10/22 or M&P

[flyfisher117]

What would YOU choose.

Smith and Wesson M&P 15-22
or
Ruger 10/22 Target Tactical

I don't own my own .22lr my dad has just let me "take over" his .22's and shoot them and use them as i please but when i leave for college im going to need my own.

Im wanting the gun for an all around .22, one that can be used for shooting whistle pigs, one that can be used to walk around in the woods and chase squirrels or walk around the utah desert and chase rabbits. And most importantly i want it to be FUN.

Heres what i like and dislike about both.

S&W:
-It is light weight and it is "tacticool"
-It is based on an AR, ive been wanting a true ar but cant afford .223 ammo
- it does have a giant magazine which one make it harder for shooting off of a rest (and if i get the smith and wesson in planning on mounting a red dot style sight)
-im not a fan of the all plastic body
-i like the capacity of the magazine
-kind of expensive
Ruger
-I HATE how hard they are to clean (the S&W you pop the pins and pull the bolt out the back) where the ruger you take it all apart
-i know i will like it
-its heavy not sure the exact weight but im guessing it would be hard to walk around with then free hand shoot?
-ive never found an aftermarket high cap. magazine that my dads 10/22 could shoot efficiently
-dont like loading the magazines, my thumb/finger gets tired
-reminds me of my Remington 700 SPS Tac, but it shoots cheaper ammo

What would you do?

 

[jbuck88]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

The Ruger is tried and true. That would be my choice of the two.

But how about a dedicated upper and real lower so that you can expand to .223 later. Not sure what the M&P's are running, but you can find the dedicated uppers used then get a cheap lower and your set.

 

[pyplynr]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

I just sold my 10/22 and bought a Nordic Components dedicated upper. I'm really impressed with it. The new 30 round mags and a 50 round drum from Black Dog make it real fun.

 

[shoot4fun]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

M&P15-22
I have one and it is loads of fun.
Plus it looks cool

 

[flyfisher117]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

I dont want a dedicated .22lr upper thats just starting to get out of what i want to spend.

the 10/22 has been around for ever (my dad is one he got back when you could buy them for $85. and its still running strong, the only thing turning me away from it is how much of a PITA it is to clean and the magazines. The smith and wesson the only thing thats a turn off for me is its a $500 piece of plastic.

 

[Oodin]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

Get the 10/22.

Magazine capacity isn't that big of a deal and if you want high capacity you might need to try a couple different brands before you find one yours likes.

I don't know how much you plan on shooting, but 10/22's run forever, you might only need to clean it every ammo brick or so.

 

[Austincqc]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

I agree with you on the PITA cleaning for the 10-22 but just love it. If you pick up a cheap one, you can slap one of the Troy kits on it to get the "tacticool" look and feel that you're going for. Plus it's all metal! I think...

 

[jbuck88]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

For $500 you should be able to get a used spikes, CMMG, Tac Sol, Nordic Upper and Plum crazy lower or other cheap lower. Definately a better product if you are leaning towards the AR pattern.

I have the Tactical Solutions Upper and it isn't in the same class as the M&P.

 

[flyfisher117]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

a brick is 500 rounds correct? It depends usually during the summer a brick lasts me about a week (sometimes 2). sometimes it lasts me a weekend just depends on what i end up doing. during the school year a brick lasts me a month or more.

To my knowledge all that isnt metal on the 10/22's are the triggers themselves and the mag release buttons.

anyone here have a 10/22 TT? what is it like to stand and free hand shoot without using a sling or anything else as aid? Im headed to town tomorow and hopefully i can find a store that will let me shoulder them and see what they feel like.

 

[flyfisher117]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

Are these dedicated uppers any good?

Last time i looked all i could find were the $600 spikes uppers. But are thise CMMG uppers any good?
What kind of magazine do they require? and can they be shipped to my home without going to a FFL?

 

[244]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: the noobie</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Are these dedicated uppers any good?

Last time i looked all i could find were the $600 spikes uppers. But are thise CMMG uppers any good?
What kind of magazine do they require? and can they be shipped to my home without going to a FFL? </div></div>

I have no personal experience with the dedicated CMMG upper. Sorry.

Regarding your second question though, you can get the CMMG magazines directly from their website. I BELIEVE the Atchison compatible magazines also work. CMMG's website will give you more information.

For your third question, yes, AR uppers can be shipped directly to your home. Only the serial number (frame/receiver) portion has to be transferred to you through an FFL.

 

[drmarc]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

One thing not mentioned is the M&P15-22 would allow you to train and become comfortable with the AR-15 platform. You state you want an AR but cannot get one at the moment, somewhere down the road you will likely own one and then you will have all the time invested learning the M&P15-22 in your pocket. The form, function and ergonomics are identical to an AR in 5.56 so it's win win in my book.

JM2C

 

[NUTT]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

I say 10/22; they are tried & true. The "Tactical Target" model is set up from the factory very similar to how mine is set up as well. You can run a red dot on it if you want; I actually just ordered a Primary Arms red dot for mine.

Cleaning a 10/22 isn't all that hard either. I think it only takes me about 10 minutes from start to finish.

 

[Timo Turl]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

M&P is great fun, good to school you on the AR platform and has lots of after market accessories. However, it isn't the most accurate rifle IMHO and that might be accentuated with a red dot sight. If you are interested in moving onto the AR later then the M&P is probably a good entry but give consideration to building your own from used Spikes and the like. You will learn a lot in the process.

 

[former naval person]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

10-22. Start lite, and add accessories/improvements as you and your finances improve. Go to "Rimfire Central"...they have comment pages and directions for doing about anything you want to the 10-22. From trigger jobs, to bedding, new barrels...lots and lots of expert (and non-expert) opinions. As is this. JMHO

 

[RicosRevenge]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

Steal your dad's 10/22... add a decent barrel for a couple hundred, add the Voquartsen trigger kit (not the whole assembly) and do the mod for the auto bolt release yourself.

Now you're in for under $300 so add an inexpensive optic (for now) and shoot that for a bit until you track down a Boyd's Tacticool stock.

Next, when talking about .22s - I don't EVER want to hear the words "its too heavy" from a college kid again... the real M4 and M14 our guys in the sandbox are carrying weigh a heck of a lot more.

 

[flyfisher117]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: drmarc</div><div class="ubbcode-body">One thing not mentioned is the M&P15-22 would allow you to train and become comfortable with the AR-15 platform. You state you want an AR but cannot get one at the moment, somewhere down the road you will likely own one and then you will have all the time invested learning the M&P15-22 in your pocket. The form, function and ergonomics are identical to an AR in 5.56 so it's win win in my book.

JM2C </div></div>

Thats one of the biggest reasons i want the M&P is because its cheap to shoot so i can shoot the hell out of it and get familiar with how an Ar feels and just experiment. Then when i get my AR in a few years (3 or 4) I will already be somewhat proficient so im not spending big bucks on .223/5.56 ammo and learning how to shoot that. Yes its lighter than a true ar but its still got to be similar in the way it handles.
If i had the money i would get both and get the best of both worlds.

 

[shoot4fun]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

M&P15 22 is one of the best training guns out there for an inexpensive AR training rifle.
You can get the funky Ruger attempt but it is definitely not the same.
Don't get me wrong here, I have a couple of 10-22 rifles and they are top notch. But from what you way you're looking for the M&P seems the best bang for your buck.

 

[flyfisher117]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RicosRevenge</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Next, when talking about .22s - I don't EVER want to hear the words "its too heavy" from a college kid again... the real M4 and M14 our guys in the sandbox are carrying weigh a heck of a lot more. </div></div>

I agree and understand but here it is coming from my point of view. I love running around in the woods chasing squirrels and i love running around down on my grandparents farm chasing rabbits. Its fun. But i dont think i will have as much fun lugging around a heavy little gun.

 

[NUTT]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: the noobie</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thats one of the biggest reasons i want the M&P is because its cheap to shoot so i can shoot the hell out of it and get familiar with how an Ar feels and just experiment. Then when i get my AR in a few years (3 or 4) I will already be somewhat proficient so im not spending big bucks on .223/5.56 ammo and learning how to shoot that.</div></div>

I know a recruiter or 2 that can help you with just this thing!

Or, you could just get the 10/22 and work on shooting. Lots of shooting with that will increase your familiarity with firearms in general. Once you can afford to step up to the full size AR, do it. While the M&P 22 is close to an AR, it isn't the same thing. Controls, mags, weight & recoil are all going to feel a lot different.

22's are good and economical training solutions. I think you are on the right track with either option, I've personally gone the 10/22 route. I should mention that I did that over 10 years ago when 22 uppers / clones weren't readily available.

 

[JMC]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

I don't have any experience with the M+P but I do with the 10-22. It's like the 350 Chevy of 22's so you can get a tons of aftermarket stuff.

I have the Sig 522. It uses the Blackdog Magazines rather that proprietary mags like the S+W does. And as far as a fun gun it rocks. And as a bonus it comes with a threaded barrel too.

I got mine here http://www.budsgunshop.com for $375 in green.

 

[BX1129]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

I third that.. M&P is definitely very AR like and a great training tool if you use AR types for work/self-defense. I say accuracy wise the M&P is close to a ruger 10/22.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: the noobie</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: drmarc</div><div class="ubbcode-body">One thing not mentioned is the M&P15-22 would allow you to train and become comfortable with the AR-15 platform. You state you want an AR but cannot get one at the moment, somewhere down the road you will likely own one and then you will have all the time invested learning the M&P15-22 in your pocket. The form, function and ergonomics are identical to an AR in 5.56 so it's win win in my book.

JM2C </div></div>

Thats one of the biggest reasons i want the M&P is because its cheap to shoot so i can shoot the hell out of it and get familiar with how an Ar feels and just experiment. Then when i get my AR in a few years (3 or 4) I will already be somewhat proficient so im not spending big bucks on .223/5.56 ammo and learning how to shoot that. Yes its lighter than a true ar but its still got to be similar in the way it handles.
If i had the money i would get both and get the best of both worlds.
</div></div>

 

[marshallwk]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

Is the NC22 an option I can use a lower I already have, set it up similarly and keep my trigger the same. Win win.

 

[flyfisher117]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

Made it to town today and after driving around for an hour fount a store with the 10/22 in stock. Fondled the gun for a few minutes and liked the feel but don't like holding it free hand, maybe it was just me but it felt a wee little nose heavy.

Found a store with the plain m&p and the MOE version. DO NOT like the plain one but I do like the MOE the extra money is well worth the IMO nicer stock, grip, and sights. Really liking the 15-22 moe but still not sure. I'm gonna ask around town and see if a buddy has one I can shoot

 

[gotzero]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

I ended up with the stock 15-22 after the Magpul one hit the shelves. All of the controls are in the right places, but I do wish they would have moved the pin holes just a bit so it would fit on other lowers. The different pins do make sense though, since they would not want people putting normal uppers on the plastic lower.

I am happy with my purchase, it is fun, it is accurate, it is inexpensive, and as long as the first round loads, it is very reliable.

 

[flyfisher117]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

Anyone seen this nutnfancy guys videos? pretty knowledgeable or a "keyboard commando"?
<object width="425" height="350"> <param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/hiPgTlKYikM&feature=channel_video_title"></param> <param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param> <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/hiPgTlKYikM&feature=channel_video_title" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"> </embed></object>

Ive watched a few of his reviews and used them and purchased the item, and so far hes good on his reviews i havent been disapointed in anything hes said is good.

 

[smokshwn]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

The Nordic Components and Tactical Solutions dedicated uppers are light years better than the M&P.

I believe Nordic is giving a 10% discount to Hide members so the upper costs $450.......

Add an inexpensive lower and you are at $700 bones which is a little more than the M&P but significantly better. Not to mention more of a lifetime gun that can change and be altered with your tastes.

Use this as your first lesson in the gun realm of how much better it is to save for a couple more months and buy a quality piece rather than a piece of junk that proves to be no bargain.

 

[maladat]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: the noobie</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Made it to town today and after driving around for an hour fount a store with the 10/22 in stock. Fondled the gun for a few minutes and liked the feel but don't like holding it free hand, maybe it was just me but it felt a wee little nose heavy.</div></div>

The nice thing about the 10/22 is that when you feel the need to upgrade, you can put the gun in an excellent stock purpose-built for offhand shooting for $140 (Revolution Yukon), can put a true match-quality, accurate barrel on for $175 (KID), and can put a world-class two stage match trigger on it for $290 (KID).

My 10/22 with a KID barrel shoots sub-MOA 10-shot groups at 100 yards with Wolf Match Extra and the Revolution stock is super comfortable offhand.

 

[flyfisher117]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

Im thinking a 10/22 with a Blue (color blue) tactical solutions barrel and an "electric blue" as they call it Stock from Boyds or Stockys. It would end up being close to the same price as the M&P but i know it will last till i have kids and heck even maybe till they have kids. Will the Plastic M&P? it might but its PLASTIC and theres no telling what there long term wear and tear is like...

 

[michshot]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

I have both and will tell you that you cant go wrong with either. I will say, with the M&P you get what you see but with the 10/22 upgrade options are endless!

 

[flyfisher117]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

Alrighty all no need to worry about the 10/22 my dad sold me his for $85 (what he gave for it new) so im going to take it and leave it as it is for now.

Now im going to stick with my original plan and get an Ar based .22lr.

Smith and Wesson M&P
or
This upper with a Complete Plum Crazy lower?

M&P comes with magazine and iron sights, but with the CMMG i can buy a 5.56 upper latter on and upgrade the rest as i go or someday just invest in a nice upper

 

[RUTGERS95]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

I had the 10/22 and sold it for the m&p 15-22. the m&p is incredibly light, accurate, easy to clean, looks and feels just like it's bigger brother, costs only $400 for the whole thing, is polymer (some don't like this but I love it, it's a .22 for pete's sake), accurate, can have all the accessories you want etc....

head on over to the smith and wesson forums as there is a huge following over there of the m&p. I love it and never looked back although, the 10/22 is an outstanding platform....

 

[DrtFrmr]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

I've had an M&P for a few months now and it is one fun gun. I've blazed through 500+ rounds many an afternoon which is something I don't do on my .223

I've never had a 10/22 nor shot one so I may be biased.

 

[triceratops3]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

I've had a ruger 10/22 for about 5 years now and have thousands of rounds through it. It works perfectly all the time, except when i use really cheap ammo. I can get decent groups with it and i can hit any target that i want (cans, etc.) with it. I'm very happy with it and it will continue to serve me well for years to come.

I think you'd be happy with either choice you make but in the long run i think the 10/22 will be better imho.

just my .02

 

[silver78]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

I own both - a tough choice - I like them both a lot. I think it depends. If you are really focused on learning the AR platform then go with the S&W. If you do not care about the tacticool look and just want something to shoot - and perhaps modify later go with the 10-22. The 10-22 has so many more options for add ons.

 

[wdhigh]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

First off I would look for a better price on the s&w. Second I would save my money and buy a used 10/22 in a pawn shop and build it how you want. Keep an eye on midway because the run sales on often for 10/22 parts. I would say hold out for a all metal trigger guard, but recent experiments for us have indicated otherwise. The only thing ruger on mine is the receiver and bolt. They are super easy to modify yourself and can shoot very well in stock form.

 

[flyfisher117]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

I got a 10//22 my dad sold me his for what he paid for it 20 or so years ago... Maybe older he got it the third year they were out I think. Anyways it's al
Metal and for now it shoots just fine.

I'm going to leave it stock and peruse my dream of an AR style .22. So would a smith and wesson 15-22 or a CMMG dedicated upper on a plum crazy lower be best? The plum crazy could accept a centerfire upper here in a few years but the smith and wesson comes with iron sights.

 

[Guns4570]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

noobie, you just listed the best way if u can swing it. The Plum Crazy lower gives u the flexibility of adding a centerfire upper later on should you feel so inclined. However, I like that M&P...Jerry M was doing crazy things with one on a shooting show on the Outdoor Channel.

 

[maladat]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

I have never had an AR conversion upper or an M&P 15-22 but if the conversion uppers are reliable I would much rather have a conversion upper on a real AR-15 lower than a complete dedicated rifle that looks like an AR-15 but isn't.

 

[flyfisher117]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

I don't see any major problems with the m&p rifles and I honestly like their magazines better than the black dog magazines because the black dog I guess can be a pain too load. The m&p also comes ready to shoot out of the box where the AR upper would require me to save up more money for a set of irons or the red dot that I'm wanting.

I think I might stick with the m&p and just shoot the crud out of it then decide if I really want to get into centerfire AR rifles.

Oh and sorry for the spelling it's a PITA to type on my iPad

 

[dragonlvg]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

one note,
Used 10/22s are getting harder to find, at least around here. I hit every pawn shop in billings and have orders in with a few dealers in nearby towns. going on 4 months now with no usable results, teh 3 that have been on the shelf have all been here for that long but are not suitable for my project. they are also at or above new retail price.

 

[jlaw973]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

If you want to get an AR eventually anyway then go ahead and buy the dedicated upper and a lower that way you only have to buy a .223 upper later. Or buy one of CMMG's bargain bin rifles for around $600 and I'll make you a deal on a CMMG .22 conversion.

 

[breachersup]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

I've shot the 10/22 alot, but I own the S&W M&P MOE.

From my experience, the both jam and misfire about the same.

Cleaning the MOE is simliar to cleaining the M4 carbine, which is simple.

The all plastic does not bother me cuz I'm not gonna put the MOE through the same abuse that I would put a real battle rifle through. So rather, it just ensures even less cleaing cuz all that plastic can't rust.

Depending on how you use it, you can build alot of the same muscle memory with the MOE as you would with an m4 throwin .223

I would give you the same advice as I give everyone else who asks me about buying something in 22 LR. I say "Go out and cry and buy once. Buy the nicest thing out there, because every time you pull the trigger you are saving money compared to shooting the same thing in .223 or .308"

Another big plus about the Smith and Wesson is that alot of the same accessories that you will some day own for your M4 are totally compatible with the M&P 15 22. - most mag pouches, grips, lights, lasers, rail protectors, slings, optics etc etc. - gotta remember that because thats just money in the bank in the long run.

 

[breachersup]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

Oh and I should add- I'm at about 2,000 rounds through my S&W M&P 15 22 MOE and it gets more and more reliable the more I shoot.

I guess it just needs some good wear and break on both the rifle and the magazines. Though it costs more, high powered ammo will make it function better - really driving that bolt back every time.

- Also, a piece broke on my MOE. I called Smith and Wesson and before I could finish my sentence, the gentleman was asking for my address so he could send a prepaid shipping label to get it fixed ASAP at no cost to me whatsoever.

 

[MJPLEO]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

Sir,

Get a TacSol upper for your AR lower (assuming you have an AR). I have the one with the smooth foregrip and threaded comp. I run an Eotech 512 for the optic. It has been flawless since day one and eats everything. Just keep it well oiled and it will run like a sewing machine. The guys I work with love it when I bring it out for our LE qual days.

Good Luck,
Matt

 

[justme]

Re: 10/22 or M&P

Never used the S&W but own 3 10/22's and love them