375CT at 2000Y and 2500Y

S

steve123

Lt. Colonel
Full Member
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Mar 16, 2008
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none of your business
#1
Ross and I went out this morning for some Extreme Long Range shooting here in Northern AZ.
A couple months ago I had bought an AR-400 steel plate that is 40inches wide X 48inches high specifically for shooting at 2500 to 3000 yards.Ross was kind enough to weld up a great stand to hang it from and up till today it had been a virgin.
I had the notion of trying 3000 yards first by using the odometer in my truck.It was so far off that we couldn't see any hits in the dirt on the hill(It turned out that I was prob at 3400 yards or so)so we decided to use Ross's 2000Y LRF instead.We ranged to 1000Y first then I stayed so Ross could range my truck another 1000Y out.So now at 2000Y we set up to shoot.
Winds were still to 5mph coming from our back at 4:00
I tried the 330gr Lehighs at 3245FPS first and was hitting the plate after 3-4 shots but had some issues with vertical and had prob a 75% hit ratio.Then I got out the Hooker 350gr load at 3070FPS and they shot higher up on the hill by about 10 feet and seemed to get to the target almost a second faster.With the Hookers it was easy to hit the plate.I would compare it to shooting a pop can at 100 yards with a 22 and had prob a 92% hit ratio.
A fun thing that happened was that Ross took one of his ear plugs out to see if he could hear the sound of the steel being hit by the bullet.Darned if we could.That thing really makes a loud gong sound.It took about 8 seconds from the time I fired till the time we heard the gong sound.It made it a lot easier to confirm a hit too.
We were running out of time and ammo so we went out to 2500Y and I was on the plate again after 4 rounds.That extra 500 yards was a whole different ball game.I decided not to try the Lehigh 330's and went straight to the 350's,good thing because with 14 shots left I only hit it 7-8 times but at least I got it 3 times in a row.We could still hear the sound of the plate being hit but it was faint.It was taking 11 seconds this time for us to hear the gong sound from the time I fired.It was like standing in front of the microwave waiting for your popcorn to get finished,a loooong time.LOL

This was what the plate looked like with 3x zoom on the camera.AT 2500 Yards


DSC00136.jpg

12x zoom at 2500 yards
DSC00135.jpg

DSC00140.jpg

Ross and a size comparison
DSC00141-1.jpg

Thanks,
Steve





 
#4
Re: 375CT at 2000Y and 2500Y

Outstanding! I noticed similar things with the .408 Lehighs. They are good bullets to about 1600-1800 yards then start getting a bit unpredictable while the LRBT/Hooker/Jamison 419s stay consistent. Of course the Lehighs are significantly less expensive, so they do have a place in toolset.

Looks like you guys had a great time
smile.gif
 
#10
Re: 375CT at 2000Y and 2500Y

Steve
That's awesome man. Where around Flagstaff do you get 2500 yards? Looks like you had fun. When do you want to get together? Hopefully, I will get my Barrett soon. Need to work up a good 750 AMAX load to get it out there. Fortunately, the elevation there is high enough that I may be able to push a bit harder on my 338 LM, but I am not counting on it.
 
#12
Re: 375CT at 2000Y and 2500Y

Your 338 should be able to push 2000 without to much problem. I have seen how that thing shoots. As far as your 50 goes it might get you to 2300 or 2400 but to get much performance out of it can be difficult. Beyond that... this is where the CT comes into play.


<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DesertHK</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Steve
That's awesome man. Where around Flagstaff do you get 2500 yards? Looks like you had fun. When do you want to get together? Hopefully, I will get my Barrett soon. Need to work up a good 750 AMAX load to get it out there. Fortunately, the elevation there is high enough that I may be able to push a bit harder on my 338 LM, but I am not counting on it. </div></div>
 
#15
Re: 375CT at 2000Y and 2500Y

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: The Mechanic</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You need to invest in a GPS. You can pick up a used one that will give you distance down to about 10 to 15 feet for $100 or so. </div></div>

Yea thats a great suggestion. I thought of that too when I read that.
 
#16
Re: 375CT at 2000Y and 2500Y

On the first picture . . . with the handsome guy, one of the marks is not round but a perfect bullet sideways. The Lehighs were just not up to the task. Hope Noels are better.

That 11 sec gig was cool. You could shoot, regain your sight picture - spot your hit and casually remove your ear plugs and hear the hit.
Ross
 
#19
Re: 375CT at 2000Y and 2500Y

Another point:

It is truly a different world comparing 2000 to 2500 yds. Loadbase suggests both are supersonic at this range, I doubt it.

I stationed myself downrange in a gully about 700 yds from the target and could hear the Lehighs flapping in the wind as they passed, that is if they made it, or possibly a few shot well and I couldn't hear them, most sounded like a card in bicycle spokes.
Ross
 
#21
Re: 375CT at 2000Y and 2500Y

Great thread and some dang fine shooting
cool.gif

How do you drop compensate from 2500m to 3000m?
After about 2500m you will run out of clicks right?
I am having a 5.5-22x56 NXS put on my rifle also, but am also considering the NEW Premier Heritage scope 5-25 when they come out in june/July, they should also have about 100+ MOA of elevation and a 34mm tube like the S&B.

http://www.premierreticles.com/test%20page/Products%20Home.html


Cheers,

Master Diver

 
#22
Re: 375CT at 2000Y and 2500Y

Steve and Ross

Nicely done guys; Steve that red rig looks like it visually sticks out pretty well in that background. Interesting on teh difference in the LeHihghs and the Hookers.

Have you given LeHigh any feedback so that he might change his design?

JeffVN
 
#23
Re: 375CT at 2000Y and 2500Y

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Master Diver</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Great thread and some dang fine shooting
cool.gif

How do you drop compensate from 2500m to 3000m?
After about 2500m you will run out of clicks right?
I am having a 5.5-22x56 NXS put on my rifle also, but am also considering the NEW Premier Heritage scope 5-25 when they come out in june/July, they should also have about 100+ MOA of elevation and a 34mm tube like the S&B.

http://www.premierreticles.com/test%20page/Products%20Home.html


Cheers,

Master Diver

</div></div>

For the cost the new 35mm tube millet has 140 moa of drop. Its the most drop out of any scope i have seen besides a USO SN-9.
 
#26
Re: 375CT at 2000Y and 2500Y

Thanks Notaguru,
for putting up the post to my rifle pics.I'm glad I listened to Barney Lawton's advice on the Nightforce 5.5-22x56.It turned out to be a great scope with 100+mins of elevation and combined the 40 min rail I have lots of elevation left at 2500 yards.I'll have to see at a later date if it's gonna have enough elevation for 3000Y.I wouldn't be opposed to trading Masterdiver my NF for that PR 5-25 though.LOL

Master Diver.It is to my shame that this operation was a fly by nighter.Meaning that we weren't really prepared and not sighted in correctly to begin with.The spring winds have been blowing alot and we made a last minute decision to go in calmer conditions.In the previous months I had done lots of load work up with the Lehigh's at different distances and lost my exact zero.When we went to 2000 yards I used the ballistic program to get close then we could see the impacts in the dirt to walk em in.I do know that it was close to 20 MOA for the Hookers which is 2 full revs on the scope from 2000Y to 2500Y.

The Horus Vision ATRAG-MP lists 42.5MOA up from a 400Y zero with the .9245BC Lehigh 330's at 2000Y and 64.6MOA up for 2500Y.I'm not sure on the BC of the Hookers.If someone knows a reliable BC for them will you please reply with the info.

Jeff,I should call Lehigh and tell them what happened.I want to try other brands of solids also and the bulletsmiths polymer tipped bullets too.I remember Dean M calling the drive bands on projos(air flaps).That always rings in the back of my mind as a possible fault with the banded solids but don't know? We all need to experiment with the different brands and post our results.Dogtown said above that he noticed the Lehigh's became inconsistent at the longer ranges also with his 408CT.The 375/330's sure shot good at 1000 yards and not to bad at a mile.

Mechanic,Yep I think it's time I got a GPS.I'm thinking I'll spend the extra money and get the walky talky/Gps ones.I don't know if we are going to be able to see the strikes in the dirt at 3000Y so we might have to have a down range spotter.

Here's that pic of the bullet that hit sideways
DSC00142.jpg


Steve

 
#28
Re: 375CT at 2000Y and 2500Y

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Master Diver</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Great thread and some dang fine shooting
cool.gif

How do you drop compensate from 2500m to 3000m?
After about 2500m you will run out of clicks right?
I am having a 5.5-22x56 NXS put on my rifle also, but am also considering the NEW Premier Heritage scope 5-25 when they come out in june/July, they should also have about 100+ MOA of elevation and a 34mm tube like the S&B.

http://www.premierreticles.com/test%20page/Products%20Home.html


Cheers,

Master Diver

</div></div>

For the cost the new 35mm tube millet has 140 moa of drop. Its the most drop out of any scope i have seen besides a USO SN-9. </div></div>

I will have to check it out, thanks, how are those Millet scopes? Are they same quality as Nightforce, S&B, leupold Mark 4 etc?

Seems the biggest problme with the .375 CT is getting a scope that will allow you beyound 2500m

Cheers,

Master Diver
 
#29
Re: 375CT at 2000Y and 2500Y

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: steve123</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I wouldn't be opposed to trading Masterdiver my NF for that PR 5-25 though.LOL

Master Diver.It is to my shame that this operation was a fly by nighter.Meaning that we weren't really prepared and not sighted in correctly to begin with.The spring winds have been blowing alot and we made a last minute decision to go in calmer conditions.In the previous months I had done lots of load work up with the Lehigh's at different distances and lost my exact zero.When we went to 2000 yards I used the ballistic program to get close then we could see the impacts in the dirt to walk em in.I do know that it was close to 20 MOA for the Hookers which is 2 full revs on the scope from 2000Y to 2500Y.

</div></div>

Ok, I think you did very well, good shooting and a fine % of hits. What a great day that must have been.
I am still thinking REAL hard about what scope will be best for my 375 Snipe-Tac, I want to be able to shoot beyound 2500m.

Cheers,

Master Diver
 
#30
Re: 375CT at 2000Y and 2500Y

Looks that you have had some fun. Thats a nice range, I wish i had one like that in Spain without having to argue with some range commander colonel, to allow me to shoot on his tank ranges with a "rifle".
I may board a plane a fly to AZ and shoot with you !!!!
The 375 really shoots nice
Ed
 
#33
Re: 375CT at 2000Y and 2500Y

Ross what magnification are you runnig when shooting 2500? Is 42 the ticket or 35? I know it depends on conditions but what do you normally find as the magnification your using? I was thinking about getting one of those but if you find your self always on 22 power I might stick with my nightforce.
 
#34
Re: 375CT at 2000Y and 2500Y

Steve as far as i have figured so far the bc on the hookers is right about 1.1.

Master From what i have seen they are a good scope. Ask later on the hide here what he thought of his after he froze it over night and it still clicked when frozen. Dont know if he used his but i would ask his opinion on them.
 
#39
Re: 375CT at 2000Y and 2500Y

Steve,

I never saw the "air flap" reference by Dean regarding engraving bands, but I do recall him questioning my use of the term "aerodynamics", as applied to this class of projectiles (personal e-mail). He preferred the use of the term "ballistic", as he appeared to believe aerodynamic analysis was reserved for aircraft, and had no application to this field.

It is ironic that it is an aeronautical term which Dean utilized in criticism of engraving bands. It is not widely publicized that when Bob McCoy's ballistic formulas are applied to the effect which these engraving structures have on BC, a great big ZERO is registered.

I believe this field will increasingly become informed by hybirdized "aero-ballistic" design, and analysis. By this measure, engraving bands are a net positive in their effect on maintainance of laminar air flow.





 
#45
Re: 375CT at 2000Y and 2500Y

Ya,that's it,drag bands not airflaps.Thanks Ross.It was a couple of years ago that I had read something about it.

Didn't dean shoot somewhere around a 100,000 rounds in testing various projos with the 408CT when in development?That's where the doubt comes from.I think if anybody on the planet has seen differences in accuracy,drop,or whatever with various projos then he'd be the one.

Hi Noel,
I'll leave all this aerodynamic analysis to you smart guy's.I know you are gonna figure this whole solid projo thing out for us and thank you for doing so.I'm really looking forward to trying your new projos out.I'm sure this shooting session would not be compared to any real test of projos.Just some impressions we had when shooting.

We are watching Lrs50bmg's,Notaguru's and Augustus's and others posts with anticipation to see how well they work with the different twists and weights of projos in the different ELR cals.

DesertHk,
Pm me sometime when you are ready and we'll make some plans.
 
#46
Re: 375CT at 2000Y and 2500Y

Thanks for the vote of confidence Steve.

It is the type of feedback I get from you, and the "weekend" activities posted by recreational shooters as in this thread, that motivates my efforts.

Best,
Noel
 
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