A couple Reloading Questions. WTF

Tactical30

Tactical30

Gunny Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
May 5, 2009
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Eastern Ohio
#1
I am new to reloading so be easy on me!
I mainly reload for my AR's (.223Rem, 6.5 Grendel) and my question is- Is it ok to resize/deprime your cases <span style="text-decoration: underline">before</span> you tumble them? The reason I ask this is because before I would tumble then resize/deprime, trim then I would tumble again to remove all the wax/oil from resizing.

I figured I could cut out a tumbling step by doing it that way.
I noticed when I did it this way there was very little tension/pull on the press handle. Im thinking its because all the residue left over from the shooting.

I noticed one other thing that is weird, every case i have ever shot then resized obviously grew in length but when I resized/deprimed (dirty cases) then tumbled I noticed the cases for my 6.5 Grendel (Lapua cases) actually did not grow at all but seemed to shrink!? The actual minimum trim length for these cases are 1.515" and after I resized/deprimed then tumbled they were at 1.510"???? I did not trim them either. Also these Lapua casings only have 1 reload in them.
<span style="font-weight: bold">What is causing this?</span>
This is the first time I ran these 6.5 Grendel cases thru the resizing/depriming die (Forester Ultra Die set)

I never had this happen to any of my .223 cases, they all normally grew in length. I just find this odd them not growing in length after shooting. (I checked my calipers to make sure they were zeroed out too.)

Would it hurt anything if the cases were .005" less than the minimum?

Has this to do with anything with resizing them dirty? I wouldnt think so but Im new at doing this so I dont know.
 
#2
Re: A couple Reloading Questions. WTF

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: longrange30</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am new to reloading so be easy on me!
I mainly reload for my AR's (.223Rem, 6.5 Grendel) and my question is- Is it ok to resize/deprime your cases <span style="text-decoration: underline">before</span> you tumble them? The reason I ask this is because before I would tumble then resize/deprime, trim then I would tumble again to remove all the wax/oil from resizing.

I figured I could cut out a tumbling step by doing it that way.
I noticed when I did it this way there was very little tension/pull on the press handle. Im thinking its because all the residue left over from the shooting.

I noticed one other thing that is weird, every case i have ever shot then resized obviously grew in length but when I resized/deprimed (dirty cases) then tumbled I noticed the cases for my 6.5 Grendel (Lapua cases) actually did not grow at all but seemed to shrink!? The actual minimum trim length for these cases are 1.515" and after I resized/deprimed then tumbled they were at 1.510"???? I did not trim them either. Also these Lapua casings only have 1 reload in them.
<span style="font-weight: bold">What is causing this?</span>
This is the first time I ran these 6.5 Grendel cases thru the resizing/depriming die (Forester Ultra Die set)

I never had this happen to any of my .223 cases, they all normally grew in length. I just find this odd them not growing in length after shooting. (I checked my calipers to make sure they were zeroed out too.)

Would it hurt anything if the cases were .005" less than the minimum?

Has this to do with anything with resizing them dirty? I wouldnt think so but Im new at doing this so I dont know. </div></div>

I'll try to address them against my experience, although I do not have any with 6.5 Grendel, so I'll try to offer something a little more generic. Others can help with details.

1) I tumble my cases before deprime/resize because the dirt and powder burn residue is very hard on dies. I've had much fewer cases that get stuck when they're clean than when they're dirty

2) The lube/size for the cases does get to be a PITA, but for match rifle ammo I'm not loading a large batch, nor am I too worried about the extra step, it's an opportunity to inspect the cases for any issues there.

For just blaster ammo it goes through the progressive press start to finish, so I clean them before sizing and I don't touch it til it comes out a loaded round. I tumble loaded ammo for a few minutes to clean the lube off everything, especially pistol rounds loaded with lead bullets, the bullet lube has a tendency to get on stuff and this is easier to keep my hands and equipment from getting lube/stickied up at the range.

The cases that are 1.510 instead of 1.515 will do just fine, shoot them and enjoy.

Was it loaded ammo that's been reloaded once? Or did you get virgin cases, load them and fire them once? Lapua may have just made the brass a touch short, it's not a big deal at all.

The Grendel has a reasonably sharp shoulder and very little body taper so it's apt to grow less than a 30-06 or a 223 which have decent taper and shoulder angles to them to facilitate extraction and reliable feeding under combat conditions.

I highly doubt that sizing them dirty had anything to do with it.

First thing I might suspect if the cases USED to be 1.515 and they're now showing shorter is that your calipers need to be re-zero'd. Are the dial or digital? A set of dials that gets even the slightest of bumps can slip a little bit and show a bit off.

Even if it's a set of digicalipers the chances of them needing a zero check is decent.
 
#4
Re: A couple Reloading Questions. WTF

This just me and I am kind of a Neanderthal on reloading, but I tumble after relaoding. My reloads are for Hunting and Varmint Silohuette shooting so I don't need the .0001 accuracy at a thousand yards.

With the Corn Cob type media I don't think it will get the inside of the case as clean as you would like because it gets packed inside the case and can't clean like it should.

In my Mind if you clean all the Grease off of them after they are reloaded they shouldn't be picking up much dirt to drag into your resizing die.

Just like Life you need to be Anal about what makes you feel good.
 
#5
Re: A couple Reloading Questions. WTF

I always tumble before sizing. As stated above the residues left on the cases are very hard on dies and if you get something embedded in the die it is ruined (personal experience). Can't comment on the shrinking cases as I have never had it happen.

If all of the grease is off of the case after reloading that would not cause the case to pick up dirt. But everywhere you touch the case you leave oils from your fingers and that certainly will pick up dirt and deposit into your die.
 
#7
Re: A couple Reloading Questions. WTF

I don't tumble my cases. I just clean the carbon off the neck and wipe off any crap with an old t-shirt.

Then, I deprime using a depriming die.

I clean the primer pocket.

I take a bronze brush soaked in rubbing alcohol and clean the carbon from the inside of the neck using a cordless drill at medium RPM. This cleans out the carbon, leaves the inside mirror polished, but does not scratch the metal.

I body size using a Redding body die.

I neck size using a Lee collet neck die.

I then take a well used clean bronze brush and spin it inside the neck to create spiral honing marks inside that add some additional bite when bullet seating.

This is alot of work, but creates a case that behaves as new in terms of bullet pull and consistency.
 
#8
Re: A couple Reloading Questions. WTF

I tumble before sizing, and use steel wool on the necks to get them spotless before I put them into my dies. If I didn't want to keep the crap out of my dies, I'd never even bother to tumble the cases at all. I mean, what would be the point, anyway?

Greg
 
#10
Re: A couple Reloading Questions. WTF

I deprime as a separate step. I use the Lee Universal decapping. Then tumble. I find that doing this does clean up the primer pocket a bit and you don't have to worry about scratching the resizing die.
 
#12
Re: A couple Reloading Questions. WTF

I had just noticed all (the most) of the brass is 1.514" AFTER being shot, (this is factory Alexander Arms loaded ammo and brass. Only a couple were 1.510" and only a couple needed trimmed after shooting.

I noticed the Lapua Brass (new) never fired is all 1.515" so Im thinking AA loaded ammo might have had shorter brass (by .005-.010). No big deal, the less brass I have to trim the better!
 
#13
Re: A couple Reloading Questions. WTF

I tumble once to clean, then lube (Dillon spray lube), resize/deprime, and wipe the cases by hand before proceeding to trimming, chamfering, and other case prep, prior to priming, charging etc. Stubborn carbon gets the 0000 steel wool. This gives me yet another opportunity to find cracks or admire their beauty.

The more I handle them, the less likely I am to miss a defect. Defects can really suck!
shocked.gif
 
#15
Re: A couple Reloading Questions. WTF

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: locked&loaded</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Do you guys tumble new virgin brass before sizing?? <span style="color: #CC0000">Not me. </span>


Or do you just lube, size, trim and load??? <span style="color: #CC0000"> For my use, on new brass, there is no need to lube it. I run it up the expander just enough to make the mouth round, then prime, charge, seat a pill, and crimp (or not) depending on the gun. For my long range, bolt gun loads, I don't crimp.</span></div></div>

A little off topic but, I was in South Carolina last weekend. What a beautiful state you live in!
 
#17
Re: A couple Reloading Questions. WTF

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: longrange30</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Is it ok to resize/deprime your cases <span style="text-decoration: underline">before</span> you tumble them? </div></div>

I have read ~400,000 gun forum posts over the last 16 years.
I have seen this question pop up now and then.

It seems to be a "On Saturday morning, mow the lawn or wash the car first?" kind of question.
It is not controversial like the "Ford vs Chevy" question.

Pro: The tumble first, de cap second crowd does not want a piece of Walnut stuck in the primer pocket.

Con: The de cap before tumble crowd want to vibrate out some primer pocket crud.

I have tried it both ways, and I have tried not tumbling at all. It does not seem to make any real difference.
 
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