How does the .300 winnie stack up against the two new wildcats 30/338 Norma Mag and the 30/375 Ruger. Looking at the .338 Norma case last night it certainly is a beutiful case I wonder if either of these two new rounds might take some popularity away from the .300 winnie ? They are not as large as the .300 RUM.
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.300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
- Thread starter pc3
- Start date
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
The 300 Winmag is so entrenched that unseating it as the leading 30 caliber magnum is a pipe dream. Norma had its own 30 caliber magnum before the 300 Winmag, the 308 Norma Magnum, which was and is a fine cartridge.See:
http://www.chuckhawks.com/308Norma.htm
Wildcatting is fun (I published a book on it) BUT if you ever want to sell the rifle, you'll be far better off with a caliber that can be bought as factory ammo everywhere...the 300 Winmag.
BTW, I am no advocate for the 300 Winmag, I shoot the 300 H&H which, in many ways a superior cartridge but does require (horrors) a magnum action.
The 300 Winmag is so entrenched that unseating it as the leading 30 caliber magnum is a pipe dream. Norma had its own 30 caliber magnum before the 300 Winmag, the 308 Norma Magnum, which was and is a fine cartridge.See:
http://www.chuckhawks.com/308Norma.htm
Wildcatting is fun (I published a book on it) BUT if you ever want to sell the rifle, you'll be far better off with a caliber that can be bought as factory ammo everywhere...the 300 Winmag.
BTW, I am no advocate for the 300 Winmag, I shoot the 300 H&H which, in many ways a superior cartridge but does require (horrors) a magnum action.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
.300 Norma isn't a wild cat any longer- it is CIP standard and will be available in AI rifles from next year
Compared...for what 1500m shooting using the 240grn Sierra MK? The .300 Norma will win hands down - more powder in a shorter, fatter collum. For shooting 100rnd strings at 1000 yards...I would probably vote with my shoulder and take the .300 win.
.300 Norma isn't a wild cat any longer- it is CIP standard and will be available in AI rifles from next year
Compared...for what 1500m shooting using the 240grn Sierra MK? The .300 Norma will win hands down - more powder in a shorter, fatter collum. For shooting 100rnd strings at 1000 yards...I would probably vote with my shoulder and take the .300 win.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
I love my .300 Winny. I can find components and factory ammo easier and cheaper. It may not be the "ultimate" round but it suits my needs at the moment.
I love my .300 Winny. I can find components and factory ammo easier and cheaper. It may not be the "ultimate" round but it suits my needs at the moment.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: konabully</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I love my .300 Winny. I can find components and factory ammo easier and cheaper. It may not be the "ultimate" round but it suits my needs at the moment. </div></div>
Same thing here,I've gotten rather attached to my 300WM,the other good thing about it that no one has mentioned,is the volumes of info you can get on it.I generally stick to two loads,190BTHP Match for targets and LR Varmints and 180 Nosler Partition for hunting.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: konabully</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I love my .300 Winny. I can find components and factory ammo easier and cheaper. It may not be the "ultimate" round but it suits my needs at the moment. </div></div>
Same thing here,I've gotten rather attached to my 300WM,the other good thing about it that no one has mentioned,is the volumes of info you can get on it.I generally stick to two loads,190BTHP Match for targets and LR Varmints and 180 Nosler Partition for hunting.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
Glad you asked, the 300 H&H was designed (as were all H&H bigbores) to always work. The feeding is always perfect, with proper loads and a proper length barrel (like my 1952 Remington 721AC) it can push a 168 TSX over 3000 FPS with RL25 and no drama. The whole short action, medium action, magnum action debate is, IMO, BS when it comes to hunting rifles. No one who knows how to operate a bolt action rifle in four position rapid fire ever short-stroked one. You gotta get off the bench rest and into a sling. Finally, it is an H&H, Super 30, and that has a "cool" index that no other 30 will ever have. Yes I like H&H:
244, 300, 375 & 400.
Glad you asked, the 300 H&H was designed (as were all H&H bigbores) to always work. The feeding is always perfect, with proper loads and a proper length barrel (like my 1952 Remington 721AC) it can push a 168 TSX over 3000 FPS with RL25 and no drama. The whole short action, medium action, magnum action debate is, IMO, BS when it comes to hunting rifles. No one who knows how to operate a bolt action rifle in four position rapid fire ever short-stroked one. You gotta get off the bench rest and into a sling. Finally, it is an H&H, Super 30, and that has a "cool" index that no other 30 will ever have. Yes I like H&H:
244, 300, 375 & 400.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
Well thanks for the pics, I am wanting at some stage to build a .30 ca hunting rifle , I have my scope already a 3.5-15x50 Mildot/MIL adj.NXS and am now thinking about calibers. The ones being considered are 30/375 Ruger, .300 win mag .30/338 Norma (work would need to be done on the bolt face of a magnum action with this one though, but gee its a ncie case) and I suppose I would throw the .300 H&H in the mix. It would seem that the .300 H&H would be able to throw the 210 Berger at the same speed as the win mag.
Thanks for answers so far.
Well thanks for the pics, I am wanting at some stage to build a .30 ca hunting rifle , I have my scope already a 3.5-15x50 Mildot/MIL adj.NXS and am now thinking about calibers. The ones being considered are 30/375 Ruger, .300 win mag .30/338 Norma (work would need to be done on the bolt face of a magnum action with this one though, but gee its a ncie case) and I suppose I would throw the .300 H&H in the mix. It would seem that the .300 H&H would be able to throw the 210 Berger at the same speed as the win mag.
Thanks for answers so far.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
I have a .30-338 win mag
Remmy 700, Krieger #4 I think. It's in the plain old wood BDL stock, bedded.
My next, however, will be .300 winch. Do what you have a hankering for, no matter.
I have a .30-338 win mag
Remmy 700, Krieger #4 I think. It's in the plain old wood BDL stock, bedded.
My next, however, will be .300 winch. Do what you have a hankering for, no matter.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
Both the 300 winmag, 308 norma (30-338) have magnum rims. I don't know about the ruger but suspect it is not a std 06' rimsize.
IMO you're just pissing money away to "build" anything unless you have some unique need that the dozens of stock rifles in 300 Win Mag can't answer. But it is your money, so enjoy it.
I have a very nice brand new 700 in 300 Weatherby (that's already a magnum bolt face and magnum length action) that I would sell for $700 plus S&I. That's a lot cheaper than any "build".
Both the 300 winmag, 308 norma (30-338) have magnum rims. I don't know about the ruger but suspect it is not a std 06' rimsize.
IMO you're just pissing money away to "build" anything unless you have some unique need that the dozens of stock rifles in 300 Win Mag can't answer. But it is your money, so enjoy it.
I have a very nice brand new 700 in 300 Weatherby (that's already a magnum bolt face and magnum length action) that I would sell for $700 plus S&I. That's a lot cheaper than any "build".
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pc3</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well thanks for the pics, I am wanting at some stage to build a .30 ca hunting rifle , I have my scope already a 3.5-15x50 Mildot/MIL adj.NXS and am now thinking about calibers. The ones being considered are 30/375 Ruger, .300 win mag .30/338 Norma (work would need to be done on the bolt face of a magnum action with this one though, but gee its a ncie case) and I suppose I would throw the .300 H&H in the mix. It would seem that the .300 H&H would be able to throw the 210 Berger at the same speed as the win mag.
Thanks for answers so far.
</div></div>
I've never looked at the date, but if I take at face value that you "can get 3000 fps with a 168 TSX with no drama" I find it hard to imagine it can throw 210s as fast as a 300WM, which can push a 200gr bullet to 3000 fps with no drama.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pc3</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well thanks for the pics, I am wanting at some stage to build a .30 ca hunting rifle , I have my scope already a 3.5-15x50 Mildot/MIL adj.NXS and am now thinking about calibers. The ones being considered are 30/375 Ruger, .300 win mag .30/338 Norma (work would need to be done on the bolt face of a magnum action with this one though, but gee its a ncie case) and I suppose I would throw the .300 H&H in the mix. It would seem that the .300 H&H would be able to throw the 210 Berger at the same speed as the win mag.
Thanks for answers so far.
</div></div>
I've never looked at the date, but if I take at face value that you "can get 3000 fps with a 168 TSX with no drama" I find it hard to imagine it can throw 210s as fast as a 300WM, which can push a 200gr bullet to 3000 fps with no drama.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
"He" is not "me". I push the 168 TSX at 3000 because it kills everything I point it at. A 210 Berger is not a hunting bullet (contrary to the hype), it will not break major bones (like an Elk's pelvis) and keep on going out the other end as a Barnes will. I see no use for any bullet heavier than the 168 TSX in a 30 caliber hunting rifle used for lower 48 game within an ethical range envelope. Elk are not bulletproof nor have they over the horizon radar. Ditto Deer and Antelope. Hunting is getting as close as you can...not playing TV show hunter at 500 yards. (They never show you all the cripples!)
WY, ID, MT & UT records indicate most Elk are taken within 150 yards or LESS.
We have no idea what the OP intends to use this rifle for but unless it's a 1000 yard paper puncher, a 210 is needed about as much as tits on a boar hog.
That's my $.02 and it may be worth a Nickle as I actually hunt and kill these Western Ungulates.
"He" is not "me". I push the 168 TSX at 3000 because it kills everything I point it at. A 210 Berger is not a hunting bullet (contrary to the hype), it will not break major bones (like an Elk's pelvis) and keep on going out the other end as a Barnes will. I see no use for any bullet heavier than the 168 TSX in a 30 caliber hunting rifle used for lower 48 game within an ethical range envelope. Elk are not bulletproof nor have they over the horizon radar. Ditto Deer and Antelope. Hunting is getting as close as you can...not playing TV show hunter at 500 yards. (They never show you all the cripples!)
WY, ID, MT & UT records indicate most Elk are taken within 150 yards or LESS.
We have no idea what the OP intends to use this rifle for but unless it's a 1000 yard paper puncher, a 210 is needed about as much as tits on a boar hog.
That's my $.02 and it may be worth a Nickle as I actually hunt and kill these Western Ungulates.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
pc3
I like my 30-375R allot.It's a great cartridge that does all I've expected of it.But...the biggest problem with 30 cal is there's no reasonably priced heavy VLD bullets yet in the 230-250 grain range.
If there was a Berger,Sierra,Hornady,etc.75-.78 BC bullet I think 30 cal would be hard to beat.
After researching cartridges and projectile BC's and ballistics the last couple years I've come to the conclusion that I would have gone a different route if I were to start over.
IMO...BC is everything for long range because the greatest error will come from the wind.So...
The heavy 7mm bullets have as good a BC as 30 cal or slightly better even.The 240SMK is close in BC which is what I use.My 30-375R has the same ballistics as a 7wsm.It just produces more energy is all.
Then there's the 338's.High BC .675-.75-.78 and good speed also.
IMO,If you have a 338 Norma already then 300winmag falls short.Pun intended.
Steve
pc3
I like my 30-375R allot.It's a great cartridge that does all I've expected of it.But...the biggest problem with 30 cal is there's no reasonably priced heavy VLD bullets yet in the 230-250 grain range.
If there was a Berger,Sierra,Hornady,etc.75-.78 BC bullet I think 30 cal would be hard to beat.
After researching cartridges and projectile BC's and ballistics the last couple years I've come to the conclusion that I would have gone a different route if I were to start over.
IMO...BC is everything for long range because the greatest error will come from the wind.So...
The heavy 7mm bullets have as good a BC as 30 cal or slightly better even.The 240SMK is close in BC which is what I use.My 30-375R has the same ballistics as a 7wsm.It just produces more energy is all.
Then there's the 338's.High BC .675-.75-.78 and good speed also.
IMO,If you have a 338 Norma already then 300winmag falls short.Pun intended.
Steve
G
Guest
Guest
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
The problem here is a failure to understand it's where they are hit at rather than what they are hit with. I've killed Moose with a FMJBT .223 round. The eye was the aiming point so as not to hit bone before taging it's brain. It went down in it's tracks. A guy named K. Bell killed more elephants than anyone else on this rock, and did it mostly with a 7x57 Roberts.
Gun rags will make you think you need the latest an greatest whatever to do the deed,....what you really need is good hunting skills,... AKA,... Fieldcraft to get as close as you can so you can't miss. A 44 Remington mag will drop a Moose as will. Man is supposed to be smarter than the animal he's hunting, but first you have to get by all the B/S thats out there.
The problem here is a failure to understand it's where they are hit at rather than what they are hit with. I've killed Moose with a FMJBT .223 round. The eye was the aiming point so as not to hit bone before taging it's brain. It went down in it's tracks. A guy named K. Bell killed more elephants than anyone else on this rock, and did it mostly with a 7x57 Roberts.
Gun rags will make you think you need the latest an greatest whatever to do the deed,....what you really need is good hunting skills,... AKA,... Fieldcraft to get as close as you can so you can't miss. A 44 Remington mag will drop a Moose as will. Man is supposed to be smarter than the animal he's hunting, but first you have to get by all the B/S thats out there.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"He" is not "me". I push the 168 TSX at 3000 because it kills everything I point it at. A 210 Berger is not a hunting bullet (contrary to the hype), it will not break major bones (like an Elk's pelvis) and keep on going out the other end as a Barnes will. I see no use for any bullet heavier than the 168 TSX in a 30 caliber hunting rifle used for lower 48 game within an ethical range envelope. Elk are not bulletproof nor have they over the horizon radar. Ditto Deer and Antelope. Hunting is getting as close as you can...not playing TV show hunter at 500 yards. (They never show you all the cripples!)
WY, ID, MT & UT records indicate most Elk are taken within 150 yards or LESS.
We have no idea what the OP intends to use this rifle for but unless it's a 1000 yard paper puncher, a 210 is needed about as much as tits on a boar hog.
That's my $.02 and it may be worth a Nickle as I actually hunt and kill these Western Ungulates. </div></div>
It's a bit off topic,but,the biggest deer I've seen here in WA state are in the grasslands of EA WA,and 500 yds on a true monster is about as close as you will get in that terrain.They didn't get that big by being stupid.I've seen a few big ones jumped out at 100-200,but never an exceptional Monster.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"He" is not "me". I push the 168 TSX at 3000 because it kills everything I point it at. A 210 Berger is not a hunting bullet (contrary to the hype), it will not break major bones (like an Elk's pelvis) and keep on going out the other end as a Barnes will. I see no use for any bullet heavier than the 168 TSX in a 30 caliber hunting rifle used for lower 48 game within an ethical range envelope. Elk are not bulletproof nor have they over the horizon radar. Ditto Deer and Antelope. Hunting is getting as close as you can...not playing TV show hunter at 500 yards. (They never show you all the cripples!)
WY, ID, MT & UT records indicate most Elk are taken within 150 yards or LESS.
We have no idea what the OP intends to use this rifle for but unless it's a 1000 yard paper puncher, a 210 is needed about as much as tits on a boar hog.
That's my $.02 and it may be worth a Nickle as I actually hunt and kill these Western Ungulates. </div></div>
It's a bit off topic,but,the biggest deer I've seen here in WA state are in the grasslands of EA WA,and 500 yds on a true monster is about as close as you will get in that terrain.They didn't get that big by being stupid.I've seen a few big ones jumped out at 100-200,but never an exceptional Monster.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
So it as a flat as Kansas and the grass is 1" high... right?
You have seen them @500 and they have seen you.
You won't get closer because you don't know how.
Deer are creatures of habit and, especially during the rut, have weakspots.
I SEE a lot of Antelope at 500, 700, 1000 yards but I SHOOT them at 350 or less because I study them and use camo & cover no matter how little. Take a look at this picture. I and my buddy have killed over a dozen Antelope within 300 yards of where Brandy and I are sitting. Cover? LOL? it's called AMBUSH.
So it as a flat as Kansas and the grass is 1" high... right?
You have seen them @500 and they have seen you.
You won't get closer because you don't know how.
Deer are creatures of habit and, especially during the rut, have weakspots.
I SEE a lot of Antelope at 500, 700, 1000 yards but I SHOOT them at 350 or less because I study them and use camo & cover no matter how little. Take a look at this picture. I and my buddy have killed over a dozen Antelope within 300 yards of where Brandy and I are sitting. Cover? LOL? it's called AMBUSH.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
pc3,
I have both the 300 WM and a 300 JAZZ (30-338 Norma Mag Imp)
The 300 WM in a 24" carry rifle w/10x Nightforce is good to go to 700 yards for me. My longrange rig is the 300 JAZZ which is an improved 30-338 Norma Mag shooting 240gr SMK @ 2900fps out of a 28" barrel. Could push the 240gr SMK to 3000 +fps, but don't feel the need. My 300 JAZZ shoots the 210gr Berger's at 3150 fps. The 338 & 300 Norma case design is great. Both my rifles are built on standard magbox length actions, but still allow the 210 Bergers and 240 SMK to be seated with the BT at the neck/ shoulder junction. Great design by Mr. Sloan. The 300 WM doesn't quite stack up to the 300 JAZZ or the 300 Norma Mag. Can't comment on the 30-375 Ruger.
pc3,
I have both the 300 WM and a 300 JAZZ (30-338 Norma Mag Imp)
The 300 WM in a 24" carry rifle w/10x Nightforce is good to go to 700 yards for me. My longrange rig is the 300 JAZZ which is an improved 30-338 Norma Mag shooting 240gr SMK @ 2900fps out of a 28" barrel. Could push the 240gr SMK to 3000 +fps, but don't feel the need. My 300 JAZZ shoots the 210gr Berger's at 3150 fps. The 338 & 300 Norma case design is great. Both my rifles are built on standard magbox length actions, but still allow the 210 Bergers and 240 SMK to be seated with the BT at the neck/ shoulder junction. Great design by Mr. Sloan. The 300 WM doesn't quite stack up to the 300 JAZZ or the 300 Norma Mag. Can't comment on the 30-375 Ruger.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So it as a flat as Kansas and the grass is 1" high... right?
You have seen them @500 and they have seen you.
You won't get closer because you don't know how.
Deer are creatures of habit and, especially during the rut, have weakspots.
I SEE a lot of Antelope at 500, 700, 1000 yards but I SHOOT them at 350 or less because I study them and use camo & cover no matter how little. Take a look at this picture. I and my buddy have killed over a dozen Antelope within 300 yards of where Brandy and I are sitting. Cover? LOL? it's called AMBUSH.
</div></div>
For starters,I generally see them at a helluva lot further than 500 yards,and we don't have the luxury of hunting the rut during modern rifle season except by special permit.Another problem that presents itself is called other hunters,you can be the best in the world at stalking,but if another guy comes over the ridge and spooks some buck you've been stalking for hours,it's game over.
How about we get back on topic on this thread and leave your perceived superior hunting skills for a different forum?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So it as a flat as Kansas and the grass is 1" high... right?
You have seen them @500 and they have seen you.
You won't get closer because you don't know how.
Deer are creatures of habit and, especially during the rut, have weakspots.
I SEE a lot of Antelope at 500, 700, 1000 yards but I SHOOT them at 350 or less because I study them and use camo & cover no matter how little. Take a look at this picture. I and my buddy have killed over a dozen Antelope within 300 yards of where Brandy and I are sitting. Cover? LOL? it's called AMBUSH.
For starters,I generally see them at a helluva lot further than 500 yards,and we don't have the luxury of hunting the rut during modern rifle season except by special permit.Another problem that presents itself is called other hunters,you can be the best in the world at stalking,but if another guy comes over the ridge and spooks some buck you've been stalking for hours,it's game over.
How about we get back on topic on this thread and leave your perceived superior hunting skills for a different forum?
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I see no use for any bullet heavier than the 168 TSX in a 30 caliber hunting rifle used for lower 48 game within an ethical range envelope.</div></div>
Is a 308 with a 175 grain overkill for an antelope, deer, or an elk compared to a 300 H&H with a 168?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A 210 Berger is not a hunting bullet (contrary to the hype), it will not break major bones (like an Elk's pelvis) and keep on going out the other end as a Barnes will.
....(They never show you all the cripples!)
</div></div>
Maybe they choose a different shot placement other than your placement in the ass?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">That's my $.02 and it may be worth a Nickle as I actually hunt and kill these Western Ungulates. </div></div>
Please provide actual number killed in the last two years. We've seen the same photos over and over. Let's talk actual numbers and what you used to take them.
pc3, listen to the others, and especially elkhuntinguide if he posts.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I see no use for any bullet heavier than the 168 TSX in a 30 caliber hunting rifle used for lower 48 game within an ethical range envelope.</div></div>
Is a 308 with a 175 grain overkill for an antelope, deer, or an elk compared to a 300 H&H with a 168?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A 210 Berger is not a hunting bullet (contrary to the hype), it will not break major bones (like an Elk's pelvis) and keep on going out the other end as a Barnes will.
....(They never show you all the cripples!)
</div></div>
Maybe they choose a different shot placement other than your placement in the ass?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">That's my $.02 and it may be worth a Nickle as I actually hunt and kill these Western Ungulates. </div></div>
Please provide actual number killed in the last two years. We've seen the same photos over and over. Let's talk actual numbers and what you used to take them.
pc3, listen to the others, and especially elkhuntinguide if he posts.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Why would I take a Texas heart shot? Question is obviously written by someone who has never hunted deer or elk in thick places. BUT just for grins. here's the setting. You're on a sneak through the black timber shadowing a 7X7 you saw at first light heading into his bedding area. You jump him out of a deadfall and he's heading straight away. Up comes your Merkel SR 9.3x62 stoked with 250 gr TSXs and carrying a 1.2-4 Trijicon with the big amber post. You have three shots quick available and #1 goes in under the asshole, through 30 pounds of full paunch, takes out all the heart plumbing and exits through the neck. He makes two more bounds and piles up. That's why... I like to eat Elk not talk about the 500 yard shots or the ones "I seen through my Swaro spotting scope"
Also did it many times on Whitetail with an 1100 12 bore and deer slugs when I lived back east.
Dead is dead, it really doesn't matter how the bullet gets into the heart & lungs.
The Merkel in question:
</div></div>
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A 210 Berger is not a hunting bullet (contrary to the hype), it will not break major bones (like an Elk's pelvis) and keep on going out the other end as a Barnes will.
....(They never show you all the cripples!)
</div></div>
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">That's my $.02 and it may be worth a Nickle as I actually hunt and kill these Western Ungulates. </div></div>
Please provide actual number killed in the last two years. We've seen the same photos over and over. Let's talk actual numbers and what you used to take them with.
First,let me apologize to PC3,as this is his thread,second,JEFFBIRD,don't they call this"ALL HAT AND NO CATTLE"down where you come from?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Why would I take a Texas heart shot? Question is obviously written by someone who has never hunted deer or elk in thick places. BUT just for grins. here's the setting. You're on a sneak through the black timber shadowing a 7X7 you saw at first light heading into his bedding area. You jump him out of a deadfall and he's heading straight away. Up comes your Merkel SR 9.3x62 stoked with 250 gr TSXs and carrying a 1.2-4 Trijicon with the big amber post. You have three shots quick available and #1 goes in under the asshole, through 30 pounds of full paunch, takes out all the heart plumbing and exits through the neck. He makes two more bounds and piles up. That's why... I like to eat Elk not talk about the 500 yard shots or the ones "I seen through my Swaro spotting scope"
Also did it many times on Whitetail with an 1100 12 bore and deer slugs when I lived back east.
Dead is dead, it really doesn't matter how the bullet gets into the heart & lungs.
The Merkel in question:
</div></div>
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A 210 Berger is not a hunting bullet (contrary to the hype), it will not break major bones (like an Elk's pelvis) and keep on going out the other end as a Barnes will.
....(They never show you all the cripples!)
</div></div>
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">That's my $.02 and it may be worth a Nickle as I actually hunt and kill these Western Ungulates. </div></div>
Please provide actual number killed in the last two years. We've seen the same photos over and over. Let's talk actual numbers and what you used to take them with.
First,let me apologize to PC3,as this is his thread,second,JEFFBIRD,don't they call this"ALL HAT AND NO CATTLE"down where you come from?
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
Pc3, are you going to hunt with this rifle, or are you wanting to punch tiny holes at long distances. Before anyone (i think) can give you any ideas, we need to know what the intended uses are. Just because one cartridge will drop an animal doesnt mean it is worth squat to kill a targer or steal with. Let us know what you want to do with it, and you will get answers.
Gunfighter, just read a book about one of your statesman, Frank Glaser, Alaskas Wolf Man. In it, there is a story about killing a grizzly with a 220swift, it deffinetly all about shot placement.
Ubet
Pc3, are you going to hunt with this rifle, or are you wanting to punch tiny holes at long distances. Before anyone (i think) can give you any ideas, we need to know what the intended uses are. Just because one cartridge will drop an animal doesnt mean it is worth squat to kill a targer or steal with. Let us know what you want to do with it, and you will get answers.
Gunfighter, just read a book about one of your statesman, Frank Glaser, Alaskas Wolf Man. In it, there is a story about killing a grizzly with a 220swift, it deffinetly all about shot placement.
Ubet
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
Well folks,
I intend to hunt this rifle and am going to follow the concept of the GAP Non Typical, a rifle that Can be used at long range as well as be more portable than a couple of the heaviver style tactical rifles I have and on the way (.338 Norma & 6.5x47).
It will be used to hunt Feral Pigs, Feral Horses on Occasions the odd dingo and possibly deer. So the rifle needs to have reasonable power, be able to take a close in shot along with stretch out at distance if required (small vermin like foxes etc. would be great targets at long range). I am not so worried about the power diff between .300 winnie and .30/375 Ruger but rather nice case design and placement of pills in the case etc. and of course practicality.
I have owned a couple of 7mm's and I just prefer .30 cal rifles. I owned a Sako 75 7mm STW with McMillan set up to do the above and I just did not like it. So rather than horse trade various factory hunting rifles I am going to build my "Keeper" exactly how I want it.
Practicality along with my smith says .300 winnie but I really want this to be right and now there are many smart case designs out there that could be better I need to consider these as "it is a lot of money" to go custom as a previous poster mentioned.
I am very interested in the .30/375 Ruger as this is just a standard mag case head, not lapua case head like the .338 Norma mag.
I have over the past year sold about 7 factory rifles off and am replaceing those with 3 custom builds (less rifles but better qaulity is what I am setting out to acheive). I owned many bigbores at one time and these overlapped. Plus I caught the long range shooting bug from you guys on this forum and well the rest is history
Thanks for all help/ideas
Well folks,
I intend to hunt this rifle and am going to follow the concept of the GAP Non Typical, a rifle that Can be used at long range as well as be more portable than a couple of the heaviver style tactical rifles I have and on the way (.338 Norma & 6.5x47).
It will be used to hunt Feral Pigs, Feral Horses on Occasions the odd dingo and possibly deer. So the rifle needs to have reasonable power, be able to take a close in shot along with stretch out at distance if required (small vermin like foxes etc. would be great targets at long range). I am not so worried about the power diff between .300 winnie and .30/375 Ruger but rather nice case design and placement of pills in the case etc. and of course practicality.
I have owned a couple of 7mm's and I just prefer .30 cal rifles. I owned a Sako 75 7mm STW with McMillan set up to do the above and I just did not like it. So rather than horse trade various factory hunting rifles I am going to build my "Keeper" exactly how I want it.
Practicality along with my smith says .300 winnie but I really want this to be right and now there are many smart case designs out there that could be better I need to consider these as "it is a lot of money" to go custom as a previous poster mentioned.
I am very interested in the .30/375 Ruger as this is just a standard mag case head, not lapua case head like the .338 Norma mag.
I have over the past year sold about 7 factory rifles off and am replaceing those with 3 custom builds (less rifles but better qaulity is what I am setting out to acheive). I owned many bigbores at one time and these overlapped. Plus I caught the long range shooting bug from you guys on this forum and well the rest is history
Thanks for all help/ideas
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
Ok t5o answer the question you have asked. First what action are you going to use?
If it is a Rem 700 the 300 Win mag is always a good calibre if you want to have the ability to get factory ammo have it long throated so you can seet your projectiles out to make length of the magnum action. The 300 H&H is a good calibre and will match the balistics of the 300 Win Mag the case capacity is slightly more buit the sloping tapered case is not quight as efficialt so they end up almost the same with all projectiles loaded to the same pressure. I personaly would skip the H&H and if you wanted the longer case go for the 300 WBY mag you can fire the 300 H&H in its chamber and fireform them to give you the ability of firing 300H&H or 300Wby factory ammo. the third case is the 375 Ruger case necked to 30 cal with no other changes, its rim is slightly larger than the standard magnum but most bolts will work without any modification some just need the face opened slightly without extractor mods. then you step up to the 300 Ultra mag a real firebreather. so if you are looking at a smaler case than the ultramag case but feel like the 300 Win mag is not enough the 300 WBY or the 30-375Ruger are both great catriges with the Ruger case being a better designed case but has the disadvantage of being a wildcat but i dont care about those things and dont use any factory ammo for any hunting. As for the 300-338 Norma mag i believe the larger case is running the margin for strength on Rem actions this is anything with the 416 Rigby sized rim including the 338 lapua the factory rem 700 338 Lapuas have troubles with their extractors and they are marginal for saftey and i think Rem has stopped production they are just to big for the bolt. I know a lot have been converted but the rem actions are definately harder than the other factory magnum actions i have trued nearly every model of rem 700 and the MLR's are the toughest steel and realy make you work to machine them.
so the calibres i would shortlist
1, 300 Win MAg if you have a 338 it will get you to 1200 yards no problem after that use the 338
2, use a 300 Wby mag it has the next level of performance.
3, have a custom barrel fitted in 30-375 Ruger it will be an awsome rifle and cartrige but their is no free lunch the harder you push a 30 cal the faster the barrel wears. As for projectiles try the 208gr A Max first it has a BC that is higher than all but the 240gr MatchKings but they are half the cost and with the added velocity they will shoot with the 240 MatchKings.
Hope this helps but i would also use a 7mm and do i dont have anymore 30 cals i use for hunting i have 7mm's then go to the 338 but it is your choice and i wish you well.
Ok t5o answer the question you have asked. First what action are you going to use?
If it is a Rem 700 the 300 Win mag is always a good calibre if you want to have the ability to get factory ammo have it long throated so you can seet your projectiles out to make length of the magnum action. The 300 H&H is a good calibre and will match the balistics of the 300 Win Mag the case capacity is slightly more buit the sloping tapered case is not quight as efficialt so they end up almost the same with all projectiles loaded to the same pressure. I personaly would skip the H&H and if you wanted the longer case go for the 300 WBY mag you can fire the 300 H&H in its chamber and fireform them to give you the ability of firing 300H&H or 300Wby factory ammo. the third case is the 375 Ruger case necked to 30 cal with no other changes, its rim is slightly larger than the standard magnum but most bolts will work without any modification some just need the face opened slightly without extractor mods. then you step up to the 300 Ultra mag a real firebreather. so if you are looking at a smaler case than the ultramag case but feel like the 300 Win mag is not enough the 300 WBY or the 30-375Ruger are both great catriges with the Ruger case being a better designed case but has the disadvantage of being a wildcat but i dont care about those things and dont use any factory ammo for any hunting. As for the 300-338 Norma mag i believe the larger case is running the margin for strength on Rem actions this is anything with the 416 Rigby sized rim including the 338 lapua the factory rem 700 338 Lapuas have troubles with their extractors and they are marginal for saftey and i think Rem has stopped production they are just to big for the bolt. I know a lot have been converted but the rem actions are definately harder than the other factory magnum actions i have trued nearly every model of rem 700 and the MLR's are the toughest steel and realy make you work to machine them.
so the calibres i would shortlist
1, 300 Win MAg if you have a 338 it will get you to 1200 yards no problem after that use the 338
2, use a 300 Wby mag it has the next level of performance.
3, have a custom barrel fitted in 30-375 Ruger it will be an awsome rifle and cartrige but their is no free lunch the harder you push a 30 cal the faster the barrel wears. As for projectiles try the 208gr A Max first it has a BC that is higher than all but the 240gr MatchKings but they are half the cost and with the added velocity they will shoot with the 240 MatchKings.
Hope this helps but i would also use a 7mm and do i dont have anymore 30 cals i use for hunting i have 7mm's then go to the 338 but it is your choice and i wish you well.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
To answer your first post....the .300WM is a great case.
If I had a choice for a "new" hunting/shooting round it would be the 300 Norma mag hands down. It's similar to the Hulk and lots of us know how that works. As for BIG game hunting it will do the job for sure. ABout three years ago I shot a mature "BUll" buffalo at 225 yards BROADSIDE with a 240SMK at 3000FPS.
The bullet went through the right rib center mass through both lungs and out the left rib center mass....the bull dropped to the ground like a train fell on it with it's feet sticking straight out...have video too! PLENTY of power.
Accuracy is a hunters best friend backed by stopping power.
Choose the .300 Norma mag my friend and you cannot go wrong. You can use a wide range of bullets to shoot past 1500 yards with NO PROBLEM with plenty of energy to get the job done on MOST critters.
Tom Sarver
To answer your first post....the .300WM is a great case.
If I had a choice for a "new" hunting/shooting round it would be the 300 Norma mag hands down. It's similar to the Hulk and lots of us know how that works. As for BIG game hunting it will do the job for sure. ABout three years ago I shot a mature "BUll" buffalo at 225 yards BROADSIDE with a 240SMK at 3000FPS.
The bullet went through the right rib center mass through both lungs and out the left rib center mass....the bull dropped to the ground like a train fell on it with it's feet sticking straight out...have video too! PLENTY of power.
Accuracy is a hunters best friend backed by stopping power.
Choose the .300 Norma mag my friend and you cannot go wrong. You can use a wide range of bullets to shoot past 1500 yards with NO PROBLEM with plenty of energy to get the job done on MOST critters.
Tom Sarver
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
To be honest, a good old fashioned 30-06 will kill pigs, and horses. I would suggest it if you arent going to reload, because the availabilty of it, with ammo made to do anything you want it to. If you are going to reload then by all means the last two posters have some good ideas.
To be honest, a good old fashioned 30-06 will kill pigs, and horses. I would suggest it if you arent going to reload, because the availabilty of it, with ammo made to do anything you want it to. If you are going to reload then by all means the last two posters have some good ideas.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
Bill Action will possibly be a Rem clone it will have a Magnum bolt face.
I am defintely reloading. I am not concerned about having more power than .300 winnie although I do want to shoot no lighter than 200 gr pills they will be berger 210's or A-Max 208's etc. and some 200 gr Accubonds. I am more interested in good case design. The 30/375 Ruger seems to be good.
Who is making dies for 30/375 Ruger and is the brass good ?
Bill Action will possibly be a Rem clone it will have a Magnum bolt face.
I am defintely reloading. I am not concerned about having more power than .300 winnie although I do want to shoot no lighter than 200 gr pills they will be berger 210's or A-Max 208's etc. and some 200 gr Accubonds. I am more interested in good case design. The 30/375 Ruger seems to be good.
Who is making dies for 30/375 Ruger and is the brass good ?
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
The 200gr accubonds are flat amazing. I had loaded some up for my 300wsm and I couldnt believe the penetration that they had, what they could go through. Sadly I never did get to shoot a pig with them, but I would imagine that they will go right through the opposite side no problem.
The 200gr accubonds are flat amazing. I had loaded some up for my 300wsm and I couldnt believe the penetration that they had, what they could go through. Sadly I never did get to shoot a pig with them, but I would imagine that they will go right through the opposite side no problem.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
pc3,
Another factor to consider is the actual availability of components and particularly when shipping to Australia. For hunting, I like something at least a reasonably well stocked gun store would carry, and better yet some back water gas station would also have on the shelf, just in case you leave the ammo at home or Mr. Murphy comes for an unannounced visit. Just a thought.
pc3,
Another factor to consider is the actual availability of components and particularly when shipping to Australia. For hunting, I like something at least a reasonably well stocked gun store would carry, and better yet some back water gas station would also have on the shelf, just in case you leave the ammo at home or Mr. Murphy comes for an unannounced visit. Just a thought.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
Jeff thats defintely a consideration and one of the reasons .300 win mag is really a front runner. And thats part of the "practicality" element that needs to be considered.
I really don't need the powder capacity of the .300 RUM unless you have a 30" barrel in a heavy platform I don't feel it will offer much benefir for this type of rifle other than the case has no belt which I kind of like.
The .338 Norma I am having built is exotic enough in Australia !!
Jeff thats defintely a consideration and one of the reasons .300 win mag is really a front runner. And thats part of the "practicality" element that needs to be considered.
I really don't need the powder capacity of the .300 RUM unless you have a 30" barrel in a heavy platform I don't feel it will offer much benefir for this type of rifle other than the case has no belt which I kind of like.
The .338 Norma I am having built is exotic enough in Australia !!
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
pc3,
The dies I use for 30-375R are Hornady custom dies.The brass is excellent.I have way to many reloads on the brass that did not pass weight sorting.Maybe 15 reloads on them and some of them at very high pressures.Primers still tight on most.
When I was out shooting with it last the velocity was 2910 fps with the 240's.It was a warm day.
Steve
pc3,
The dies I use for 30-375R are Hornady custom dies.The brass is excellent.I have way to many reloads on the brass that did not pass weight sorting.Maybe 15 reloads on them and some of them at very high pressures.Primers still tight on most.
When I was out shooting with it last the velocity was 2910 fps with the 240's.It was a warm day.
Steve
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
pc3,I read an article several years ago about varmint hunting in Australia,you guys have some serious varmints there.
pc3,I read an article several years ago about varmint hunting in Australia,you guys have some serious varmints there.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SANDRAT</div><div class="ubbcode-body">pc3,I read an article several years ago about varmint hunting in Australia,you guys have some serious varmints there.</div></div>
We have a lot of varmints we can shoot here when on trips and it makes for a lot of fun. Our open outback terrain is great for long range shooting at Vermin !!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SANDRAT</div><div class="ubbcode-body">pc3,I read an article several years ago about varmint hunting in Australia,you guys have some serious varmints there.</div></div>
We have a lot of varmints we can shoot here when on trips and it makes for a lot of fun. Our open outback terrain is great for long range shooting at Vermin !!
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
PC3- Have a long, hard look at the .300 Blaser...essentially a factory standard 30-.375 Ruger. Case in my hand has a case head size of .531 and rim of .532.
Better neck design than the .300 win. CIP standard chamber is intended for accuracy. Blaser placed accuracy first amongst their design critera and then velocity etc.
Gives you 10% more velocity than a .300 win. Brass will be expensive (Blaser or Norma), but at least not a fire forming job.
Dave Kiff at Pacific made the test reamers and has all the specs.
.300 Norma- Designed for 240grn SMK's and targets beyond 1000m
.300 Blaser- designed for 180grn TTSX and game out to 500m
PC3- Have a long, hard look at the .300 Blaser...essentially a factory standard 30-.375 Ruger. Case in my hand has a case head size of .531 and rim of .532.
Better neck design than the .300 win. CIP standard chamber is intended for accuracy. Blaser placed accuracy first amongst their design critera and then velocity etc.
Gives you 10% more velocity than a .300 win. Brass will be expensive (Blaser or Norma), but at least not a fire forming job.
Dave Kiff at Pacific made the test reamers and has all the specs.
.300 Norma- Designed for 240grn SMK's and targets beyond 1000m
.300 Blaser- designed for 180grn TTSX and game out to 500m
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
Printheader
Blaser > Home > Blaser Magnum
Blaser Magnum
New generation of cartridges by Blaser and Norma
* 7mm Blaser Magnum
* .300 Blaser Magnum
* .338 Blaser Magnum
* .375 Blaser Magnum
In cooperation with Norma, Blaser has developed a brand new generation of high-performance cartridges. No existing calibres were copied. Instead, the latest ammunition technology was applied to achieve the optimum performance in each calibre group. A pleasant change in the history of ammunition: Both high-quality manufacturers were equally keen to avoid any compromises with the production of their joint venture.
The product development was determined by the following key factors:
* notably increased precision values
* higher performance in terms of energy and speed at low gas pressure
* more comfortable recoil effects
* enhanced reliability
* perfectly suitable for reloading
Thanks to an optimised cartridge geometry, stable cartridge base and modern powder types together with 4-groove barrel profiles and adapted twist rates, all development objectives have been achieved.
To start with, Blaser will distribute loads with Nosler Accubond and Barnes TSX/TTSX cartridges whereas Norma will offer additional loads under their own company label. Additional Blaser loads are in progress.
All Blaser R93 and K95 models can now be ordered in the new calibres (K95 in calibers 7mm, .300 and .338). Delivery of rifles and cartridges starts from August 2009.
Download PDF technical data (2.6 MB)
Note
Blaser ammunition is not offered for sale, sold, or distributed in North America.
It sounds like an awesome cartridge for over 1000 yds,only problem is for us yanks,read the bottom of the Blaser site,I don't know how current it is.
Printheader
Blaser > Home > Blaser Magnum
Blaser Magnum
New generation of cartridges by Blaser and Norma
* 7mm Blaser Magnum
* .300 Blaser Magnum
* .338 Blaser Magnum
* .375 Blaser Magnum
In cooperation with Norma, Blaser has developed a brand new generation of high-performance cartridges. No existing calibres were copied. Instead, the latest ammunition technology was applied to achieve the optimum performance in each calibre group. A pleasant change in the history of ammunition: Both high-quality manufacturers were equally keen to avoid any compromises with the production of their joint venture.
The product development was determined by the following key factors:
* notably increased precision values
* higher performance in terms of energy and speed at low gas pressure
* more comfortable recoil effects
* enhanced reliability
* perfectly suitable for reloading
Thanks to an optimised cartridge geometry, stable cartridge base and modern powder types together with 4-groove barrel profiles and adapted twist rates, all development objectives have been achieved.
To start with, Blaser will distribute loads with Nosler Accubond and Barnes TSX/TTSX cartridges whereas Norma will offer additional loads under their own company label. Additional Blaser loads are in progress.
All Blaser R93 and K95 models can now be ordered in the new calibres (K95 in calibers 7mm, .300 and .338). Delivery of rifles and cartridges starts from August 2009.
Download PDF technical data (2.6 MB)
Note
Blaser ammunition is not offered for sale, sold, or distributed in North America.
It sounds like an awesome cartridge for over 1000 yds,only problem is for us yanks,read the bottom of the Blaser site,I don't know how current it is.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
in Australia any case besides the 300 Win mag will not be available at most gun shops as factory ammo so forget that. As for the cases the 375 Ruger cases are readily available here in Australia so i would realy look at it the Norma based case does not fit the mag boltface so if you want a mag boltfaced action forget it. As for dies Redding will make them for you or just email Hornady and they will make them up for you without any trouble also have the reamer speced with a long freebore the 208A Max's are awsome performers on Game and critters and their expansion is devistating aswell as their internal penetration and tissue damage. If you stick with te 300 Win MAg and have a good 26" match barrel with a long throat the 208's should be around 2900fps in good brass like Lapua. the Ruger case will get you over 3000fps.
I would definately use the Ruger case have the dies made and have dave Kiff desighn the reamer around the 208 A Max loaded to the max mag length you have on your rifle that way you will gain the best performance with a mag boltfaced rifle. Dont even think about the 300 Blaser it will not be easy to get cases here and if you do they will be very expensive the ruger case will do what the Blaser does a lot easier here in Aust.
in Australia any case besides the 300 Win mag will not be available at most gun shops as factory ammo so forget that. As for the cases the 375 Ruger cases are readily available here in Australia so i would realy look at it the Norma based case does not fit the mag boltface so if you want a mag boltfaced action forget it. As for dies Redding will make them for you or just email Hornady and they will make them up for you without any trouble also have the reamer speced with a long freebore the 208A Max's are awsome performers on Game and critters and their expansion is devistating aswell as their internal penetration and tissue damage. If you stick with te 300 Win MAg and have a good 26" match barrel with a long throat the 208's should be around 2900fps in good brass like Lapua. the Ruger case will get you over 3000fps.
I would definately use the Ruger case have the dies made and have dave Kiff desighn the reamer around the 208 A Max loaded to the max mag length you have on your rifle that way you will gain the best performance with a mag boltfaced rifle. Dont even think about the 300 Blaser it will not be easy to get cases here and if you do they will be very expensive the ruger case will do what the Blaser does a lot easier here in Aust.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
Bill,
I am seriously consdiering the 30/375 Ruger or just .300 win mag. 208 A-Maxes are a bullet to consider I was looking at 210 Bergers mainly and 200 Accubonds........never thought about using A-Maxes.
Cheers paul.
Bill,
I am seriously consdiering the 30/375 Ruger or just .300 win mag. 208 A-Maxes are a bullet to consider I was looking at 210 Bergers mainly and 200 Accubonds........never thought about using A-Maxes.
Cheers paul.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
http://accurateshooter.wordpress.com/2007/07/09/sarver-shoots-1403-group-at-1000-yards/
http://www.6mmbr.com/thirty338.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.300_Lapua_Magnum
http://accurateshooter.wordpress.com/2007/07/09/sarver-shoots-1403-group-at-1000-yards/
http://www.6mmbr.com/thirty338.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.300_Lapua_Magnum
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
Tom- sounds like the .300 Hulk and the .300 Norma are very similar! Both use shortened ..338 Lapua or .416 rigby brass...Goes to prove there are not many new ideas out there....!
Bill- since it looks as though Horniday are tooling up to produce .338 Norma and .300 Norma your case problems may go away...in the meantime If any Aussies need Norma brass, contact the agent- Parrabelum Imports & Wholesalers
03 93 29 48 80.
For the Yanks...I belive (but am not 100% certain) that the issue of the name 'Blaser' has been resolved - and certainly the US Agents for Mauser/ Blaser rifles will be importing the ammunition - and the boxes could easily have been marked -'Mauser' had Blaser wished to do so. Also I cannot see Blaser stockists selling Blaser rifles and only Norma ammunition (much as I would love it)
Tom- sounds like the .300 Hulk and the .300 Norma are very similar! Both use shortened ..338 Lapua or .416 rigby brass...Goes to prove there are not many new ideas out there....!
Bill- since it looks as though Horniday are tooling up to produce .338 Norma and .300 Norma your case problems may go away...in the meantime If any Aussies need Norma brass, contact the agent- Parrabelum Imports & Wholesalers
03 93 29 48 80.
For the Yanks...I belive (but am not 100% certain) that the issue of the name 'Blaser' has been resolved - and certainly the US Agents for Mauser/ Blaser rifles will be importing the ammunition - and the boxes could easily have been marked -'Mauser' had Blaser wished to do so. Also I cannot see Blaser stockists selling Blaser rifles and only Norma ammunition (much as I would love it)
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
Thanks for all the ideas folks. After all this the choice will be .30/375 ruger or plain old .300 winnie I do not need any more powder capacity than those offer and I do not want to have to open the bolt face of an action to the lapua case head size as it closes some options further down th track if you I to re-barrel to something else.
I feel to go with more capacity than the two I have narrowed down to your better served with a heavy long range type rig to take adavantage of that extra bit of power.
Thanks for all the ideas folks. After all this the choice will be .30/375 ruger or plain old .300 winnie I do not need any more powder capacity than those offer and I do not want to have to open the bolt face of an action to the lapua case head size as it closes some options further down th track if you I to re-barrel to something else.
I feel to go with more capacity than the two I have narrowed down to your better served with a heavy long range type rig to take adavantage of that extra bit of power.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
30-375 Ruger
Neck has been lengthened a little.
[url="http://i411"]http://i411.[/url]
[img]http://i411.photobucket.com/albums/pp195/shmonty03/DSC00024.jpg
Steve
30-375 Ruger
Neck has been lengthened a little.
[img]http://i411.photobucket.com/albums/pp195/shmonty03/DSC00024.jpg
Steve
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
Not be be a cynic but what do any of these do that a 300 WinMag won't (besides being unable to buy ammo anywhere)?
A 300 Weatherby or 30-378 Weatherby will match or exceed any of these and you can still buy factory ammo.
Reminds me of a guy of a guy who bought a 1930s R.F. Sedgley Springfield in 22-06 that was all shot out. He had a new reamer, barrel and reloading dies built to put it back as it was.....
As the song goes "the man in the mirror, he can't leave the devil alone."
Not be be a cynic but what do any of these do that a 300 WinMag won't (besides being unable to buy ammo anywhere)?
A 300 Weatherby or 30-378 Weatherby will match or exceed any of these and you can still buy factory ammo.
Reminds me of a guy of a guy who bought a 1930s R.F. Sedgley Springfield in 22-06 that was all shot out. He had a new reamer, barrel and reloading dies built to put it back as it was.....
As the song goes "the man in the mirror, he can't leave the devil alone."
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
pc3,
I haven't tried necking down with the Hornady custom dies yet because I'm still on the first set of brass.
I used 338RCM and then 30RCM dies to neck down the brass I have because I had not received the new dies from Hornady yet.Then I fireformed them and had to wait 2 months.They were moving to a new building at the time.
Steve
pc3,
I haven't tried necking down with the Hornady custom dies yet because I'm still on the first set of brass.
I used 338RCM and then 30RCM dies to neck down the brass I have because I had not received the new dies from Hornady yet.Then I fireformed them and had to wait 2 months.They were moving to a new building at the time.
Steve
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Not be be a cynic but what do any of these do that a 300 WinMag won't (besides being unable to buy ammo anywhere)?
A 300 Weatherby or 30-378 Weatherby will match or exceed any of these and you can still buy factory ammo.
Reminds me of a guy of a guy who bought a 1930s R.F. Sedgley Springfield in 22-06 that was all shot out. He had a new reamer, barrel and reloading dies built to put it back as it was.....
As the song goes "the man in the mirror, he can't leave the devil alone."</div></div>
Good Points really..........and I will take them on board.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Not be be a cynic but what do any of these do that a 300 WinMag won't (besides being unable to buy ammo anywhere)?
A 300 Weatherby or 30-378 Weatherby will match or exceed any of these and you can still buy factory ammo.
Reminds me of a guy of a guy who bought a 1930s R.F. Sedgley Springfield in 22-06 that was all shot out. He had a new reamer, barrel and reloading dies built to put it back as it was.....
As the song goes "the man in the mirror, he can't leave the devil alone."</div></div>
Good Points really..........and I will take them on board.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
The issue here has come down to two cartriges yes the 300WBY will equil the 300-375 Ruger but here in Australia ammo is still not redily available. As for the 300 Win MAg if i built it i would not use factory ammo anyway as the best you can get is loaded with a 190gr MatchKing and they are not available at many gunshops accross Asutralia likley you will get Remington or Win loaded with a 150 or 180gr Projectile most other types of ammo are not stocked so factory ammo is still no good for long range making handloads the real option. So the two choices
300 Win MAg it is a great round but it does have the belt in a tight match Chamber this is no real issue and when loading for it after the first fireform i headspace off the shoulder and forget about the belt.
the 300-375 Ruger as said above it is a wildcat but the rifle is designed for long range shooting with high BC projectiles so no factory ammo will suit either. as also stated get a 338 and 300 RCM die to form the case if you have the custom set of 300-375 ruger dies just get any old 338 Ruger die loke a lee die as they are cheep and only used 1 time per case. so the form dies are easily taken caer off. the 375 ruger brass is great and if i was building this rifle that is the way i would be going. ALso for loading try the CCI250 primer with AR2225 (retumbo) and the 208 A Max this i believe would give you the ultimate without stepping up to an ultramag sized case and the cartrige OAL will fit the standard magnum length actions available with the long throat.
Hope this helps give me a PM if you need any other info.
The issue here has come down to two cartriges yes the 300WBY will equil the 300-375 Ruger but here in Australia ammo is still not redily available. As for the 300 Win MAg if i built it i would not use factory ammo anyway as the best you can get is loaded with a 190gr MatchKing and they are not available at many gunshops accross Asutralia likley you will get Remington or Win loaded with a 150 or 180gr Projectile most other types of ammo are not stocked so factory ammo is still no good for long range making handloads the real option. So the two choices
300 Win MAg it is a great round but it does have the belt in a tight match Chamber this is no real issue and when loading for it after the first fireform i headspace off the shoulder and forget about the belt.
the 300-375 Ruger as said above it is a wildcat but the rifle is designed for long range shooting with high BC projectiles so no factory ammo will suit either. as also stated get a 338 and 300 RCM die to form the case if you have the custom set of 300-375 ruger dies just get any old 338 Ruger die loke a lee die as they are cheep and only used 1 time per case. so the form dies are easily taken caer off. the 375 ruger brass is great and if i was building this rifle that is the way i would be going. ALso for loading try the CCI250 primer with AR2225 (retumbo) and the 208 A Max this i believe would give you the ultimate without stepping up to an ultramag sized case and the cartrige OAL will fit the standard magnum length actions available with the long throat.
Hope this helps give me a PM if you need any other info.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
So a hunting bullet must be built for pelvis to vital shots? That's stupid.
So a hunting bullet must be built for pelvis to vital shots? That's stupid.
Re: .300 Win Mag Versus 30/375 & 30/338Norma
PC3. If you want a good hunting round for any target inside 1000m, there is nothing wrong with the .300 Win.
If you want a better cross canyon round then a .300 Blaser, .300 RUM, .30/.378, But I am guessing that coming from the land of dust and dog s¤#t you are mostly dealing with a uni directional wind...
If you enjoy wild cats...then there ia always something better than what the factory makes (and if you truely belive that you probably also vote socialist)...
If you want a target round...300 Norma, .300 RUM or .30/378 Ammo and Brass for weatherby/ blaser etc is available in Aussie- just not in the local store- you have got to order it from the importer...but if you are building a decent rifle you can afford to buy 500 cases from cabela's/midway etc and have them shipped. they will last the life time of your barrel....
PC3. If you want a good hunting round for any target inside 1000m, there is nothing wrong with the .300 Win.
If you want a better cross canyon round then a .300 Blaser, .300 RUM, .30/.378, But I am guessing that coming from the land of dust and dog s¤#t you are mostly dealing with a uni directional wind...
If you enjoy wild cats...then there ia always something better than what the factory makes (and if you truely belive that you probably also vote socialist)...
If you want a target round...300 Norma, .300 RUM or .30/378 Ammo and Brass for weatherby/ blaser etc is available in Aussie- just not in the local store- you have got to order it from the importer...but if you are building a decent rifle you can afford to buy 500 cases from cabela's/midway etc and have them shipped. they will last the life time of your barrel....
