223 Wylde Proof CF 3gun Durability

[guillermo415]

Hi guys, wondering if anyone else out there running a Proof CF barrel for 3 gun has had durability issues or concerns. My build is off a 16” intermediate gas length 223 wylde. It shot the lights out when I initially got it and for the first few matches. Easily a 3/4 MOA barrel with 77SMK but now won’t hold a group under 2 MOA. I’ve put less than 6-700 rounds through it in the 3 months I’ve had it over 6 3gun matches and practice time.


Rest of the build is on a Wilson Combat matched billet set, giessele MK8 rail, nitride Wilson BCG, and lantac dragon break.



thanks

 

[hlee]

In my limited reading on the subject, it seems that while carbon fiber can be very good in conduct heat along the lenght of the fibers, it is a very poor heat conductor across the thickness of the material. As such it seems that carbon wrapping a barrel would be wrapping a steel liner in a very good insulator. Perhaps you cooked your barrel with rapid, high round-count shooting?

 

[guillermo415]

I hope that’s not the case. I know it’s not uncommon to see a proof barrel in 3 gun but any training session I did with the gun was 100rds or less. With ammo shortage and all I would just jam 2-3 mags and work drills until they were done. Usually took about 45 min or an hour to let the gun cool and mentally reset

 

[Forgetful Coyote]

@MSTN might can chime in

 

[MSTN]

I can’t see such a low round count having such an effect on your accuracy.

Any changes made to the rifle? At all?

Have you borescoped the barrel? Not everyone has access to a borescope, I know, but one pass can give you a lot of information about a barrel.

Just brainstorming a bit, what else could it possibly be???

Off the top of my head:

Ammo
Scope
Scope mount

Here's one to consider: I have seen more than a few rifles have accuracy issues when a screw securing a rail to the forend, say, for a bipod mount, makes contact with the gas block when the barrel vibrates or “noodles” inside the rail as the gun fires. Check that possibility out.

 

[SilencedShooter11B]

Stupid question but has the barrel been cleaned?

Shooting 3Gun, has something been knocked loose after Gun barrel dumps? I’d consider taking the upper entirely apart (removing rail, barrel, brake, optic and mount) and basically rebuilding it, and seeing what happens

Have you confirmed your “go to” ammo load with another rifle you’re confident with?

 

[guillermo415]

Thanks for the input guys. I’ve been on a long trip the last few weeks and still have some time left on the road.

before I left I had done a thorough carbon cleaning and then swapped scopes to shoot it with my NF 4-16 ATACR and same groups that open up to 1.5-2 MOA with BH factory 77 SMK and my reloaded Hornady 75 grn BTHP.
The original ATACR 1-8 scope I had on it was swapped to another upper to ensure no issues with scope or mount. The other upper with Wilson Combat steel barre shot between .8-1 MOA with both loads as well.

I talked to some friends and they recommended copper cleaning so I went through that process with Bore Tech and soaked/scrubbed overnight before wiping clean. I reinstalled a normal flash hider as well if the break was the issue too. With the 4-16 same issue 1.5-2 moa.

Before I left a friend used the copper scrubbing foam and let it drain out overnight. There was a ton of residue drained out so hopefully the remaining copper was the problem. Shooting that upper after being copper scrubbed will probably be one of the first things I do when I get back. Fingers crossed

 

[guillermo415]

I can’t see such a low round count having such an effect on your accuracy.

Any changes made to the rifle? At all?

Have you borescoped the barrel? Not everyone has access to a borescope, I know, but one pass can give you a lot of information about a barrel.

Just brainstorming a bit, what else could it possibly be???

Off the top of my head:

Ammo
Scope
Scope mount

Here's one to consider: I have seen more than a few rifles have accuracy issues when a screw securing a rail to the forend, say, for a bipod mount, makes contact with the gas block when the barrel vibrates or “noodles” inside the rail as the gun fires. Check that possibility out.

Definitely appreciate the input. I consistently check with a white light to ensure the gas block is not being contacted by the rail nor any mlok attachments when I’m shooting. Like I mention in the post below hopefully it was me that didn’t do a good job doing copper removal and the foam cleaner does the trick

 

[TonyTheTiger]

If you can build up enough copper in 700 rounds to destroy accuracy then the barrel is garbage anyways.

 

[Jdfd556]

Any updates on what happened? I was looking into possibly getting the same 16" intermediate gas CF Proof so this is relevant to me haha.

 

[TonyTheTiger]

Funny this thread would get revived. I just shot the WI Championship match with 3 guys using Proof CF barrels. I asked how they liked them and guys 1 and 2 said they were the most accurate barrels they've had, and guy 3 said that's only if you need accuracy at the beginning of a stage. He said if the long range stuff is after you've got the barrel smoking you're screwed. Guy's 1 and 2 looked sad and kinda nodded in agreement.
So of the 8 three gunners I've asked if they will be buying a second CF barrel, 6 said hell no and 2 didn't answer.

 

[Jdfd556]

Funny this thread would get revived. I just shot the WI Championship match with 3 guys using Proof CF barrels. I asked how they liked them and guys 1 and 2 said they were the most accurate barrels they've had, and guy 3 said that's only if you need accuracy at the beginning of a stage. He said if the long range stuff is after you've got the barrel smoking you're screwed. Guy's 1 and 2 looked sad and kinda nodded in agreement.
So of the 8 three gunners I've asked if they will be buying a second CF barrel, 6 said hell no and 2 didn't answer.

LOL well that clears it up then thank you!

 

[TurboTrout]

6-700 should be nothing in a 223

 

[eastexsteve]

So of the 8 three gunners I've asked if they will be buying a second CF barrel, 6 said hell no and 2 didn't answer.

I wouldn't think a CF-wrapped barrel would work too good in 3gun due to the heat. Until about a year ago, I was doing some heavy irons 3gun down here in Texas with some stages out to 600 and beyond. The gun I used was an AR10 clone with a plain 18" 4150 Faxon pencil-barrel. I had glass on it at first when I was finding the tightest ammo to use. It was good for just under one MOA under ideal conditions. But after that, the glass came off and the rail-mounted A2 sights went on for good. It definitely got hot, but I never had any trouble holding it on the 4 MOA plates at distance. But, the heat issue I had was the four Allen screws holding the barrel-length Mlock rail. The gun would get hot enough that I had to periodically make sure they stayed tight. Loctite didn't seem to help.

I had that gun out a couple weeks ago. It still groups good, even after all the rounds I shot through it.

 

[SilencedShooter11B]

Any updates on what happened? I was looking into possibly getting the same 16" intermediate gas CF Proof so this is relevant to me haha.

ive been using a Stainless proof barrel with nothing but 77gr SMKs in four matches and the shooting in between. Some fast, some slow. Not a single hiccup.

i have a 16” Shilen 223 Wylde barrel that I use as a truck gun and for some <200yd hunting with my 3.5x ACOG....I would like to swap the 16” CF proof on there since it’s a low round count rifle and the weight savings would be amazing on a rifle that gets carried a good bit

 

[deersniper]

Definitely appreciate the input. I consistently check with a white light to ensure the gas block is not being contacted by the rail nor any mlok attachments when I’m shooting. Like I mention in the post below hopefully it was me that didn’t do a good job doing copper removal and the foam cleaner does the trick

So is the barrel a turd or what ?