357 Lever Action with Threaded Barrel Options?

[wcoats]

I've always thought a 357 mag lever action rifle is cool and kind of wanted one. 7 or 8 years ago I shot a Rossi 92 with a threaded barrel and suppressor that was stupid quiet and fun shooting 38 special. I was just doing some looking online and it seems like there are a lot of options that already come with threaded barrels nowadays. At first glance the Citadel Levtac looks interesting and at a lower price than I thought it would take to get something like that. From the reading I've done it sounds like it is a rebranded Rossi 92 in 'tacticool' trim which I'm ok wiht.

The one hold up I have is when I noticed it and the Rossi 92 have 1 in 30 twist rate for their 357 mag lever guns. I think the Marlin and Henry options in 357 mag have 1 in 16 twist barrels. Am I correct in assuming that the 1 in 30 twist barrel would make it a no go for loading up reasonably heavy subs? I like the idea of being able to make some handloads with 180 gr subs but wondering if a 1 in 30 twist would even stabilize a 158gr sub load. Am I fixating on twist rate too much? I already have a 300 blk AR SBR should I just stick with that if I want to shoot heavy subs and accept the idea of just using a lever gun for shooting comically quite 38 special loads?

What options are there for a threaded 357 lever gun with a fast enough twist rate to stabilize 158 and 180 gr sub loads? Other than the Rossi and Citadel the least expensive option I've seen so far is the Henry Big Boy with a 17.4" barrel, synthetic stock and threaded barrel for just under $1K. I know the Marlin 1894 can come in 357 mag but so far I haven't seen any in my brief search and they look to actually be more expensive than the Henry.

To be honest I've never owned a lever action so I am not particularly up to speed on the differences/pros & cons between the common models. I'm assuming the Henry and Marlin options are going to be nicer than a Rossi/Citadel?

 

[stanley_white]

After experiencing the catastrophic / not fixable without tools nature of the Marlin Jam I avoid Marlin and similar designs like a Henry.

I settled on a takedown model of the Winchester 1892 and could not be happier.

-Stan

 

[carbonbased]

After experiencing the catastrophic / not fixable without tools nature of the Marlin Jam I avoid Marlin and similar designs like a Henry.

I settled on a takedown model of the Winchester 1892 and could not be happier.

-Stan

Interesting. I also do not know a darn thing about lever actions. Care to explain the Marlin Jam?

 

[wvfarrier]

I have several thousand rounds.thru assorted Henry rifles and never had a jam but blew up a winchester

 

[stanley_white]

Interesting. I also do not know a darn thing about lever actions. Care to explain the Marlin Jam?

Lots of info lots of places.

the marln jam - Google Search

-Stan

 

[Gingerbeard-man]

I picked up a Henry Big Boy .357 and had it threaded. A bit pricier that route but I wanted wood furniture. Suppressed .38 is a blast.

 

[carbonbased]

I’m sorta interested in that AR-mag-fed Henry Supreme that was unveiled at Shot 2024 (not on their site yet). Not sure if I’d go 300bo or 223.

 

[FuhQ]

View attachment 8432145I picked up a Henry Big Boy .357 and had it threaded. A bit pricier that route but I wanted wood furniture. Suppressed .38 is a blast.

Who did the threading job? I have an 1894SS .44 Mag that needs to be threaded so I can run my Obsidian 45 on it...

 

[Gingerbeard-man]

Who did the threading job? I have an 1894SS .44 Mag that needs to be threaded so I can run my Obsidian 45 on it...

I sent it to Morgan at class 3 machining

 

[Mike Casselton]

Interesting. I also do not know a darn thing about lever actions. Care to explain the Marlin Jam?

It happens to people who are used to "short stroking."

 

[wcoats]

Does anyone have any experience with the GForce Arms Huckleberry LTAC 357? It looks interesting and I emailed them, and they stated the barrel is a 1 in 16 twist so it should stabilize heavy subs better than the Rossi or Citadel that have a 1 in 30 twist. Curious to hear if anyone has used one and there thoughts since it is from a company I haven't heard of. It looks like GForce arms is just the importer and it's a Turkish manufactured and imported gun. It seems like there has been an increase in Turkish imports/options in several gun categories. I've heard good thinks about Canik handguns that are made in Turkey.

https://gforcearms.com/firearms/rifles/huckleberry-ltac/

My practical side thinks I should just buy a Ruger American Ranch in 300 BLK that would fit the same practical purpose, be cheaper, more accurate and could still shoot comically quite loads that wouldn't cycle in my AR. But I don't own any lever guns and the idea of running a lever gun shooting quiet loads has a higher fun factor in when thinking about it.

 

[Yondering]

To answer a question in the OP - you're not overthinking the twist rate; it matters a lot. 1:30 is stupid slow for any sort of suppressed setup, that'd be a hard pass for me.

1:16 will handle up to 250gr or a bit more depending on bullet design, using .358 cal rifle bullets. I shoot a few different suppressed 35 cal rifles with that twist rate (it was the standard twist for a lot of 35 Remington and 35 Whelen rifles) and have used blunt cast bullets up to 280gr but did experience tumbling with 300gr round nose, FWIW.

A tip on long heavy bullets in a 357 Lever gun - use 38 Special brass, but load near the maximum length for the action. 357 Mag brass has a long internal taper that will bulge cases if you try to seat a heavy bullet very deep, but the 38 Special has a much shorter internal taper and more straight section for seating long bullets.

Some .357 barrels are 1:20, it's been years since I experimented with one but IIRC that's good for 180gr-200gr. Of course a custom barrel is always a possibility if you know the right gunsmith; if you do that I'd recommend starting with a 1:14 blank, that'd let you shoot any bullet weight that could possibly fit in a 357 lever gun, and still wouldn't be too much for the light weight bullets.


BTW that RAR in 300 Blk is the easy button for the rifle, but IME subsonic 35 cal is a lot more effective without going to expensive boutique bullets like Lehigh Defense, etc. The 300 Blk also isn't as quiet unless you handload using some of the old 300 Whisper data using fast pistol powders like Red Dot, Clays, etc; the normal AR15 subsonic loads use slower powder and a lot more of it and just aren't as quiet as a lot of the common 38 Special stuff. Common lead 158gr 38 Special is the easy button for ammo if you want quiet subs; the SWC-HP versions work well enough for small-ish game up to coyote size. I do prefer a heavier bullet for deer in this application; a 180gr hollow point like you mentioned can work well.

 

[wcoats]

@Yondering thanks for the detailed info you seem to know a lot about this.

I have experience with non-AR 300 blk loads. I used to have an AAC H&R Handi rifle and had some fun quit loads for it including 180 gr bullets over unique all the way down to 90 gr over trail boss. I recently sold it intending to buy a RAR in 300 blk but notice that the Rossi 92 or the Citadel Levtac in 357 mag with threaded barrels can be picked up for only about $200 more than the going price for the Gen 2 RAR so that got me thinking/going down the lever gun rabbit hole but the 1 in 30 twist seems to be a no go for them.

Any input on the Huckleberry LTAC 357 mag? It looks to be another clone of the 1892 lever action and has a 1 in 16 twist. If it will take $1000+ to get a lever gun worth having it will be harder for me to justify to myself not just picking up the RAR in 300 blk. I don’t have any lever guns but it looks like the fun factor as a range toy would be higher than a bolt action 300 BLk but could also fill about the same practical purpose. And off the shelf 38 spl could be cheap fun if I’m out of hand loads and tight on time.

I have harvested deer with 300 blk with a 200 gr Maker Rex( short 20-30 yard distance). I’m assuming a 180 gr 357 loaded just barely sub sonic would be at least as effective.

 

[Yondering]

Sounds like you know what's what in regards to handloads and making the 300 Blk quieter, so that's an advantage. IME though the bigger bore of the 357 is still an advantage for subs; it's easier to get hollow points to perform right, at least in my experience with making cast bullet molds specifically for subsonic hunting use. Obviously either one will do with the right bullet of course, as you know.

I am unfamiliar with that Huckleberry lever gun; I hadn't even heard of them until you mentioned it. It'd depend a lot on the price for me; some of the Turkish guns can be a bit crude and hard to find parts for, but others can be very functional. I kind of like the looks of that wood stocked version; I picked up a cheap turkish semi-auto shotgun a couple years ago that has nicely figured wood like that, so you could potentially get a pretty nice looking wood stock if you're into that. As far as the quality or function of that rifle though, sorry, I have no idea.