A little help concerning a military discharge

Jgault

Jgault

Gunny Sergeant
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Minuteman
Aug 26, 2020
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Keller, Texas
#1
My son is 17, he has a friend who is 18. I’ve been around the kid a little and he struck me as a little socially awkward but no big deal. So the kid joined the military and reported in May, and 6 weeks later he’s back. He said they found some kind of court issue from when he was 14 and discharged him. I might just be being paranoid but the only thing I knew of that could get you kicked out that fast was a section 8 or a medical, and if he’s too crazy for the military I question if I want him around my kid, not to mention I take him with us to the range occasionally. Is his story remotely plausible? I’ve known guys that signed up to get out of a charge, I’m having a hard time wrapping my head around the military kicking a recruit for something as a minor, and it couldn’t have been that bad or I would have heard about it 4 years ago.
 
#7
Real life is nothing like the movies or stories. Entry Level Separation discharge is stupid easy to get. Fuck, you can just say over and over “I want my mommy” and get separated while in initial training.

Sounds like he broke and blabbed about shit in his past, either scared at their threats of a background check or just wanted to go home because it was nothing like COD. If he was in the DEP for anything longer than three months, they had already run his background and would have come back before shipping to boot/basic.

It’s been a good while, but I was a recruiter before and some shit never changes. Pussies are always going to pussy out when push turns into push-ups.
 
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#8
Jgault said:
I don’t know, I haven’t ru into the kid yet, but I will this weekend, so we will have a chat, I normally mind my own business but if he’s over to the house like he used to be it becomes my business.
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Discharge From Basic Training

A recruit can be discharged from the Army before the conclusion of Basic Training. Discharges that occur before the completion of 180 days (approximately 6 months) of training are considered uncharacterized, which are neither honorable nor less than honorable.

  • An Entry Level Separation (ELS) can occur when a recruit demonstrates unsatisfactory performance and/or misconduct. A recruit can only be ELSed after at least 4 weeks of training and 2 counseling sessions, except under extreme circumstances, such as the recruit being deemed suicidal.
  • If it is found that a recruit is unable to train due to a chronic medical condition, he or she may obtain a medical discharge by the recommendation of an Army medical doctor.
  • A discharge due to any condition Existing Prior To Service (EPTS) may occur when a recruit is found to have a prior medical condition existing before enlistment. A recruit may receive a rare honorable discharge for an EPTS condition if they have been in Basic Training for more than 180 days.
 
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#10
Def plausible... happens often enough. Then you run into them later in life with military swag and running their mouth how they were in every chance they get... then you ask them if they deployed or hell what unit they served with and all the sudden its like well I got separated cuz xyz...

Almost as bad maybe worse than the well I almost joined but group
 
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#11
Might have wet the bed or got caught Jenkins off, had a buddy in HS got kick out of the marines cause he had asthma and didn't declare it when he joined , then had a bad attack after running in the rain .
 
#12
I think Francis is a section 8.

Full-Metal-Jacket.jpg
 
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#13
Bed wetter, ADD meds for far too long, maybe fucked the neighbors dog? Weak people say weird shit in those interviews, maybe threatened self harm. It's pretty easy to kick him loose and save a lifetime of misery from his shit.

Ask to see the paperwork, it has a reenlistment code on the bottom, copy 4 I think.
 
#14
Don’t assume the worst….

Kid a couple of years behind me in HS went into the Air Force right out of school. Could not hack basic. Simply had too many issues with separation from family, never been away from home. Thrown into unfamiliar situation.

They separated him half way through training.

Two years and a bit (lot??) of growing up later, he breezed through army basic, graduated strong in tank school. Found his calling in life. Made NCO really fast. Army got him a degree. Now lives in the ME where he is a highly-paid contractor managing fleets of tanks for the host countries.

Some kids need some time. 18 is still not exactly grown up for some. For others 18 is like being 30 and divorced twice! Might have been a drug test. Might have been separation anxiety. Might have been couldn’t meet minimum physical standards. Lots of things… most of us were very different people at 20 than we were at 18. Evolution works that way.

Sirhr
 
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#15
Hell, in boot camp quite a few of the guys were there to work off a legal issue as opposed to doing jail time.
Seems they were all from the "deep south" so maybe it's a thing down there ?

But I digress.....this was a few years ago (*koff*, decades).
I don't think I was around any of those types of "forceable enlistment" lads after boot....maybe I was and it just didn't come up in a convo ?
Who knows what the fuck they do these days though ?

One thing to keep in mind...
They are DESPERATE for recruits right now, so you KNOW it wasn't a small thing.
 
#17
Redmanss said:
Real life is nothing like the movies or stories. Entry Level Separation discharge is stupid easy to get. Fuck, you can just say over and over “I want my mommy” and get separated while in initial training.
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This. I knew two guys "booted" from boot camp. One was caught smoking in the barracks and after the DI finished he decided he didn't like this authoritarian stuff, went to 1st SGT and said he was attracted to the DI. Another was 17 and had trouble tying his bootlaces. Also, his recruiter had told him he could go to flight school after basic.
 
#18
We had a guy that after two weeks decided it wasn't for him and refused to train. The drill instructors tried fucking with him and he didn't care. They'd tell him to do pushups and he'd sit down and do nothing. Whatever they barked at him he'd just ignore. It took a few days for them to get him out of the platoon. I'd say it took a few weeks to get his paperwork processed for the discharge.
I know a guy that joined the Marines and went to the MEP on ship day. He changed his mind before the final swearing in and came home.
It's not for everyone
 
#19
EddieNFL said:
This. I knew two guys "booted" from boot camp. One was caught smoking in the barracks and after the DI finished he decided he didn't like this authoritarian stuff, went to 1st SGT and said he was attracted to the DI. Another was 17 and had trouble tying his bootlaces. Also, his recruiter had told him he could go to flight school after basic.
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Nothing beats the lies and embellishments told by recruiters. My favorite was the "You get steak and lobster whenever you want." Navy recruiters.

Also, it's not that difficult to get discharged. He could have lied about something and confessed when they do their whole scare tactic routine.
 
#22
Short of some serious "court issue" at the age of 14, there's ZERO chance any investigation found something.

My bet is he had some medical issue, went to the sick call/DR, spoke the truth cause a DR with medical info is hard to beat, got booted.
I know a medical provider at a US Army training base does it on the regular to AIT soldiers. Not in a mean vindictive way, but only as a matter of duty or reasonable action to protect the soldier. Yes, there are a few AIT that show up to her office that deserve to be booted. Some just can't be helped. Others just have the heart to serve and hope they can get to the other side into active duty. I could tell a few stories about the medical/psych issues that people have entering the Army. Plenty should have never gotten past MEPS medical.
 
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#23
Did he use the wrong pronoun for the Drill Sargant? Maybe he was kicked out for that........ :rolleyes:


The court issue would have been flagged way before he went. That is BS. Piss test is very unlikely, unless he was doing drugs there and got caught. The has to piss day one and they get lab results in a few days. If someone pops hot they "release" them for "Failure to Adapt", as @buffalowinter pointed out. It is fast and takes very little effort. Most of the medical reasons are picked up way before 6 weeks.

Could be that he just quit, could not take it. That is the most likely reason.
 
#24
Jgault said:
My son is 17, he has a friend who is 18. I’ve been around the kid a little and he struck me as a little socially awkward but no big deal. So the kid joined the military and reported in May, and 6 weeks later he’s back. He said they found some kind of court issue from when he was 14 and discharged him. I might just be being paranoid but the only thing I knew of that could get you kicked out that fast was a section 8 or a medical, and if he’s too crazy for the military I question if I want him around my kid, not to mention I take him with us to the range occasionally. Is his story remotely plausible? I’ve known guys that signed up to get out of a charge, I’m having a hard time wrapping my head around the military kicking a recruit for something as a minor, and it couldn’t have been that bad or I would have heard about it 4 years ago.
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NAVINST 1920.6D Several possibilities but probably popped hot on UPC.
 
#27
Surprised he didn’t claim he was too hardcore and beat up his instructors.

Probably suicidal ideation to get a free ride home since being a homo is no longer a free ticket out of service.
 
#29
Jgault said:
My son is 17, he has a friend who is 18. I’ve been around the kid a little and he struck me as a little socially awkward but no big deal. So the kid joined the military and reported in May, and 6 weeks later he’s back. He said they found some kind of court issue from when he was 14 and discharged him. I might just be being paranoid but the only thing I knew of that could get you kicked out that fast was a section 8 or a medical, and if he’s too crazy for the military I question if I want him around my kid, not to mention I take him with us to the range occasionally. Is his story remotely plausible? I’ve known guys that signed up to get out of a charge, I’m having a hard time wrapping my head around the military kicking a recruit for something as a minor, and it couldn’t have been that bad or I would have heard about it 4 years ago.
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He would've had to get a waiver. Which aint easy if you aint got the right connections/depending on the charges.

They wouldnt let me in after seeing my juve record(poss. of xanax in a school zone, manufacturing..). And I scored 94 on the ASVAB.. all I wanted to do was be a Ranger. Recruiter said it was a high enough score to be a nuke engineer in the Navy.

They wont let us rebellious youth types in.. but seems they're glad to pull strings to fudge pack as many tranny degenerates in as they possibly can.. fuck em, I wouldnt have gotten their tard vaccine anyway(maybe thats partly why they try to weed out any of us possible belligerent rebels LOL).
 
#30
Jgault said:
My son is 17, he has a friend who is 18. I’ve been around the kid a little and he struck me as a little socially awkward but no big deal. So the kid joined the military and reported in May, and 6 weeks later he’s back. He said they found some kind of court issue from when he was 14 and discharged him. I might just be being paranoid but the only thing I knew of that could get you kicked out that fast was a section 8 or a medical, and if he’s too crazy for the military I question if I want him around my kid, not to mention I take him with us to the range occasionally. Is his story remotely plausible? I’ve known guys that signed up to get out of a charge, I’m having a hard time wrapping my head around the military kicking a recruit for something as a minor, and it couldn’t have been that bad or I would have heard about it 4 years ago.
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It's hard to say but the"socially awkward" part might be that he didn't fit in well with military life. It's been thirty some odd years since I went through basic but some just cannot handle being away from home and thrown into that setting. I've seen people freak out at MEPS and get out. It could be medical like HeavyAssault said or a piss test like Weiserbucks mentioned. But I think one would admit a medical discharge and it seems like a piss test result would come in sooner. So one possible reason is he couldn't hack basic and decided enough was enough. IMO he's already on the defensive on disclosing what happened. You'd have to go easy to get to the truth. I've seen people get out on a psyche eval and go on to productive lives. It just all depends on how they recover from it.
 
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#31
Forgetful Coyote said:
He would've had to get a waiver. Which aint easy if you aint got the right connections/depending on the charges.

They wouldnt let me in after seeing my juve record(poss. of xanax in a school zone, manufacturing..). And I scored 94 on the ASVAB.. all I wanted to do was be a Ranger. Recruiter said it was a high enough score to be a nuke engineer in the Navy.

They wont let us rebellious youth types in.. but seems they're glad to pull strings to fudge pack as many tranny degenerates in as they possibly can.. fuck em, I wouldnt have gotten their tard vaccine anyway(maybe thats partly why they try to weed out any of us possible belligerent rebels LOL).
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Marines side at the height of the last wars, a conviction of ANYTHING related to trafficking was no waiver possible, and we were the most lenient on criminal history of all the branches.
 
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#32
Redmanss said:
Marines side at the height of the last wars, a conviction of ANYTHING related to trafficking was no waiver possible, and we were the most lenient on criminal history of all the branches.
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Yes sir, thats pretty much what the Army recruiters told me. Unless I knew a General or Senator or something that could write some letters or pull some strings, I wasn't getting in anywhere.
Whats up with that policy BTW? Maybe its just me - but morally speaking, selling drugs is way down on my list of how bad a crime is. Shit, it aint even in the 10 commandments.. so hopefully won't need a waiver to get in heaven..? 🤔
 
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#33
Jgault said:
My son is 17, he has a friend who is 18. I’ve been around the kid a little and he struck me as a little socially awkward but no big deal. So the kid joined the military and reported in May, and 6 weeks later he’s back. He said they found some kind of court issue from when he was 14 and discharged him. I might just be being paranoid but the only thing I knew of that could get you kicked out that fast was a section 8 or a medical, and if he’s too crazy for the military I question if I want him around my kid, not to mention I take him with us to the range occasionally. Is his story remotely plausible? I’ve known guys that signed up to get out of a charge, I’m having a hard time wrapping my head around the military kicking a recruit for something as a minor, and it couldn’t have been that bad or I would have heard about it 4 years ago.
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I think you are jumping to conclusions without any actual facts. Just my opinion.
 
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#35
Baron23 said:
I think you are jumping to conclusions without any actual facts. Just my opinion.
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Maybe jumping to possibilities, unfortunately none of the possibilities are particularly good and a few of them are more than concerning, just want to eliminate crazy before he’s at my house which has a small arsenal or the range with a weapon in his hand.
 
#36
Forgetful Coyote said:
Yes sir, thats pretty much what the Army recruiters told me. Unless I knew a General or Senator or something that could write some letters or pull some strings, I wasn't getting in anywhere.
Whats up with that policy BTW? Maybe its just me - but morally speaking, selling drugs is way down on my list of how bad a crime is. Shit, it aint even in the 10 commandments.. so hopefully won't need a waiver to get in heaven..? 🤔
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The services already have enough drug dealers in them, they don’t need any more. The CIA is always looking though.

And no senator or general could do shit with that, only someone with pardon authority.
 
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#37
Redmanss said:
Marines side at the height of the last wars, a conviction of ANYTHING related to trafficking was no waiver possible, and we were the most lenient on criminal history of all the branches.
Click to expand...

There were absolutely waivers for people with convictions as juveniles for selling drugs.

Waivers for drug use over 50 times.

Hell, even felony waivers.

Oddly, very few GED availabilities.
 
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#38
Redmanss said:
The services already have enough drug dealers in them, they don’t need any more. The CIA is always looking though.

And no senator or general could do shit with that, only someone with pardon authority.
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LOL I doubt any .gov agency would have me. Id be redflagged as a subversive right away for calling out gay pride tardation and constantly jabbing every vaxxed person for taking the mark of the beast so now they cant get in heaven like I can. 😁
I never let the opportunity go to waste at work or otherwise to let the vax cult know they're now screwed for eternity. Just gotta word it right so HR dont get involved.
 
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#39
Bigfatcock said:
There were absolutely waivers for people with convictions as juveniles for selling drugs.

Waivers for drug use over 50 times.

Hell, even felony waivers.

Oddly, very few GED availabilities.
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There weren’t. I know well, I wrote many, many waivers. I had one I wrote, arrested on possession with intent, reduced on plea bargain to possession over 20gr with no intent, he shipped but I had to prove there was absolutely no conviction of the intent charge or he would have been perm DQ with no waiver possible. I never had a single waiver disapproved and I submitted every one possible.

GED rates were never allowed below 95%, where DOD minimum was 90%, so 1 GED per 20 shipped. Even females then were capped at 10% for USMC, not that we needed WMs in a war anyhow.

I put in 2x more felons than I did GEDs or females, if not 3x or higher. The Army and I had a deal, I’d send them the ones with tats up their neck and hands or with GEDs, they’d send me the ones with shady backgrounds. They made the best Marines because they had more to prove.

I’ll be the first to say I was a horrible recruiter. I would actually tell them they were going to war if they joined, the other branches offered more bennies, and their life would have more times of suck than good if they joined. I didn’t recruit many, but I did recruit quality.
 
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#40
Redmanss said:
Marines side at the height of the last wars, a conviction of ANYTHING related to trafficking was no waiver possible, and we were the most lenient on criminal history of all the branches.
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I don't know about trafficking, but I know for a fact that admitting to using weed and coke as a juvenile didn't even merit a batted eye for the Army in the mid 80's.

Didn't matter a bit regarding MOS, either. As long as I was willing to wait for a slot, I could have had any MOS in the Army. (Of course, I was a dumbass and didn't want to wait.)
 
#41
Forgetful Coyote said:
Yes sir, thats pretty much what the Army recruiters told me. Unless I knew a General or Senator or something that could write some letters or pull some strings, I wasn't getting in anywhere.
Whats up with that policy BTW? Maybe its just me - but morally speaking, selling drugs is way down on my list of how bad a crime is. Shit, it aint even in the 10 commandments.. so hopefully won't need a waiver to get in heaven..? 🤔
Click to expand...
Manufacturing and selling drugs, especially to kids, (You did say in school zone) isn’t going to win you many supporters here. Don’t know about heaven.
 
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#42
hlee said:
Manufacturing and selling drugs, especially to kids, (You did say in school zone) isn’t going to win you many supporters here. Don’t know about heaven.
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"Manufacturing" was literally tacked on for the pills not being in a pill bottle.

I was 16 and a ultra tard, living for the keg party weekend to weekend. Half my class was doing the shit so figured why not..
Obviously regret getting involved in the dumb shit now. Not asking for anyone to support degeneracy..
 
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#45
Redmanss said:
Drug screens are conducted immediately, they don’t take weeks to come back. The labs are at MEPS and at the boot/basic bases and run right away. If we had someone come back hot, it was before they even swore in at MEPS.
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Who's to say how long it took to process discharge paperwork? It's not like they care about getting him back on the block.
Process discharge and arrange travel could take a couple weeks.
 
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#46
DarnYankeeUSMC said:
Who's to say how long it took to process discharge paperwork? It's not like they care about getting him back on the block.
Process discharge and arrange travel could take a couple weeks.
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True. There was a guy in our sister flight of basic that dove out the window, dumbshit was standing right next to me in the "dayroom" when we were getting released back to our dorm. We were on the third floor, one floor of other training flights below us, then in the center was the command section and chow hall...so he went head first our the window and landed on the roof two stories down.

He was convulsing laying on the roof as Drill Sgts climbed up over the building and back down to the roof of the chow hall....screaming at ultra-dummy and telling him to get on his feet, stand at attention, give a reporting statement. He got turned over to medical and mental health, OSI did an investigation about it a couple weeks later and questioned several of us that saw it happen. I think they were trying to figure out if he got thrown out the window or went willingly. From what I heard he eventually got booted out and sent home, but it took some time...probably for medical and mental health...along with discharge paperwork.

ETA: USAF basic training; it's not for the faint of heart...or a day two idiot, apparently. 🤣
 
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#47
Cowpokey said:
True. There was a guy in our sister flight of basic that dove out the window, dumbshit was standing right next to me in the "dayroom" when we were getting released back to our dorm. We were on the third floor, one floor of other training flights below us, then in the center was the command section and chow hall...so he went head first our the window and landed on the roof two stories down.

He was convulsing laying on the roof as Drill Sgts climbed up over the building and back down to the roof of the chow hall....screaming at ultra-dummy and telling him to get on his feet, stand at attention, give a reporting statement. He got turned over to medical and mental health, OSI did an investigation about it a couple weeks later and questioned several of us that saw it happen. I think they were trying to figure out if he got thrown out the window or went willingly. From what I heard he eventually got booted out and sent home, but it took some time...probably for medical and mental health...along with discharge paperwork.
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I hadn't thought about any investigation bullshit. If he said anything about a drill instructor they would have to investigate the claim.
A buddy of mine went on drill instructor duty and had a kid try to throw a grenade at the platoon. He knocked the grenade out of the kids hand and threw him over the bunker. It went off as he cleared the pit. He got some shrapnel in his legs but nothing major. He said that the investigation took weeks. Buddy got the Navy Marine Corps medal pinned on by the Commandant in a big shin dig. I never did ask him how long that kid was in psych eval. But probably twice as long as the mishap investigation
 
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#48
Cowpokey said:
True. There was a guy in our sister flight of basic that dove out the window, dumbshit was standing right next to me in the "dayroom" when we were getting released back to our dorm. We were on the third floor, one floor of other training flights below us, then in the center was the command section and chow hall...so he went head first our the window and landed on the roof two stories down.

He was convulsing laying on the roof as Drill Sgts climbed up over the building and back down to the roof of the chow hall....screaming at ultra-dummy and telling him to get on his feet, stand at attention, give a reporting statement. He got turned over to medical and mental health, OSI did an investigation about it a couple weeks later and questioned several of us that saw it happen. I think they were trying to figure out if he got thrown out the window or went willingly. From what I heard he eventually got booted out and sent home, but it took some time...probably for medical and mental health...along with discharge paperwork.

ETA: USAF basic training; it's not for the faint of heart...or a day two idiot, apparently. 🤣
Click to expand...
Jesus.. how fckd up was he from hitting the roof below?
 
#49
DarnYankeeUSMC said:
I hadn't thought about any investigation bullshit. If he said anything about a drill instructor they would have to investigate the claim.
A buddy of mine went on drill instructor duty and had a kid try to throw a grenade at the platoon. He knocked the grenade out of the kids hand and threw him over the bunker. It went off as he cleared the pit. He got some shrapnel in his legs but nothing major. He said that the investigation took weeks. Buddy got the Navy Marine Corps medal pinned on by the Commandant in a big shin dig. I never did ask him how long that kid was in psych eval. But probably twice as long as the mishap investigation
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My dad was a cook in the Corps; he dropped out of high school so no diploma or GED...so not a lot of options; cook or infantry I'd guess. Ended up being the head chef for the Commandant before he got out at 9 1/2 years...he said it was good duty, but having to run the show for all the after hours big shindig parties burned him out, said fuck it got out of the Corps and went back home to farm. I always told him, dang you were half way to a retirement check...he said it wasn't worth it.
 
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