Need some help here. I have a NF nxs 3.5-15 F1 I plan to use. The thing is I question if that is a good choice. I see lots of people running much higher mag on .22’s. What are you running and why? Will what I have be enough to stay competitive?
-
Having trouble using the site?
Contact support
.22 PRS scope choice help
- Thread starter NorthWesterner
- Start date
Yes and no. On my center fire prs rigs I seldom zoom past 18 power. For positional shooting, I don’t feel like I need it. But .22 rimfire is much smaller, so spotting impacts would be harder.
While it's rare in NRL22, every now and then there's a stage where higher power in the scope is helpful. In December we had a paper stage at 100 yards and the wind was changing. With the Althlon Talos BTR 4-14 I couldn't see where I was hitting on paper therefore my score suffered for it on that stage. I would suggest spending the money to get a higher power scope. I just ordered a Athlon Midas Tac 6-24 for my next 22 rifle.
On a 22 for NRL, when some targets will be at 25 or 35Y, I suggest a scope that has close enough focus to view the targets clearly. 50Y minimum parallax adjustment isn't ideal.
I now use a 5-25 because as a earlier poster mentioned, it's an advantage to see where your bullets land. On a low power scope it's hard to see bullet holes in a dark background, like a black bull.
I now use a 5-25 because as a earlier poster mentioned, it's an advantage to see where your bullets land. On a low power scope it's hard to see bullet holes in a dark background, like a black bull.
You will want (in order of importance):
1. A scope that tracks consistently and is repeatable
2. Zero Stop
3. Focus (parallax) to 25 yards
4. 6-24x about covers all needs (most of us are magnification whores and can get by with 4-16x but you need to be able to spot your hits at max distance - choose accordingly)
5. If you are going FFP look for a reticle that does not disappear at low power setting or one that isn't too thick at max
6. Hold over (christmas tree) reticle - this is subject to debate but every now and then a match director will throw in a stage that requires you to shoot different distances without touching your knobs
After that its just wt. and how much you are willing to pay for glass quality.
Note: if you are using this as a bonafide trainer, you will want to have the same scope that you have on top of your centerfire match rifle. That's how you justify putting a $3,400.00 S&B on top of a .22 - something I highly recommend.
Midas TAC
Vortex PST Gen II PST are some that come to mind that work great but don't completely destroy the bank.
1. A scope that tracks consistently and is repeatable
2. Zero Stop
3. Focus (parallax) to 25 yards
4. 6-24x about covers all needs (most of us are magnification whores and can get by with 4-16x but you need to be able to spot your hits at max distance - choose accordingly)
5. If you are going FFP look for a reticle that does not disappear at low power setting or one that isn't too thick at max
6. Hold over (christmas tree) reticle - this is subject to debate but every now and then a match director will throw in a stage that requires you to shoot different distances without touching your knobs
After that its just wt. and how much you are willing to pay for glass quality.
Note: if you are using this as a bonafide trainer, you will want to have the same scope that you have on top of your centerfire match rifle. That's how you justify putting a $3,400.00 S&B on top of a .22 - something I highly recommend.
Midas TAC
Vortex PST Gen II PST are some that come to mind that work great but don't completely destroy the bank.
Last edited:
My son and I both shoot NRL22 matches. I have a Tract Toric 30mm HD on my rifle and my son has an Athlon Midas TAC 6-24. Both scopes have performed well. For the money both scopes are excellent buys. I will say both optics have really amazed me. For the price points I really don’t think there are better scopes on the market.
I am using a 5-25 Gen 2 PST FFP.. It is clear at 25 yards when not on max power, usually I am shooting around 6-8x.. Spotting on steel is not an issue even with your 4-14x.
The issues are as mentioned, the paper stage that is usually at 50 yards, but they did have the 100yard paper during one COF. 25x is great for that. Evening shooting also presents challenges in the winter as it get dark.
Seems everyone gets the 25yard parallax thing, but so many do not get the FOV thing. You'll most likely go to the matches (this was way more common when the first NRL22 matches started) and see some guy, or even a couple of guys with really heigh magnification scopes. thinking 10x bottom is all they need.. The issue is even at 10x it is a pin hole at 25 and 50 yards. These guys almost always struggle. Depending on the NRL22 match, the targets might be set amongst other targets on the range. A wide FOV really helps in seeing the landmarks to quickly acquire the correct targets. Think about your regular center fire positional match where we are around 12x the entire match .. there are few targets closer than 250y and often past 1000. Running the NRL22 mach at the same 12x power at 25y is kinda like having 10x less FOV... Sure it doesn't work out exactly like that but it illustrates the point.
You'll also want an FFP for the hold over stages and if for nothing else to match your centerfire match rifle. I agree with 300ATT -- another great feature of this model is the Razor HD zero system. You score more points by being in the X-ring on the paper targets a perfect zero helps.. Personally, I separate myself most and probable won the most matches, in a large part, because of the paper stage score.. sometimes by a healthy margin.
Edited to add: Other than the "required no dialing" stage you'll see from time to time, 120 seconds is easily enough to dial the targets and clean most stages (unless the wind is going nuts), if you don't waste time finding targets.
PST on the rifle below
The issues are as mentioned, the paper stage that is usually at 50 yards, but they did have the 100yard paper during one COF. 25x is great for that. Evening shooting also presents challenges in the winter as it get dark.
Seems everyone gets the 25yard parallax thing, but so many do not get the FOV thing. You'll most likely go to the matches (this was way more common when the first NRL22 matches started) and see some guy, or even a couple of guys with really heigh magnification scopes. thinking 10x bottom is all they need.. The issue is even at 10x it is a pin hole at 25 and 50 yards. These guys almost always struggle. Depending on the NRL22 match, the targets might be set amongst other targets on the range. A wide FOV really helps in seeing the landmarks to quickly acquire the correct targets. Think about your regular center fire positional match where we are around 12x the entire match .. there are few targets closer than 250y and often past 1000. Running the NRL22 mach at the same 12x power at 25y is kinda like having 10x less FOV... Sure it doesn't work out exactly like that but it illustrates the point.
You'll also want an FFP for the hold over stages and if for nothing else to match your centerfire match rifle. I agree with 300ATT -- another great feature of this model is the Razor HD zero system. You score more points by being in the X-ring on the paper targets a perfect zero helps.. Personally, I separate myself most and probable won the most matches, in a large part, because of the paper stage score.. sometimes by a healthy margin.
Edited to add: Other than the "required no dialing" stage you'll see from time to time, 120 seconds is easily enough to dial the targets and clean most stages (unless the wind is going nuts), if you don't waste time finding targets.
PST on the rifle below
Last edited:
i run the athlon midas tax 6-24 and recommend it to people asking about first scopes for rimfire matches on a budget. its repeatable, mine tracks true, has really clear glass for the price, the turrets are solid and it can focus down to 10 yards.
i'm also considering the ares etr for my next scope but i can't seem to see if it is worth the additional cost
i'm also considering the ares etr for my next scope but i can't seem to see if it is worth the additional cost
A high magnification scope is handy on the 1/4” target on the KYL. You won’t need a 40 power scope but something with a max magnification of 24-25 or so is nice to have on that stage. Otherwise like most people mentioned, you will spend most of your time at 10-16 power depending on your optic and preference.
Last edited:
Wow that sure is a different take than I’ve posted it or experienced. The 1/4” KYL is at 25 yards.
That is a 1 MOA target - or about the same as 50x shouting most PRS targets... just keeping this in perspective
For centerfire, I rarely go over 18x.
For nrl22, I’m almost exclusively at 25x or whatever max power is available. This is because the targets are easily found even with a smaller fov. Also, because of virtually no recoil, you won’t lose the target with small FOV.
For PRS .22 I tend to go back to max 18x and sometimes max power once I’m on target depending on its size.
You can be competitive and win with a 15x. It’s just nice to have some extra. If you can afford it, go for it.
For nrl22, I’m almost exclusively at 25x or whatever max power is available. This is because the targets are easily found even with a smaller fov. Also, because of virtually no recoil, you won’t lose the target with small FOV.
For PRS .22 I tend to go back to max 18x and sometimes max power once I’m on target depending on its size.
You can be competitive and win with a 15x. It’s just nice to have some extra. If you can afford it, go for it.
okI 100% agree 5-25 is great for the NRL 22 - I just believe mostly it is to much. Especially if you want to train.
Is your NRL22 set in the smallbire silhouette range? Our clubs is as well as another local club ( our club is officially part of the NRL22 and the other just uses the COF)..
There ends up being a lot of berms and targets.
Last edited:
Wow. This as all very helpful. I could spring for a higher mag scope. This nf I have is quite valuable, so flipping it shouldn’t be a problem. Just tough buying another tier 1 optic.
I did forget to add one of the reasons for not running max power all the time other than FOV and general training is that you’ll save a time having to dick with your parallax.
When I first started I did shoot a higher powers, a lot like peope new to positional centerfire Matches -
Again a big fan of the 5-25 for the matches, just I finished each stage faster and shoot more calmly at the lower power. Kinda a slow is smooth and smooth is fast feel- if that makes sence.
When I first started I did shoot a higher powers, a lot like peope new to positional centerfire Matches -
Again a big fan of the 5-25 for the matches, just I finished each stage faster and shoot more calmly at the lower power. Kinda a slow is smooth and smooth is fast feel- if that makes sence.
With 5-25x I am at 12-18x most of the time especially at a centerfire match here in CO where the mirage will make going to higher mags useless.
Running at lower mag makes the eye box more forgiving esp. if you are moving around changing positions in a stage.
I believe it is mostly psychological, and humans tend to be more confident and believe they are better shooters if they can see the target at 25x vs 12x. 25x is sometimes useful at 200+ yards (depending on mirage) for .22 prone stages to spot impacts. .22’s don’t kick up a lot of dirt and this is where good glass makes a “yuge” difference.
Running at lower mag makes the eye box more forgiving esp. if you are moving around changing positions in a stage.
I believe it is mostly psychological, and humans tend to be more confident and believe they are better shooters if they can see the target at 25x vs 12x. 25x is sometimes useful at 200+ yards (depending on mirage) for .22 prone stages to spot impacts. .22’s don’t kick up a lot of dirt and this is where good glass makes a “yuge” difference.
At our NRL22 match we use a lane that isn't the widest, so the previous or next stage can be very close to the one we are shooting, thus myself and others have shot the wrong targets, since most of the NRL 22 targets are round, it can be confusing at times. So 25x isn't working well for me in dynamic stages.
I need the FOV big enough to see the target layout to make sure I'm on the correct steel. Seems like 12-15x is about right.
Any less mag I can't see the .2's well, I holdover a lot with H59 so...
Definitely 25x for paper stages!
My biggest problem is deciding the best way to shoot a stage off obstacles as far as building the steadiest position! Especially off a barrel, it's too tall for kneeling using my solo sack and too short otherwise.
I need the FOV big enough to see the target layout to make sure I'm on the correct steel. Seems like 12-15x is about right.
Any less mag I can't see the .2's well, I holdover a lot with H59 so...
Definitely 25x for paper stages!
My biggest problem is deciding the best way to shoot a stage off obstacles as far as building the steadiest position! Especially off a barrel, it's too tall for kneeling using my solo sack and too short otherwise.
^ another benefit to saving a few seconds is using them somewhere else, if not working extra on a position, pressing on the correct breath pattern.
I honestly believe the few small things I gain by only using 25x on the paper (huge help); and not having to work parallax with the lower mag and wider FOV ~ has been the only secret that places me at the top of every 22NRL match I’ve shot. Weather I used the RPR rim fire, Savage or Vudoo.
It is not the Vudoo, I’ve had everyone in my squad use my gun and ammo on a couple of occasions, It isn’t me being the best shooter, it is just that I effectively have more time than the guys running higher magnification.
Soon as the guys start figuring that out in our matches, I won’t be the one winning.
Edited to add: not saying that someone can’t out shoot me doing the entire match using 25x, just that the guys I am shooting against in our NRL22 matches could and will, if they didn’t make themselves work so hard.
I honestly believe the few small things I gain by only using 25x on the paper (huge help); and not having to work parallax with the lower mag and wider FOV ~ has been the only secret that places me at the top of every 22NRL match I’ve shot. Weather I used the RPR rim fire, Savage or Vudoo.
It is not the Vudoo, I’ve had everyone in my squad use my gun and ammo on a couple of occasions, It isn’t me being the best shooter, it is just that I effectively have more time than the guys running higher magnification.
Soon as the guys start figuring that out in our matches, I won’t be the one winning.
Edited to add: not saying that someone can’t out shoot me doing the entire match using 25x, just that the guys I am shooting against in our NRL22 matches could and will, if they didn’t make themselves work so hard.
Last edited:
The best scope is a second scope just like the one you will be using on your centerfire rifle, lets you get used to the controls and sight picture. However, there are some cheaper options that do very well for the cost. I put an athlon argos BTR 6-24x on my 22 and have been very impressed with it. Some people swear by some of the fixed scopes (such as the SWFA 10x hd) for 22s as they are fairly cheap and offer good glass for cost.
Like some others posting above, my home range and the range I shoot NRL22 matches on is more "crowded" than the places I shoot prs style field matches. I find myself happy in a field match leaving the power alone anywhere between 10 and 16x, 22's on a narrow range with small targets I find myself adjusting the power range more on the clock as it is to much / to little depending.....
I 100% agree 5-25 is great for the NRL 22 - I just believe mostly it is to much. Especially if you want to train.
Is your NRL22 set in the smallbire silhouette range? Our clubs is as well as another local club ( our club is officially part of the NRL22 and the other just uses the COF)..
There ends up being a lot of berms and targets.
Ours is usually shot in a 100 yd rifle bay.
To be fair, I have spent a ton of time working on getting my NPA lined up while I’m setting up my position (thank you Phil Velayo videos). So it’s rare that my target isn’t in my FOV when I get behind the optic.
^ I didn't see the video, but I imagine your talking about a solid stage management plan, like stage approach and not getting distracted away from the targets as you set dope, build and align your positions and finally while still looking at the target just above the turret, then into your glass. Yep you'll be on your target. edited to add: Also why I like scope caps that flip back over themselves usually to the side and out of the way.
In our 22 bay, The NRL22 events are in the bay where they hold the National Small Bore Silhouette Matches so they are populated with all kinds of targets and berms. No excesses, but it is WAY harder to track the targets with the naked eye or be sure your on the correct target once on scope, than most any centerfire match I've ever shot. Of course it can all be shot at 25x, it is just harder than it needs to be. Just something to think about for someone who might end up on a range like ours for a match.
D, by the logic you are representing (For nrl22, I’m almost exclusively at 25x or whatever max power is available ) You should you be using and love the FOV @ 55x benchrest scope always at max power, for your centerfire matches. It actually scales in a way where the 50x in a center fire match has a better FOV for most targets.
Ok, I'm pushing this too far... In reality, if Shooter A needs X to feel good and Shooter Y something else, so what.. I get it and am having a bit of fun, I am not meaning to sound like you are wrong for getting it done your way..
I only hope through my hard to read typing, maybe something will resonate with someone and they'll either finish each stage faster, smoother or score a couple shots better by trying to reduce the power and fiddle less with the parallax for most of the stages if they are running higher magnification scopes.
In our 22 bay, The NRL22 events are in the bay where they hold the National Small Bore Silhouette Matches so they are populated with all kinds of targets and berms. No excesses, but it is WAY harder to track the targets with the naked eye or be sure your on the correct target once on scope, than most any centerfire match I've ever shot. Of course it can all be shot at 25x, it is just harder than it needs to be. Just something to think about for someone who might end up on a range like ours for a match.
D, by the logic you are representing (For nrl22, I’m almost exclusively at 25x or whatever max power is available ) You should you be using and love the FOV @ 55x benchrest scope always at max power, for your centerfire matches. It actually scales in a way where the 50x in a center fire match has a better FOV for most targets.
Ok, I'm pushing this too far... In reality, if Shooter A needs X to feel good and Shooter Y something else, so what.. I get it and am having a bit of fun, I am not meaning to sound like you are wrong for getting it done your way..
I only hope through my hard to read typing, maybe something will resonate with someone and they'll either finish each stage faster, smoother or score a couple shots better by trying to reduce the power and fiddle less with the parallax for most of the stages if they are running higher magnification scopes.
Last edited:
I see christmas tree reticles mentioned above as recommended but I have 0 experience using one with a 22 lr rifle.
I've got a Vudoo ordered so I was trying to decide what optic I want to put on it. My two leading choices were S&B PMII 5-25 or Kahles k525i but I have no idea on reticle.
Looks like S&B has H37, H58, H59 and TReMoR2 available.
Kahles is a bit simpler looks like the only tree reticle option there is SKMR3.
Does anyone have any experience or recommendation between the two optics or those reticles? Should I consider something else?
I've got a Vudoo ordered so I was trying to decide what optic I want to put on it. My two leading choices were S&B PMII 5-25 or Kahles k525i but I have no idea on reticle.
Looks like S&B has H37, H58, H59 and TReMoR2 available.
Kahles is a bit simpler looks like the only tree reticle option there is SKMR3.
Does anyone have any experience or recommendation between the two optics or those reticles? Should I consider something else?
Reticle preference is a very personal thing to many of us. If starting from scratch I highly recommend a reticle with all .2 mil hashes. I have stayed with the H59 since it came out and have no reason to want to change.
I like having the FOV fairly open so the H37 never worked for me.
Like the dot in the H59 vs the center of the H58.
T reticles even for me are getting too busy and if you practice you don't need the wind dots.
Probably the best holdover reticle I've seen is the TUBB design, but the scopes are expensive. I'd have no problem shooting a 6xc at 2950 fps with 115's, which the reticle is tuned for, but were talking 22rf and I'm not sure how that would cross over.
I'm fine with any of the tree reticles as long as they are all .2's. I don't like it when scope Co's mix/transition .2 mil hashes to .5 mil hashes down on the vertical crosshair.
I've ran both the 3-20x50 and the 5-25x56 S&B's on my 22rf's, too me the 5-25 is more versatile for NRL22.
The NF 7-35 and the March 5-40 would be great choices as well for higher end scopes. At least the March has a all .5 mil reticle and is thick enough to see on 12x. The NF is supposed to come out with other H reticles this year.
I'm starting from scratch basically. I have a 6.5CM rifle with a 4.5-27 Razor with the EBR2-C reticle on it, but that's really my only experience with those style reticles.
Ill definitely check out the h59, is there a reticle simulator that would show what it looks like on different powers? Like 5x and 25x?
Looks like they have a ton of information available on the Horus website downloaded the spec sheet and guide to read through.
The H59 type reticles are controversial. Some love them and some like me find them distracting as I think they clutter up the picture too much; however, they do work and with practice I have seen shooters get really good with them. Where they seem to really shine is with fast, flat shooting (6mm) PRS cartridges inside of 5-600 yards where there is not much elevation difference between shooting targets at 250 vs 450 yds and little need to hold a lot of wind beyond "edge of plate".
I tend to set the knobs for elevation and hold wind as needed. If you can get good with an H59 type reticle there is one less movement or adjustment you can screw up as you move between targets at different distances.
There is a tradeoff between not enough and too much information displayed in a reticle. Each has to find that balance that works for them. YMMV.
I tend to set the knobs for elevation and hold wind as needed. If you can get good with an H59 type reticle there is one less movement or adjustment you can screw up as you move between targets at different distances.
There is a tradeoff between not enough and too much information displayed in a reticle. Each has to find that balance that works for them. YMMV.
Why not grab the 5-25 PSTII it will have the same reticle as your Razor and 25y parallax for your 22 will letting you buy more ammo
Glass really. I don't like the PST II glass at all. I had one on a different rifle for a while and it really fell apart on optical quality past 18x. Thats what I replaced with the Razor actually. Everything had a blue tint.
Last edited:
Completely get that - Don't forget for at least NRL22 your talking 100yards and in so mirage and other optical disturbances don't seem to be as much in play.
The only time I really noticed the glass was when we shoot the matches at night.. It is a bit worse than my Razor or Kahles 5-25; but the Minox really separates it's self in that type of light. FWIW my Razor nor my Minox had the parallax to work well for NRL22.. The S&B, and Kahles do, then some of the lower tier glass like the gennII PST and Athlons etc.
few exceptions anything less than 20x will be to weak for 50 yards.
Mid Quality glass at higher magnification will reduce eye fatigue which most people don’t notice with cheap glass because they aren’t on the bench for hours +.
In my humble opinion mid priced glass with about 20x or higher is what you should look at for a starting point. There are many name brands and models to sort through and pic from.
I don’t have many scopes but I do have some cheap and mid priced ones. All my rifles have glass and because of my eyes I depend on glass to be able to shoot. After getting some mid priced glass, I don’t hardly touch the guns with cheap glass anymore and when I do use them eye strain is quickly noticeable.
This is one example
6-18x40 AO and at 50 it falls short on magnification but makes up for it in image quality.
This scope will set you back nib about $450 u.s. and $250 manufacturers refurbished when you can find them.
The middle line of vortex scopes seems to be popular.
$400-500 price range is where I’d start for regular bench/target work glass.
“Aim small to hit small”
what this means is the more you magnify the target and better you can see it, the better/easier it is to make tighter groups.
This can be demonstrated with an accurate rifle and two equal quality scopes at 50 yards with a 10x and a 20x.
The guns potential doesn’t change but the difficulty does. You will no matter the rifle, shoot tighter groups with the 20x over the 10x magnification.
If you can’t see it you can’t hit it. Regular competitive bench rest shooters that compete regularly and/or score on the top end of their sport are using 36x and higher at 25 and 50 yards.
I’m not advocating you buy a $1000 dollar 30x or 40x maybe a $400 +/- 26x, 36x or a little less $. For bench/target work there’s no substitute for magnification.
I am a big believer in quality over quantity when considering my next purchase and this really helps when buying glass.
Go to a few ranges and post a target you want to use, then ask to look though several peoples scopes “they won’t mind I’m sure” on that line or use several range scopes. This will quickly tell you where you will want to start for magnification then start looking for the best quality you can afford.
One thing to consider in all of this.
If you buy cheap then want to sell and move up? The cheap glass will sell for less than half of New or won’t sell at all.
A good quality scope if/when you go to sell to upgrade will sell near or at its original value and it will sell. So in short the better the glass the better it will hold its value.
I started out buying/using cheap glass then moved up. It was a waist of time and money and ammo. I now have a box full of cheap glass I can’t give away because it’s cheap.
My woods and truck guns have $40-60 dollar glass and I hardly look through them time wise.
My target guns all have $400-500 dollar and up on them. I spend hours looking through them, and this makes a big difference in what quality glass you want to use.
Mid Quality glass at higher magnification will reduce eye fatigue which most people don’t notice with cheap glass because they aren’t on the bench for hours +.
In my humble opinion mid priced glass with about 20x or higher is what you should look at for a starting point. There are many name brands and models to sort through and pic from.
I don’t have many scopes but I do have some cheap and mid priced ones. All my rifles have glass and because of my eyes I depend on glass to be able to shoot. After getting some mid priced glass, I don’t hardly touch the guns with cheap glass anymore and when I do use them eye strain is quickly noticeable.
This is one example
6-18x40 AO and at 50 it falls short on magnification but makes up for it in image quality.
This scope will set you back nib about $450 u.s. and $250 manufacturers refurbished when you can find them.
The middle line of vortex scopes seems to be popular.
$400-500 price range is where I’d start for regular bench/target work glass.
“Aim small to hit small”
what this means is the more you magnify the target and better you can see it, the better/easier it is to make tighter groups.
This can be demonstrated with an accurate rifle and two equal quality scopes at 50 yards with a 10x and a 20x.
The guns potential doesn’t change but the difficulty does. You will no matter the rifle, shoot tighter groups with the 20x over the 10x magnification.
If you can’t see it you can’t hit it. Regular competitive bench rest shooters that compete regularly and/or score on the top end of their sport are using 36x and higher at 25 and 50 yards.
I’m not advocating you buy a $1000 dollar 30x or 40x maybe a $400 +/- 26x, 36x or a little less $. For bench/target work there’s no substitute for magnification.
I am a big believer in quality over quantity when considering my next purchase and this really helps when buying glass.
Go to a few ranges and post a target you want to use, then ask to look though several peoples scopes “they won’t mind I’m sure” on that line or use several range scopes. This will quickly tell you where you will want to start for magnification then start looking for the best quality you can afford.
One thing to consider in all of this.
If you buy cheap then want to sell and move up? The cheap glass will sell for less than half of New or won’t sell at all.
A good quality scope if/when you go to sell to upgrade will sell near or at its original value and it will sell. So in short the better the glass the better it will hold its value.
I started out buying/using cheap glass then moved up. It was a waist of time and money and ammo. I now have a box full of cheap glass I can’t give away because it’s cheap.
My woods and truck guns have $40-60 dollar glass and I hardly look through them time wise.
My target guns all have $400-500 dollar and up on them. I spend hours looking through them, and this makes a big difference in what quality glass you want to use.
Most FFP scopes are not in the sweet spot on lowest mag, that would require a thick reticle width which is too thick at the higher magnifications where FFP is used most. I look at my reticle for the fun of it on 5x and that's all it's there except when shooting through my Chronograph.
.025 mil reticle thickness gets to be too thin IMO, for me it's hard to see even on 12x which I'm on half the time in very dynamic stages.
.05 mil to me is about right on 12x and not to thick on 25X.
Almost all the FFP reticles are between .025 and ,05 mil thick.
One other thing I like about H reticles for holdovers is they do not have big and obscuring mil line numbers directly off the vertical crosshair. I absolutely hate putting a number on a target when that's what the wind hold requires!
I've won long range matches using holdovers/offs only with the H59, it can be done with practice, remember .2's become .1's when halved, that's one click you can see in the reticle. Holdoffs and holdovers are best used in steady positions but on some stages I can still do well if I either dial wind or can aim on the edge of the steel.
Thanks for the info! I did a bit of reading and checked out all the technical manuals for the Horus stuff last night. I also stumbled into the Nightforce Mil-XT reticle design, which makes a lot of sense.
I think like everything, the rabbit hole goes as deep as you want. I Just need to figure out where I want to jump in at and be happy there.
I think like everything, the rabbit hole goes as deep as you want. I Just need to figure out where I want to jump in at and be happy there.
No, 25x helps a lot in seeing where the bullet lands in the black or other darker colors on the paper stages, and it's nice for things like KYL racks to see your hits or where your misses land.
I was using that S&B 3-20 on 20x and couldn't see exactly where my hits in the black bull were, so I didn't know how to correct for center.
I doubt I would ever use 3x or 5x but i definitely use 25x and would prefer even more mag.
i like higher magnification, its always there if you need it.
my first shooting school was CVT Vern Harrison, he trained me to shoot both eyes open when on a scope.
my field of view is what my left eye is for and my right eye is where the aiming point is.
if its really bright out ill turn on the illumination if both eyes are getting washed out, or i can just dial down and close the left.
so for me the field of view and finding targets or misses with a zero recoil cartridge like a 22lr with a higher mag is not my biggest issue...shooting like shit is what kills me more often than not.
my first shooting school was CVT Vern Harrison, he trained me to shoot both eyes open when on a scope.
my field of view is what my left eye is for and my right eye is where the aiming point is.
if its really bright out ill turn on the illumination if both eyes are getting washed out, or i can just dial down and close the left.
so for me the field of view and finding targets or misses with a zero recoil cartridge like a 22lr with a higher mag is not my biggest issue...shooting like shit is what kills me more often than not.
Again -- if we are talking matches like NRL22 (really it has become the most popular and easiest to find):
Honestly, 5-25 is the sweat spot. You can primarily shoot at 8x-10x like I do, or 12-15x like steve123; turning it up to 25x for the paper; or shoot the entire match at 25X like Dthomas3523. We are all probably the top scorers at the end of our NRL type matches in our areas. I think what we'd all agree on is the a 5-25 with close range parallax, good reticle and good turrets are key.
The problem with "even more magnification" is you give up something. Now, if you are a benchrest guy or ELR 22 shooter, by all means more is better..
The 7-35 is like looking through a straw at 50 yards with about 3.5' FOV @ 7x also where the reticle is relatively hard to read. See again Steve's post about the reticles. BTW at max power, FOV it is a hair over 1.5' @ 50.
I saw guys chase hits by buying more magnification, like the popular 1050 Sightrons with 13y Parallax and 35% better FOV at 10x than the NF at 7x, then very quickly they started disappearing back off the 22s, as did a couple 7-35s.
Remember there is usually only one stage on paper__ sometimes unsupported where over 25x isn't going to help anyway
Yes, you can get the job done with anything~ but why repeat others mistakes.
Honestly, 5-25 is the sweat spot. You can primarily shoot at 8x-10x like I do, or 12-15x like steve123; turning it up to 25x for the paper; or shoot the entire match at 25X like Dthomas3523. We are all probably the top scorers at the end of our NRL type matches in our areas. I think what we'd all agree on is the a 5-25 with close range parallax, good reticle and good turrets are key.
The problem with "even more magnification" is you give up something. Now, if you are a benchrest guy or ELR 22 shooter, by all means more is better..
The 7-35 is like looking through a straw at 50 yards with about 3.5' FOV @ 7x also where the reticle is relatively hard to read. See again Steve's post about the reticles. BTW at max power, FOV it is a hair over 1.5' @ 50.
I saw guys chase hits by buying more magnification, like the popular 1050 Sightrons with 13y Parallax and 35% better FOV at 10x than the NF at 7x, then very quickly they started disappearing back off the 22s, as did a couple 7-35s.
Remember there is usually only one stage on paper__ sometimes unsupported where over 25x isn't going to help anyway
Yes, you can get the job done with anything~ but why repeat others mistakes.
Last edited:
Well I guess I will have to try my schmidt pm2 on the vudoo then. I was hoping to use this nxs I have. That being said I suppose I could just flip it and buy another 5-25. I need to keep the pm2 on my ELR rig and not play musical scopes.
