I know the business pretty well.
So it is now official:
www.theepochtimes.com
4 States in Northeastern US Sign Pact to Share Data on Guns
www.theepochtimes.com
They are sharing info on guns used in crimes.
Not sure that's an issue for me. It's already in the local police database.
Not sure that's an issue for me. It's already in the local police database.
If you sold the gun you are obviously innocent until proven guilty and could legally tell the ATF to fuck off. But if the gun has been used in a crime obviously it makes sense to give them whatever you have.
I just find it so stupid that there are folks who insist on using an FFL when selling a gun privately. They think it offers them protection. It doesn't. Innocent until proven guilty does. Also not being a dick to the AFT guys helps.
Folks don't realize that the 4473 form is a PERMANENT record of who has what gun and this record is actually or de facto in the hands of the federal government. Germany proved this was a bad idea.
I just find it so stupid that there are folks who insist on using an FFL when selling a gun privately. They think it offers them protection. It doesn't. Innocent until proven guilty does. Also not being a dick to the AFT guys helps.
Folks don't realize that the 4473 form is a PERMANENT record of who has what gun and this record is actually or de facto in the hands of the federal government. Germany proved this was a bad idea.
It's none of your business what anyone does.
You should.....mind your own business
Many who feel the same, here in Canada, have discovered their faith in the integrity of system was unsound. There are some who still trumpet “the government won’t do that to us” while being bent over every day. It’s almost like they are willing to trade uncertainty for the feeling of security watched over by a benevolent socialist government. All the folks in the US that don’t understand this are supporting the journey to becoming Canada.
Your average Mary Jane Rottencrotch you dated in Junior High that reappeared at your High School reunion as a twice di-vorced Biden supporting, anti-gun activist.
I agree. It sounds like a good thing, and fuck criminals…
However, I was not born last night.
This will be abused by the totalitarian regimes in those North East shitholes before the ink is dry. You can tell these motherfuckers are lying, because their lips are moving. I trust them as far as I can throw my house, and if you trust them you’re an ignorant child.
However, I was not born last night.
This will be abused by the totalitarian regimes in those North East shitholes before the ink is dry. You can tell these motherfuckers are lying, because their lips are moving. I trust them as far as I can throw my house, and if you trust them you’re an ignorant child.
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I'm trying to remember from decades ago conversation with an ffl. Seems that he said that all gun sales were kept at the state police level and no further. Correct? Then why the fed forms when you make a purchase?
My understanding is the shop keeps the 4473. In order for the feds to come looking for a gun, say used in a crime...
They'd look to see if it was manufactured/imported whatever. It'll show as being manufactured/imported whatever and delivered to XYZ gunshop for sale.
Then they have to physically send somebody to wherever the fuck that is, and go through the records, paper/digital what have you, and find the sale.
Maybe sold to ABC citizen.
Then they have to physically drive over to wherever the address is on the 4473 of ABC citizen was on the 4473.
Did ABC citizen move? Well shit. Now we're searching property records, forwarding addresses, etc. trying to track it down.
It's not as easy as it sounds and it's a gigantic use of manpower and logistics. Say you do find the gun and address of ABC citizen and plan to confiscate it or whatever.
Well, you'd be stupid to just send a fedboi over to the house, what if the ABC citizen is dangerous? Now you're doing records search for criminal history, social media, social credit or whatever bullshit threat assessment they want to make.
If you're timid they send a glowie to intimidate you into turning over your shit. That's still more man hours for the research and sending out the collector.
If you're actually dangerous they're going to have to put a team together. That's on site recon, pattern of life development, then closing down the area and trying to make the grab.
That's Boku man hours and resources. Frankly, it's probably too much to dedicate to somebody who hasn't done anything yet.
Point being, door to door is a logistical non starter.
They'll make everything illegal and just try to pick people off one at a time like whack a mole as the threats present themselves. They literally don't have the resources for wholesale seizure.
We spent 20 years in Afghanistan and they took it back in less than a month. The only requirement for the success of an insurgency is for it to survive.
They'd look to see if it was manufactured/imported whatever. It'll show as being manufactured/imported whatever and delivered to XYZ gunshop for sale.
Then they have to physically send somebody to wherever the fuck that is, and go through the records, paper/digital what have you, and find the sale.
Maybe sold to ABC citizen.
Then they have to physically drive over to wherever the address is on the 4473 of ABC citizen was on the 4473.
Did ABC citizen move? Well shit. Now we're searching property records, forwarding addresses, etc. trying to track it down.
It's not as easy as it sounds and it's a gigantic use of manpower and logistics. Say you do find the gun and address of ABC citizen and plan to confiscate it or whatever.
Well, you'd be stupid to just send a fedboi over to the house, what if the ABC citizen is dangerous? Now you're doing records search for criminal history, social media, social credit or whatever bullshit threat assessment they want to make.
If you're timid they send a glowie to intimidate you into turning over your shit. That's still more man hours for the research and sending out the collector.
If you're actually dangerous they're going to have to put a team together. That's on site recon, pattern of life development, then closing down the area and trying to make the grab.
That's Boku man hours and resources. Frankly, it's probably too much to dedicate to somebody who hasn't done anything yet.
Point being, door to door is a logistical non starter.
They'll make everything illegal and just try to pick people off one at a time like whack a mole as the threats present themselves. They literally don't have the resources for wholesale seizure.
We spent 20 years in Afghanistan and they took it back in less than a month. The only requirement for the success of an insurgency is for it to survive.
Seems I remember a recent article about a school shooting in Texas. Thought I heard he was back home the next day. Guess there's no existing laws for this so we need more.
Some states use their own version of NICS but the form is still federal. It must be kept for 20 years or until cessation of business. If business is ceased before the 20 year mark all forms must be sent to ATF.
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