Rifle Scopes All Mark 4's FFP?

[308Shooter1911]

I am at work so I dont have time to research what may be a stupid question. Are all Leupold Mark 4 First Focal Plane? I have a Nikon Buckmaster 6-18X Mil Dot which the only setting you can use the mils for range estimation is at power 12. I'm interested in up grading to a Mark4 Mil Dot with 1/4MOA Adjustments. Are these FFP, meaning a Mil = Mil at any magnification? Here is the link to the particular scope I'm interested in. Your expert information is greatly appreciated.
Leupold Mark 4

 

[SingleShot85]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

nope, most are SFP and I'd bet the scope you linked is SFP since it is not designated FFP.

 

[lennyo3034]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

I believe only the ER/T line are FFP, and I'm not even sure if all of those are.

 

[remau308]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

Your only problem with that scope is the M1 knobs are 1/4 MOA adjustments. You will want to get some M5 knobs which are 0.1MIL if you go with a mildot or TMR reticle. I think there are some for sale in the optics thread actually.

 

[FCS]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

Not all Mk4 Leupold scopes are FFP.
#54680 is a second focal plane scope.

#64660 is Mk4, 6.5-20 w/Mil-Dot, FFP.
http://swfa.com/Leupold-65-20x50-Mark-4-ERT-30mm-Riflescope-P10949.aspx

 

[YN*Dotte]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

Not all mark 4's are FFP, although I think they are only making them that way now, I dont think the model you sent a link to was not FFP either, FFP is about 450 bucks more than the SFP, but here is a link to the scope you want in FFP

http://www.opticsplanet.net/leupold-mark...riflescope.html

BTW its not always a plus IMHO to go FFP, as the reticle can appear "tiny" on the lower settings, making it very difficult to see, especially if its going to be a hunting scope. Hope this helps.

 

[308Shooter1911]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

Another dumb question. If it is SFP, does that mean the range estimation can only be used at a particular power setting?

 

[Shooter21]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: remau308</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Your only problem with that scope is the M1 knobs are 1/4 MOA adjustments. </div></div>
and that it is a Leupold.. for that price range, watch the board here and buy a NF. 10000000 times better scope as far as durability goes. you can get a NF F1 for around $1900 if you watch. good luck

 

[FCS]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 308Shooter1911</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Another dumb question. If it is SFP, does that mean the range estimation can only be used at a particular power setting? </div></div>

Correct, SFP scope is only going to be able to range at a certain magnification setting.

 

[remau308]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shooter21</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: remau308</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Your only problem with that scope is the M1 knobs are 1/4 MOA adjustments. </div></div>
and that it is a Leupold.. for that price range, watch the board here and buy a NF. 10000000 times better scope as far as durability goes. you can get a NF F1 for around $1900 if you watch. good luck </div></div>

I don't disagree that Nightforces are more durable. Most people aren't dragging their gun through the mud though. Mark 4's are plenty durable to get the job done. The glass is also really clear especially at dusk and dawn conditions when the sun is low. He definitely wouldn't be making any kind of mistake by purchasing one, I would just recommend getting the M5 0.1MIL knobs if he chooses to get a MIL reticle. Maybe he just wants the higher magnification, or maybe he just likes the way a Mark 4 looks a feels compared to other scopes. In the end it's just preference, and if he fought tooth and nail over a Counter Sniper he would probably still get a Counter Sniper despite the opposing views. I have a FFP Mark 4 myself, it doesn't compare to S&B's, but I still like it even though it cost a little more than the Nightforce.

 

[Shooter21]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

I agree with the MIL/MIL theory, actually I won't have any other type of setup. I killed 2 MK4s a few years ago and wasn't really being hard on them, one of which the reticle crashed on, the other, the elevation adjustment fell apart.

 

[remau308]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

That doesn't sound good at all, luckily mine is still working great. I know having to send one in for repairs can be a hassle, and most people hate it, but Leupold will usually take care of you.

 

[308Shooter1911]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

Ok guys...I really appreciate all the info and help. I have narrowed my search down to 2 scopes. A Nightforce and a Leupold ER. What are your opinions on the scopes linked at the bottom. Im leaning toward the Leupold for the simple fact of the price, but I really love the Nightforce.

Leupold Mark 4 ER
Nightforce NXS F1

 

[lwrkeysfisher]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

You should be able to get the Leupold much cheaper if you look a little.

In fact just look HERE.

I really like my Nightforce, but like my Leupolds as well (no problems yet) and would be hard pressed to pay $1K more for the Nightforce. If you were deploying with it my recommendation might be different, but in the end of the day you'd probably be better served spending that extra $1K on ammo and shooting.

 

[remau308]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

That's a very good point lwrkeysfisher. At $2,300 I would go with a USO or other brands. That seems a little steep for a Nightforce in my opinion. However, they do make great scopes, and if you can justify the purchase to yourself then go for it.

 

[frankythefly]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

I bought two of the Leupold Mark ER/T 4.5x14x50 thinking that I better keep a backup, well after everything that ER/T has gone through I realized that I wouldn't need a back up and sold it. I really like the turrets a lot, my only complaint would be a lack of a zero stop and 10 Mil per rotation turrets. But honestly for the money they are hard to beat. Also if you are military it is pretty hard to look at anything else for the savings..

 

[YN*Dotte]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: lwrkeysfisher</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You should be able to get the Leupold much cheaper if you look a little.

In fact just look HERE.

I really like my Nightforce, but like my Leupolds as well (no problems yet) and would be hard pressed to pay $1K more for the Nightforce. If you were deploying with it my recommendation might be different, but in the end of the day you'd probably be better served spending that extra $1K on ammo and shooting. </div></div>

You can also find the Nightforce scopes for considerably less in the used section here on the hide don't forget, the Nightforce scope is considerably more expensive, but it is also considerably better built and more rugged, most people don't drop their valuable scopes off of buildings, or drag them up a mountain side, but if you needed too, the Nightforce would do just fine, not so sure I could say the same about the Mark 4.

 

[CrazyDonkey]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 308Shooter1911</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ok guys...I really appreciate all the info and help. I have narrowed my search down to 2 scopes. A Nightforce and a Leupold ER. What are your opinions on the scopes linked at the bottom. Im leaning toward the Leupold for the simple fact of the price, but I really love the Nightforce.

Leupold Mark 4 ER
Nightforce NXS F1

</div></div>Where is the option for neither?

 

[bcw1284]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

The new Vortex Viper PST can deliver everything that the mk4 can, for less money and with a better warranty... Leupold "says" lifetime, but they don't necessarily honor it depending on what you use it for. Search their site, you'll find the disclaimer. IMHO, it's bullshit and it's part of why I don't do business with them. Plenty of people on this forum have been screwed on mk4 repairs, and know what I mean. Need proof? clicky: http://www.leupold.com/lightbox/features...ducts-warranty/

The vortex PST has FFP models available as well. Many of our Hide vendors have them in stock and arriving frequently! Check SWFA, Cameraland, CSTactical, Liberty Optics, etc.

If you never ever want to second guess your decision, then just buy the nightforce and be done with it.

 

[308Shooter1911]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: CrazyDonkey</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 308Shooter1911</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ok guys...I really appreciate all the info and help. I have narrowed my search down to 2 scopes. A Nightforce and a Leupold ER. What are your opinions on the scopes linked at the bottom. Im leaning toward the Leupold for the simple fact of the price, but I really love the Nightforce.

Leupold Mark 4 ER
Nightforce NXS F1

</div></div>Where is the option for neither?</div></div>

What would you go with?

 

[CrazyDonkey]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

For that price and what you want, 3.5-18x50 IOR

 

[YN*Dotte]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

Have you checked out the Vortex Razor HD scopes yet? $2000 new and and better than the mark 4 by lightyears and as good or maybe even better than the NXS for $200 dollars less. Just something to think about,...

 

[BobinNC]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

Here's some other scopes you may want to research:

In no particular order:

Vortex Razor HD 5-20x50mm $1999.

Nightforce F1 3.5-15x50mm $2290. (can be had w/rings included)

IOR 3.5-18x50mm $1779. (w/rings included)

USO 3.2-17x44mm $2326. ($ varies depending on options, but this one has 44mm ergo, MIL adjustments #3 & #1, Gap reticle, and Illumination)

That's your universe of scopes comparable to the 6.5-20x50mm FFP, MIL/MIL Leupy your also looking at.

Here's a couple of articles that discusses and compares most of the offerings (and those a whole price range above) those your considering.

High End Tacticals Scopes: Part 1

High End Tactical Scopes: Part 2

Pay particular attention the comparisons with the others scopes and the Leupold E/RT FFP M5 tested. A 6.5-20x50mm will be very similar.

All will work, after a fashion.

Bob

 

[Runamuk]

Re: All Mark 4's FFP?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: YN*Dotte</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Have you checked out the Vortex Razor HD scopes yet? $2000 new and and better than the mark 4 by lightyears and as good or maybe even better than the NXS for $200 dollars less. Just something to think about,... </div></div>

Opinions may vary