556 NATO Chambering VS 223 Wylde 18" Rifle Length -

[Jethro.McFarland]

Gentlemen - Please provide me the benefits of 556 NATO Chambering vs. Wylde Chambering. Please present the information from results and personal experience.

Build:
Rock River Lower Receiver
Rock River Single Stage Trigger with JP 3.5 Trigger Springs. (Hopefully a better trigger in the future) Open to suggestions for later improvements.
Ergo Grip
Magpul BAD Lever
Winter Trigger Gaurd
Vltor A5 Buffer Tube
Heavy Buffer's Tunable A5 Buffer Kit
Heavy Buffer's Rifle Length Spring
Magpul Mil-spec CTR Stock

I have yet to start building my upper as it will be done in stages But this is what I am considering the following:
Rainier Arms Upper Receiver
I need suggestions for a BCG -
Diamondhead 15" Free Float Handgaurd (I love the way these feel) If you have any you like let me know

Now here is where I am stuck
I want to build my rifle with a 18" in. Rifle length gas port.
I want to be able to shoot 77 grain bullets but my main source of ammunition is 55 grain.
I would like to hear your opinions of 1 in 8 twist vs 1 in 7
Barrel Contour?? Medium vs Heavy
Muzzle Device - Flash Hiders vs Comps - which do you prefer (Brands/Models) - Also considering QD from Yankee Hill or AAC for a someday supressor...
Chambering NATO vs Wylde.

I want to use this gun for 3 gun comp
Long Range Plinking in the Desert/Coyote Hunting
I am thinking a Vortex 1x4 MRAD (I have a FNAR .308 with a large scope on it for out to 8-9 yards so I don't want another Pig and a Rock River Operator)

Basically, my goal is to build a rifle that I can have fun with while being as accurate as possible. If you could help me that would be great

 

[kraigWY]

White Oak wins most of the high power matches. 200, 300, & 600.

It uses the Wylde chamber. Mine don't care it's 223, 5.56 or what ever. 1:8 will shot both 55s and 77s, but so will a 1:7. Only difference is some day you may want to try some 80-90 gr bullets.

For info the Army uses a Mann device to test ammo. It's a 1:7, for a control round they use 52 gr Sierra match bullets.

If you decide for poops and grins to really step out there, 80-90 gr bullet work at 600 and 1000 yards.

 

[Jethro.McFarland]

I have been noticing that a lot of higher end rifle manufacturers are using the Wylde chambering with the 1 in 7 twist. I would love to try some 80-90 grainers someday. Thanks for posting.

 

[ORD]

The only real question for whether to go with a standard 5.56 NATO vs. a Wylde chamber is whether or not you plan on running any .223 commercial ammo through the rifle. If yes...then the Wylde is the better course to take as it will safely (and with better accuracy) run BOTH and will run the full range of pills you have specified (1:8 works VERY well up through 77gr at mag-length and will also run 80gr single feed without issue). If no...then there is no real "advantage" per se with the Wylde chambering. If you are going to reload for the rifle...then pick one and move on knowing that you'll be making your ammo to fit your particular chambering/needs and that you don't have to worry or otherwise "settle on" one versus the other.

As for contour...again...that's your call. Some will tell you that you MUST have a heavy barrel for the utmost accuracy, etc., etc. Don't get fixated on the contour of your barrel, but instead get a barrel from a quality source with a true, match-quality blank (i.e. - Krieger just for one example) that is properly headspaced/chambered to your bolt (if you have one by then) or a barrel that comes already provided WITH a matching, headspaced bolt. Most reputable barrel outfits around will gladly sell you a matched bolt or will be glad to properly setup your barrel to run with your bolt that you provide them...your call as to which path to take. Knowing your budget and expected timeframe for having everything in hand and ready to shoot (for the bbl and for the other items you need/want) would be helpful as many sources will take a LONG time to get you what you may want whereas others will be considerably quicker. For an 18" tube with a rifle-length gas port setup...the WOA SPR barrels are damned hard to beat for the money and their wait-times are only around 4mo or so right now! You can also check with Paul Craddock at Craddock Precision as he can offer you a custom barrel, setup with your bolt, in a VERY short timeframe (3-5 weeks generally unless you want a specific barrel blank he doesn't have or can't get in a timely fashion) that will more or less mirror the WOA SPR tube.

As for a BCG...there are so many damned mfgs for BCGs these days that you really just need to determine what options/features you want/need and then narrow your options and pick from there (i.e. - do you want a true mil-spec, phosphated BCG or some alternative like a high-end NP3/NiB/chromed/etc. NM BCG, and do you want/need an "enhanced" bolt like the JP, etc., etc.). Lots of options/flavors to consider...none necessarily better or worse than another (they all have their ups/downs), but there are a lot of BAD options in terms of QC/out-of-spec/etc. junk on the market...especially with the huge surge in the semi-auto/AR market in recent months.

Now as for optics...the 1-4x PST is a decent enough optic for limited-range use and I see 3-gun too. I personally like a little more juice for reaching out beyond 300yds (depending on target size) but optics, as with all things in this world, are HIGHLY subjective in terms of wants/needs. A 1-6x or similar offering, or even a 1.8, 2.0 or 2.5-10x may serve you better, especially in conjunction with a micro RDS in something like a Burkett mount. Again...more food for thought!

 

[Jethro.McFarland]

I am thinking that the WOA brings a lot of bang for the buck at this point. Pardon my ignorance but do you know if they can sell me a bolt with the matching head space? I did not see any options for that (probably need to get on the horn and find out)

As for the BCG I feel like I am wandering into a sea of options/confusion. I have looked at the JP Enhanced Bolt Carrier and so forth and I really am trying to understand the benefit of the enhanced vs low mass. I know that I want a mil-spec BCG. But if someone were to bring forth the benefit of a certain one that would be nice. I have a certified applicator for Cerakote that literally is 3 minutes from my house and he is pretty reasonable on his prices so I am thinking NiB/Coated from the box is not too big of a selling factor for me unless it would be cheaper out of the box with a coating. I am trying to avoid getting caught in the buy it now because it is in stock- I can wait for quality components.

As far as people being subjective with their scope choice... I would say that about sums it up. I have a Micro Red Dot on my FNAR and I love that thing for close up so I think I will be doing the same thing on this most like with the angle mount.

 

[ORD]

I am thinking that the WOA brings a lot of bang for the buck at this point. Pardon my ignorance but do you know if they can sell me a bolt with the matching head space? I did not see any options for that (probably need to get on the horn and find out)

As for the BCG I feel like I am wandering into a sea of options/confusion. I have looked at the JP Enhanced Bolt Carrier and so forth and I really am trying to understand the benefit of the enhanced vs low mass. I know that I want a mil-spec BCG. But if someone were to bring forth the benefit of a certain one that would be nice. I have a certified applicator for Cerakote that literally is 3 minutes from my house and he is pretty reasonable on his prices so I am thinking NiB/Coated from the box is not too big of a selling factor for me unless it would be cheaper out of the box with a coating. I am trying to avoid getting caught in the buy it now because it is in stock- I can wait for quality components.

As far as people being subjective with their scope choice... I would say that about sums it up. I have a Micro Red Dot on my FNAR and I love that thing for close up so I think I will be doing the same thing on this most like with the angle mount.

1) Yes...WOA offers matching bolts with their barrels. It is ~$55 IIRC. They offer a host of other options as well, including different finishes, fluting, etc. It is all a part of the steps you'll walk through to order one from them (you need to call to do so).

2) The JP low mass/full mass carriers and enhanced bolts offer a variety of advantages. First and foremost, the low mass setup is really designed out of competition settings wherein fast follow-up shots/controlled pairs/etc. are highly desirable. By reducing the total amount of reciprocating mass in the rifle, you essentially reducing perceived recoil, increase speed (of both the bolt cycling and for follow-up shots), etc. If going with the low mass BCG, you'll want to also run the low mass buffer/spring combo, and, ideally, an adjustable gas block to fine-tune your rifle's operation...again, all in an effort at reducing perceived recoil, muzzle jump, etc. to get you back on target faster for faster follow-ups/operation of your rifle. The enhanced bolts offer a number of features, but they are primarily designed to far exceed the average service life of your basic mil-spec AR bolt (which is only around ~6k rounds give or take depending on use/abuse/etc./etc.). The JP full mass operating system/BCG is more or less JP's answer to offering its products to mil/le where "speed" with the low mass stuff gives way to utter reliability/dependability. Also, you mentioned cerakote...you do NOT want to cerakote a BCG!! If you want a specialized finish, then stick with some of the proven methods like nickel-boron (NiB), NP3, chroming, the JP QPQ hardcoat treatment, etc. and not a "coating" or "painting" type process such as cerakote and the like...it won't work out too well for you on an AR BCG in the long-run given the bearing surfaces and the beating that your average carrier can take in a hurry. Sure...you can do it...but it won't take long for it to wear through and show badly (and perhaps cause you function issues).

 

[Howa4AU]

If you are wanting to use it for 3 gun, the micro dot will put you in open class and you may not want to go there. That leaves the best option is a 1x ? scope. 1x8 Swaro is great, but pricey. I have a 1x6 SWFA that is working well for 3 gun. I had a 1x4 before and the 6 power is really nice now. Anything over 1 power is difficult to shoot quickly with both eyes open for most people- myself included. If you want more than 1 power you can mount an iron sight on a 45 degree and stay out of open class.

I shoot a Rainier 18" barrel w/rifle gas 1x8 wylde chamber. Very good accuracy out to 300-400 yards with the 6 power scope for hitting steel. Mostly shoot 55 gr bullets due to cost, though.

The JP low mass stuff ORD is talking about would be great, but I would at least run an adjustable gas block and, to answer your previous question, a comp instead of a flash hider. I have a Rolling Thunder comp and a JP adj gas block and my muzzle really doesn't even move.

 

[Jethro.McFarland]

Gentlemen,

I went ahead and placed an order with WOA for a 18" Rifle Length Gas tube SPR barrel with a Matching Bolt Face, as well as, WOA Upper and WOA BCG. Good crew over there BTW. I am going with a Mod 3 or Rainier Arms Raptor Charging Handle and strongly considering a Diamondhead 15" VRS "T" handgaurd. As for optics my wife is ready to slaughter me as it is so I am going to get by with what I have at the current then move up when I get the funds. Thanks for all the help guys.

 

[kraigWY]

Jethro you made a good choice. And you're correct John is a great guy. Besides a great product you'll find his customer service is second to none. Don't hesitate to call him for loading data. He knows what shoots in his rifles. I took his advice for mine (HP service rifle version) and never looked back.

 

[BCP]

The 18" White Oaks are good barrels get some 24gr varget and 69 or 77smks, load to 2.245" and it should shoot really well.

 

[silver78]

I have an 18 inch SPR complete upper on order w White Oak and I have another complete upper that I bought from White Oak three years ago. Based on past experience I expect another wonderful upper. I continue to be surprised at his reasonable pricing considering his top quality product.

 

[ORD]

Gentlemen,

I went ahead and placed an order with WOA for a 18" Rifle Length Gas tube SPR barrel with a Matching Bolt Face, as well as, WOA Upper and WOA BCG. Good crew over there BTW. I am going with a Mod 3 or Rainier Arms Raptor Charging Handle and strongly considering a Diamondhead 15" VRS "T" handgaurd. As for optics my wife is ready to slaughter me as it is so I am going to get by with what I have at the current then move up when I get the funds. Thanks for all the help guys.

Good deal!!! I think you'll be VERY pleased with those purchases in the long-run. WOA stuff has earned its reputation for quality/accuracy over the years for a reason! John and others behind the scenes make it look easy!! Is John still quoting ~5mos (20wks) for a barrel orders? Even if that's the case...it'll be worth your wait.

As for your CH dilemma...I own a couple Raptors now and having recently gotten to handle/used one of the BCM Ambi CHs one afternoon, I'll go for the Raptor 10 times out of 10! Yes, they are more money over the BCM, but run them both hard, side-by-side and you'll see where the Raptor shines (IMHO...you may come to a different conclusion).

 

[Jethro.McFarland]

Jane is actually the gal that quoted me 4 months out on my purchase at this point. I was highly impressed with their efficiency. Second ring and the phone is answered in this gun climate? Impressive! I will have to get some good loads from John over there though. I'm eager to experience how my build shoots. I was impressed at how reasonable their prices were for sure.

I'm leaning towards the raptor at this point as well. As far as muzzle treatments go I'm considering the Brownells tunable muzzle brake or going with a Yankee Hill Machine Qd comp. I'm getting the itch to go quiet. - someday...