Anyone been shooting this cartridge? What about the 50-416 Barrett since brass is available? Should be a more efficient cartridge than the full 50BMG.
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50 Spotter?
- Thread starter excaliber
- Start date
Re: 50 Spotter?
I have a noreen shellholder chambered in the 50 spotter.I cut the barrel down to 20 inches for easier use in a ground blind and use the Barnes 647 XXX projo for deer hunting.I like hunting with .50 cals.It's not a long range round by any means.It's not even in the same atmosphere as the .416,50bmg or it's variants in terms of velocity.It's a great cartridge for surpression use. 50-416 barrett ? The 416 is a 50bmg cartridge necked down to .416".Ballistically its superior to the 50bmg,but so are alot of other cartridges that come in a lighter rifle platform.
I have a noreen shellholder chambered in the 50 spotter.I cut the barrel down to 20 inches for easier use in a ground blind and use the Barnes 647 XXX projo for deer hunting.I like hunting with .50 cals.It's not a long range round by any means.It's not even in the same atmosphere as the .416,50bmg or it's variants in terms of velocity.It's a great cartridge for surpression use. 50-416 barrett ? The 416 is a 50bmg cartridge necked down to .416".Ballistically its superior to the 50bmg,but so are alot of other cartridges that come in a lighter rifle platform.
Re: 50 Spotter?
The 416 is not actually the BMG necked down. It is about 1" shorter. I wanted to neckup 416B to 50 just because it would be more efficient. What kind of velocity are you getting with the 20" barrel?
The 416 is not actually the BMG necked down. It is about 1" shorter. I wanted to neckup 416B to 50 just because it would be more efficient. What kind of velocity are you getting with the 20" barrel?
Re: 50 Spotter?
Robert,
There are several .50 Wildcat cartridges out there. In the FCSA, the late Skip Talbot took the .50 Spotter Case and sharpened the shoulder, made a very short neck (just enough to hold the .200 wide driving band on a 700 grain 12L14 Steel bullet) which worked well at the time we did not have anything other than surplus powder to use. Barrel life, even with nitrided barrels, could be 900 rounds or 50 rounds, so this was another reason we moved away from the steel bullets. Once we had VV powder, and started using brass allow bullets in the 750 to 800 grain range, the lighter steel bullets were no longer competitive. The late Lynn McMurdo and I also designed a case that was about .375 shorter than the .50 BMG with less body taper, and a sharper shoulder. I used an 800 grain brass alloy bullet of our combined design, with VV20N29 powder to win the FCSA National Championship 5 years in a row. The case was decidedly more efficient, as I got about 50-100 fps higher velocity with 6-10 grains less powder (depending on the lot of powder) than the BMG case using the same bullet. The 50 Spotter in it's current form, would not be any significant improvement. If you turned it into an "Improved" case... then you might, but with the reduced case capacity, you will have difficulty pushing 800 gr. projos up to decent speed. I have not had a chance to try the new RL50 powder in the McMurdo Case yet, but Dale Arenson has had great success with it the last 2 years at the FCSA Championship matches, using RWS standard BMG cases. I am more interested in using the .50 Improved case, with 300 grains of powder to push a 930 grain bullet at competitive velocities... I have only had one opportunity to try this combination so far, and except for needing a 1:13 twist barrel, instead of the 1:15, they seemed to work well (about 1or 2 of a 5 round string wound tumble 50-100 yards in front of the target.
The ones that made it to the target grouped really well. I apologize for the lengthy dissertation here, especially if you are already aware of all this, but just wanted to make you aware that there are a variety of ways to go with your project. Ultimately, your choice of case should be made on the bullet you plan on using, and then choosing the best case to match with efficiency and case capacity. Your powder choices will also be determined by your projectile choice.
Hope this provides some useful information in what you are seeking to do. .50 Spotter cases are out there, just not quite as easy to find as BMG cases. If you want more info on the .50 McMurdo case, I can send you a copy of the reamer drawings. (May take me a while to find it though). The forming dies, Full length, Neck Sizer and Seating dies are all available form CH-4D Die. You could also neck the .50 McMurdo down to .416, and it would be a more efficient case than the Barrett .416 in my opinion.
One important caveat: NO NOT try to shoot .50 Spotter projectiles at BMG velocities.. they were never designed for that velocity and are not bore safe. They can detonate in your barrel with obviously bad consequences.
Trivia Question: What was the .50 Spotter designed for?
Robert,
There are several .50 Wildcat cartridges out there. In the FCSA, the late Skip Talbot took the .50 Spotter Case and sharpened the shoulder, made a very short neck (just enough to hold the .200 wide driving band on a 700 grain 12L14 Steel bullet) which worked well at the time we did not have anything other than surplus powder to use. Barrel life, even with nitrided barrels, could be 900 rounds or 50 rounds, so this was another reason we moved away from the steel bullets. Once we had VV powder, and started using brass allow bullets in the 750 to 800 grain range, the lighter steel bullets were no longer competitive. The late Lynn McMurdo and I also designed a case that was about .375 shorter than the .50 BMG with less body taper, and a sharper shoulder. I used an 800 grain brass alloy bullet of our combined design, with VV20N29 powder to win the FCSA National Championship 5 years in a row. The case was decidedly more efficient, as I got about 50-100 fps higher velocity with 6-10 grains less powder (depending on the lot of powder) than the BMG case using the same bullet. The 50 Spotter in it's current form, would not be any significant improvement. If you turned it into an "Improved" case... then you might, but with the reduced case capacity, you will have difficulty pushing 800 gr. projos up to decent speed. I have not had a chance to try the new RL50 powder in the McMurdo Case yet, but Dale Arenson has had great success with it the last 2 years at the FCSA Championship matches, using RWS standard BMG cases. I am more interested in using the .50 Improved case, with 300 grains of powder to push a 930 grain bullet at competitive velocities... I have only had one opportunity to try this combination so far, and except for needing a 1:13 twist barrel, instead of the 1:15, they seemed to work well (about 1or 2 of a 5 round string wound tumble 50-100 yards in front of the target.
Hope this provides some useful information in what you are seeking to do. .50 Spotter cases are out there, just not quite as easy to find as BMG cases. If you want more info on the .50 McMurdo case, I can send you a copy of the reamer drawings. (May take me a while to find it though). The forming dies, Full length, Neck Sizer and Seating dies are all available form CH-4D Die. You could also neck the .50 McMurdo down to .416, and it would be a more efficient case than the Barrett .416 in my opinion.
One important caveat: NO NOT try to shoot .50 Spotter projectiles at BMG velocities.. they were never designed for that velocity and are not bore safe. They can detonate in your barrel with obviously bad consequences.
Trivia Question: What was the .50 Spotter designed for?
Re: 50 Spotter?
The Spotter was designed for the M8 Spotter rifle which was mounted on the M40 and M27 106mm Recoiless rifle. I do have some spotter bullets that I was wanting to load in a BMG case, and was wondering if you know what loads would work best? I know that the bullets loaded in the Spotter should not be shot at full BMG velocities but I would like to shoot them. I am trying to find a 50FCSA cartridge for my collection and a 50 Mcmurdo also. If I could find enough Spotter cases, I would probably do a 50 Spotter improved. Just because it`s different. I don`t think I would shoot anything heavier than a 650gr bullet.
The Spotter was designed for the M8 Spotter rifle which was mounted on the M40 and M27 106mm Recoiless rifle. I do have some spotter bullets that I was wanting to load in a BMG case, and was wondering if you know what loads would work best? I know that the bullets loaded in the Spotter should not be shot at full BMG velocities but I would like to shoot them. I am trying to find a 50FCSA cartridge for my collection and a 50 Mcmurdo also. If I could find enough Spotter cases, I would probably do a 50 Spotter improved. Just because it`s different. I don`t think I would shoot anything heavier than a 650gr bullet.
Re: 50 Spotter?
I will have to look it up, but I do have the recommended loads for shooting the 50 Spotter projos in the BMG case.
You are correct, the .50 Spotter was designed to have the same ballistic trajectory as the 106. If the spotter round was on target, then they would fire the 106. I you want, I can send you a .50 McMurdo case.. I have plenty of them!
Scott
I will have to look it up, but I do have the recommended loads for shooting the 50 Spotter projos in the BMG case.
You are correct, the .50 Spotter was designed to have the same ballistic trajectory as the 106. If the spotter round was on target, then they would fire the 106. I you want, I can send you a .50 McMurdo case.. I have plenty of them!
Scott
Re: 50 Spotter?
lrs50bmg, I would like to get (2) Mcmurdo`s from you if you don`t care. Do you know much about Skip`s 50FCSA? PTG already has a reamer made up for that cartridge but I would like to see it first. I think the Spotter improved or standard Spotter is what I`m looking for but I don`t want to build a rifle that brass is hard to find. I have a truckload of military API`s and full metal jacket bullets so it would make a nice rock buster.
lrs50bmg, I would like to get (2) Mcmurdo`s from you if you don`t care. Do you know much about Skip`s 50FCSA? PTG already has a reamer made up for that cartridge but I would like to see it first. I think the Spotter improved or standard Spotter is what I`m looking for but I don`t want to build a rifle that brass is hard to find. I have a truckload of military API`s and full metal jacket bullets so it would make a nice rock buster.
Re: 50 Spotter?
Excaliber,
I would be happy to send you a few of my .50 McMurdo cases, if it is OK, I will send you a few that are getting a little long in the teeth for competition, but still serviceable. Skips FCSA case is not practical for shooting anything other than the steel bullets we used back in the early 1990's. the neck is much too short to hold a standard bullet. The neck was only about .300-.400 long if I recall. And it does not have the case capacity to push a regular bullet if you seated it down into the case. His case was actually a cut down .50 Spotter. Unfortunately, I do not have any samples of his cases to be able to show you. I did not have the forethought to ask him before he passed away so suddenly on us. The club was never quite the same after he and Lynn McMurdo psssed away, and some of the rest of us veterans drifted away from frequently competing.. I will get those cases on the way to you next week, as I am out of town at the moment..
Excaliber,
I would be happy to send you a few of my .50 McMurdo cases, if it is OK, I will send you a few that are getting a little long in the teeth for competition, but still serviceable. Skips FCSA case is not practical for shooting anything other than the steel bullets we used back in the early 1990's. the neck is much too short to hold a standard bullet. The neck was only about .300-.400 long if I recall. And it does not have the case capacity to push a regular bullet if you seated it down into the case. His case was actually a cut down .50 Spotter. Unfortunately, I do not have any samples of his cases to be able to show you. I did not have the forethought to ask him before he passed away so suddenly on us. The club was never quite the same after he and Lynn McMurdo psssed away, and some of the rest of us veterans drifted away from frequently competing.. I will get those cases on the way to you next week, as I am out of town at the moment..
Re: 50 Spotter?
I would also like to find a 50 Fat Mac cartridge while we are on the 50 cal subject. I see that the Mcmurdo is similar to the DTC.
I would also like to find a 50 Fat Mac cartridge while we are on the 50 cal subject. I see that the Mcmurdo is similar to the DTC.
