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Annealers, please throw your knowledge in. Thank you

Widowmaker300

Widowmaker300

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Minuteman
Mar 12, 2018
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Jackson center Ohio
#1
So I am venturing into shoot prs matches amongst shooting just for fun. I have the chance to pick up a amp Annealer for 900$ with two pilots, is it worth the money compared to say annealerz propane machine? I will be doing 6.5x47, 223 and 308 and maybe random brass for my friends. 600$ price difference could help me buy a better powder dispense system and other gear.
 
#4
i bought one new, the way i looked at it was it should make my brass more consistent, and if it got me 2 more reloadings out of my brass it would be worth it. its very easy to use, no regrets
 
#6
Having used a cheap torch annealer for as long as I have, I would say if you can afford it, get the AMP. A torch annealer will certainly get the job done on a budget, but it can also be frustrating as all hell. If I had the money, I would have upgraded to an AMP a long time ago.
 
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#9
i used a home made torch annealer for 9yrs then bought a annealezz that i used for about 5yrs and both of these worked great.
i bought an amp mark 2 this year....i never realized how much time it took to anneal with a torch...i annealed 150pcs of 6BR brass this morning in about the same time it would of took to get set up with a torch and i dont have to go in the garage.
 
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#10
I love my amp. Never bothered to upgrade to Aztec mode. I’m fine without it. I came from an anneal-ez propane machine to the AMP. Any propane system takes time to setup and your guessing if your annealing time is correct. With that said, I rarely broke out the propane machine. AMP is used regularly. So easy !
 
#12
I went from Annealeaz to an AMP. Hated the old torch systems. AMP is the shit. Mine was version 1 without Aztec, but I upgraded it to Aztec which you can do yourself. I love everything about it.
 
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#13
The above looks like a cool product with some advantages . However, I would go with a Bench Source Vertex. Almost half the money and works flawlessly. ( had mine 4 years, used every week). Leaves alot of money left over for other equipment.
 
#14
sharpshooter437 said:
The above looks like a cool product with some advantages . However, I would go with a Bench Source Vertex. Almost half the money and works flawlessly. ( had mine 4 years, used every week). Leaves alot of money left over for other equipment.
Click to expand...

I had the Bench Source before I bought the AMP so I have experience with both. It's not even close, AMP all the way even at the price difference. It's kind of like comparing a RCBS Chargemaster to a Prometheus if the was was only double to get into a Prometheus.

To be fair, when it comes to buying reloading equipment I've been guilty of valuing my time more than my money. If a piece of equipment can maintain or increase quality while saving time I'm all over it.
 
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#16
can you expand on how the amp is better? The original post referenced a new to long range game shooter,, who could use the extra money for all the other equipment needed for this game.
 
#17
dimar1492 said:
To be fair, when it comes to buying reloading equipment I've been guilty of valuing my time more than my money. If a piece of equipment can maintain or increase quality while saving time I'm all over it.
Click to expand...
This is why the AMP is better, along with the absolute certainty of accurate repeatable annealing.

Like mentioned, propane powered annealers can get the job done, but it isn't even close to the ease, repeatability and convenience of the AMP (Gen1 or Gen 2).

To argue otherwise, is really just splitting hairs to support one particular view point or another. Think about it; these machines are over a grand, and have been very popular and well received. There's a reason for that, and it isn't just because some have cash burning a hole in their pockets.
 
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#18
Had the Gen 1 AMP and flipped it for the new Gen2. Like it a lot better with Aztec, faster, seems to give me a bit better control over the annealing. Gen 2 has 3 or 4 cooling fans which is a Big improvement over the Gen 1. Buy with confidence.
 
#20
Widowmaker300 said:
Looks to me like a concensus vote of the hide. Now what about a powder system for varget? Varget used in all three of my rifles. And occasionally may load for friends.
Click to expand...

Id seriously consider spending less on your annealer if you dont already have a solid powder dispensing system. Id say for someone new to reloading and long range, the last piece of equipment you should be dumping $1K+ worth of cash on is an annealer. They're nice to have, but if you're using a RCBC kit balance beam scale and powder thrower, but have an AMP in the room, you've definitely allocated funds poorly. For someone looking to get good consistency and not blow the bank, look at the RCBS Chargemaster (1500 or Lite), and the reducing insert from here. If you're dead set on spending $1K, buy yourself a Fx120i scale and powder dispenser system. Believe me, the time savings from that will drastically out way the ones setting up an annealer.
If you're set on buying an annealer, honestly, the $600 you save buying a benchsource or even more buying an annealeez would be better spent on premium dies, a solid press, an electronic powder dispensing scale system, or a number of other items.
If you've got the cash, then by all means, buy the AMP, but if you dont have the items that will actually make a major difference first, Id say its not worth spending the money on one yet.

And to be fair, the benchsource takes me MAYBE 2min to setup and get going. making caliber specific collars, marking your adjustment knob, and having a propane tank with regulator set up are all ways to make changing calibers a breeze. But then again, once Im fully setup with everything I need, I will likely buy an AMP, but certainly not before then.
 
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#21
I was done with reloading 18 months ago,it was taking up too much time and I was no longer enjoying it.

A few pieces of equipment totally changed that for me!The AMP annealer and the autothrow/trickler powder dispenser,Not cheap but absolutely worth it.


www.autotrickler.com

Auto-Trickler

As of May 13, 2019 we are no longer taking orders for AutoTrickler V2. We are now out of stock and are transitioning production to the V3 model. There will be an official announcement within a week...
www.autotrickler.com
 
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#22
sharpshooter437 said:
can you expand on how the amp is better? The original post referenced a new to long range game shooter,, who could use the extra money for all the other equipment needed for this game.
Click to expand...

Post #5 shows that he's good with the "buy once, cry once" philosophy. But if money is a major concern then honestly a giraud case trimmer is probably the most bang for the buck as far as reloading equipment that maintains precision and saves time in the reloading room.

For the $900 that the OP would spend on the annealer, he could buy a Chargemaster and a giraud. That would put him further ahead than just having an annealer.

If we decide to buy once cry once get the following:

Giraud case trimmer

Auto Trickler w/area 419 upgrades, (and get in line for a Prometheus) Leave the Prometheus set up for your match rifle and use the Auto Trickler for all the other odds and ends.

AMP annealer

A tumbler for whichever cleaning method you prefer
 
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#24
I have everything but a Annealer, and (good) powder throw system. I have two Hornady single presses and a Dillon, and I corncob tumble. For trimmers I’m using WFT and I have a hornady case prep for the rest of processing (trimmer is to much pain to do bulk on it).
 
Last edited:
#25
With 2 shell holders it's about as fast as you can pop em in and out depending on the cartridge.

But that's not really where I saved time. I saved time because I load for quite a few cartridges and each time I had to adjust the following.
Torch height and realign the torch angle both horizontal and vertically. Adjust the timer and check temp via tempilaq or orange flame method. Then hope that during an extended session a drop in bottle pressure doesn't affect flame temps, regulated or not. And if the brass had a different case head diameter from the previous batch, you had to adjust the offset on the rotation of the plate or whenever a case sat on top of the piece the spun the brass in the flames it would oscillate in and out of the flames instead of spinning directly in the flames. So, I would lose probably 10 minutes or so getting all that crap set just right. In 10 minutes I could have been finished a batch of 100 in the AMP.

As @MarinePMI stated above, I think the batch consistency and batch to batch repeatability is unrivaled.

And honestly if you've used a bench source weekly for the last 4 years then you've probably burned enough propane to make up the difference in price.
 
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#26
Sheesh!

All this new fangled equipment, I'm still using a candle to anneal my brass like the rest of the old timers . Buy a $2 candle and depending on size of case takes 13-20 seconds to anneal. Can do 100 pcs in less than 1/2 hour while watching TV. Guess I'll never change my ways, too old, too stubborn, and too close to death at this point. Keeps my fingers warm in winter, that's one benefit to the candle method

TM6
 
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#32
If you really want to save time with the AMP, spend the extra money and get the auto feeder. Pour your brass in it, start it up, and go do something else for 30-60 minutes. Come back and you’re good to go. ;)
 
#34
It is very fast after getting everything set up. I would set it up with coil hanging over the edge of the table was actually using a small torx driver that fit freely in the flash hole, then when you hit the button to anneal the induction would center the brass inside the coil... Very quick.
 
#35
dimar1492 said:
I had the Bench Source before I bought the AMP so I have experience with both. It's not even close, AMP all the way even at the price difference. It's kind of like comparing a RCBS Chargemaster to a Prometheus if the was was only double to get into a Prometheus.

To be fair, when it comes to buying reloading equipment I've been guilty of valuing my time more than my money. If a piece of equipment can maintain or increase quality while saving time I'm all over it.
Click to expand...
^^THIS^^ ...if you can cash flow the AMP. time > $$$; one I can always make more of...
 
#37
TM6 said:
Sheesh!

All this new fangled equipment, I'm still using a candle to anneal my brass like the rest of the old timers . Buy a $2 candle and depending on size of case takes 13-20 seconds to anneal. Can do 100 pcs in less than 1/2 hour while watching TV. Guess I'll never change my ways, too old, too stubborn, and too close to death at this point. Keeps my fingers warm in winter, that's one benefit to the candle method

TM6
Click to expand...
LOL I would smoke a turd in hell before I spent $1000 on an annealer.
 
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#40
Threadcutter308 said:
Hi Spife,

I’m getting ready to pull the trigger on one. Please suggest “do’s”, “don’ts”, “needs”, “dont needs”.

I will be annealing .223, 6x47L and .308W handloads, only 50 pieces per session.........very low duty cycle ;)

TIA, T/C.
Click to expand...
  • Do get tempilaq 750° paint
  • Dont smell it.
  • Do let it dry completely, it will turn powdery looking.
  • Dont need to paint the entire case, just a small line down the neck and just over the edge of the shoulder to the case body. The more you put on the more you have to scrape off later.
  • Do heat until it gets clear.
  • Dont worry about the 450° for the bottom of the case, its even harder to scrape off and Ive never found a situation where it was needed even for 300bo. I will use the rim of another case to knock the big cooked tempilaq parts off and then a spin in 0000 steel wool to buff it clean.
  • Do heat up 10 or more cases just to get it warmed up before you start the actual cases, I keep a bag of 20 little 223s to run through real fast but anything will work.
  • Dont hold on to them too long after they cook
  • Do use red and yellow jaw combo (they have stickers on the side) for 223 and for .473 case head stuff I use a two red jaws.
  • Dont over cook them, when it turns from a seam foamy green to clear they are hot, cooking until it turns black is too much.
  • Do center the middle of the shoulder in the space so that the smaller neck sticking out from center will hopefully finish at the same time. If the neck is centered it will suck up way more energy too fast and the shoulder will be left uncooked. The bigger the case the lower on the shoulder you can go.
  • Dont worry about the water cool coil, Ive never had an overheat and Ive done it outside in 100 degree weather and Ive done 250 at a time with no overheating. For batches of 50 you have zero issues.
  • Do.... um Im not sure, I really like it and it goes fast. Using the jaw combos above 223 rem is 1.5 seconds, 223 lapua is 1.8, 6xc is 3.5. The rest I have written down but the small cases should be under 2 seconds and larger cases are somewhere from 2.5-3.5 generally.
 
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#41
^^^^ Yep what @spife7980 said. I do have the water cooled coil, just did 50pcs of 7RM, 55pcs 300 wsm, and 60 pcs of 6.5CM this morning before leaving home, took about 30 min. As stated case size and brand effects length of time. For instance the Federal Premium 7RM and 300 wsm both took 1.5 or 1.6 sec, where the Prime 6.5CM took 2.1 sec. Just depends on case makeup. Good luck.
 
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#42
spife7980 said:
  • Do get tempilaq 750° paint
  • Dont smell it.
  • Do let it dry completely, it will turn powdery looking.
  • Dont need to paint the entire case, just a small line down the neck and just over the edge of the shoulder to the case body. The more you put on the more you have to scrape off later.
  • Do heat until it gets clear.
  • Dont worry about the 450° for the bottom of the case, its even harder to scrape off and Ive never found a situation where it was needed even for 300bo. I will use the rim of another case to knock the big cooked tempilaq parts off and then a spin in 0000 steel wool to buff it clean.
  • Do heat up 10 or more cases just to get it warmed up before you start the actual cases, I keep a bag of 20 little 223s to run through real fast but anything will work.
  • Dont hold on to them too long after they cook
  • Do use red and yellow jaw combo (they have stickers on the side) for 223 and for .473 case head stuff I use a two red jaws.
  • Dont over cook them, when it turns from a seam foamy green to clear they are hot, cooking until it turns black is too much.
  • Do center the middle of the shoulder in the space so that the smaller neck sticking out from center will hopefully finish at the same time. If the neck is centered it will suck up way more energy too fast and the shoulder will be left uncooked. The bigger the case the lower on the shoulder you can go.
  • Dont worry about the water cool coil, Ive never had an overheat and Ive done it outside in 100 degree weather and Ive done 250 at a time with no overheating. For batches of 50 you have zero issues.
  • Do.... um Im not sure, I really like it and it goes fast. Using the jaw combos above 223 rem is 1.5 seconds, 223 lapua is 1.8, 6xc is 3.5. The rest I have written down but the small cases should be under 2 seconds and larger cases are somewhere from 2.5-3.5 generally.
Click to expand...
LOL! Or, just get an AMP. (Sorry, couldn't resist) :ROFLMAO:
 
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#43
spife7980 said:
  • Do get tempilaq 750° paint
  • Dont smell it.
  • Do let it dry completely, it will turn powdery looking.
  • Dont need to paint the entire case, just a small line down the neck and just over the edge of the shoulder to the case body. The more you put on the more you have to scrape off later.
  • Do heat until it gets clear.
  • Dont worry about the 450° for the bottom of the case, its even harder to scrape off and Ive never found a situation where it was needed even for 300bo. I will use the rim of another case to knock the big cooked tempilaq parts off and then a spin in 0000 steel wool to buff it clean.
  • Do heat up 10 or more cases just to get it warmed up before you start the actual cases, I keep a bag of 20 little 223s to run through real fast but anything will work.
  • Dont hold on to them too long after they cook
  • Do use red and yellow jaw combo (they have stickers on the side) for 223 and for .473 case head stuff I use a two red jaws.
  • Dont over cook them, when it turns from a seam foamy green to clear they are hot, cooking until it turns black is too much.
  • Do center the middle of the shoulder in the space so that the smaller neck sticking out from center will hopefully finish at the same time. If the neck is centered it will suck up way more energy too fast and the shoulder will be left uncooked. The bigger the case the lower on the shoulder you can go.
  • Dont worry about the water cool coil, Ive never had an overheat and Ive done it outside in 100 degree weather and Ive done 250 at a time with no overheating. For batches of 50 you have zero issues.
  • Do.... um Im not sure, I really like it and it goes fast. Using the jaw combos above 223 rem is 1.5 seconds, 223 lapua is 1.8, 6xc is 3.5. The rest I have written down but the small cases should be under 2 seconds and larger cases are somewhere from 2.5-3.5 generally.
Click to expand...
Sutherlandsd said:
LOL I would smoke a turd in hell before I spent $1000 on an annealer.
Click to expand...
Smoke away bro! lol
 
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