ATF trying to facilitate gun registration

[alpine44]

Please read this and sign the letter to Congress


ATF Proposes Step to Make a National Gun Registry Easier
The ATF has issued new rules that will alter the format for Form 4473’s and make it easier to create a national gun registry.

The movie, Red Dawn, shows how the 4473 form can be used as a backdoor gun registry. In the movie, a Cuban commander orders an officer to obtain the 4473s from the sporting goods store, so the invading forces know who owns firearms.
Here’s what we know. ATF agents have used annual inspections to electronically record the contents of Form 4473’s being kept by federal gun dealers. See here and here.

We also know that a software company exhibiting its wares at the Shot Show in Las Vegas has crafted a system where ATF can take the contents of all the dealer’s Bound Book entries (which contain all of the buyer’s personal information and gun information which is on a Form 4473) by simply capturing them on a thumb drive.

We know that billionaire “Midget Mike” Bloomberg has made Universal Background Checks/National Gun Registries the centerpiece of his $2 BILLION campaign for the presidency — presumably because, if everyone with a gun has a 4473, then everyone with a gun will be in the national gun registry being compiled by ATF, using its copies of 4473’s.

And we know that the ATF is now trying to put the names of gun owners on the same page of the 4473 as the identifying information of the gun. See here.

But if they’re successful with changing the 4473 in this way, it will be much easier for ATF to create a national gun registry by photographing paper documents.

So it appears that we have an answer to the almost inexplicable question of why ATF is crawling over glass now to reincarnate the format for the 4473 which was junked decades ago.

This is, of course, one piece of the National Gun Registry strategy.

But, given that ATF is required by law to receive comments between now and February 24, it is worth our time to let them know that we know what they’re up to.

So please, go above to urge our federal government to REJECT the proposed changes to the 4473 form.

Again, let them know that bureaucrats shouldn’t be making it easier to register the firearms of law-abiding gun owners!


Link to take action. The swamp is deep.

 

[wh20crazy]

Done.

 

[Snuby642]

If you have any nfa items you are allready on the list.

What would be the point of worry past that ?

 

[MK20]

If you already registered as a Jew why worry about wearing the star?

 

[BAMCIS]

Enough of this shitshow already

 

[alpine44]

If you already registered as a Jew why worry about wearing the star?

This analogy does not apply to the ATF 4473 form but let me put your comment in a different context.

If you are a CCW permit holder, do you want your home address made public (as it was tried in CA) so that some crazy 'Antifa' douche-bags can pay you a visit?

 

[308pirate]

If you have any nfa items you are allready on the list.

What would be the point of worry past that ?

I don't have any NFA items. So do most people.

Your comment is idiotic in the extreme.

 

[Snuby642]

LMAO

Everybody on this forum is on the list and then some.

2 handguns or more at a time, list.
5 rifles at a time, list.

After having made the list multiple times it no longer matters, no action warranted.

 

[deersniper]

If I was a gun dealer the forms would be stored in a leaky shed. Probably garden house them once a week to be sure

Make sure no one says anything bad about the Atf agents copying all the forms. They are just doing their job

 

[W54/XM-388]

Do you use Facebook, Instagram, twitter or any other online service platform?
Have you ever taken a picture with your cell phone of a firearm?
Have you ever posted a picture of a firearm or you with a firearm?
Have you ever recently e-mailed a picture of a firearm using any of the primary "free" services?

If so, they probably already have your serial number in a database (if it was visible anywhere) tagged to you as an owner.
If the serial number is not visible, they still have it tagged in a database to your name, and make / model

Everything is already in place, it's just waiting for the switch to be flipped.

Yet folks still use Facebook for their shooting groups......

 

[deersniper]

^need to overwhelm the system. Get everyone into shooting and semi autos/silencers

Video games helped our cause more than most realize.

 

[amcardon]

My goal is so that when they see the number of times my name is in their "4473 database" they say, "oh shit, we might need to send more than just a pair of jackboots to this guy"

 

[Romeo458]

If I was a gun dealer the forms would be stored in a leaky shed. Probably garden house them once a week to be sure

Make sure no one says anything bad about the Atf agents copying all the forms. They are just doing their job

I'm not sure the penalties for that, but you would be willing to risk federal jail time for a bunch of people you do not know?

They already have a low rent version of registration thanks to the 4473, the electronic files just make it easier to copy.

 

[deersniper]

I'm not sure the penalties for that, but you would be willing to risk federal jail time for a bunch of people you do not know?

They already have a low rent version of registration thanks to the 4473, the electronic files just make it easier to copy.

Hmm. Seems other people say f .gov. You should try it instead of bowing down and kissing their ring. Doesn’t say anything about investigating or penalties for those dealers.

 

[E. Bryant]

I'm not sure that a random Forbes article constitutes solid legal advice.

 

[Romeo458]

View attachment 7250531

Hmm. Seems other people say f .gov. You should try it instead of bowing down and kissing their ring. Doesn’t say anything about investigating or penalties for those dealers.

Don't assume because someone asks question of something you say they are automatically against you, or they are sucking up to the kings men. That attitude only helps them by dividing us.

 

[DarnYankeeUSMC]

Fuck the ATF. Throw them along with the FBI, CIA, DHS and a couple others in a pit and fill it with gasoline and set a match to it.

 

[broncoaz]

I’ve got NFA stuff, so I’m already on all the lists.

My former dealer kept his completed forms in a wooden file cabinet with a couple cans of white gas and a box of strike anywhere matches on top.

 

[acudaowner]

that's funny .

 

[Snuby642]

Nothing really funny about the doing my job crowd at all when you think about it.

 

[Scott037]

LMAO

Everybody on this forum is on the list and then some.

2 handguns or more at a time, list.
5 rifles at a time, list.

After having made the list multiple times it no longer matters, no action warranted.

Well that's a boring hunting trip

 

[SilentStalkr]

I’m already on multiple lists by big bro lmao. So I’m not really worried but I see your point.

 

[Snuby642]

Carefull what you say.

Ron White - Tater Salad - Comedy Central Presents (Video Clip) | Comedy Central US

After being thrown out of a bar, Ron White's old alias resurfaces.

www.cc.com

 

[308Gunner]

Done but as others have stated I am on the list already .

 

[alpine44]

Especially if one is on a list, this person should be concerned that fellow patriots aren't.

Thanks, to everyone who signed.

 

[QuickNDirty]

Lists, you say? This is the only list I'd care to have been on. The rest are just lists maintained by morons, and feared by idiots.

The ATF needs to be disbanded.

 

[myronman3]

Along with the fbi, epa, and on and on.

 

[BoilerUP]

Everybody is on a list.

Veteran? List. LEO? List. Own Title II? List. Active member of a gun forum? List. Registered voter? List. Politically active? List. Ever used the word “boogaloo” on social media? List.

Honestly, who cares?

Lists really only matter when they are acted upon, and let’s be honest, in this day and age it’ll take less than 5 minutes for action on a list to go public and the balloon will go up at that point.

V/R,

Guy on a whole bunch of lists

 

[EddieNFL]

At one time SC required dealers to log all ammo sales. In the late '70s, homicide detectives tracked me down from purchase of a semi-odd caliber. The dealer was in the next county and they were on my doorstep two days after the killing. Looking back, I'm pretty impressed considering the number of sealers in the area and the state of computers at the time.

Turns out a rifle I had traded and been traded again was used to kill a jealous wife's husband.

 

[deersniper]

Everybody is on a list.

Veteran? List. LEO? List. Own Title II? List. Active member of a gun forum? List. Registered voter? List. Politically active? List. Ever used the word “boogaloo” on social media? List.

Honestly, who cares?

Lists really only matter when they are acted upon, and let’s be honest, in this day and age it’ll take less than 5 minutes for action on a list to go public and the balloon will go up at that point.

V/R,

Guy on a whole bunch of lists

? Red flags are a thing. Balloon is deflated

 

[BoilerUP]

? Red flags are a thing. Balloon is deflated

Disagree.

Do you honestly believe a mass red-flagging isn't going to draw just a little attention, especially if the reasoning behind them is flimsy? In the event of a mass red-flagging, which would be all over the interwebs within minutes of its execution, do you think everybody would willfully comply? Do you believe law enforcement would be able to muster the resources to enforce a mass red-flagging simultaneously, negating informational spread of its beginning?

There's so much paranoia and fear involved in this topic that rationality and logical thought has gone straight out the G-D window in favor of raw emotion and conspiracy theory.

 

[Fig]

Remember this?

Ashcroft Tightens Gun Checks but Limits Use of Data

Safety: Using the FBI's lists of firearm owners to find criminals is prohibited, the attorney general says.

www.latimes.com

I can’t find it, but I’m pretty sure Ashcroft also brain wiped several illegal data bases being kept but the BATFE and FBI.

After the shit show coup attempt by the FBI and CIA anyone who trusts these organizations and thinks they’re just a bunch of disinterested professionals is a dangerous, ignorant, moron. They are a direct threat to the republic and until they are brought back under civilian control, back under the Constitution, and are no longer free to perpetrate crimes against the American people without fear of prosecution or facing justice, we are all at risk!

How’s that for “sedition“ you statist, deep state, motherfuckers monitoring this site?

 

[Fig]

Disagree.

Do you honestly believe a mass red-flagging isn't going to draw just a little attention, especially if the reasoning behind them is flimsy? In the event of a mass red-flagging, which would be all over the interwebs within minutes of its execution, do you think everybody would willfully comply? Do you believe law enforcement would be able to muster the resources to enforce a mass red-flagging simultaneously, negating informational spread of its beginning?

There's so much paranoia and fear involved in this topic that rationality and logical thought has gone straight out the G-D window in favor of raw emotion and conspiracy theory.

How can you even say that? That’s like saying when a cop catches a speeder you should assume that’s his first time speeding, or a drug dealer it’s his first time dealing, and anyone who believes the evidence indicates more than a singular event is a “conspiracy theorist”. Clearly you do not have the mind or experience of a LEO or a Lawyer, because we know you only see the very tip of the iceberg. if you believe that only the top brass of FBI and CIA were criminals I have a bridge to sell you. That would be the first time ever the people sitting at the top of a massive bureaucracy were corrupt, but everyone else was a “non-partisan professional”. Give-me-a-break!

 

[deersniper]

“How’s that for “sedition“ you statist, deep state, motherfuckers monitoring this site?”

Get some get some!

 

[pmclaine]

Ask Canada how registration worked.....

Never solved any crimes and became prohibitively expensive and unwieldy.

If a people that will elect Justin Trudeau can figure this out and abandon it who is our govt to be so stupid?

 

[Fig]

Canada probably has a limited budget. The leftists in the USA will throw unlimited money at something, no matter how big a failure it is, till the end of time. In fact, the bigger a failure it is the more of our money they will throw.
You have to understand, that is literally what constitutes their morality. How much they care is directly corelary to how much of your money they force you to spend on what they think is important. How else could Bernie, who proposes $300,000,000,000,000 of new spending over the next ten years, be considered anything but a sick joke?

 

[pmclaine]

Canada probably has a limited budget. The leftists in the USA will throw unlimited money at something, no matter how big a failure it is, till the end of time. In fact, the bigger a failure it is the more of our money they will throw.
You have to understand, that is literally what constitutes their morality. How much they care is directly corelary to how much of your money they force you to spend on what they think is important. How else could Bernie, who proposes $300,000,000,000,000 of new spending over the next ten years, be considered anything but a sick joke?

Bernies a Communist.

Since time immemorial Communists say that the only reason Communism fails is because the place it was tried wasn't Communist enough.

Is there any other philosophy that is permitted to get away with that shit?

 

[MadDuner]

None of the lists will mean anything when it comes down to having to go door to door to confiscate weapons from legal gun owners. If it ever comes to this - they will soon run out of willing collectors. That whole argument about having to feed their families means nothing if they don’t make it home from work.

 

[W54/XM-388]

Disagree.

Do you honestly believe a mass red-flagging isn't going to draw just a little attention, especially if the reasoning behind them is flimsy? In the event of a mass red-flagging, which would be all over the interwebs within minutes of its execution, do you think everybody would willfully comply? Do you believe law enforcement would be able to muster the resources to enforce a mass red-flagging simultaneously, negating informational spread of its beginning?

Go do a bit of research on how many "Red Flag" confiscations Florida has done recently.
The number is truly stunning.
NO refusal from LE, in fact they love to do it
NO public uprising, just all the sheep clucking their heads.


The ones with their hands on the levers of power are way smarter than you when it comes to how much they can get away with and not cause an uprising.

They will come for you a few at a time here and there.

They actually don't care as much if you have guns hidden under your mattress, it just gives them a good excuse anytime they need.

 

[Rthur]

The below is a graph of gun realed crime in England and Wales:
As this is from the BBC I'll wager it is light by more than a bit.

With all the restrictions and laws how is this possible?

The following is a graph covering prior and after the handgun ban:

As seen from 1990 to 2011 they've achieve a zero net effect in curbing handgun use in crimes.
Wonder why no one, like those who voted it in, is asking if these laws are effective?

R

 

[deersniper]

None of the lists will mean anything when it comes down to having to go door to door to confiscate weapons from legal gun owners. If it ever comes to this - they will soon run out of willing collectors. That whole argument about having to feed their families means nothing if they don’t make it home from work.

They are doing confiscations. Right. Now.

Not mass confiscations. One by one they pick us off. Red flags. Bs prohibiting offenses. Bans. Registration. Etc

 

[deersniper]

The below is a graph of gun realed crime in England and Wales:
As this is from the BBC I'll wager it is light by more than a bit.
View attachment 7250804
With all the restrictions and laws how is this possible?

The following is a graph covering prior and after the handgun ban:
View attachment 7250806
As seen from 1990 to 2011 they've achieve a zero net effect in curbing handgun use in crimes.
Wonder why no one, like those who voted it in, is asking if these laws are effective?

R

???? It’s not about safety. It’s about consolidating power for the oligarchy

 

[Arc Light]

These are the kind of things that make me wonder about Trump's commitment to our 2nd Amendment. And I say that as a Trump supporter. He could put a stop to this tomorrow. He could have nominated a pro-gun director to the ATF instead of an anti-gun career bureaucrat. All Trump supporters should be demanding that he put words into action and show us that he means what he says.

 

[W54/XM-388]

These are the kind of things that make me wonder about Trump's commitment to our 2nd Amendment. And I say that as a Trump supporter. He could put a stop to this tomorrow. He could have nominated a pro-gun director to the ATF instead of an anti-gun career bureaucrat. All Trump supporters should be demanding that he put words into action and show us that he means what he says.

Good luck with that.

Trump can't even find or figure out how to appoint a single non deep state plant to the FBI and Justice Department.

 

[TACC]

Go do a bit of research on how many "Red Flag" confiscations Florida has done recently.
The number is truly stunning.
NO refusal from LE, in fact they love to do it
NO public uprising, just all the sheep clucking their heads.


The ones with their hands on the levers of power are way smarter than you when it comes to how much they can get away with and not cause an uprising.

They will come for you a few at a time here and there.

They actually don't care as much if you have guns hidden under your mattress, it just gives them a good excuse anytime they need.

Exactly, have yet to see one LEO, state this red flag law is not right, they just go along with the flow.

 

[JB.IC]

from my understanding, ATF reports to the DOJ AG which the AG reports and advises the POTUS.

but he’s pro 2a right? RIGHT!?

 

[MadDuner]

Isn’t it odd that tax stamps go through the DOJ?

 

[candyx]

The below is a graph of gun realed crime in England and Wales:
As this is from the BBC I'll wager it is light by more than a bit.
View attachment 7250804
With all the restrictions and laws how is this possible?

The following is a graph covering prior and after the handgun ban:
View attachment 7250806
As seen from 1990 to 2011 they've achieve a zero net effect in curbing handgun use in crimes.
Wonder why no one, like those who voted it in, is asking if these laws are effective?

R

Don't tie your right to bear arms to stats that they want to use to disarm everyone its just a distraction to weaken your resolve. They tell you its to save the children while at the same time they promote full term abortion to receive the profits to fund their political campaigns . See through the smoke they produced to blind the sheep.

 

[armorpl8chikn]

RedFlag =Stasi

 

[Voyager1]

DONE