Rifle Scopes ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

V

Vette447

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Apr 30, 2009
232
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Oklahoma
#1
Does anyone have experience with the PS-22 made by ATN? I am interested in a quality night vision device that is a versatile day/night scope type set up and this seems to be the best option available to civies. Is it high quality? Is there much difference between the Gen 2+ and Gen 3? Does it interface well with most rifle scopes? The customer reviews online at the optics vendors seem positive but I thought I would see if there are any Hide members that have used it firsthand.

To preface, I have owned three different Gen 1 devices and gotten rid of all of them due to poor image quality, etc. I have not gotten the chance to use a Gen 2+ or Gen 3 device in an actual environment at night. Any help or input would be appreciated.

Thanks!
 
#2
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Vette447</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Does anyone have experience with the PS-22 made by ATN? I am interested in a quality night vision device that is a versatile day/night scope type set up and this seems to be the best option available to civies. Is it high quality? Is there much difference between the Gen 2+ and Gen 3? Does it interface well with most rifle scopes? The customer reviews online at the optics vendors seem positive but I thought I would see if there are any Hide members that have used it firsthand.

To preface, I have owned three different Gen 1 devices and gotten rid of all of them due to poor image quality, etc. I have not gotten the chance to use a Gen 2+ or Gen 3 device in an actual environment at night. Any help or input would be appreciated.

Thanks! </div></div>

We've been awakened many of nights from LE agencies we work with having MAJOR POA/POI issues with this system and then to find out getting their slim budget money back or the unit repaired is all but lost.

There's only ONE style of clip on devices and that is the PVS-22, 24 and 27 made from OSTI and KAC that REALLY work over and over again in the field. We have used the OSTI systems for years without failure. There is NO POA/POI issues with these systems as they are optically aligned perfectly. Yes, they run in the 7.5K and up for these systems but you do get what you pay for. The PS-22, no matter what marketing hype you hear, can and does have major issues with their optical design that are causing POA/POI shifts along with tube failure from high recoil weapons. Another reason the OSTI has been received so well with it's shock mitigation housings that mitigate the recoil effect to the intensifier tube. Hope this helps.

Vic

Edited, we also tell everyone to save for a Gen 3 if you can. There really is no substitute for for the clarity, brightness and resolution. There is also a reason these PVS systems do NOT even come with an option for a Gen 2 system. It would defeat the whole purpose of what a clip-on device needs to do in the first place while in front of a day scope...
 
#4
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

Going to a T&E session tonight for Trijicon and their night vision toys. We were trying to get some ATN stuff as well just to compare.

Of course it's raining, so we get to test is real world conditions.
wink.gif
 
#5
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LoneWolfUSMC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Going to a T&E session tonight for Trijicon and their night vision toys. We were trying to get some ATN stuff as well just to compare.

Of course it's raining, so we get to test is real world conditions.
wink.gif
</div></div>

Would be interested to hear how it turned out if you got to play with some good "toys".
 
#7
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mo_Zam_Beek</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Victor - when will you be able to release details on the WASP M4000? </div></div>

We hope by Christmas.
 
#9
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

The PVS-27 does look to be very impressive and it looks to be the one I would love to get/have. The $7.5K investment is very hard to swallow for an individual (me). However, I guess if I was thinking about $4K for the PS-22; what's an additional $3.5K? Right?
smile.gif
 
#10
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

Ive been looking at night vision equipment for a while.
It seems impossble to get any of the decent US made stuff out exported outside the US,

Ive been looking at the Qioptiq Sniperkite and the Hensold NSV 80.

I used to use a Yukon device which was ok for short range fox control, but I'm looking for equipment for my customers these days and only the top range kit will suffice,
We took a look at some of the Dedal kit at the IWA.

do you guys have any comparisons to make ? and any idea on exporting ?
regards Pete
 
#11
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

Lonewolf, how did the PS-22 do? I was gong to go to the demo as well simply to see how the PS-22 performed but I hade a prior commitment that I couldn't break...
 
#12
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

Pete- I will be at the IWA show...let me know what you have found. Am in the market for a decent PVS 22 type system and the Zeiss NSV 80 is the only one I have seen so far that appears it will do the job- but it is very bulky compared to some of the US stuff I have used.
 
#13
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dr Don Heath D.Sc.</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Pete- I will be at the IWA show...let me know what you have found. Am in the market for a decent PVS 22 type system and the Zeiss NSV 80 is the only one I have seen so far that appears it will do the job- but it is very bulky compared to some of the US stuff I have used. </div></div>

You should see trace through the NSV 80... Looks like a lightning bolt!

Since everyone's high-end CNVD is using basically the same Gen III tube (ITT or L3), it is the optical elements that set the units apart. The 80mm lens adds some bulk, but the unit only weighs 2.8lbs with batteries.
 
#14
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

Like Victor I am a dealer for this stuff (Nightvision Depot) and have owned and tried a lot of it. I agree with Vic, stay away from the ATN and stick with OSTI. For my money Id go with a 14 ond a 4x Trijicon. Very versatile and can be used hand held. You can get one for about $3300 and add the Trijicon later. The 22 is bulky heavy and tends to make a rifle really front heavy. It gets very grainy at higher power.
 
#15
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

Don,
we are exhibiting at the IWA. Hall 3. Stand 3-741. drop by and see us.

I'm looking for a unit that mounts in from to the scope.
The NSV80 runs around 8-9000€ trade price depending on where you get it from. Its probably available cheaper but ive not looked into that just yet,
The Sniperkite is for LE and MOD only end users, which is fine, but there is a market for civie use devices too.
Simrad sits to high for the application requirement.

And anything decent from the US is practicaly impossible to get exported out,, or am i wrong about that ?

regards Pete
 
#16
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

All US Gen 3 NV cannot be exported without valid State Dept. paperwork in place. US citizens also are not allowed to take Gen 3 NV with them if traveling outside the USA unless proper export paperwork. Hope this helps.

Vic
 
#19
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

Vic Paperwork wouldn't be a problem this end. But some of the US export laws are a clusterfuck. Wont export to honest Allied citizens, but sell in tons to bananna republics who tend to use the kit against us before one can blink.. I'm not saying that our rule makers are any cleverer mind.
It just all gets in the way of an Honest days work for an honest days pay.

I wonder if you can export the stuff without the tubes so its a non functioning unit ?? without all the burocracy

regards Pete
 
#20
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

Hi Pete--yes, there is a fair demand for decent night vision kit for African hunting. Unfortunately I have the wrong passport (Zimbabwe) and bounce between two countries on the US no no list Zimbabwe and Sweden (Yup Sweden- need a special permit to export even a Leupold scope to Sweden!). I am also not prepared to break US regulations and simply smuggle the right kit out. I have dealt with a couple of companies that were prepared to go through the hoops of getting an export permit...and once I have had a chance to actually try and monkey finger some of the kit I may go that route- I just want to actually try such a unit and see that it does what I want before I spend that kind of shilling. Played with the PVS 7's and 14's in Iraq but never got my paws on a 22
 
#22
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Vette447</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Very nice Fongman, I am jealous! Can civies purchase the PVS-22? </div></div>

I bought mine over a year ago. The one I have is the same model the Marine's are using. I thought that I read some time earlier this year they were now restricted. But I believe similar models are still available to the civilian market.

Your best bet would be to contact Vic. I don't keep up with the latest regulations or availabilities.

I want a thermal scope now, but believe most of the good ones are already restricted. My business has taken such a hit this year that one is not in the cards anyway...
 
#24
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Fongman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I want a thermal scope now, but believe most of the good ones are already restricted. My business has taken such a hit this year that one is not in the cards anyway... </div></div>

I got a chance to play with the Trijicon ATWS two days ago. It was an interesting device, but not worth the price tag for most applications. The TANS (Trijicon's PVS-22) was much better for low light. Now if you had to look through smoke then the ATWS may have merit.

I am not digging the price tag, and I don't think the ATWS is available for civilian sale. I could build several nice NV equipped weapons systems for the cost of one ATWS.
 
#25
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

Hell Don, you need an export permit to export a 1/4x28 screw from the US, allthough you can buy them in wheelbarrow loads at the hardware store.
Its the same here mind, everything we have in the webshop, bar the textiles is export permit required. all exept the picatinny rails,, for some strange reason they are export permit exempt..

Ive been thinking of offering a golfing line, as i have found out that i can ballance golfballs nicely on my muzzle brakes, and if i sell tham as tactical T's for the descerning golfer i can sell the sods without a permit !! DUH go figure..

anyhow,

back to night vision. There is a market for it, and with the increasing numbers of wild boar (population explosion) in Germany and the expense to hunting lease owners caused by crop damage there is added pressure to generaly allow night vision hunting. We can use head mounted night vision to hunt with now, we just aren't allowed to weapon mount it,, which means folck comming up with all sorts of head mouted gadgets and smacking them selves in the eye with a monocular on every shot,.,.
now that cant be in the spirit of cleanly killing game, and if you are going to use a technological advantage,, then it should be done right,,

I'm currently looking for the right kit, as ive contracts for rifle looming that require it,, and a whole load of hunters want the right kit too..
regards Pete
 
#26
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LoneWolfUSMC</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Fongman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I want a thermal scope now, but believe most of the good ones are already restricted. My business has taken such a hit this year that one is not in the cards anyway... </div></div>

I got a chance to play with the Trijicon ATWS two days ago. It was an interesting device, but not worth the price tag for most applications. The TANS (Trijicon's PVS-22) was much better for low light. Now if you had to look through smoke then the ATWS may have merit.

I am not digging the price tag, and I don't think the ATWS is available for civilian sale. I could build several nice NV equipped weapons systems for the cost of one ATWS. </div></div>

Most of the thermal stuff is restricted but oddly enough you can get it on your new Mercedes or Cadillac. Lets yu see out to 3-500 feet in smoke or fog. really nice stuff if you have the cash to pony up.
 
#29
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LoneWolfUSMC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It's harder to mount a Cadillac to a .50bmg
wink.gif
</div></div>

Haha. It might be more fun to mount your .50 BMG to your Cadillac or Mercedes.
 
#30
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LoneWolfUSMC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It's harder to mount a Cadillac to a .50bmg
wink.gif
</div></div>

Were working on a special adapter
grin.gif
 
#31
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Fongman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This PVS-22 (OSTI) ROCKS!
Buy Once - Cry Once...then play.

IMG_1992.jpg


IMG_1991.jpg
</div></div>

Fongman, we should get together again sometime to compare our NODs which clip on in front of the day optics...
 
#32
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

They now have out the StalkIR by Oasys and are about 6k cheaper than Trijicon ATWS. Now all I need to do is figure out how to get one. Use PVS14 and thermal camera now for hog ministry, feeding hungry families...... this would go a long way of putting a lot more meat in the freezer.

Dave
 
#33
Re: ATN PS-22 Day/Night Scope System

I've had great luck with an ATN PS40-3P (3rd generation ITT Pinnacle tube). My preliminary tests shows that there is little to no POI shift and that it's consistent after removing and reattaching.

I'm relatively new to the NV game and certainly don't have the level of professional military/LE NV expertise that many of the participants on this board have so take my advise with a grain of salt.

I started out with a first gen ATN scope. It was crap. ATN took it back and I upgraded to a second gen scope. Better but still not what I expected. At this point I was married to ATN. Couldn't get my money back, but they would upgrade to a 3rd gen unit if I paid the difference. Made the jump to the ATN dedicated MARS unit with an ITT Pinnacle tube. True 3rd gen was what I was looking for... much better. Sighting the MARS in was a pain in the behind. I never had confidence that it was holding zero. The quick release rail mounts seemed cheap to me. Eventually I was able to get it to shoot straight out to about 150 yards assuming there was enough ambient light. Just as I started feeling confident in the scope the recticle let loose. POI literally moved 6+ inches per shot. Sent it back to ATN. They replaced the unit and I once again got it out to 150 yards accurately as long as I left it on the rifle. I really wanted to have a NV device that I could use on multiple weapons. Ran into a guy who had good luck with a 3rd gen ATN PS22. Started looking at the PS40 (better for larger objective scopes). Ended up making a lateral move from the MARS unit to the PS40. Very happy with it so far. I've put roughly 1,000 rounds of 7.62x39 through my AR using the scope and it works great. At a hundred yards I can't tell the difference between my day and night groups. Easily takes me, accurately, out to 150. I'm having a Badger Ordnance embedded front rail put on my Remington mil-spec 5r .308 and have ordered a laser illuminator so I can take it out further and give it a real run for the money. Will post my findings once I have a chance to test it out.

Overall ATN's customer service is good. They support their products and will replace or switch you between models without hassle. The only thing is that you are out your gear for up to a month at a time for shipping, repairs, paperwork, etc.

If I had it all over to to again, AND I had DOUBLE the budget I'd go the PVS22/27 route. Wouldn't even look at ATN if I was LE/Mil. For my weekend warrior hog hunting the ATN PS40 is a success.

Another option, if you feel like most of your shots will be around 100 yards or less is to go with a PVS14 and Aimpoint. Light weight, flexible use and works great.
 
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