6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

[B3dlam]

So I was looking at the recommended load hornady provides to duplicate their match ammo on the 6.5 creedmoor 140gr ammo boxes. It calls for 41.5 grains of H-4350 I assume this is Hodgon H4350 However when I refrence the Hornady reloading handbook 8th edition it says the max load for H4350 is 40.9 IMR 4350s max load is 41.5 but there is no H involved in the IMR I am just trying to figure out if the manual is just being cautions or if there is something else going on here. I attached a snapshot of just the reloading lines that apply to 4350 powders along with a picture of the ammo box I found somewhere. If any of you guys are duplicating the factory loads I would appreciate confirmation that it is the Hodgon H4350 being loaded to 41.5grains.

 

[lal357]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

the h is for hogdon powder (h4350)i was told that they load by velocity and preesure and that that powder charge was for that lot# of powder i pulled one of my factory rounds and found 42.2 grs. of owder in it.i was in the boat as you i went the 6.5 creedmoor site and it made it worse since some guys were shooting up to 43.0 grains of powder when i called hornady they were not much help either. i ended up starting at the low side of the scale and worked up to 43.0 grs in .5 increments and settled on 42.0 for my load . hope this helps some i like the round and i'm still playing with it.

 

[Break Bad]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

FWIW A fellow shooter at my range measured about 42.5 grains (+- .3) when he pulled apart factory stuff.

Here is a post that indicates 41.2, and much more:

http://snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=3257059

 

[Rob01]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

The manuals are being conservative. There are people who have gone higher than that without pressure but as with any reloading let the rifle tell you what's safe for your set up and work up slowly. The factory listed load on the box is a good load. As mentioned they sometimes go higher depending on lot of powder used at Hornady. If you wanted a good starting point, especially with a semi auto you have in your sig line, then use the factory box listed 41.5grns of H4350, as H4350 and IMR4350 are not the same powders. Or use the book and work from there.

 

[Killswitch Engage]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

i wish they wouldn't have even out the load recipe on the box and or put that that is a starting load. this seems to have people even more jacked up when figureing out a load.

i am running 42.9gr of 4350 and its a hammer. really no pressure signs yet but will know for sure come summer.

ymmv

 

[rcamuglia]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BreakBad</div><div class="ubbcode-body">FWIW A fellow shooter at my range measured about 42.5 grains (+- .3) when he pulled apart factory stuff.

Here is a post that indicates 41.2, and much more:

http://snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=3257059</div></div>

Thanks for referencing the thread BreakBad.

Hey BD3lam,
Check out this "group" I shot with my buddy's rifle and my FACTORY Creedmoor ammo. It's the ammo that I pulled bullets from and weighed the powder on 8 shells from 41 to 41.5 grains....

 

[MDM]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

The factory stuff I pulled weighed 42.4. That gave me about 2815. I'm shooting 42.9 at 2850 out a 28" tube. If I loaded at 41.5 with my lot of H4350 there is no way in hell I could even get to 2750.

 

[mtnhntr]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

I'm running into the same problem if you run the load on the box with H4350 I have I get 2717 avg with 140 Amax out of a 26 inch barrel. I'm not sure if my Chrono may be off. The other issue I have with is what barrel length are they using for load development.It stinks they use a 28 and then all the Magazine articles you see on 6.5 CR there shooting 24 inch. Hard to decide on a good start point.

 

[Killswitch Engage]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mtnhntr</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm running into the same problem if you run the load on the box with H4350 I have I get 2717 avg with 140 Amax out of a 26 inch barrel. I'm not sure if my Chrono may be off. The other issue I have with is what barrel length are they using for load development.It stinks they use a 28 and then all the Magazine articles you see on 6.5 CR there shooting 24 inch. Hard to decide on a good start point. </div></div>

have you even shot any of the 140 match stuff and seen how it performs in your rifle? thats the best place to start. if it will group good and perform at distance just break one down that you have and tweak it for your gun. im also running 42.9 of 4350 and getting 2850ish out of a 26" barrel.

 

[mtnhntr]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

I guess thats one way to start Thanks for the suggestion.

 

[BigJohn141]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

I chrono'd the factory stuff out of my surgeon built rifle with a 24" Krieger 5R and I was getting swings from mid 2700s to low 2900s with average right at 2850. A few days before that I checked my chrony against my friends chrony by lining them up and shooting through both at the same time and both were within 10fps of each other. I cant get a 140gr hand load to run that fast without pressure sign so they are using some Hornady magic somewhere. Even with the velocity all over the place, it will still shoot a bug hole at 100 yards.

 

[Rob01]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

There's no magic. It's H4350. Start at 41.5grns and work up.

 

[ANGLICOMarine]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

I just pulled 10 factory rounds:
41.5
41.5
41.3
41.6
41.3
41.5
41.3
41.3
41.6
41.3
Ave: 41.4

I've been thinking about bumping up my load to try to get closer to 2900. I'm going to try 42-43 grains H4350...I've been shooting only the factory load (41.5 H4350). Has anyone used Reloader 17?

 

[Killswitch Engage]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ANGLICO Marine</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I just pulled 10 factory rounds:
41.5
41.5
41.3
41.6
41.3
41.5
41.3
41.3
41.6
41.3
Ave: 41.4

I've been thinking about bumping up my load to try to get closer to 2900. I'm going to try 42-43 grains H4350...I've been shooting only the factory load (41.5 H4350). Has anyone used Reloader 17? </div></div>

I'm running 42.9 of 4350 out of a 8tw 26" rock and Im getting 2860 out of it. No serious pressure.

 

[ANGLICOMarine]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

Check...I have a 3, 5 and 600 yard match this weekend...think I'm going to try 43 of 4350. I shoot with an F-classer that gets 2950 from his 6.5x47L using RE-15...I'm thinking that the load advertised by Hornady is probably moderated by liability (lawyers)...I don't think I'm even scratching the surface of this round at 41.5.

 

[mtnhntr]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

I tried going up to 41,42 and 43 grns with the 140 Amax my accuracy went from .25 to 1" I'm running 40 grns H4350 at 2630 out of a 26 inch barrel and it will consistently shoot under .375

 

[Killswitch Engage]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

Thats awesome but you can't count the higher nodes out because jumping in 1 gr increments you are probably missing it. If you are only gonna get 2600's you might as well have a 308

 

[glocksig40]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mtnhntr</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I tried going up to 41,42 and 43 grns with the 140 Amax my accuracy went from .25 to 1" I'm running 40 grns H4350 at 2630 out of a 26 inch barrel and it will consistently shoot under .375

</div></div>

As mentioned, with any work up, you need to break it down more than 1 whole grain increments. You are missing it in the .1-.9 gap somewhere. 2600 fps at 100 yards is giving you .3" groups, what's it going to do at distance? Keep breaking it down and you will find a sweet spot.

SP

 

[Judd]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

I am just finishing up developing one for my rifle and 2933 average with 43.7 and no signs of pressure. 43.9 showed slight ejector marks but no sticky bolt.

My factory loads were around 2800. 25" McGowen barrel.

 

[Killswitch Engage]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Judd</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am just finishing up developing one for my rifle and 2933 average with 43.7 and no signs of pressure. 43.9 showed slight ejector marks but no sticky bolt.

My factory loads were around 2800. 25" McGowen barrel. </div></div>

what powder? im getting light ejector marks at 42.9 4350. no other pressure signs though. nice bolt lift and no flowed or flattened primer. im really wondering if there is some questionable brass out there.

the factory stuff was running 2820-30 in my rifle. when i broke some down it was 42.6-7

 

[Judd]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

H4350, sorry I left that part out. Also using Federal match primers with factory Hornady brass.

 

[Rob01]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

Got nothing to do with the brass. Rifles are different. Some will show pressure sooner than others. Also different lots of powder vary as well.

I have loaded 43.5grns of H4350 with the 140 AMAX and got 2930fps and no pressure. Too many variables to start blaming brass.

 

[Killswitch Engage]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Got nothing to do with the brass. Rifles are different. Some will show pressure sooner than others. Also different lots of powder vary as well.

I have loaded 43.5grns of H4350 with the 140 AMAX and got 2930fps and no pressure. Too many variables to start blaming brass. </div></div>

definitely not trying to blame anything but i will tell you i weighed 10 fires cases and had variances from 151.2-155
i think that is a bit excessive.

anyhow, i cant argue with how it performs so hell with it. i'm running it.

 

[Judd]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

Just an update...43.7g H4350 was creating loose primer pockets after 2 firings. So I backed off a grain and did some more testing. I have settled with 42.9g and also switched to cci br2 primers because my es and sd were better. Also, seated .040 off the lands. Coincidently, that is the exact length the factory shells are in my gun.

She is a hammer and now I am going to just shoot her.

 

[Huckleberry75]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

Hey Rob, how long is the tube on your 6.5cm rig? I am in the process of building, and trying to decide on bbl length.

 

[NOMAD]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

Mine is 28 inches. We wanted the max velocity!!

 

[Rob01]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

Mine was 28" to start but after the set back its about 26.5". 26" is a good length and leaves room for a set back.

 

[Huckleberry75]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

Thank you sir. I have a 27" RV 1/8.5tw Kreiger blank coming, so that will be just dandy. Now if that Tac30AW will hurry up from Stiller...oh wait, there is nothing fast about a custom build.

 

[fireguyty]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

My team all runs the same load. 41.6 of H4350 with the 139 Sceners. Mine is the fastest at 2911 with a 26.5" barrel. One of the other guys shooting the same load gets 2750 with an inch longer barrel. The others on the team are between us, and all of our rifles were cut with the same reamer. Like Rob said, different guns....

If you want another variable to scramble your noodle, start playing with 139 Lapua Sceners. As stated, I get 2911 fps with the 139. With the same load and seating depth in relation to the lands, I get 2820 with the 140 A-max. Most of us have tried this out and get the same slower result with 140s from Hornday and Berger. I read some where that the Lapua's are ever so slightly larger in diameter which makes more pressure.

In the end, I have stopped chasing that last little bit of velocity and just go for accuracy.

 

[pcplodd]

Re: 6.5 Creedmoor Load Confusion?

Had the same issue starting at a lower charge. After reading this post, I will jump up to at least 41 h4350 and work up. Using 140'amax in a gap10 22" barrel. Barrel is still in a break in period with less than 100 rounds through it.