What is the average life expectancy of the quality 300 win mag barrels and 308 barrels before they need to be swapped out due to significant accuracy degradation? Also if someone were to consistently clean the barrel after shooting will this increase the barrel life? I have heard people state that they only get 1000 rounds out of their 300 win mags. But I have read those who take care of their barrels are getting around 4,500 rounds and more. What is your experience? Thanks
-
Having trouble using the site?
Contact support
Barrel Life Expectancy
- Thread starter 42N8 1
- Start date
There's isn't a definitive answer to your question other than you'll get less barrel life out of a .300WM and more barrel life out of your .308 Winchester. Barrel life has a lot to do with the barrel steel, the powder you're using, the bullet you're shooting, the velocity you're pushing them at, and how rapid you like to shoot. Shooting long, heavy bullets (= more bearing surface) at a relatively high velocity to take advantage of the ballistic coefficient will generally not be conducive to a long and happy barrel life. Especially if you like to rack the bolt and see how many rounds you can get down range in under a minute. On average you can expect to maybe get a couple thousand rounds out of a .300 WM and out of a .308 Winchester you could see maybe five time that if you shoot a mild load. Also cleaning the barrel after every range trip will shorten the barrel life, not increase it. Hope this helps.
You should only clean your rifle when your accuracy degrades. For me in the 6.5 Creedmoor, this happens about every 400-500 rounds. Every time you scrub your barrel you scrub away barrel life. With a 30 cal, you should be able to extend your cleaning by a bit.
A 308 should last a damn long time. Probably 10-15000 rounds. If you wore out a 308 in a bolt rifle, I would think you where the coolest! I don't have enough experience with a 300 to say, but I would expect a long time as well.
Ty
A 308 should last a damn long time. Probably 10-15000 rounds. If you wore out a 308 in a bolt rifle, I would think you where the coolest! I don't have enough experience with a 300 to say, but I would expect a long time as well.
Ty
Taking care of your barrel doesn't mean cleaning all the time. It means keeping it from overheating which reduces life significantly, not cleaning it with sandpaper or in the midst of a sandstorm helps. Don't pour oil down the tube and shoot.....little things like that. Guys who tell you that cleaning it often will extend life are leaving out some important info.
Frank
Frank
Break-In & Cleaning
.308 is going to last a LONG time, that's why I basically thrash the piss out of mine and don't worry, case efficiency is directly proportional to barrel life in context with pressure. In other words, any time you are using disproportionally more powder to gain more diminishing returns on speed you are hurting barrel life. Bigger diameter and less powder moves in the opposite (longer life) direction.
I clean once every 150-200 rounds, its one wet patch of copper solvent, wait 1 min, dry patch. Then a wet patch of powder solvent, then 1 dry patch. Done. I like to keep an average amount of copper on the lands so I don't have a radical POI shift after cleaning.
.308 is going to last a LONG time, that's why I basically thrash the piss out of mine and don't worry, case efficiency is directly proportional to barrel life in context with pressure. In other words, any time you are using disproportionally more powder to gain more diminishing returns on speed you are hurting barrel life. Bigger diameter and less powder moves in the opposite (longer life) direction.
I clean once every 150-200 rounds, its one wet patch of copper solvent, wait 1 min, dry patch. Then a wet patch of powder solvent, then 1 dry patch. Done. I like to keep an average amount of copper on the lands so I don't have a radical POI shift after cleaning.
I was told by someone recently that when the USMC was testing barrels they took a schneider 308 barrel to well past 20k rounds and the gun still shot with accuracy specs.
There are far too many variables to predict barrel life. Powder burn rate, velocity, cleaning regiment, rate of fire. etc. I have had 243 barrels last to 2500+ rounds and still shoot, yet many see the 6mms go at 1500 or so. 1000 rounds for a 300 WM is extremely low, one should expect upwards of 5K+ out of a 300WM, far more out of a 308.
Bart Bobbitt in 1992 says ~ 3,000 rounds for the 308 per the formula he derived.
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/rec.guns/iC-CoKQCeW8/UF0WINR94kAJ
Later in 1997 he shot a 3.325" 20 shot group at 800 yards with a 308.
https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#%21topic/rec.guns/iL7zv-cktJc
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/rec.guns/iC-CoKQCeW8/UF0WINR94kAJ
Later in 1997 he shot a 3.325" 20 shot group at 800 yards with a 308.
https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#%21topic/rec.guns/iL7zv-cktJc
I had 3200 rounds down a .300 win mag 700 Police. It STILL SHOT 3/4 moa out to 1200 yards before I got it rebarreled. Some last longer than others. But I would think more cleaning solvent would make it go faster??
As everyone has said there are a lot of things that go into barrel life. However one thing no one has mentioned is what you consider acceptable accuracy. That IMO is one of the main factors in barrel life.
I bought a TRG 22 26" new and rebarreled it when the accuracy fell off at 4600 rounds. I know how to properly maintain a rifle and clean with out damaging a bore or crown. I always clean with a Dewey rod and Lucas bore guide. The barrel only every saw 118LR, or hand loaded 175 SMK @ 2600fps with either Varget or RL15. The throat of that barrel hardly moved up to 3600 rounds, I never measured it again until I was diagnosing the accuracy loss. After verifying the load was still good, all screws were tight, and the scope was OK I measured the throat and it was 0.100" longer. So to me the accuracy became unacceptable when the rifle went from being easily sub half MOA (meaning every time that I pulled the trigger as long as I didn't mess it up) to not being able to shoot 1/2 MOA if it had to but was able to hole under MOA.
I too have seen 300WM barrels get shot out just over 2000 rounds. I also torched a 6.5X284 in 1200 rounds. But there again it all goes back to an acceptable level of accuracy...
I bought a TRG 22 26" new and rebarreled it when the accuracy fell off at 4600 rounds. I know how to properly maintain a rifle and clean with out damaging a bore or crown. I always clean with a Dewey rod and Lucas bore guide. The barrel only every saw 118LR, or hand loaded 175 SMK @ 2600fps with either Varget or RL15. The throat of that barrel hardly moved up to 3600 rounds, I never measured it again until I was diagnosing the accuracy loss. After verifying the load was still good, all screws were tight, and the scope was OK I measured the throat and it was 0.100" longer. So to me the accuracy became unacceptable when the rifle went from being easily sub half MOA (meaning every time that I pulled the trigger as long as I didn't mess it up) to not being able to shoot 1/2 MOA if it had to but was able to hole under MOA.
I too have seen 300WM barrels get shot out just over 2000 rounds. I also torched a 6.5X284 in 1200 rounds. But there again it all goes back to an acceptable level of accuracy...
Not really, unless you seriously trashing you barrel with your cleaning technique. I clean after 50-100 rounds, barrels keep their accuracy instead of getting worse because your not cleaning. Copper builds up with fast calibers, and tons of carbon and powder fouling with large cartridges. My guns do 1/3moa or better at 100m, and intend to keep it that way so I know if I shoot less than that it is my fault, not the rifle's.
It's a myth that cleaning harms your barrel; that only holds water if you don't do it right.
It's a myth that cleaning harms your barrel; that only holds water if you don't do it right.
A 308 will go for a very long time... I put over 7000 rounds through one and it still shot 1/2 MOA. You can spend your money on reloading components instead of replacement barrels.
My factory sendaro 300 wm had about 600 rds before I changed it out. It would foul out after 10-15 rds. The last time I shot it I had a 3 shot 6in group at 1000yds. Best group I ever shot at 1k. Mostly luck. Then it would just throw a curve ball and I would hit the plate 5ft away into a 10mph wind. I cleaned it and It was back on. After a couple of trips to the range like this I decided to get a barrel. Maybe I had something else going on but who doesn't like a new barrel and some accurizing?
[MENTION=3512]Zulu[/MENTION]: The 308 is an efficient case, but you can make a calculation if a 308 or a 6.5CM will be more or less expensive. Less powder and cheaper bullets can mean paying back the extra barrel sometimes. Yet you will have to work up loads an extra time. In the end you have to decide if the extra wind bucking abilities of a 6 or 6.5mm is more important than an extra barrel. A 6x47 costs just as much to run as a 308, despite the barrel only lasting half as long.
6x47 Lapua
Berger 6mm 105H $32
Lapua brass $103 (20 reloads) = ($103/100)/20 = $0.0515/rd
Primers $32 = $0.032/rd
Powder $67/kg = ±$0.18/rd
Barrel $650 (4000rds) = $0.16/rd
ammo cost: $0.58/rd
barrel wear: $0.16/rd
TCO: $0.75/rd
308 Win
Berger .30 185H $45
Lapua brass $70 (40 reloads)
Primers $32 = $0.032/rd
Powder $67/kg = ±$0.18/rd
Barrel $650 (8000rds) = $0.08/rd
ammo cost: $0.68/rd
barrel wear: $0.08/rd
TCO: $0.76/rd
If you get less reloads with the 308 brass, it even become more expensive to run. But as above, they cost exactly the same to run as you can see. The extra (double) barrel wear on the 6mm is offset by the compenent costs.
This kind of cost calculating could also show if either of these would be suited if you're just paper punching at 100m/100y most of the time. For that purpose I have a dedicated rifle shooting a 221FB at $0.47/rd. With 2000-2500 rounds per year at $0.19 difference to the 308, this adds up to $400/yr savings. That's 500 rounds of 308W
Whah, it's saturday 2am and I'm getting wasted Enough with the numbers.
6x47 Lapua
Berger 6mm 105H $32
Lapua brass $103 (20 reloads) = ($103/100)/20 = $0.0515/rd
Primers $32 = $0.032/rd
Powder $67/kg = ±$0.18/rd
Barrel $650 (4000rds) = $0.16/rd
ammo cost: $0.58/rd
barrel wear: $0.16/rd
TCO: $0.75/rd
308 Win
Berger .30 185H $45
Lapua brass $70 (40 reloads)
Primers $32 = $0.032/rd
Powder $67/kg = ±$0.18/rd
Barrel $650 (8000rds) = $0.08/rd
ammo cost: $0.68/rd
barrel wear: $0.08/rd
TCO: $0.76/rd
If you get less reloads with the 308 brass, it even become more expensive to run. But as above, they cost exactly the same to run as you can see. The extra (double) barrel wear on the 6mm is offset by the compenent costs.
This kind of cost calculating could also show if either of these would be suited if you're just paper punching at 100m/100y most of the time. For that purpose I have a dedicated rifle shooting a 221FB at $0.47/rd. With 2000-2500 rounds per year at $0.19 difference to the 308, this adds up to $400/yr savings. That's 500 rounds of 308W
Whah, it's saturday 2am and I'm getting wasted
Enough with the numbers.
Last edited:
2150 rounds through a new SS Krieger .308 WIN, the throat has eroded by 0.032". Noticeable throat roughness. Accuracy fell off dramatically recently and I checked erosion; I had been following the throat, jumping 185 Bergers Juggernauts about 0.040", adjusting seating depth to compensate for erosion, then suddenly the barrel didn't like them jumping anymore. So now I seat them about 0.002" off the lands and they're shooting great again. I suspect this is due to throat roughness or perhaps even due to uneven throat wear; I don't have a borescope but I do have two new barrels waiting to be fitted. I was pushing the crap out of them with Re-17, a powder which I'm told is not known for being barrel-friendly. Now I'm pushing the crap out of them with Varget.
What I'm trying to say is, barrel life depends on your needs and your "habits". If you shoot softballs all the time you'll have less erosion and your .308WIN barrel could last a really long time. If you shoot a bullet that likes to jump, and is OK with jumping a long way (SMKs), then you won't really notice throat erosion because you won't notice accuracy falling off, and it will fall off slower because you have less throat erosion shooting factory "match" ammo. If you handload, you can do "some" compensating for erosion as it affects accuracy. If you don't handload, then WYSIWYG. See?
I clean each trip because I don't want moisture-attracting crap left in the barrel; I have tried the "don't clean" thing and after leaving the rifle for a week when I shoot again and then DO clean it comes out the wrong color. IMO this is combustion by-products left in the barrel which attract and absorb moisture from the air and then turn into god-knows-what. No thanks.
About 650 rounds through a factory Savage .300WM and the bore is quite rough when I push a patch or a brush through it; this is probably stress-cracking. It didn't used to be this way.
What I'm trying to say is, barrel life depends on your needs and your "habits". If you shoot softballs all the time you'll have less erosion and your .308WIN barrel could last a really long time. If you shoot a bullet that likes to jump, and is OK with jumping a long way (SMKs), then you won't really notice throat erosion because you won't notice accuracy falling off, and it will fall off slower because you have less throat erosion shooting factory "match" ammo. If you handload, you can do "some" compensating for erosion as it affects accuracy. If you don't handload, then WYSIWYG. See?
I clean each trip because I don't want moisture-attracting crap left in the barrel; I have tried the "don't clean" thing and after leaving the rifle for a week when I shoot again and then DO clean it comes out the wrong color. IMO this is combustion by-products left in the barrel which attract and absorb moisture from the air and then turn into god-knows-what. No thanks.
About 650 rounds through a factory Savage .300WM and the bore is quite rough when I push a patch or a brush through it; this is probably stress-cracking. It didn't used to be this way.
Barrel life is not usually a question based on 'wear' (unless you are bordering on mental about cleaning long and often), as much as barrel heating.
The barrel usually fails because the bore's throat area erodes from incandescent gas heating. When the gas temperature heats the throat metal high enough, expansion and contraction of the bore metal will cause the throat surface to crack and checker. When this checkering reaches the point where surface chips are ripped loose by gas erosion and bullet passage, the accuracy goes bad, usually all at once between shots.
The usual sequence is, the cleaning patch starts to drag slightly in the throat area, and some minor accuracy degradation begins to appear; then suddenly, it goes straight to hell, and nothing will bring it back.
That's the bell going off announcing rebarrel time. Managing barrel heating cycles by loading ammo not so hot, and developing a firing cadence that reduces surface temperatures to responsible levels can significantly push that maximum round count higher.
Understand that surface temperature is not an especially good gage of throat temperature. Exterior heating temperatures lag because of thermal propagation limits in the barrel metal. Rapid fire can heat the throat to critical temperatures somewhat sooner than when the exterior becomes alarmingly hot. As LL says, one cannot miss fast enough to win a gunfight.
Greg
The barrel usually fails because the bore's throat area erodes from incandescent gas heating. When the gas temperature heats the throat metal high enough, expansion and contraction of the bore metal will cause the throat surface to crack and checker. When this checkering reaches the point where surface chips are ripped loose by gas erosion and bullet passage, the accuracy goes bad, usually all at once between shots.
The usual sequence is, the cleaning patch starts to drag slightly in the throat area, and some minor accuracy degradation begins to appear; then suddenly, it goes straight to hell, and nothing will bring it back.
That's the bell going off announcing rebarrel time. Managing barrel heating cycles by loading ammo not so hot, and developing a firing cadence that reduces surface temperatures to responsible levels can significantly push that maximum round count higher.
Understand that surface temperature is not an especially good gage of throat temperature. Exterior heating temperatures lag because of thermal propagation limits in the barrel metal. Rapid fire can heat the throat to critical temperatures somewhat sooner than when the exterior becomes alarmingly hot. As LL says, one cannot miss fast enough to win a gunfight.
Greg
Last edited:
I used to agonize over barrel life, but no longer fret it. I enjoy shooting and consider barrels a cost to contend with. A barrel is $350, chamber job around $250. Only have to true action once- $200 or so. When 1000 bullets costs $300, I am not going to gripe about retubing a rifle for $600.
