Range Report 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

Y

yavapai kid

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Apr 28, 2004
214
1
Arizona
#1
Shooting 115 grain bullets........

The 6XC is creating a good buzz.
Kind of a hassle to form. Needs a long 28" barrel and
has to be hotrodded to be at peak.

The 243 Win is winning some matches.

But why not the 243 WSSM?
I'm thinking overlooked potential here.
The speedier of the three with a shorter powder column for a
better potential SD and ES.
Can seat long bullets out long, in a short action.
Can burn slower powders for
lower pressures and would not have to be hotrodded or need a long barrel like the 6 XC.

Am I missing anything here?
 
#2
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

6x47 Lapua
243 Ackley Imp.
6BR
6mm Ackley Imp.
etc.
etc.


What are you wanting to do with it ?
confused.gif
 
#5
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

jeez......the 6xc has won all sorts of matches....brass now is the best its ever been.....

every match i go to, and if the shooter can drive the stick the 6xc pretty much trumps the rest of the also ran's....
 
#9
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

6XC hands down. Brass is $60ish per 100, COAL fits easily in a 2.800" mag box with room to spare, drives the 105/107's at 3,000+fps easily, 115's at 2,950+ easily, a breeze to shoot, accuracy in the .2's with ease to 300 yards and under .5 moa at distance.

One of the mistakes I made at the last tactical match I shot was leaving the XC at home and shooting a new .260, placed 8th. That won’t happen again. An XC was in the top three at that match.
 
#10
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

Gotta hand it to David Tubb...6XC is well thought out.

Mine was a bit finicky to start but once I got my load...WOW!!

Fits great in a short action too.
 
#13
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wnroscoe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
One of the mistakes I made at the last tactical match I shot was leaving the XC at home and shooting a new .260, placed 8th. That won’t happen again. An XC was in the top three at that match.
</div></div>

Now don't go blaming the arrow.
smile.gif
 
#14
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RADcustom</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wnroscoe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
One of the mistakes I made at the last tactical match I shot was leaving the XC at home and shooting a new .260, placed 8th. That won’t happen again. An XC was in the top three at that match.
</div></div>

Now don't go blaming the arrow.
smile.gif
</div></div>

Oh I'm not. I did say "one of the mistakes I made"
wink.gif
 
#18
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

I agree with the 6XC.
I went through the same question process of caliber choices prior to buying the XC reamer. My final decision was made based on the fact that brass is readily available and reasonably priced. You can buy great brass from Tubbs, or you can easily make them from any 22-250. Simply run the 22-250 in the XC die and go shoot them. I have several hundred made from 22-250's and have never felt handicapped. Granted, I don't push it to the outer limits on the pressure scale, so I don't worry about loosening primer pockets in one firing. As PGS stated, the XC fits well in a short action and feeds great from a magazine. There is plenty of extra room to chase the lands with the heavy bullets as you get some throat deterioration. The straighter body and 30 degree shoulder are nice, I HATE to trim brass and the case design greatly reduces stretching, especially compared to the 243.
I don't believe that you must have a 27+ in barrel to make them work. Mine is a Pac-Nor 1:8 Poly at 25.5 inch and shoots very well. I have verified 5.2 mils at 800 yards. The last measured group was 2.5 inch vertical and 8 inches horizontal for 10 shots at 525 in a 5-12 Mph 90 degree wind. This was with 105 Amax's at 3025.
I can't address your 115 bullet choice. I am not sure the 1:8 will stabilize them and so far I have not felt the need to go with the DTAC or the Berger over the 105's.
I doubt you would be disappointed with any of the 6mm's, but this one was well thought out and is a great performer.

 
#19
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

I shot the 115 DTAC in my 7.5 twist Schneider barreled .243 down into the 20's and it stabilized just fine. That is actually the temps I worked my load up in it as I got it in Jan. Probably colder in Montana though.
 
#21
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jasonk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Rob01, what's the length of your 243 barrel? </div></div>

if i remember correctly his is 27in

i asked rob alot of questions about it when i was spec'in mine
 
#23
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

How easy is 6XC brass to come by these days?

How easily can it be formed from another case? It was based on 22-250 right? Shorten a 22-250 die, bump the shoulder down and then blow it out? Shoulder is probably too sharp to form directly, I would think...
 
#24
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

Run a 22-250 case into the full length 6XC die.

Load
Shoot

6XC brass.

I have not noticed a difference in practical accuracy with the fireform cases. They just don't cycle as well with the wrinkle in the shoulder.
There is a link from Tubb's web site to a method using a 308 die to pre bump the shoulder that makes the case without the wrinkle. I haven't tried it, haven't found the need.
 
#26
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

.243 win, runnin 115 bn coated dtacs @ just over 3000 with 41gr R-17 (no signs of pressure at all), 6.6mil to 1k & still 1600fps+ , works great, accuracy is great, standard brass cases readily available, many die options, feeds perfect, and loaded ammo is available across the country if needed for some reason.
 
#27
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

I know. I've just never been a fan of a caliber that has only one source and can't easily be formed from something else. Will look at the 6XC if the 6mm Crusader doesn't work out for me.
 
#28
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

the temp / altitude threshold is what PGS found I'd bet.

Up at the altitudes we shoot at I would bet it was in the mid 20's or so for it to not stabilize. I think David Tubb had a similar incident with one of his rifles. I talked to him about it and he was at a shoot where they didn't stabilize for him too.
 
#29
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kombayotch</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I know. I've just never been a fan of a caliber that has only one source and can't easily be formed from something else. Will look at the 6XC if the 6mm Crusader doesn't work out for me.</div></div>

As stated, they can be made from 22-250.

My concern with the Crusader is that I want a tactical comp gun, most comps these days seem to limit speed to 3000-3100fps, so what's the point of the Crusader? I think George even mentioned in one thread that he downloaded the Crusader to shoot in the NorCal competition.
 
#30
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

I got that part.

But for me, its more fun to trailblaze with the Crusader than to follow the pack with the XC. And the OP never said strictly for tactical. The Crusader will be better in F Open.
 
#32
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

More capacity and a shoulder angle better suited to feeding from a magazine. The 40 deg. shoulder doesn't feed well from the mag. Terry Cross posted something about that not too long ago. He switched back to regular 260 fromt the 260 AI because of it. Crusader has a 32 deg. shoulder.
 
#37
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

that is his experience with his rifle. Like I said, I have never had feeding issues with either Ackley I own. Paper punching or hunting.

I just don't see the difference or benefit of the 6 Crusader over the 243 Ackley.

Not saying one is better than the other, no matter what your use is.
 
#38
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

243 does everything a 6XC does but better. Shoots the 115 faster, is about as accurate as you can ask a round to be, Lapua brass is less expensive than a 6XC, and there are plenty of accomplished shooters here that have excelled with the 243.

The 243 is a flat-out better round with the 115 DTACs than the 6XC. It is undisputed fact.

6.5 mil to 1K
 
#40
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kombayotch</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How easy is 6XC brass to come by these days?

How easily can it be formed from another case? It was based on 22-250 right? Shorten a 22-250 die, bump the shoulder down and then blow it out? Shoulder is probably too sharp to form directly, I would think... </div></div>
I don't know whether there are still people who form 6XC brass from a 22-250 anymore. You can buy really excellent Norma brass from David Tubb at SSS, and possibly elsewhere. 6XC is my fave cartridge, although I do shoot 243Win as well. Both are really easy to reload and are not finicky. BTW, the 6XC doesn't have to be "hotrodded" to work well. Pumping it up for another 200fps is not useful unless you are shooting well beyond 1,000 yards and need the extra velocity. Sure, you need a little less windage at 1kyd, but it's a minor improvement, sort of like 260AI versus 260Rem.
 
#41
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

In my book 243 is #3, right after 6.5x55 and 308win! Numberwise 243 looks better than 6XC. Why a bad a$$ shot like D. Tubb, chose the hard way? Just curious, is there a story behind it?
 
#42
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?


FWIW, this is what I did when wildcatting the 6XC to even higher performance:

I used the excellent 6.5x47 Lapua brass necked down to 6mm.

Loaded using any brand of small rifle primers, 38 grains of H4350 with 107 SMK's.

Fireformed the brass in a <span style="font-weight: bold">6XC chamber </span> (with a David Kiff 3/4 degree throat reamer) which shortened the neck but <span style="font-weight: bold">significantly increased the case capacity!</span> (call David Kiff, he is an expert in this reamer).

what I end up with is a short throat and <span style="font-weight: bold">very high pressure capable</span> version of the 6XC! (HOTTER than the Tubbs or Norma brass could handle.)

I was able to shoot 115 DTAC's with outstanding accuracy easily at over 3100 fps using heavy load of H4350 (a very <span style="font-weight: bold">HOT</span> load off the charts, don't blame me if something goes wrong!) and CCI BR-4 small rifle match primers.

greatest advantage: I <span style="font-weight: bold">NEVER</span> had to trim to length! The neck could grow all it wanted, it was never going to get to the trimming length!

I never blew a primer, or had to throw away a piece of brass!

If I did this again I would use Reloader 17 instead of H4350, and I'm sure I'd gain <span style="font-weight: bold">at least 100 fps faster with the same amazing accuracy</span>.

And one more thing, the twist on my (special order Krieger) barrel was 1:6.75". Yes, that's a VERY fast twist, but 105's through 115 bergers and the now unobtainable DTAC Limited Edition 117's shot outstanding groups.

If I was to build another 6mm / .243 caliber rifle of any cartridge, this is the barrel and cartridge recipe I'd use.
 
#44
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Belisarius</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> In my book 243 is #3, right after 6.5x55 and 308win! Numberwise 243 looks better than 6XC. Why a bad a$$ shot like D. Tubb, chose the hard way? Just curious, is there a story behind it?</div></div>

There is a story behind it. If you shoot a 243 with a 115 DTAC, the only kickback David sees is from the bullet. Now, when he makes a quick little tweak here and there, he gets you for the bullet, the brass, and the dies. It's a pure marketing (as it is with most wildcats) coup. David gets paid more when you shoot "his" cartridge vs. just his bullet.
 
#45
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

The story is money and i dont blame him a bit. If you want XC brass or dies or 115 DTAC bullets. Who but him has them. I have owned and shot a lot of XCs nothing wrong with them.It was built for Xcourse shooting. I still shoot several 6mms with the 115 bullet none of them are the XC anymore. it all depends on what your needs are <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Belisarius</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> In my book 243 is #3, right after 6.5x55 and 308win! Numberwise 243 looks better than 6XC. Why a bad a$$ shot like D. Tubb, chose the hard way? Just curious, is there a story behind it? </div></div>
 
#46
Re: 6XC or 243 Win or 243 WSSM?

jasonk, Sorry for the late reply...been out in the sticks past 4 or 5 days.

Bryan Litz was a huge help in solving my stability problems with the 115s in cold air. About 15F seemed to be the temp when things started going haywire. Elevation here is 2600 to 3000ft. Humidity runs about 50 to 60% most of the time. Bryan thought that 1-7" would shore up the problem and thats what will go on the rifle when this barrel goes away. In the mean time the 105 scenar is doing what I need it to do...very impressed with that bullet. It shoots very well out to 1200 meters. Its also a real killer!

That rifle was put together by Simon Evans in Great Falls, Montana. He doesnt build many but what he builds are hammers!!
 
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