Anyone doing PCC competitions?

[tna9001]

Hello, All.

Looking for input regarding guns and gear for PCC competitions, primarily for a carbine and optic.

Thanks in advance.

 

[davsco]

jp gmr-13 (glock mags) here with cmore slideride 6moa dot. love it!

the usual advice goes though - hit some matches and see what folks are using. everyone will let you hold/fondle their guns and gear and most will also let you shoot it.

 

[excess]

Sort of the same answer. JP GMR-15 for me, but with a Holosun 510C. Highly recommend going with the short stroke system in the JP - super soft shooting.

 

[tna9001]

Thanks for the input. Sounds like the JP GMRis the way to go, which version did you guys buy?

 

[excess]

i've got two GMR15s - one 10.5" that i shoot in most matches, and one 16" that I bought for use until the stamp went through on the SBR. The 10.5" is an advantage for USPSA PCC. One thing though, USPSA doesn't allow braces, so keep that in mind if you go with a short barrel.

 

[padom]

7" AR 9 SBR non-reciprocating side charger with dedicated can, LRBHO, Glock mags, Geissele SD3G, Seekins 10" handguard with 3" of can under handguard, Magpul CTR, Vortex Crossfire red dot.
Recently swapped the stripped upper for the side charging upper receiver I grabbed on sale Black Friday. Same.upper, they just offer a standard and side charging one. Gonna build my son one for.his bday with the standard upper receiver..

One of my favorite guns to shoot. My son wont give it back at the range.





And here is the Taccom billet glock mag extension for 57rd of goodness.






My son running my 165gr sub loads on steel

 

[Downtown]

I use a JP also. Aimpoint T1. As someone mentioned, it must be a carbine. A brace means it's a handgun.

 

[Darqusoull13]

For a general purpose entry into USPSA gun, I'd go with a JP GMR-15 with a 14.5" pin and weld comp. JP does have Ready Rifles available to ship as their "Match PCC."

If you want to go with a SBR my 10.5" GMR-15 (far right) is my absolute favorite rifle to shoot. I switch it between USPSA game legal and with a suppressor for some fun night matches we host.

If you plan on shooting Steel Challenge snag the new Ultralight barrel model (Center). Way faster to swing back and forth and it's a solid choice for USPSA as well.

The 2 options that are "Must Have" are the 5 Stainless Short Stroke SCS and the Taylor Freelance Magwell (far right). The 5S-SCS drops the recoil and changes the gun more than any single other change you can make on a PCC. You can damn near put a mag in sideways with the TF magwell. It is very forgiving and well designed.

I strongly recommend the Trijicon MRO on top for PCC. One of my MRO's has stood up to me beating the shit out of it over 3 years. My rifles have also helped a lot of shooters finish matches, either due to gun problems or optic problems. If you shoot USPSA, the 45 degree offset sight is cool to shoot around left side leans every now and then to avoid switching shoulders. I prefer the new SRO here but a RMR works too. Neither is 100% necessary but if you want to go deep get a 45 offset.

Feel free to message me if you get lost in the options.

 

[tna9001]

Thank you all for the input. I've got an MRO sounds like that will work.

 

[TonyTheTiger]

7" AR 9 SBR non-reciprocating side charger with dedicated can, LRBHO, Glock mags, Geissele SD3G, Seekins 10" handguard with 3" of can under handguard, Magpul CTR, Vortex Crossfire red dot.
Recently swapped the stripped upper for the side charging upper receiver I grabbed on sale Black Friday. Same.upper, they just offer a standard and side charging one. Gonna build my son one for.his bday with the standard upper receiver..

One of my favorite guns to shoot. My son wont give it back at the range.





And here is the Taccom billet glock mag extension for 57rd of goodness.






My son running my 165gr sub loads on steel

Not allowed in USPSA IIRC..

 

[padom]

Not allowed in USPSA IIRC..

I never said it was

 

[TonyTheTiger]

I never said it was

I guess the OP didn't specifically say USPSA, but thats kinda ground zero for PCC matches.

 

[padom]

I guess the OP didn't specifically say USPSA, but thats kinda ground zero for PCC matches.

Not the local PCC club matches around here. I dont shoot USPSA but what exactly isnt legal?

 

[TonyTheTiger]

Not the local PCC club matches around here. I dont shoot USPSA but what exactly isnt legal?

IDPA? Now you got me curious.

 

[padom]

IDPA? Now you got me curious.

Nope. Just club action pistol/PCC matches

Action Pistol - University Rifle Club

Low-stress, Action Pistol Matches - NOT N.R.A. Approved. The pistol match has two stages, fired from two different shooting positions.

www.universityrifle.org

 

[excess]

Not the local PCC club matches around here. I dont shoot USPSA but what exactly isnt legal?

I assume he’s talking about the can. That’s a no-go in USPSA due to challenges with the timer picking shots up. Heck, my unsuppressed short barrel JP is hard to pick shots up on unless the RO holds the timer really close.

 

[TonyTheTiger]

Yeah, the can, thought I said that but I see that I didn't.

 

[padom]

Can is removable. Easy. Wasnt understanding why the gun wasnt.

 

[striped1]

Fastest sight I have run is the C-More.
I have a 16" JP barreled, taccom buffer Glock mag that runs fast.
The JP or Taccom will serve you well

 

[sam4886]

@padom what side charging upper are you using? I've got a Gibbz on one of my rifles and I don't think I could go back to normal charging. I'd like to build a PCC one of these days.

 

[padom]

@padom what side charging upper are you using? I've got a Gibbz on one of my rifles and I don't think I could go back to normal charging. I'd like to build a PCC one of these days.

Spartan 9MM/45ACP Non-Reciprocating Side Charge Billet Upper Receiver w/ LRBHO

Spartan 9MM/45ACP Non-Reciprocating Side Charge Billet Upper Receiver w/ LRBHO

www.joeboboutfitters.com

 

[sam4886]

Copy that. Thanks.

 

[avastcosmicarena]

@padom what side charging upper are you using? I've got a Gibbz on one of my rifles and I don't think I could go back to normal charging. I'd like to build a PCC one of these days.

I've got two 9mms with Quartercircle10 side charging uppers, which are manufactured by Gibbz, but with a different charging handle specifically made for Quartercicle10. One is a competition PCC with a 16" barrel, and the other is more of a PDW self defense/fun gun with a pistol brace.

I also have a 3-gun style .223 Wylde AR15 with a Gibbz receiver set with the gen 3 latching side charger.

Love them. I do wish the side charging handles were a little larger though. You can only really get one finger on them, and they tend to tear up your hands a bit. I'd rather they were oversized and able to fit 2-3 fingers on them for competition use.

 

[avastcosmicarena]

Spartan 9MM/45ACP Non-Reciprocating Side Charge Billet Upper Receiver w/ LRBHO

Spartan 9MM/45ACP Non-Reciprocating Side Charge Billet Upper Receiver w/ LRBHO

www.joeboboutfitters.com

This is actually the Gibbz' design. A few companies license it from them. However, I think they aren't allowed to use the gen 3 charging handle design (or maybe they just never switched to it?). I believe they use the gen 2 side charging handle.

 

[avastcosmicarena]

I've spent a bunch of time tuning the PCC pictured above. I ended up with Blitzkrieg hydrualic buffer (the HD one) + Blitzkrieg weight to short stroke it + a reduced power ar15 spring. I'm using a JP enhanced 9mm bolt (not the newer one with the notch to allow a short stroke system to lock back... I bought it before that came out), a BSF carbon fiber tension/pencil barrel, an APA "The Answer" muzzle brake/compensator, a Coda Evolution carbon fiber mlok handguard, a Holosun 510C optic, and a TriggerTech Diamond trigger set to a crazy low pull weight (like 0.85 pound). Took a long time to get to this setup, but it's reliable and fun. The key to reliability is finding a trigger and bolt combination that works in your gun. This is much harder than it sounds.... or, at least, it was for me. lol. I went through a few other combinations and dealt with a lot of trigger reset issues. I hear some people also have problems with consistent feeding and get ramped barrels to fix it, but I've never had a feeding problem with my unramped barrel.


One thing worth noting: The barrel and handguard make it very light. So, it transitions fast.... but, honestly, I think the lightness might be causing a bit more muzzle rise than if I had a heavier setup, because that AR9 PDW in the pic up above actually feels a little flatter (heavier gun). So, I am undecided on whether or not going super light is really the way to go. I may go with a heavier barrel down the road whenever I feel like it's time to replace the current one.

 

[hic28]

I run a definitive arms AK-X9. bought it from a buddy who needed cash and it’s a cool limited edition AK that runs off colt smg Mags with bolt hold open and similar AR controls.

Stupid Cali laws require the grip wrap but it comes off for comps

 

[hitman]

I do not shoot PCC but I am loving the 9mm carbines for fun. I have steel set up at the house and can get out to 80 yrds so it is perfect for 9mm carbines. My wife is loving shooting them also so I have been thinking about the JP for awhile. Some say it is as close as you can get to the feel of an HK recoil. If so, that is impressive! It may have to be the next pick up.

 

[mgrs]

I do not shoot a PCC, but have observed a lot of PCC shooters ranging from unclassified to GM (USPSA). Observations:

#1- If you are serious, get a JP or SIG MPX. These guns run well and are a good indicator of someone who is not going to be a problem for the whole squad. Put one RDS at the 12 o clock and another offset so that you can shoot weak hand around barriers easier.

If no, continue reading.

#2- Show up with the most problem-prone franken-build possible. Use components from a variety of manufacturers to ensure nothing will function consistently. Be sure to bring poor quality reloaded ammunition. Have a squib, don't bring a rod- someone else will surely have one. Insist that "this never happens" when the PCC malfunctions at least twice per stage. It's OK, you can blame your poor performance on this.

#2.1- Get the longest possible aftermarket extension. 50% you'll never have to reload, 50% you'll have a meltdown reinforcing #2. Good odds.

#3- Be sure to turn your sight off after each stage and back on again when the shooter for the next stage. Your Aimpoint may have a 50,000 hour battery life, but you'd better conserve the 30 minutes until you shoot again. Take as long as possible cycling the brightness up to where you want. Go ahead, the 6 other shooters in the squad will wait. You've already taken the time to pull your carbine out of the case, remove the chamber flag, and either find somewhere to tuck it on your person or handed if off to the RSO.

#4- If you do place well, be sure to talk trash to the pistol shooters you placed above overall. They might have been production or single stack division, but they should know you beat them.

After all, what were they thinking, bringing pistols to a pistol match.

 

[TonyTheTiger]

I do not shoot a PCC, but have observed a lot of PCC shooters ranging from unclassified to GM (USPSA). Observations:

#1- If you are serious, get a JP or SIG MPX. These guns run well and are a good indicator of someone who is not going to be a problem for the whole squad. Put one RDS at the 12 o clock and another offset so that you can shoot weak hand around barriers easier.

If no, continue reading.

#2- Show up with the most problem-prone franken-build possible. Use components from a variety of manufacturers to ensure nothing will function consistently. Be sure to bring poor quality reloaded ammunition. Have a squib, don't bring a rod- someone else will surely have one. Insist that "this never happens" when the PCC malfunctions at least twice per stage. It's OK, you can blame your poor performance on this.

#2.1- Get the longest possible aftermarket extension. 50% you'll never have to reload, 50% you'll have a meltdown reinforcing #2. Good odds.

#3- Be sure to turn your sight off after each stage and back on again when the shooter for the next stage. Your Aimpoint may have a 50,000 hour battery life, but you'd better conserve the 30 minutes until you shoot again. Take as long as possible cycling the brightness up to where you want. Go ahead, the 6 other shooters in the squad will wait. You've already taken the time to pull your carbine out of the case, remove the chamber flag, and either find somewhere to tuck it on your person or handed if off to the RSO.

#4- If you do place well, be sure to talk trash to the pistol shooters you placed above overall. They might have been production or single stack division, but they should know you beat them.

After all, what were they thinking, bringing pistols to a pistol match.

To be fair, almost all of that applies to plenty of open shooters..

 

[avastcosmicarena]

I do not shoot a PCC, but have observed a lot of PCC shooters ranging from unclassified to GM (USPSA). Observations:

#1- If you are serious, get a JP or SIG MPX. These guns run well and are a good indicator of someone who is not going to be a problem for the whole squad. Put one RDS at the 12 o clock and another offset so that you can shoot weak hand around barriers easier.

If no, continue reading.

#2- Show up with the most problem-prone franken-build possible. Use components from a variety of manufacturers to ensure nothing will function consistently. Be sure to bring poor quality reloaded ammunition. Have a squib, don't bring a rod- someone else will surely have one. Insist that "this never happens" when the PCC malfunctions at least twice per stage. It's OK, you can blame your poor performance on this.

While it's true that it's easy to run into problems, it's also possible to build a really good gun that is better & costs less than buying an off the shelf JP. Max Leograndis is proof of this. Up until this year when he got the Limcat sponsorship, he used guns he put together himself, was able to make them reliable, & generally crushed the competition over and over again.

Oh, and he also doesn't use a secondary offset red dot and is still faster than pretty much everyone.

Of course, Max is highly skilled and knows what he's doing. So, it all depends... but blanket statements like that aren't always accurate. A lot of people have had issues with the MPX too.

 

[TonyTheTiger]

The MPX has caused plenty of trouble for people. I've never seen any evidence of it ranking very high in reliability, and it eats triggers and needs a lot of cleaning.
Have Leograndis and Froelich ever gone head to head? I'd like to see that, just because they're both at the top of the game but on opposite ends of the ideological spectrum. I've held Froelichs PCC and rifle and he likes them on the heavy side, his 3G rifle is a solid 12+ pounds. He also isn't as explosive as Leograndis but he misses less.

 

[Mk32784]

If i was going to do this again, I would probably have bought an JP. I have run a couple and they are sweet out of the box PCC ready guns.

Personally I built mine with NFA lower/upper, 16 inch Faxon barrel and JP SCS and bolt. Run the +20 TF extensions and the gun hammers. 124s loaded with 3.4gn of titegroup and the dot barely moves. But the amount of time and ammo spent testing and tuning could have probably just bought me a JP and then some.

And tbf at local matches, for every pcc trouble maker I've meet, I have meet just as many open/limited/frankinGlock/etc trouble makers. PCC bashing is getting old, get over it.

 

[tna9001]

Thanks for the input. I ended up getting a JP GMR-15 and love it, I'm doing my first competition Saturday. Check out the American Eagle 115g (14.5" barrel), I thought I'd see a bit more velocity, perhaps it will speed up as the barrel breaks in but checkout the SD 11.1 (10 rounds) that really surprised me given the price point of the ammo.

 

[mgrs]

Thanks for the input. I ended up getting a JP GMR-15 and love it, I'm doing my first competition Saturday. Check out the American Eagle 115g (14.5" barrel), I thought I'd see a bit more velocity, perhaps it will speed up as the barrel breaks in but checkout the SD 11.1 (10 rounds) that really surprised me given the price point of the ammo.

Very good choice.

To be fair, almost all of that applies to plenty of open shooters..

Very correct, and it is only fair that we acknowledge this.

While it's true that it's easy to run into problems, it's also possible to build a really good gun that is better & costs less than buying an off the shelf JP. Max Leograndis is proof of this. Up until this year when he got the Limcat sponsorship, he used guns he put together himself, was able to make them reliable, & generally crushed the competition over and over again.

Oh, and he also doesn't use a secondary offset red dot and is still faster than pretty much everyone.

Of course, Max is highly skilled and knows what he's doing. So, it all depends... but blanket statements like that aren't always accurate. A lot of people have had issues with the MPX too.

And tbf at local matches, for every pcc trouble maker I've meet, I have meet just as many open/limited/frankinGlock/etc trouble makers. PCC bashing is getting old, get over it.

I apologize if I offended. The post was meant to contain some suggestions and have some fun at the expense of the archetype "that PCC guy" and throw out some humorous suggestions on what to do/not do. To be sure there is a "that guy" in every division, but this happens to be a PCC thread.

If you are ready when it's time to be ready, help reset the stage when its not, are safe, bring a functioning firearm and ammunition, I don't think anyone is going to have an issue with what division or skill level you shoot.

 

[avastcosmicarena]

I think the JP PCC would probably run with less dot bounce/muzzle rise with a Blitzkrieg hydraulic buffer or a Taccom or MBX with the internal springs vs the JP silent captured system. It's definitely worth experimenting with. This is why some people choose to piece together your own from scratch. Well, that and the trigger. You'll still end up wanting to tweak it while chasing performance when buying a JP, which isn't cheap. I'm not a JP hater, by the way. I own and use 2 of their 9mm bolts and their super lightweight aluminum bolt for .223/5.56.