.308 dead zone??

[jippy1]

so a few years ago, I bought a used rem700 sps-aacsd, in .308, 20" barrel, 1:10 twist.
came with a used Nikon 4-16x42 BDC scope

first trip to the range and I was hitting 200, 400, and 600 steel reliably, the day I bought it
Had never shot beyond 200 yards before that day, so I was pretty stoked for my $540.00 investment off of arms list

Put on (call me naive) a Horus Vision FALCON scope
(Like the reticle, hate the parallax knob)

Took a two day 1:1 course with a retired usmc scout/sniper.
Hitting out to 636 on my own

800? No go . . . we assumed it was due to vegetation (rather than dirt) around the targets, and hence, no dirt splash to find the misses
Hitting maybe 50% at 1,000 (prolly just me)

Now, years later, NO change to gun or scope, but better ammo (maybe).
One day with a new coach
Out to 600 is a piece of cake (from a bench and bag)

800? Maybe 5% hits

1,000 yards - 75-80% hits
At 1,000, we saw hits move from center to 2 o’clock as barrel heated up
Cool barrel down, and back on center for a few (till re-warming)

What gives with the 800 yard zone?
Thanks,

 

[theLBC]

are you dialing only or did you try holding over?

 

[JBoomhauer]

Second question are your 800 yard shots always at the same range/targets? Might not actually be 800

 

[jippy1]

two different ranges,
hold over with Horus h-59 reticle at first go, years ago

dialing at second try, different range

embarrassingly,
I didn't range it, just assumed it was 800

 

[theLBC]

low altitude funnel-gunnel?
some ranges have odd winds from different directions depending on target location as well.

 

[JBoomhauer]

I would not put it past a mental block either. Knowing you struggled at 800 in the past, you might be influencing the 800 yard shots now.

 

[aljones_315]

Are you using a ballistic calculator or going off other peoples data?

 

[Huskydriver]

It's a 308...

 

[moaorbust]

Are you using 168 grain bullets? I believe that weight has a known ballistic issue getting past 800. I use 175s which do not have the issue. I am repeating what I have heard however and have no first hand experience. Hopefully it’s helpful.

 

[Dthomas3523]

Several things:


Is the range correct
Do you have proper dope?
Is the round in transonic flight at that range?
Is the sd/es of the ammo within the error size of target?
Does the shooter suck?

One or several of those things is the issue.

 

[jippy1]

Are you using a ballistic calculator or going off other peoples data?

Years ago:
Caldwell chrono
Hornaday ballistic app
Strelok-Pro

This time:
Hornaday calculator
And lab radar chrono

 

[jippy1]

Are you using 168 grain bullets? I believe that weight has a known ballistic issue getting past 800. I use 175s which do not have the issue. I am repeating what I have heard however and have no first hand experience. Hopefully it’s helpful.

All 178 grains this time

I think it was all 178gr, years ago, as well
As I have very few 168gr boxes at all

 

[supercorndogs]

Are you using 168 grain bullets? I believe that weight has a known ballistic issue getting past 800. I use 175s which do not have the issue. I am repeating what I have heard however and have no first hand experience. Hopefully it’s helpful.

That applies to the 168 SMK specifically, and is not endemic to all 168 class bullets.

 

[jippy1]

Several things:

Is the range correct

I hope, the coach, who built (?owns?) the range shoots a lot of 3-gun and pro pro level matches

Do you have proper dope?

I think

Is the round in transonic flight at that range?

Muzzle Velocity 2421
1337.9 @ 800 yards
1225.9 @ 900 yards

Is the sd/es of the ammo within the error size of target?

all ammo was same-lot, new, hornaday ELD-x
E.S. = 43
S.D. = 17

Does the shooter suck?

a little?, but not a lot

One or several of those things is the issue.

 

[jippy1]

That applies to the 168 SMK specifically, and is not endemic to all 168 class bullets.

the old 178's were new hornaday superformance,
and some black hills 178>168

 

[ofelas]

Fixed it for ya.

That applies to the 168 SMK specifically, and is not demonic to all 168 class bullets.

 

[Steel head]

I’ve seen too many 308’s kick ass at 1000+ now to believe the old wives tale of them falling apart at distance.
Even with 168SMK’s.
Not saying it couldn’t happen with a abnormal slow twist or weird circumstance but I haven’t seen it.

 

[acudaowner]

no idea on the grain of his bullets at that range but by the hits its still got energy left and if they can do it you could as well .and even after hit the ground its still together .

 

[W54/XM-388]

I usually only go with either 155 or 175 and have no problem getting out to 1000 yards

What is your muzzle velocity from the labradar reading?

Have you tried some other higher end brand name 175 and 155 target ammunition to see?

Do you have a kestrel or any device to measure the wind speed?

 

[isofahunter]

You guys know the 308 is not relevant any more, right?

 

[Gee Kay]

no idea on the grain of his bullets at that range but by the hits its still got energy left and if they can do it you could as well .and even after hit the ground its still together .

Mark is using 175gr Bergers

 

[littlepod]

Most likely the target wasn't at 800. Go range it. There are no dead zones in the middle of a trajectory and then it pops back fine at 1000. But it's common for people to shoot at the wrong targets thinking they're of a certain range.

 

[GlockCop]

You guys know the 308 is not relevant any more, right?

Yeah...I hear junk like that a lot. Usually from people parroting incorrect information from other people.

 

[Charger442]

Shot with some SWAT guys using their department ammo, 155 grains out of 18"-20" barrels. They could get to 800, and that was it. I think they were hitting 20% at 900. At 1000, most gave up except one guy, who took 26 rounds to hit at 1000. They were going transonic and he just got lucky

 

[W54/XM-388]

Shot with some SWAT guys using their department ammo, 155 grains out of 18"-20" barrels. They could get to 800, and that was it. I think they were hitting 20% at 900. At 1000, most gave up except one guy, who took 26 rounds to hit at 1000. They were going transonic and he just got lucky

With a 26" barreled AI and 155gr Lapua rounds, 1000 is doable for every shot assuming you have yourself and your wind figured out (Which is the biggest problem with a .308 at 1k)

 

[W54/XM-388]

Also with a 20" barreled AI and 175gr rounds, 1000 reliably.

 

[Charger442]

With a 26" barreled AI and 155gr Lapua rounds, 1000 is doable for every shot assuming you have yourself and your wind figured out (Which is the biggest problem with a .308 at 1k)

Right, their limitations were really their barrel length which cost them velocity. I was shooting 22" barrel with a can and 175s and had lots of juice.

 

[Newbie2020]

Shot with some SWAT guys using their department ammo, 155 grains out of 18"-20" barrels. They could get to 800, and that was it. I think they were hitting 20% at 900. At 1000, most gave up except one guy, who took 26 rounds to hit at 1000. They were going transonic and he just got lucky

I have a friend in Oklahoma who loves teaching nay-sayers what a 308 can do—-1,500 yds. Made a believer out of me. Glad I didn’t bet money on it.

 

[Newbie2020]

@lowlight likes proving people wrong too!

 

[calshipbuilder]

Put up a bigger target at 800, a big cardboard box works great. You need to see where the impacts are.