Range Report 30-06, 208amax, H4350

[Onemoretime]

RD Precision 30-06
25" Bartlien 1-10 twist barrel (M24 contour)

All rounds were loaded in Federal Brass with Fed210 primers

208 Amax @ 3.434 OAL
54 - 2758,2772,2773
54.2 - 2772,2768,2793 (light marks so I stopped)

I think I might try between 53.4 up to 54 and see if I can get a good load around 2750ish. I like the idea of using an "H" powder with all the problems I've had with temperature sensitivity with the RL25.

I loaded up to 55 at increments of .2 but started to see slight pressure signs at 54.2 so I stopped.

 

[Falar]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

These results look promising. I'd be tempted to give H4350 the nod over RL17/RL22/RL25 because of the temperature stability also as long as velocity is decent.

 

[Onemoretime]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

Yeah, that's what I'm thinking. I'm going to see if I can back it down a bit and find a nice load that's still above 2700fps... hopefully 2750fps.

54 grains looks great but at 54.2 I was seeing some pressure so I want to back a bit further away from the edge, so to speak.

 

[herr.baer]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

I use 53.3 grs of H4350 with a 200 gr SMK out of my .06 COAL 3.320 using LC brass. It runs at 2550 fps. I think the H4350 held better in varying temps over the IMR4350.

I need to check out the 208 Amax as well. Thanks for the data.

 

[Onemoretime]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

You velocity seems low to me. I was getting 2550 with the 208 out of my 22" 308 with W760.

 

[esorensen]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

I think you'll be surprised about how temp stable it is. Even that close to redline. I've run a warm load of H4350 in my .243 for years now. I have shot it in a hot rifle on a hot day with black mags laying in a bed of a black pickup. NO problems. No change in zero out to 700.

 

[Onemoretime]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

That's good news.... I have a couple more pounds on it's way and I'm going to shoot some more on Thursday or Friday this week.

I'm going to ladder up from 53.6 and see if there is a more accurate load then the 54 in there somewhere.

 

[Falar]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

Have you thought about H4831?

It is close to RL22 in burn rate while H4350 is closer to RL19. Maybe it might be the way to go to try and get RL 22 like velocity with 200gr + bullets without the huge amount of temp instability of the RL powders.

 

[Onemoretime]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

I have some and could try it. I may try a few rounds just to see.

I went back to the range yesterday.

ES's are WAY down 6-7 fps, only tested 3 shot strings.

German Salazar is using the 4350 for his competition gun for shooting 210 Bergers.

 

[Onemoretime]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

Okay here it is.

208 Amax
53.9 grains H4350
3.434 COAL
Fed Brass
Fed 210 primer

2707.6 average fps (5 rounds)

I can probably get more velocity but I'm happy with 2700. I'll trade velocity for consistency any day of the week.

 

[esorensen]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

That's good news. I really want to try this in an 1903A3 I have. It won't make mag length, but that's okay. I may end up shooting about 1-2% lower charge than you in an attempt to find a lower node and save some wear and tear on the old weapon.

 

[Onemoretime]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

It shoots in the .3's or better.

 

[bohem]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ffl medic</div><div class="ubbcode-body">That's good news. I really want to try this in an 1903A3 I have. It won't make mag length, but that's okay. I may end up shooting about 1-2% lower charge than you in an attempt to find a lower node and save some wear and tear on the old weapon. </div></div>

When was the 03 made and who made it?

These heavy doses of slow powder and heavy bullets can be pretty tough on the weapons and there's a few of the 03's out there that are suspect in strength when you're doing something like this.

I know the 30's era Smith Corona's are supposed to be very strong, but that's not an A3. I'm not particularly familiar with them other than how to spot an A3 vs. other models, but I'd check into this before you stretch the action out. Or worse.

Before and after shooting some similar loads with RL22 and 208 Amax I took my K98 action apart and got a guy at work to mag-flux and Xray the action and bolt for me on the sly. Just to double check it.

Thanks Onemoretime for chasing this load data out, and keep posting it up, it's good info for all of us "suckers" who cling to their 06's.

 

[Onemoretime]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

I love my 06. I have people everyday I go to the range ask me why the 06 instead of a .308.

Some actually say, "why do you shoot that when the .308 is so much better?"

Stupid people.

 

[bohem]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Onemoretime</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I love my 06. I have people everyday I go to the range ask me why the 06 instead of a .308.

Some actually say, "why do you shoot that when the .308 is so much better?"

Stupid people. </div></div>

That line always makes me chuckle, whether someone writes it here or says it at the range.

 

[Onemoretime]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bohem</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Onemoretime</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I love my 06. I have people everyday I go to the range ask me why the 06 instead of a .308.

Some actually say, "why do you shoot that when the .308 is so much better?"

Stupid people. </div></div>

That line always makes me chuckle, whether someone writes it here or says it at the range. </div></div>

When people say that I usually look at them like they have 3 heads and show them a 30-06 case and tell them to look at how much powder I can fit in here compared to a .308 case. Wouldn't it make sense that I can now shoot the same bullet out of this case at a much faster speed? Usually I refrain but have to hold myself back from completing the sentence with... "dumbass."

 

[esorensen]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

I'm almost certain that the A3 designation is exempt from the brittle heat treat issues of the earlier models. It's a Remington from '42. The magnaflux is not a bad idea. I suppose I could x-ray it at work, but I suspect that I wouldn't know what to look for as it is not made of bone. I just think it would be real neat to take an old warhorse and use newer powder and bullet technology to extract some wicked eye opening performance. (without breaking it or me of course)

Doing the same thing (or something similar) to the Garand might be kind of fun too, but I'd rather try it in the bolt gun first. I put an adjustable gas plug on it and functions as advertised. it's MUCH easier on the brass and it now lands in a pile instead of a zip code. I can actually cycle/fire it manually too. I got both of these weapons from my father in law when he died. He used them in the CMP/DCM matches. Both are VERY accurate and I have an assload of LC ammo that I intend to save. I also have tons of once fired LC brass that I intend to use for them in projects such as this.

 

[USSR]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

A little history on the 1903 rifles. The heat treat problem was solved during WW1 (problem receivers are those with serial numbers below 800,000 made at Springfield Armory, and below 286,506 made at Rock Island Arsenal), so all WW2 produced M1903's and 03-A3's produced by Remington and Smith-Corona are very strong.

Don

 

[Falar]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Onemoretime</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bohem</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Onemoretime</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I love my 06. I have people everyday I go to the range ask me why the 06 instead of a .308.

Some actually say, "why do you shoot that when the .308 is so much better?"

Stupid people. </div></div>

That line always makes me chuckle, whether someone writes it here or says it at the range. </div></div>

When people say that I usually look at them like they have 3 heads and show them a 30-06 case and tell them to look at how much powder I can fit in here compared to a .308 case. Wouldn't it make sense that I can now shoot the same bullet out of this case at a much faster speed? Usually I refrain but have to hold myself back from completing the sentence with... "dumbass." </div></div>

The big myth out there is that somehow .308 is a "magic cartridge" and is vastly more accurate than .30-06. This is a commonly held belief on some other forums I frequent.

 

[howdydoit]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Falar</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Onemoretime</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bohem</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Onemoretime</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I love my 06. I have people everyday I go to the range ask me why the 06 instead of a .308.

Some actually say, "why do you shoot that when the .308 is so much better?"

Stupid people. </div></div>

That line always makes me chuckle, whether someone writes it here or says it at the range. </div></div>

When people say that I usually look at them like they have 3 heads and show them a 30-06 case and tell them to look at how much powder I can fit in here compared to a .308 case. Wouldn't it make sense that I can now shoot the same bullet out of this case at a much faster speed? Usually I refrain but have to hold myself back from completing the sentence with... "dumbass." </div></div>

The big myth out there is that somehow .308 is a "magic cartridge" and is vastly more accurate than .30-06. This is a commonly held belief on some other forums I frequent.

</div></div>

this bull is spewed for many on the intranetz. Once its read by anyone it becomes gospel. Best thing to do is just show them what the 06 can do.

 

[bohem]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: USSR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A little history on the 1903 rifles. The heat treat problem was solved during WW1 (problem receivers are those with serial numbers below 800,000 made at Springfield Armory, and below 286,506 made at Rock Island Arsenal), so all WW2 produced M1903's and 03-A3's produced by Remington and Smith-Corona are very strong.

Don </div></div>

Thanks for clearing that up. I knew I'd heard something about it and just wanted to have someone who knows to clear it.

My 30-06 is built on a 1938 Turk Mauser action... so yeah, I understand about how it feels to take an "ancient" old war horse and turn it into a long range steel ringing machine.

The 150 FMJBT's at 3200 fps make nice groundhog bullets too...

 

[esorensen]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

That's what I read also. I can't even imagine how many 03A3 receivers that were made into other higher pressure cartridges that are still going strong.

I have shot my 03A3 and the Garand with LC ammo only. I can hit the gongs at 425 with both of them with BORING regularity. The sights are somewhat optimistic, however. Whatever GI was issued either of these rifles was a lucky SOB. They both flat out shoot!

I just think it would be neat to take an amazing shot with these rifles and harvest something. It would be a great story for the family, and add some more history to some already fine weapons.

 

[308sako]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

Deleted in protest!

 

[Onemoretime]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

I could try some RL19 but the temp sensitivity has been a problem for me and the Alliant powders.

Why don't you like the fed brass?

 

[bohem]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Onemoretime</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I could try some RL19 but the temp sensitivity has been a problem for me and the Alliant powders.

Why don't you like the fed brass? </div></div>

I've seen rather large swings in velocity from RL22, letting a round cook in the warm chamber is good for quite literally 175 fps!

Fed brass has a reputation for having soft case heads. When you're chasing high pressure loads like these they don't last long.

 

[Onemoretime]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

I have lots of brass... fed, win, rem, and gfl.

I've used the hell out of my win brass and now am using them to shoot my training rounds, 155amax at about 2950fps, so they should last quite a bit longer. The GFL seems to have about the same or a bit more case volume (in a fire formed case).

I have lots of fed and I like it as it seems to be a bit harder then the win I was using. The fed brass is going to be for my 4350/208 load.

What brass do most of you like?

 

[bohem]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

I really like WW brass for my RL22/208 and 4350/178 loads. For plinking rounds that are just a thrown charge of BLC2 and 150 FMJBT surplus I'll run anything.

 

[308sako]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

Deleted in protest!

 

[Onemoretime]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

That's good info on the other brass types. I have a bunch of R-P and Win.

 

[Alan_H]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

tag

 

[johncamino]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

tag

 

[trailrider121]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

Anyone else using H4350 and 208 amax's?

Going to retest again with H4350 and new brass. Looks like a scatter node at 54grs. I went to 54.5grs but stop due to hard bolt lift, really flatten primers.

 

[SPAK]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

I've got a load at 52.2gr H4350 208amax seated .020" off the lands....The limiting factor for this rifle is the very short throat limiting how far I can seat the bullet, and thus case capacity...

Velocity in a 22" tube is right around 2650fps. I've since cut the barrel down to 16" and same load runs about 2450ish fps. Accuracy is still pretty good about 1/2moa but this throat is pretty worn and cracked. I can only fire about 10-15 rounds before I get some crazy pressure signs.

I like h4831sc too..but I get a little better accuracy out of H4350...

 

[trailrider121]

Re: 30-06, 208amax, H4350

Frogman,

My barrel is short throat too.Seems to be a good node at 52.5gr.