Hi gentlemen, looking at a new scope purchase and i've taking a liking to the Leupold xv3i LRP 6.5x20-50. I can't decide on the regular moa crosshair in ffp or their impact 29 moa reticle that has the "christmas tree" style subtensions below. Its unlikely that I will ever do PRS competions but I like the idea of faster corrections down range. So are the Christmas Tree style reticles truely useful or just distracting clutter for the average shooter. Thanks
Rifle Scopes Are Chistmas Tree reticles really all that useful?
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Depends if you are a solve then dial your scope or shoot and adjust shooter. If your always adjusting turrets so your shooting center of crosshair then the use of ballistic crosshairs are limited to you. If you prefer to zero and use hold over hold off for all shooting solutions and reactions to impacts then ballistic crosshairs or "christmas trees" are very awesome for that use.
Thanks guys! I guess it would be a'lot faster to use the extra crosshairs rather then twisting the knob constantly to correct.
Not really. There are comps out there that are set up to as close to real as you can get, an you will need the 5 different types to complete the course if your looking to score high or win.
Sounds like a tacticool idiot was high on bath salts while writing a stage description. 5 types of ammo.
Stage 5:
You are 3 weeks into the zombie apocalypse, you ran out of your 6mm GT ammo. You have to scrounge 5 different types of ammo off random corpses around you.
At the sound of the buzzer strip search at least 14 zombies and construct your own improvised cartridges using bubblegum, tooth paste and aluminum foil.
Par time is 17 seconds.
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(1) Explain to me how you would take a sentry out when the closet you can get w/o being seen from your approach angle is 175 yds, an alerting the others sentrys is not an option? You think even if you have a can the sonic crack won't be heard from high speed ammo.
(2) How would you set a bldg on fire from 100yds away while using a subsonic?
(3) Will your std load, tag a soft target at 300yds on the other side of 1/2" of mild steel?
(4) How do you mark a target w/o tracer?
(5) Will your std load punch 1/2" of armor an start a fire using the contents of the vessel?
(6) What ammo do you use when you want to shift fire quickly?
(7) Do you know where all your ammo flies over your std load or do you only have one load you use?
Not every thing is as it appears at times.
That sounds like a pretty sweet match.
That style match was started in the 70's by a few guys who ran together for awhile. Most don't shoot anymore do to age an the original dirt it was shot on being sold for housing.
So...you're carrying five sets of DOPE?
I was going to say something about how sometimes, on stages with a lot of KD range transitions and not a lot of movement (prone mostly), I'll dial the closest target and then use the Christmas tree to holdover and adjust for windage on the more distant ones to save time and stay behind the glass..., but now I lost my train of thought...
Switching ammo once seems like a terrible idea, much less five times. Adding in that distraction would probably crater my score.
This answer has rattled me.
I was going to say something about how sometimes, on stages with a lot of KD range transitions and not a lot of movement (prone mostly), I'll dial the closest target and then use the Christmas tree to holdover and adjust for windage on the more distant ones to save time and stay behind the glass..., but now I lost my train of thought...
Switching ammo once seems like a terrible idea, much less five times. Adding in that distraction would probably crater my score.
This answer has rattled me.
I have to believe the OP ‘s needs will not include Incendiary ammunition.
Most all of the High speed offsets are memorized, an the sub math can be done in ones head very easily with practice. Bulk of the targets are 3-4 moa in size. The sub targets is where you have to know your data 100%, as if you miss-range as little as 10 yds on some targets it will be a complete miss.
D
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You can roll you own. Jackets can be had or home made for all cals, plus the mix is a shelf item if you look hard enough.
Well....like all things opinions vary. I tested both and settled on no tree, but there may be a time I go to it I won't rule it out. I really like the SCR-mil on my XTR II. I dial elevation and hold for windage and it's served me quite well. My other buddy uses the Tremor reticle and shoots outstanding.....neither of us is right or wrong. I will say I do not like the distraction of it at all when I shoot my buddies NF ATACR. I had considered maybe buying a tree reticle and growing into it, but like the clean look of what I have now. TBD down the road.
And to answer the OP, Yes, they are very good. If you are using a semiauto then it is a must for super fast second shots with corrections without dialing anything.
I use mine a lot.
I rarely dial wind and on my 260 I usually just hold drop and wind now.
I rarely dial wind and on my 260 I usually just hold drop and wind now.
So it is bath salts then. That is totally impractical at most matches. punching through the steel at our matches gets you booted off right quick. APIs are a total no go as well, same with tracers, mostly due to fire concerns, so is a normal steel or tungsten core due to fire hazards here.
You know what else guys in the 70s were doing??? Acid
And possibly in the 80’s and 90’s
Ok, so discounting the hypothetical multi-ammo match that someone, somewhere seems to be shooting.. the grid reticle is only as useful as you allow it to be.
In competitions, it can be handy, more so in PRS on non dial stages where you cant touch your turrets. It's not necessary for 3 Gun, a standard BDC is up to the task. For all other off the clock, non competitive scenarios, there is zero need for a grid reticle. You can dial and hold wind.
The grid reticle is only useful if you choose to employ it. If you choose to do holdovers and wind holds instead of dialing. The actual "need" for it is extremely limited.
In competitions, it can be handy, more so in PRS on non dial stages where you cant touch your turrets. It's not necessary for 3 Gun, a standard BDC is up to the task. For all other off the clock, non competitive scenarios, there is zero need for a grid reticle. You can dial and hold wind.
The grid reticle is only useful if you choose to employ it. If you choose to do holdovers and wind holds instead of dialing. The actual "need" for it is extremely limited.
If in doubt: It is better to have it and not need it, than the other way around.
Just pertaining to matches, I dont really care for a tree reticle. I've had a few, but realistically, the need for them is slim IMO. I know there is some guys that hold everything, or some holdover stages when the wind is blowing 20mph where they are nice to have, but from all the matches I've shot that's not very many stages. I prefer to have a more open reticle for spotting shots, lol, or should I say misses
So, how often have you held 6 mil of elevation and also held 4 mils of wind at the same time? Or better yet held 3 mils and needed to hold 2 or 3 mils of wind at that distance? Not very often, if you have to are in much different conditions than I and are shooting a shitty bc bullet. Trees could be better if they would slim them down or open them up a little. They have a purpose, but all of them are exaggerated too much I believe.
So, how often have you held 6 mil of elevation and also held 4 mils of wind at the same time? Or better yet held 3 mils and needed to hold 2 or 3 mils of wind at that distance? Not very often, if you have to are in much different conditions than I and are shooting a shitty bc bullet. Trees could be better if they would slim them down or open them up a little. They have a purpose, but all of them are exaggerated too much I believe.
At least locally I’m seeing a lot of matches adding multiple target stages where you are either only engaging the target once or twice or you are alternating between 2 or 3 targets for the stage.
Combine that with 90 or 120s and it starts to become inefficient to dial after every shot. The tree becomes more useful in these situations.
As far as hunting, it’s only beneficial if you have several distances in which an animal may appear and be gone before you are able to range and dial. You can have a dope card already made with certain landmarks and use the tree. This is a limited situation as you’ll usually have time and opportunity with distance.
I personally dial as much as I can. So a tree is more of a utility. It’s one of those I don’t need it until I need it, and then it’s very convenient.
Also my preferred tree reticle is mpct2 and the tree doesn’t start until 2mil. That *should* be plenty of room to spot.
Combine that with 90 or 120s and it starts to become inefficient to dial after every shot. The tree becomes more useful in these situations.
As far as hunting, it’s only beneficial if you have several distances in which an animal may appear and be gone before you are able to range and dial. You can have a dope card already made with certain landmarks and use the tree. This is a limited situation as you’ll usually have time and opportunity with distance.
I personally dial as much as I can. So a tree is more of a utility. It’s one of those I don’t need it until I need it, and then it’s very convenient.
Also my preferred tree reticle is mpct2 and the tree doesn’t start until 2mil. That *should* be plenty of room to spot.
The bushnell G2/G3 is pretty much like what you are talking about.
What continually boggles my mind is why you athesists insist on naming your retc after a Christian holiday?
I move from now on we call it
- The Hanukah Tree
- The Hanging Tree
- The Deviltry
- The Manchineel Tree
- etc etc
I am only looking out for your eternal salvation. Thank me later
GL
DT
I move from now on we call it
- The Hanukah Tree
- The Hanging Tree
- The Deviltry
- The Manchineel Tree
- etc etc
I am only looking out for your eternal salvation. Thank me later
GL
DT
Yep, pretty much this. I ran an H59 for years, and mostly only used it on no dial stages. But even then I can count on one hand how many times I really needed long holds with a lot of wind. It's just very situational.
I'm liking the new SCR2 grid reticle from Burris. It hits on all cylinders for me. But for me it's definitely my competition reticle. I prefer the regular SCR for hunting.
Interesting responses. So basically if you have never had the experience or can google anything about it, it's all impossible is that about right?
Then we should call it a Balsam Fir reticle or by its scientific name Abies Balsamea reticle.
You're such an arrogant bastard... I understand that you actually did some badass shit while you were in, at least that's the impression I've gotten over the years, and for that I truly respect you sir. But so many of your responses are cloaked in this unnecessary level of ambiguity to indicate that you 'know things, but aren't going to divulge things'. And seriously, who the fuck is making their own API rounds, then using them in ANY comp anywhere?!
So the poor guy comes one here & asks about tree reticles (generally speaking) on his $1,000 scope & you go off on some tangent about comps no one's ever heard of with ammo no one knows how to load & can shoot basically nowhere!
So I'm sorry if your answer to the fairly straightforward question didn't garner the response(s) you were looking for.
*rant off* *I've been drinking, but stand by my words (probably)*
^ lol, i took it as a foil to the folks that don't like or use them, so they feel like chiming in to say they are stupid, useless or whatever.
if you don't like them or use them, you can probably save your opinion when somebody genuinely asks about them, jmho.
i use one because i have one rifle to do everything, and should i ever really "need" one, it will be too late to go buy one.
if i had a plethora of rifles, i would probably not pay the extra money for a strictly range toy scope where i will never need a tree.
i will probably never understand how or why it bothers people so much.
i seem to be able to ignore it, or at least not be bothered or distracted by the tree, unless i am using it.
besides, i'm tactical as fuck.
if you don't like them or use them, you can probably save your opinion when somebody genuinely asks about them, jmho.
i use one because i have one rifle to do everything, and should i ever really "need" one, it will be too late to go buy one.
if i had a plethora of rifles, i would probably not pay the extra money for a strictly range toy scope where i will never need a tree.
i will probably never understand how or why it bothers people so much.
i seem to be able to ignore it, or at least not be bothered or distracted by the tree, unless i am using it.
besides, i'm tactical as fuck.
