1903A3 ADVICE

[Tactical]

Picked up a Smith Corona 03A3 in original Collector Grade Condition. Original everything from 1943.

My plan was to build into a 03A4 but this is so nice I am affraid to change anything.

So should I sell to get 03A4 or modify this one?

 

[DevilDoc224]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

Please don't modify this rifle. Keep it original. There are some reproductions of the 03A4 out there. Check here http://www.gibbsrifle.com/1903-a4_sniper_rifle.html.

 

[Robb]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

You can do what I did, find a 1903 that was modified for a scope already (for hunting purposes or??). Plenty of these were modified for hunting use in earlier years when these rifles were plentiful.
Many of us like to keep them in thier original military configuration for historical purposes; it seems a shame to take a peice of american history and drill n tap her when there are many of them already out there.
Find a nice barreled action already drilled n tapped and use it for your 03a4 project. Than post plenty of pics!!!!
Good luck.
Robb

 

[BasraBoy]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

Mike, if it is a collector grade rifle and you paid a premium for it, do not cut it up.

There should be a ready supply of suitable rifles for use as a donor for this type of project (at least that is what I have found with my Enfield, Mauser and now 1903A1 project rifles).

A good, well maintained/serviced and restored original rifle with any worn parts replaced will serve very well.

Most important is that the chosen rifle shoots well - that is the foundation for any succesful project in my view.

Just remember that these project rifles will never have the value of an original. If that is your prime objective, best to buy an original.

They're out there (even on this side of the pond):

http://www.kirkemmerich.co.uk/fac-rifles...4-sniper-rifle/

http://www.kirkemmerich.co.uk/fac-rifles...4-sniper-rifle/

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DevilDoc224</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> There are some reproductions of the 03A4 out there. Check here http://www.gibbsrifle.com/1903-a4_sniper_rifle.html. </div></div>

Sorry but these Gibbs repro's are probably the last thing you should consider.

If in doubt, follow this link and read the review from the smith who works on my vintage rifles (he know's what he is talking about) :

http://www.thamesvalleyguns.co.uk/

Read the "Building a Springfield Sniper Rifle" article in the "Armourer's Notes" pull down menu on the left of the home page.

For those who either don't have the budget for an original or who do not want to expose a valuable/irreplaceable rifle to the risks of everyday or regular use. a project/replica rifle done well with an appropriate investment in time and effort, is a pleasure to own and shoot (whether for range/competition or hunting).

Done badly (like the Gibbs 03A4 above) they can be a real nightmare!

Paul was lucky, he has the skill, experience and tools to put problems he encountered right (plus it is a valuable exercise for him as part of his business)....most of us aren't that lucky and a similar experience could put a large hole in your finances and probably put you off owning a classic rifle for life

 

[armydog]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

I'm in the exact same boat, got a Smith Corona, mostly correct to make an 03A4 clone, what I plan on doing is offering to TRADE even up for a Remington of a collector want the Smith. in fact if any collector wants to trade PM me or were gonna start drilling.

 

[ThrottleJ]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: armydog</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm in the exact same boat, got a Smith Corona, mostly correct to make an 03A4 clone, what I plan on doing is offering to TRADE even up for a Remington of a collector want the Smith. in fact if any collector wants to trade PM me or were gonna start drilling.</div></div>

Pm sent

 

[2clicks]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

Go guy a $350 1903A3 someone has already monkeyed with. I'd really like to scope my 03A3 but I can't bring myself to wreck a perfectly good rifle. And I see no other way of properly mounting a base without jackin up the receiver.

 

[bcw1284]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

you need to find a bastardized pawn shop rifle and start there.

They can go from this:

to this:

with a little money and a lot of elbow grease!

 

[ArcticLight]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

You can pick up a good used springfield "Sporterized" for under $300 at any gun store these days...

Keep it original!!

 

[bcw1284]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

I paid $255 for my donor with the scope, rings, & bases.

 

[armydog]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ArcticLight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You can pick up a good used springfield "Sporterized" for under $300 at any gun store these days...

Keep it original!! </div></div>

Not really, been looking for one like that, no luck so far.

 

[m1sniper]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

Not mine,and not associated with the seller:
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=249446044

 

[ranger1183]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: m1sniper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Not mine,and not associated with the seller:
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=249446044 </div></div>
Picture 13 is really and truly <span style="font-style: italic"><span style="font-weight: bold">UGLY!</span></span>

 

[armydog]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

good opening bid, wonder what it will end up going for, the appraised price seems a little low for an original 03A4 even without the scope.

 

[bcw1284]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

A slip from a pawn shop doesn't mean a whole lot to me. However, there are ways to tell that it is original. Note that the receiver stamping is clocked so that it is not obscured by the base. The regular 03-a3 is not stamped in this manner.

Also note the taper on the rear of the redfield base, milspec mounts were done like this. Very few civilian mounts have this taper (I have one), and they can still be distinguished. The civy mounts are engraved "redfield" & patent # in front of the action port, the milspec are not. That base REALLY needs to be shimmed. IIRC, numrich has (or had at one time) shims.

The bolt is correct for the standardized version, though there are a few weird ones out there that look a little different (early models?).

Model 1903A4 rifles fall in three serial number blocks: 3407088 to 34427087, 4992001 to 4999045, and Z4000000 to Z4002920. It is speculated but not verified that scrapped receivers which were recovered had a letter 'A' hand stamped before the serial number. The auction rifle's serial # is in the correct range.

 

[swift09]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: armydog</div><div class="ubbcode-body">good opening bid, wonder what it will end up going for, the appraised price seems a little low for an original 03A4 even without the scope.</div></div>

im wondering the same thing. i paid 2500 for mine. did some research and found out if was one of the first 1000 made too. however, a genius, at the gunstore looked at the serial number and told me since the last 2 digits were 51 it was made in 1951. wish he was rich cause i would have made him a "real good" deal haha

 

[Clark]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

10 years ago you could say, "Take a $600 1903 Springfield, add $600 worth of gunsmithing, and voila, you have a rifle worth $150."

My father got out of WWII and bought a 1903 for $39.95 at Sears and Roebuck with his $20/week for 20 weeks unemployment. He got a marksmanship badge when he was in basic, and he wanted to relive that.

 

[ArcticLight]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: armydog</div><div class="ubbcode-body">good opening bid, wonder what it will end up going for, the appraised price seems a little low for an original 03A4 even without the scope. </div></div>

That's not an original, if you look you can see the 03-A3

AND HTE LAST DAMN time someone did this I emailed and told them and they complained and locked my account out - It's WRONG for people to try to sell things off as fakes.

To teh best of my knowledge it should be a CLEAN 03-A4 Not an 1903-A<span style="text-decoration: line-through">3</span>4

 

[mtlucas0311]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

I'm certainly no expert, but I don't think that's true. I too, don't think that appraisal is particularly professional or significant, but if you go to the NRA firearms museum website, they have excellent pictures of their displays. if you go to "ever vigilant", in case 65, there is an 03-A4. If you zoom in, it is stamped "MODEL 03-A3".

I do agree with you 100% that, unfortunately, there are tons of fakes on GB. And its a shame. They really should take steps to try and minimize the flagrant fakes that get listed.

 

[bcw1284]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

maybe someone more knowledgeable than me will chime in, but there were some receivers recovered from scrap and made into a4's... perhaps that is one? The stamping IS clocked correctly out from under the base... otherwise, they look like this:

I'm not saying you're wrong, but if it is a fake someone went to a lot of trouble to re-roll mark it just to botch it up with that stamp.

 

[swift09]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

http://www.olive-drab.com/od_other_firearms_rifle_m1903a4.php
this is a site i found explaining the a3 and a4 stamps

http://www.milsurps.com/index.php
this website has a forum dedicated to the 1903, but all military rifles as well. people here are very helpful with dates of manufacture and proof marks

http://www.remingtonsociety.com/rsa/questions/barrelcodes
this website lists the a block of serial numbers by month of manufacturing

 

[mtlucas0311]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

If the info on OD is correct (they cite Springfield as their source, which is persuasive) this rifle is right around the change from A3 to A4, but should be A4. But the placement of the SN seems to be in the right spot. Seems like there's a reasonable argument either way. I don't know how you'd fake SN location. It's over my head, I'll be interested in seeing further opinions.

 

[armydog]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

as i understand it they were never stamped A4, all were all stamped A3 and if they didn't pass the accuracy test to be a sniper rifle the just into service as a standard A3.

 

[SaepeExertus]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

If you want an 03A4 definitly look for an original one. Personally I find it blasphemous

to modify a beautiful rifle such as an 03A3 (esp a collectors grade one).

 

[Former0302]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

I believe the 03A4 models were still labeled 03A3 but the serial number was offset so that it could be read with the scope mount on the rifle.

I could be wrong though.

 

[armydog]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: former0302</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I believe the 03A4 models were still labeled 03A3 but the serial number was offset so that it could be read with the scope mount on the rifle.

I could be wrong though. </div></div>

You are correct Sir...

 

[xarmor]

Re: 1903A3 ADVICE

Some M1903a4 rifles that went through a rebuild did have the 3 lined out and a 4 added. I have probably senn 4 or 5 in the last 20 years. this particuliar rifle does fall into the correct serial range and is roll stamped correctly. The parkerization looks wrong (but it could be photo). The stock is a correct stock for the A4 but was probably not original to that rifle. All 499 sn rifle were produced in 1944 and would have had the scant grip (hog nose)stock. The barrel may be original but I would have to look at it closer. Anyway, please do not cut up an original Smith Corona, you have received lots of good advice on how to make a replica out of one that Bubba has already started. Here are some pics of an 03a4 that I bought from a gentleman that carried it in Italy and then into Germany. It is 100% untouched since 1945, still retains all its original pieces and never saw an arsenal rebuild. He passed away in 2005.

Here is a link to a bunch of pics of this 1903a4.
Original 1903a4 pics