Gunsmithing Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

[A10XRIFLE]

This is not a Tactical Type Post but alot of guys always ask about Button Vs Cut rifled, Who is making the best barrels Etc. results like these are hard to argue with.



NBRSA Nationals were last week 13 new National records where set. 3 new world records set.

All with Bartlein Barrels

Examples:

Tony Boyer new Unlimited class record 8 ten shot groups at 100 yards agg. = .189 (previous record was .2195)

Jack Neary LV record of 5 five shot groups at 100 yards = .1482

Tony Boyer won the 3 gun with a grand agg. of .199 this was for the Sporter class, LV class, HV class 100 and 200 yard combined. A total of 150 rounds being fired for these three classes if I have it correct. Yes a grand agg. of .199 for 150 rounds being fired at 100/200 yards.


Top 20 shooters were all using cut rifled barrels.
65% of the top 20 were shooting Bartlein

Out of the top 80 shooters (20 from each class Sporter, LV, HV and Unlimited) Bartlein barrels accounted for 60%, Kriegers where 38% and Hart and Shilen had 1% each.


Congrats for Trace Bartlein and his crew, thats quite an accomplishment for being a less than 5 year old company.

 

[GasLight]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

George, word like this is just going to make the wait longer LOL..

Awesome results, very tough to argue with that!

Dave

 

[300sniper]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DebosDave ©</div><div class="ubbcode-body">George, word like this is just going to make the wait longer LOL..

Awesome results, very tough to argue with that!

Dave </div></div>

i think it is good that it may make the wait shorter than normal if you choose another brand that will suit most of us just fine

edit: but i am about to chamber my first bartlein so i expect to be winning benchrest matches real soon

 

[Scottmilk9]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

George rebarreled my .308 with a bartlein and its a shooter

 

[Whiskey 2-1]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

That is indeed quite a statement about the quality of their product. Some amazing shooting on the trigger end as well.

Looks like my first Bartlein tube from GAP will be on the way in about a week. I am sure it will keep to both company's high standards.

 

[Rob01]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Getting a Bartlein on my 300WM from GAP. I knew it would be a shooter but nice to see this.

 

[mdesign]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

I also noticed the number of Bartlein barrels that were placing high in matches and wondered what type of barrel they were.

Are they all the T style (or twist) rifling or are they just the standard rifling? Anyone in the "know" here that can comment?

This data may also be telling us something about twist rifing if in fact that is what is being used.

 

[skeetlee]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Tony Boyer could and would win even if he was shooting a shilen. He is the best there is.......... If he chooses bartlein that must mean something. I have a bartlein on my new 30BR and it is by far the most accurate rifle i have ever owned. What makes there barrels better than anyone else though? Is it the way they cut there rifling? Is it all in the tolorences? The lapping? What actually sets one maker apart from another? I sure the heck dont know. Bartlein sure is tearing them up right now though thats for sure!!!! Kriegers aren't to bad either!! Lee

 

[308sako]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

..

 

[A10XRIFLE]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Most of them are shooting gain twist, Or T-style, with 3/4 gain from breach to muzzle. But there are also some shooting traditional twists. Tony shoots a 3/4 gain.

 

[Graham]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Roach built me a GAP Bartlein/Sugeon, my first such barrel, and it's probably one of the best shooting rifles I have, period. But it's just a plain-old regular twist tube. I've heard form more than one barrel maker that gain twist is all the rage now, but can someone explain to me why? Does it really start the bullet easier along it's journey? It would seem to me that the bullet doesn't know about the gain...

 

[A10XRIFLE]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

It keeps constant pressure on the driving side of the lands.

 

[A10XRIFLE]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Possibly Trace or Frank could explain that in detail.

 

[Hateca]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Bartlein and nothing else unless you bring it to me.

 

[Bryan27]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Just out of curiosity, how much faster do gain twist barrels get from chamber to muzzle? Would one start at 1:12 and exit the muzzle at 1:10, or is it something more broad than that? I would think it would deform the bullet more from the increasing pitch, but apparently that doesn't make much difference in the results.

 

[Hink]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

The official answer, straight from Bartlein, is that it depends.

Bartlein explaination of gain twist barrels

 

[427Cobra]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

I'll be shooting a 260 next year with a Bartlein tube attached to a Surgeon Action.

I have seen some amazing FPS out of F-TR .308 with gain twist Bartleins, 175smk going 2900+, but theres always a trade off.

 

[A10XRIFLE]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: hink</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The official answer, straight from Bartlein, is that it depends.

Bartlein explaination of gain twist barrels</div></div>

Thats a genral decription, there is more current theroy on why its working so well. Lou Murtica and Tony Boyer have done a ton of shooting on these barrels and have shared their knoledge with Trace and Frank.

Load tuning is not much of a factor with the T style. Again becouse the bullet is being driven into the driving side of the lands the entire length of the barrel.

 

[Frank Green]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Sorry but this is gonna be kinda long!

Gain twist barrels have been around for nearly ever. They kinda died away when jacketed bullets came about. Harry Pope (Pope rifle barrels) is probably the best known maker of gain twist barrels. There have been others and I'm not intentionally leaving anyone out. Pope died in 1910 I think it was. Back in his day one of the main types of shooting matches where the German Schutzen fest matches. Guys used guns like the Winchester HI Wall, Ballards, Hepburns, Stevens 44's etc..., the German rifles and others. Nearly all of Popes barrels where gain twist (left hand to boot also). They still where shooting lead bullets and most guys even though they had cartridge guns still muzzle loaded the bullet with false muzzles.
The advantages listed back then where these. 1.) The twist being less at the breech gives less friction to the bullet, it therefore starts easier and quicker, giving the powder less time to burn on in front of the chamber, which therefore fouls less than in a barrel of uniform twist at the same necessary muzzle twist/pitch.
2.) The slight change in angle of rifling in connection with choke boring effectually shuts off any escape of gas and prevents gas cutting, which is another cause of imperfect delivery.
3.) It holds a muzzle loaded bullet in position much better than a uniform/straight twist barrel.

The above is quoted from the manual of Stevens-Popes barrls literature and remember they are referring to lead bullets.

Now lets fast forward a bunch of years. There are differences in shooting lead bullets vs. jacketed bullets. I'm not claiming I or let alone anyone else I can think of knows all the real answers but I will share some observations.

The gain twist type rifling will what we call will give a mechanical choke on the bullet just like with lead bullets. A lot of bench shooters always ask for the bores of the barrels to be lapped with choke in them (this is another subject). Some comments made to us about the gain twist is that is seems to give a broader tune window (i.e. different bullets and different powders and or charge weights) the barrels seem to be more forgiving. One of the first gain twist barrels that went to Lou Murdica (2 light gun barrels and a rail gun barrel). He put a 100 rounds thru the rail gun barrel at the range one day. I asked him what it averaged. He said lets put it this way. I shot 5 different bullet makers bullets both flat base and boattails. The worst group was a .120 at 100 yards.

Now with this being said I will say what I've said for years as to why single point cut rifled barrels are better than button rifled barrels.

Button rifling does not always produce a uniform twist. The twist is built into the button. If during the rifling process the button hits a hard spot in the material or soft spot the button will slow down. It could even speed back up to what it was suppose to be doing the original twist at. The down side here is a non-uniform twist or a twist that slows down thru out the length of the barrel. If you are shooting bullets in a certain twist barrel that is on the edge of stabilizing the bullets this will cause accuracy problems.

Some button rifle makers are trying to help guide the rotation of the button during rifling.

I will also say the button rifled barrels can make a good barrel and have set there share of records over the years and have more than proving themselves but for years after World War 2 there where not really anyone doing cut rifling it kinda died away until guys like Obermeyer and Krieger put it back on the map also. Button rifled barrels are not as consistent from one to the next in terms of how uniform the rifling is like in a cut rifled barrel.

One benchrest shooter and machinist made a machine that he could check the twist rates and uniformity with. Another guy has access to a machine that can do the same thing (machine wasn't designed for this but does it very well). Both guys have giving/shared inspection data with me. The first guy (in his 70's now) has checked a lot of barrels in his time (and just last year was in the lead for shooter of the year in one of the state's for short range benchrest). What he has noticed that in checking the so called hummer barrels that shot really well they all had either a uniform twist or had a slight gain to them.
The barrels that didn't shoot well didn't have a uniform twist or had a negative twist to them.

Are gain twist barrels flat out better than a straight twist barrel. Off hand I don't think so but I can also say for the most part they are showing a lot of promise. There is no loss in velocity as some have said would happen and they have giving up nothing in accuracy at all with jacket type bullets. If anything they might make the barrels more consistent from one to the next.

Another disadvantage of button barrels is bore uniformity in terms of size and the stress the button rifling induces into the barrel steel.

How did we start making gain twist barrels. The cast lead bullet shooters shooting the lead bullets asked us to make them. Then the guys shooting the solid copper style jacket bullets with driving bands on them some how where told they need a gain twist barrels.

The first two guys shooting conventional jacketed bullets in a gain twist barrel from us was the famed benchrest shooter Tony Boyer and the other I mentioned earlier was Lou. What Tony said to us was he had a button rifled barrel that as close as they could check it the twist went from 15 to 14.25. So they flipped the blank around so the twist ended faster at the muzzle. He said it was one of the best shooting barrels he has ever had but until us no one could make him another one with that twist rate. That was last year and the rest is history.

Also another famous gun maker who builds mostly Palma rifles and F-Class guns started using some button barrels because he wasn't happy with one of the cut rifled barrel makers and service he had been getting. He knew about the twist uniformity problems with button barrels. So he checked all the first ones he started getting from a button rifle maker. He got a batch of four or six 6mm suppose to be 1-8 twist barrels. The twist in this batch of barrels where running as slow as 8.5 to 8.75. None of the barrels would shoot the 107gr. weight type bullets. Since he was a customer that I knew before and when he found out we where up and running has been buying from us since and not using button barrels anymore.

What twist rates are best? Just not enough data. The twist still has to be fast enough to stabilize the bullet you are shooting. That is where you have to start.

We have one customer shooting a 30BR for score shooting. He ordered a couple barrels late last year and shot one for the first time in a bench match earlier this year. He ordered a .30cal. barrel and the twist started at 28 and ended at 19. I told him I had no idea how it would work. He insisted we make it and charge his c.c. So we did. The first match he went to the shooting was being done at 100-300 yards the smallest group he shot was somthing like a .150 and the largest was a flat .500. He won the match. So what do you say? He has more on order.

Guys have shot the gain twist barrels in F-Class, Palma, Benchrest etc...

Cut rifled barrels are winning more matches and setting more records than button rifled barrels currently are and have been for a while.

Later for now!
Frank
Bartlein Barrels

 

[mdesign]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Thanks Frank, you are forgiven for the length

I have both buttoned and cut barrels and they all shoot well but this gain twist concept is interesting. I thought Tony was shooting a T-style but was not sure on the others.

 

[Graham]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

What gain-twist appears to be working for the F class guys shooting .284 180 VLD's at 1000?

 

[Alan Warner]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Also another famous gun maker who builds mostly Palma rifles and F-Class guns started using some button barrels because he wasn't happy with one of the cut rifled barrel makers and service he had been getting. He knew about the twist uniformity problems with button barrels. So he checked all the first ones he started getting from a button rifle maker. He got a batch of four or six 6mm suppose to be 1-8 twist barrels. The twist in this batch of barrels where running as slow as 8.5 to 8.75. None of the barrels would shoot the 107gr. weight type bullets. Since he was a customer that I knew before and when he found out we where up and running has been buying from us since and not using button barrels anymore.


Frank:
If you ever dissapear from the face of the earth again for any lengh of time like before, all of "us guys" who build for all of those guys will hunt you down and lock you in a damn closet!!

Every rifle smith and their customers owe a large part of our success to the barrel makers of this world. Don't ever forget that!

Alan

 

[Frank Green]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

What appears to be working? We've only done a handful of 7mm's in GT for guys. What we have done off the tip of my head that I remember is:

9.75 at the breech and ending at 9 at the muzzle

and

9.688 at the breech and ending at 8.75 at the muzzle

Both have shot great. One of the guys shooting the 9.75 to 9 twist barrels was here last week. He stopped on his way to Butner, NC for this years F-Class Champs. One thing he told me that I found interesting was the GT barrel vs. his 9 twist button barrel was faster velocity wise and no pressure signs with the same ammo in both barrels and both barrels where chambered with the same reamer. The button barrel had hard bolt lifts (double clicking etc..) This guy by the way is one of the top shooters from the U.K.

Why? I don't know. Does the GT help the pressure curve/spike? I wouldn't think so. I think the pressure has nothing to do with twist but more do do with the surface area of the bore. You tighten up the groove or bore dimensions and this will raise pressure. I don't know and didn't ask what the bore sizes supposedly where on the button barrel.

I feel this another indication as to what Lou told me. It gave him a broader tune window.

Keep in mind again guys that people shooting these types of barrels from us with conventional jacket bullets has only been a year now. We don't have 3 or 4 or 5 years of data to go off of.

I forgot in my previous post about the Tactical guys shooting cut rifled barrels and winning matches as well.

George from GAP shot a 6mm GT barrel earlier this year at a Sniper Match in CA and he said the thing just shot very well for him at a 1000. Maybe George can recap a little for everyone here what he shot for ammo (I think it was his new Crusader round), groups/scores etc....I believe that barrel was a 9 to 8 twist or a 8.75 to 8 I don't recall.

Also I have to say Thanks to ALAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Later, Frank

 

[Jester8]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

I have a Bartlein on my 22-250, and it is a laser. Very minimal fouling...I am glad that I went with Bartlein, definitely worth the wait.

 

[Pete Lincoln]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Frank, I'm always open for a new mousetrap.
will you guys export to Germany ?
will you garantie that there will be no differenciation between US and Export customers when it comes to quality,consistency and delivery time?
will you garantie that blanks ready for an export customer wont be taken to fill a more local customers order placing the export customer back on the wait list?
will you garantie that barrels that dont quite make the grade as top grade select wont be palmed of to export customers?
Will you send me a trade pricelist?
I'd like to have a try of some of you barrels.

Ive yet to find a barrel that is as consistently accurate as the barrels i get from Lothar Walther cut or buttoned. The customer service is excellent and i dont have to worry.
The last barrels i got from the US where shit. I wont name the manufacturer but i got screwed around on delivery, and when the barrels arrived they where as rough as a butchers bulldog licking piss of a nettle..
I think it was a case of, we've some 2nds, lets fob them off on an export customer.
Needless to say, i'm once bitten twice shy.
Ive just got some Trueflight in from NZ. they look good, machine well. The proof of the pudding will be in teh shooting so we'll see.
If your barrels are winning matches, you can bet the guys over here will read about it and want to try some barrels out,. so i might as well get the wheels in motion.
This is a seriouse enquiry, Kindest Regards Pete Lincoln.

 

[Graham]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Thanks for the detailed replies Alan and Frank, and for the benefit of your experiences.

I'm still a bit 'old school', meaning I learned much of this stuff in the 80's, so I have used Mclellan barrels for a while now. I hear that he's been doing cut rifled recently, but I still have an old button barrel on my ELR .300WM that shoots bugholes at 300, and you almost can't tell that it's not cut rifled. I've found no problems stabilizing the heavies in cold temps with his barrel, but I admit that I never measured the actual twist to see whether it is a 'real' 1 in 10.

I have two Bartleins now, a fast 10 and a slower 11, both on tactical .308 GAP builds, and I can't think of a bad thing to say about them. The first one stopped fouling itself after four shots; the second took twenty, but both just plain shoot. I also noticed slight velocity gains at about the 300-round mark, and I'm not sure why.

I'm planning a .284 Win build, Bartlein again, for 180 VLD's at no more than 2850-2900fps, and that's why I'm asking about gain-twist. Is there any advantage to starting slower than 9 and ending faster than 9?

Again, common sense tells me that the bullet doesn't know at what rate it's being accelerated, only the rate at which it leaves the tube (and maybe not even that

).

 

[psinclair]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Four of my rifles have Bartlein tubes on them, they are all tack drivers...doesnt hurt that they came out of Georges shop either!

This GT has got me thinking...its always something isnt it?!....grin!

BTW, I run 5R rifling and love it!

 

[nesikabay]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

I should know in a couple of weeks. We have a couple of 284s and a couple of 284 improve on the way <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Graham</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What gain-twist appears to be working for the F class guys shooting .284 180 VLD's at 1000? </div></div>

 

[Frank Green]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Pete, Yes we will export. You will have to fill out a DSP-83 forms to get state dept. approval and there is a yearly fee for this.

We don't make any barrels different from one person to the next. Gary and Des who where the 1st and 2nd place finishers as individuals at Bisley for the World F-Class Championships both had our barrels on they're guns. Des bought his barrel last year while he was here for the U.S. F-Class Champs and Gary had his gun built by Warner Tools. The barrels where made at different times and again we didn't make one better than the other etc.....

More time for overseas orders. Yes it can happen and no it can't happen. If you place an order at one time for several different types of barrels caliber wise and you want them to ship all at one time than yes it can take longer. Not all calibers run the same time wise etc.....Also we are currently quoting 6 months for barrels.

We also don't ship a lesser grade barrel to someone else in a different country. Look at the results of the World Benchrest Championships held in South Africa about two months ago. One of the U.S. teams lead everyday and going into the last day where in 1st place. One of the Australian teams beat the U.S. for the gold. 3 or 4 of the Aussie's (4 man team) had our barrls on they're guns. If we where shipping a lesser quality barrel to overseas shooters I don't think the Aussie's would've beat the U.S. team.

Email us directly at work and we will give any other information that you need.

Later, Frank
Bartlein Barrels

 

[Frank Green]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Graham, Off hand I cannot say they are flat out better or have an advantage. We've only been making them for about a year now for guys shooting conventional jacket bullets.

I will be putting a 7mm F-Class rifle together over the winter as is one of the guys in the shop. As of right now my mind isn't made up. I would go with a straight 1-9 twist. If I'm gonna run a GT barrel I would do something like a 9.5 to 8.9 twist. Not a lot of gain just something so it is putting a fresh bite on the bullet as it does down the length of the barrel.

I'm gonna put on a 32" finish. One guy in the shop is building a .284 Win. and I'm gonna do that or a 7 short mag.

Is there a better choice? I will keep watching what is working and make my mind up as my components (stock, action etc...) arrive.

Later, Frank
Bartlein Barrels

 

[spot69221]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Frank, what would you say about barrel life? I have had much conjecture with the barrel life being shorter in a cut rifled barrel (or GT cut rifle).

By the way you need to make MORE barrels!

 

[Pete Lincoln]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Thank you Frank for that reply. I will contact you directly and we will see about putting some of your barrels to the test then.
We are currently changing the emphasis or direction of our business from 100% one off custom manufacture to 80% custom series production and could incorporate your barrels into this.
Like I said, ive an open mind and am always willing to try.
Best Regards Pete

 

[desertHK]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Getting a Bartlein on my 300WM from GAP. I knew it would be a shooter but nice to see this. </div></div>

Got mine back already. It is definitely a shooter for sure. First time in my life I have difficulty picking the best load, just because they are so many good groupings.

 

[Frank Green]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Actually in our experience barrel life on average is longer in a cut rifled barrel. We attribute this to when the button rifled barrels are made during button rifling the button work hardens the bore.

This is just us making it up. This based on information from ammunition makers using test barrels and keep much better data than the average shooter, long time shooters who are consistently at the top of there game and have done it for years upon years and other barrel makers like when we worked at Krieger and in conversations with Obermeyer etc....if I recall correctly Obermeyer said years ago his steel and Harts steel even when they came out of the same lot they had compared information and found that Obermeyer's barrels on average where lasting longer.

Also when we we're at Krieger we made two barrels out of the same lot of steel. A Krieger cut rifled one and a button barrel made out of Kriegers Criterion division. Both shot great but the button barrel at the same round counts showed twice as much wear in the throat area.

There would be no difference between a straight twist or a gain twist barrel as far as barrel life goes there.

Later, Frank
Bartlein Barrels

 

[Frank Green]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Pete, The website email address at work is [email protected]

Later, Frank

 

[Pete Lincoln]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Ive noticed 20-30% longer barrel life with the LW50 stainless barrels over the 416 barrels.
I put it down to the fact that the LW steel is hard as nails.

any of you guys noticed anything similar?

Frank, email sent
regards Pete

 

[psinclair]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

I agree. I ran 2 different LW barrels on a Sako .220 swift ackley. My smith said they were as hard as flint. They were CM not SS. They shot good but always carried a lot of copper and after 50 rounds or so groups got big and it was a bearcat to clean. I use Bartlein,Krieger and Rock barrels now.

 

[Pete Lincoln]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

PGS.
Yes both the SS and CM barrels are hard as nails.

Unless specified on ordering (or before completion) the LW barrels do not come lapped. they call it special treatment for match something or other ( sonder behandlung für der erzihlung match treffer bilder) anyhow trust the Germany to use 8 words where 1 would do. What they mean is lapping.

I only use lapped LW barrels in precision rifles, but occasionaly re barrel a brush gun for a hunter or two, these guys carry thier rifles through thickets whilst beating on driven boar hunts, hardly ever clean the damn things and ranges are point bkank to max 50m. They dont ever want to pay the little extra for lapping,, and ive noticed that the barrels foul noticably more, which is just common sence.
Anyhow. back to Bartlein barrels.
I'm looking forward to trying..
Pete

 

[Frank Green]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

That's interesting? According to one of the top ammo makers in Europe that we make they're test barrels for, I asked him why does he buy barrels from the States. Back when I was at Krieger and now here at Bartlein. One he said he was very happy with the barrels and accuracy he was getting out of our shop. I said to him that there are a couple of decent barrel makers over in Europe why not get them there and save on the shipping etc...he responded back that the Steel quality over there wasn't good and the barrels didn't last a long time. He also told me that in all the years he has been with the company all of the test barrels they bought even when they where buying barrels from the old Schultz and Larsen Company that made the Model 54 thru 68 S&L rifles (which where cut rifled barrels) he said the cut rifled barrels lasted longer than the button.

I will read your email today in our website and respond back.

Later, Frank
Bartlein Barrels

 

[psinclair]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Pete,

That makes perfect sense...I know a lot of guys that run LW barrels and really like them. I'll bet I had the unlapped version in the two I had. We ordered them from Brownell's and I remember the price being a lot lower than the other premium barrels availible thruogh Brownell's at the time.....guess I should have researched it a little more...thanks for passing that on,

Pat

 

[nesikabay]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

I agree LW barrels are hard. BUT NOT A SINGLE LW BARREL Placed in the world championship F/CLASS matches. Or in the Benchrest matches. Hell they didnt even use them at the Nationals. A hard barrel wont win a great or good barrel will. <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pete Lincoln</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ive noticed 20-30% longer barrel life with the LW50 stainless barrels over the 416 barrels.
I put it down to the fact that the LW steel is hard as nails.

any of you guys noticed anything similar?

Frank, email sent
regards Pete </div></div>

 

[Downzero]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 300sniper</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DebosDave ©</div><div class="ubbcode-body">George, word like this is just going to make the wait longer LOL..

Awesome results, very tough to argue with that!

Dave </div></div>

i think it is good that it may make the wait shorter than normal if you choose another brand that will suit most of us just fine

edit: but i am about to chamber my first bartlein so i expect to be winning benchrest matches real soon

</div></div>

Do they steer bullets to the target, too?

 

[pavementends]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Frank,
Have you got enough data to tell what difference barrel length makes? I would think that the rate of gain would be much quicker on a 20" as opposed to a 28". This is of course assuming the same starting twist and ending twist.
Thanks
Kent

 

[Frank Green]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Hey Kent! If you want the starting and ending twist to be the same (GT)in a shorter length barrel then you are correct that the rate of gain will be much more.

The only thing barrel length really effects is velocity. The longer barrel (to an extent) will burn the powder more so you get more velocity out of it vs. the shorter length barrel (cartridge/chamber effects has a lot of effect on this also). A shorter/longer barrel is has more of an effect on a 7mm mag. vs. a guy shooting a 7mm-08 etc.....do you follow me?

If you are running a barrel that starts out at a 14 twist and ends at 7 twist that is a gain of 7 (or 2-1). Now in a 30" long barrel that comes out to .233 per inch gain starting at the breech. Now if you cut that barrel down to 20" and you want the same starting and ending twist to be the same now your gain is running at .350 per inch gain. Make sense?

Later, Frank

 

[pavementends]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Thanks Frank,
I guess it will take more data to establish optimal "
rate of gain"
thanks again
Kent

 

[bigwheeler]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Amazing! Winning matches in the 1's. That kind of shooting was shrouded in mystery only 20 years ago. Congrats.

 

[Grand]

Re: Bartlein Barrels, Proof is in the results!!

Frank: Thanks for the input.