Sidearms & Scatterguns 1911 mainspring housing operation

Hitman 4 Actual

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Minuteman
Mar 14, 2011
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Northern VA.
Sorry for this being long but I need to make sure you guys know exactly what I'm talking about and what I'm asking. I have a Springfield MC Operator. It is my first 1911 and I enjoy understanding how they work. I have used the internet and the search function but I can't quite find the answer to a question that has been annoying me.

I've become competent in properly fully stripping and assembling the pistol. My question is with the mainspring housing and its internals. My Operator does have the ILS housing. Out of curiosity, I've researched what need to be done to make the system inoperable. I understand that there are 2 options. One is to get a new standard housing, mainspring, cap and cap pin. The other, apparently, is that the ILS housing can still be used as long as new standard internals are used.

Ok, here we go, please bear with me. Let's say I chose option 2. I get new standard internals and plan on using the ILS housing. I remove the housing by cocking the hammer, inserting the takedown pin, lowering the hammer to where the takedown pin captures mainspring tension, drive out the housing retainer pin and slide the housing off of the frame. I get that. Simple. Done it a hundred times.

The new standard internals are now in. I understand that a standard mainspring is longer than the ILS mainspring. I also understand that a standard cap is shorter than the ILS cap. The question - How does the cap pin not act like the takedown pin? In my mind, because it goes in the same hole, the cap pin will capture tension at the same place as the takedown pin does. How does it matter that the cap is shorter and the spring longer? It's all under the cap pin so how does the length matter? It'll be captured at the same spot no matter what internal are used. Therefore, the hammer strut will loose contact with the cap and won't drive the hammer to strike the firing pin with force. The hammer will be loose and floppy around the half cock point, just like is is using the takedown pin. I hope that what I'm asking makes sense to you guys.

The above would also apply to option 1, if the pin hole in the standard housing is in same spot as it is in an ILS housing. I would understand how it works if the hole for the pin(s) was in a different spot or my hammer strut needed to be longer as well in order to keep contact with the cap pin. Apparently the strut is standard, which is why Springfield uses a shorter mainspring and taller cap. If so, great, but that still doesn't answer my question.

The only thing I can think of is that the cavity in a standard cap for the hammer strut is shallower than the cavity in the ILS cap. That would make sense, enabling the strut to keep contact with the standard cap, at the point where the cap contacts the cap pin. Sound right? If so maybe that's the case and I already had the answer to my question. Sorry if I haven't been clear enough and I confused you. Thanks in advance for the replies. I may post this on a 1911 forum but I tried here first because, well, I like this site better!

 
Re: 1911 mainspring housing operation

A picture is worth a 1000 words.......

I'm pretty sure I can fix you up but my eyes are glazing over reading.....

The strut cup in the ILS is much deeper than a standard cap.
 
Re: 1911 mainspring housing operation

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: buffybuster</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A picture is worth a 1000 words.......

I'm pretty sure I can fix you up but my eyes are glazing over reading..... </div></div>

I know. Again, I apologize for the length but I'm not sure posting a picture will help you guys with my question. I have considered it though, thank you.
 
Re: 1911 mainspring housing operation

Never heard of any other way other than replacing the MSH.

I would replace the MSH, cap, etc. and install a 19 lb ISMI mainspring while you're in there.
 
Re: 1911 mainspring housing operation

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Downzero</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Never heard of any other way other than replacing the MSH.

I would replace the MSH, cap, etc. and install a 19 lb ISMI mainspring while you're in there. </div></div>

When I go to replace it I will go that route. Thanks. I understand that it will work. The question is how. What is different about standard parts (besides length) that will enable the strut to keep contact with the cap even after the mainspring decompresses and contacts the cap pin?
 
Re: 1911 mainspring housing operation

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Downzero</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Never heard of any other way other than replacing the MSH.

I would replace the MSH, cap, etc. and install a 19 lb ISMI mainspring while you're in there. </div></div>

While you can retain the ILS mainspring housing and replace ALL the guts with standard parts, that is definitely not the usual way most convert (you'd have to be a major cheapskate). Generally to eliminate the ILS you throw it away and replace it with ALL standard parts and replace the FP and FP spring while you're at it.
 
Re: 1911 mainspring housing operation

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: buffybuster</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Downzero</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Never heard of any other way other than replacing the MSH.

I would replace the MSH, cap, etc. and install a 19 lb ISMI mainspring while you're in there. </div></div>

While you can retain the ILS mainspring housing and replace ALL the guts with standard parts, that is definitely not the usual way most convert (you'd have to be a major cheapskate). Generally to eliminate the ILS you throw it away and replace it with ALL standard parts and replace the FP and FP spring while you're at it. </div></div>

Thanks. If you wouldn't mind please look a few posts above.
 
Re: 1911 mainspring housing operation

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Hitman 4 Actual</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Downzero</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Never heard of any other way other than replacing the MSH.

I would replace the MSH, cap, etc. and install a 19 lb ISMI mainspring while you're in there. </div></div>

When I go to replace it I will go that route. Thanks. I understand that it will work. The question is how. What is different about standard parts (besides length) that will enable the strut to keep contact with the cap even after the mainspring decompresses and contacts the cap pin? </div></div>

Because the strut is long enough to have some preload on the spring even with the hammer down. The cap pin is only there to keep the spring contained if you have to remove the mainspring housing.
 
Re: 1911 mainspring housing operation

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Downzero</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Hitman 4 Actual</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Downzero</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Never heard of any other way other than replacing the MSH.

I would replace the MSH, cap, etc. and install a 19 lb ISMI mainspring while you're in there. </div></div>

When I go to replace it I will go that route. Thanks. I understand that it will work. The question is how. What is different about standard parts (besides length) that will enable the strut to keep contact with the cap even after the mainspring decompresses and contacts the cap pin? </div></div>



Because the strut is long enough to have some preload on the spring even with the hammer down. The cap pin is only there to keep the spring contained if you have to remove the mainspring housing. </div></div>

Yes. I understand that. With the ILS though the takedown pin captures the tension around the half cock point. If the holes are in the same spot in a standard and an ILS housing the the cap pin will capture the tension at the same point as the takedown pin. In my mind the spring will be captured at the same point either way.