Beginner - Ideal Handloading Setup, Process, and Bullet-specific plan?

[richthe1]

I have this post split into a few parts. 1: Equipment, 2: Process, 3: Bullet-specific loading questions.

I’ve done a lot of research online, but have never reloaded before.

Part 1: Equipment
I am considering going this route for reloading. What do I have on this list I should take off/substitute? Anything I should add?
(For example, I have the rock chucker on the list so I have the option of using the 1 1/4 threads for the Area 419 M Series die. Maybe I should just use the SAC die and go the Co-Ax for a press instead?). Can I skip annealing? The arbor press seems nice (I wouldn’t ever need to take the die out of the rock chucker, either - but not sure if it’s worth it). Any point in a concentricity gauge?

Reloading
Press	RCBS Rock Chucker Supreme	$200.00
Calipers	Mitutoyo 500-196-30	$121.00
Comparater - Bullet	Hornady Lock-N-Load Bullet Comparator Basic Set 7 Inserts	$33.00
Comparater - Head Space	Hornady Lock-N-Load Headspace Gauge 5 Bushing Set with Comparator	$43.00
Case Gauge	LE Wilson Case Length Headspace Gauge	$40.00
Go/No Go Gauges	Forster Gauge Set	$80.00
De-Priming	N/A (on sizing die)	-
Case Cleaning	Frankford Arsenal Case Tumbler Kit	$93.39
Case Prep	N/A	-
Annealer	N/A	-
Case Lube	Hornady One Shot	$16.99
Sizing Dies	SAC Modular OR A419 M	$500.00
Case Trimming	Giraud	$555.00
Primer Seating	Frankford Arsenal Hand Primer	$75.00
Powder Dispensing	AutoTrickler V4 + A&D FX-300IN Combo	$1,050.00
Funnel	A419 Master Funnel Kit	$75.00
Bullet Seating	K&M Arbor Press Standard Force Pack Full Kit RH	$320.00
Seating Die	L.E. Wilson Micrometer Seater Die (do I need a specific VLD seating stem?)	$120.00
Concentricity Gauge	Sinclair w/ Digital Indicator	$130.00
Reloading Trays (6)		$60.00
Bullet Puller	Hornady Cam Lock	$35.00
	TOTAL	$3,547.38

Part 2: Reloading Process
What I like about the idea of this process is I never have to change the die on the RC. Am I missing any steps?

Step 1: Dry Tumble with polish for 1hr. Sift Brass

Step 2: Anneal (I will skip this step for budget reasons)

Step 3: Lube brass with one-shot.

Step 4: Deprime/Resize/Neck Tension in one step (SAC or Area 419 M Series)

Step 5: Ensure shoulder is bumped 0.002" and neck tesion is 0.002"

Step 6: Trim, Chamfer, and Deburr

Step 7: To remove lube, Dry Tumble with polish for 1hr. Sift Brass

Step 8: Seat Primers with Hand Primer

Step 9: Dispense and Load Powder

Step 10: Seat “X” amount (bullet dependent) off the lands with Arbor Press. Probably will start at 0.015” and move by 0.015” increments.

Part 3: Bullet Specific Factors

Bullet:	Berger 156 EOL
Powder:	H4350, 40.3
Velocity:	2550
Twist:	7.5
RPM:	244800
Berger SG	1.59

Should I use LRP or SRP brass? And does it matter if my rifle has a LFP or SFP? Currently have a SFP, but have been considering a Barrett MRAD which is only LFP.

I’ve heard the 156 is pretty long and to fit them in a mag I’d have to consume most of the internal volume with bullet instead of powder. I have also read some powders (I think N555) would require a compressed load. I also want to avoid high pressures. I to make sure I don’t pierce any primers.

I guess I’m wondering is if I should just use a normal 140gr bullet and a 1:8 twist barrel. I might be trying to bite off more than I can chew with using the 156gr.

I do not have a barrel ordered yet.


Thanks in advance for your insight!

 

[Devildog]

I don’t have time to comment on all the above but I’ll throw this at you. I’d suggest ugly reloading comparator kit over the Hornady, there very well done.

HEADSPACE AND BULLET COMPARATOR SET – Ugly Reloading USA

 

[Evintos]

Equipment
- Change the Hornady comparators (headspace and bullet) to Ugly Reloading Comparator Set, saves you some money and in opinion, the Ugly Reloading set is a better set (I own both).
- LE Wilson case length gauge is unnecessary, use your calipers and comparator set.
- You can skip annealing and experiment later as your budget allows
- SAC and A419 dies are nice kit and unnecessary but if you want to spend the money, go for it. Forster, RCBS, Redding, they all work (I do like my SAC modular sizing dies though, I think the bushing design that incorporates the shoulder to be a better design compared to other neck bushing dies).
- A419 funnel kit, get the drop tube but in general there are cheaper funnel kits.
- Wilson seating die - it depends on the bullet nose profile whether or not you'd want the VLD seating stem, it's cheap, just add one.
- Henderson > Giraud trimmer.
- Concentricity gauge (runout gauge), the only practical reason to use one is to check to make sure your reloading process and equipment is set up properly. Example, load a few rounds with high quality components and check the first couple, runout +/- 0.001" (for example), then you check cartridge #50 to #52 and all of a sudden it's +/- 0.005", something in your process went wrong. Could be seating stem, could be dies not locked down, press linkage bolt got loose, etc.

Process
Your process looks fine although you don't have to dry tumble that long to remove lube. Set up the bullet seating to be mag length minus a few thou if you're mag feeding as a starting point unless your chamber is the limiting factor for your OAL. You can play with seating depth if you want to but tangent ogive and hybrid ogive bullets are pretty insensitive to depth. Secant ogive bullets are more sensitive though (personal experience).

Specific factors
Large firing pin on small rifle primers doesn't matter in most use cases. Benchrest guys might say otherwise, I defer to them on that. SRP is cheaper. You can get Gordon's Reloading Tool to play around with simulations on powder/barrel/bullet combos and potential pressure. Pick up a load manual, they're cheap.

 

[FLIGHT762]

I will also suggest the Ugly comparator set. It looks to be out of stock @ Ugly reloading, but It's in stock on amazon for $46.00.

I tried to link it here but, the link wouldn't work.


I bought mine from carl @ Ugly reloading a few weeks ago when it was in stock. This set is much better than the Hornady set, which I have. This set comes with both Headspace comparators and the bullet comparators. Machined way better than the Hornady set and cheaper.

 

[richthe1]

Equipment
- Change the Hornady comparators (headspace and bullet) to Ugly Reloading Comparator Set, saves you some money and in opinion, the Ugly Reloading set is a better set (I own both).
- LE Wilson case length gauge is unnecessary, use your calipers and comparator set.
- You can skip annealing and experiment later as your budget allows
- SAC and A419 dies are nice kit and unnecessary but if you want to spend the money, go for it. Forster, RCBS, Redding, they all work (I do like my SAC modular sizing dies though, I think the bushing design that incorporates the shoulder to be a better design compared to other neck bushing dies).
- A419 funnel kit, get the drop tube but in general there are cheaper funnel kits.
- Wilson seating die - it depends on the bullet nose profile whether or not you'd want the VLD seating stem, it's cheap, just add one.
- Henderson > Giraud trimmer.
- Concentricity gauge (runout gauge), the only practical reason to use one is to check to make sure your reloading process and equipment is set up properly. Example, load a few rounds with high quality components and check the first couple, runout +/- 0.001" (for example), then you check cartridge #50 to #52 and all of a sudden it's +/- 0.005", something in your process went wrong. Could be seating stem, could be dies not locked down, press linkage bolt got loose, etc.

Process
Your process looks fine although you don't have to dry tumble that long to remove lube. Set up the bullet seating to be mag length minus a few thou if you're mag feeding as a starting point unless your chamber is the limiting factor for your OAL. You can play with seating depth if you want to but tangent ogive and hybrid ogive bullets are pretty insensitive to depth. Secant ogive bullets are more sensitive though (personal experience).

Specific factors
Large firing pin on small rifle primers doesn't matter in most use cases. Benchrest guys might say otherwise, I defer to them on that. SRP is cheaper. You can get Gordon's Reloading Tool to play around with simulations on powder/barrel/bullet combos and potential pressure. Pick up a load manual, they're cheap.

Thanks for the advice. So far, everyone has recommended the Ugly Reloading Comparator Set, so I went ahead and ordered that!

I’ll remove the Case Length Gauge from the list and skip annealing for now.

Any other advice on the SAC vs A419 dies? I’m probably going to go with one of those, just because it can decap, resize, and mandrel all on one go.

Already have the A419 funnel kit (4/19 sale) so I’ll add the drop tube.

Noted on seating die and trimmer (I’ll have to research on Henderson vs. Giraud).

I don’t know if the mag or chamber is limiting, so I’ll have to look into that too. Can I order a barrel specific to that bullet? Running AW mags. Lots to learn!

Hadn’t heard of Gordan’s Reloading Tool - thanks for the tip!

 

[Evintos]

Any other advice on the SAC vs A419 dies? I’m probably going to go with one of those, just because it can decap, resize, and mandrel all on one go.

I don’t know if the mag or chamber is limiting, so I’ll have to look into that too. Can I order a barrel specific to that bullet? Running AW mags. Lots to learn!

A419 dies comes with a .002 mandrel but for the SAC Modular Sizing die, if you want a specific mandrel diameter for the SAC, it's a separate purchase.

The SAC Modular Sizing die neck/shoulder bushing should also be chosen in appropriate diameter if you want to minimally work your brass and that requires knowing total loaded neck diameter or knowing neck wall thickness. If you don't have a loaded cartridge to measure and only have brass, you'd have to measure the neck wall thickness with a tube micrometer. Calipers are not a good tool for neck wall thickness measurements.

With bushing dies and mandrels, there's all sorts of combinations you can play with so it can add up if you're buying a bunch of bushings and mandrels but eventually you'll just settle on a single combo, so it's up to you whether or not you want to spend money and experiment.

A good starting point is select the neck/shoulder bushing diameter that is a 0.003" to 0.004" under loaded neck diameter. This would account for some brass spring back. Example - your loaded neck diameter is .292" (.264 bullet diameter + 2x neck wall thickness of 0.014" = .292), select something like a 289 or 288 bushing + 262 mandrel. Some 6.5 creedmoor brass have neck walls thinner or thicker than 0.014" so be aware that if it's thinner, a 288 bushing might be enough constriction. You might want a 287 or a 286 bushing with the 262 mandrel.

A good gunsmith can chamber a barrel for your specific setup, but you'd typically you need to send in a few dummy cartridges for them to use as reference, that way they know what your seating depth and other parameters are.

 

[XikoPlavi]

I learned NOT to skip anneal process and I would use the rock chucker just as a bullet puller dedicated or dedicated deprimer. For me the turret press zero/amp/sac dies worked good. Basically you don’t need to get area or sac dies for a chucker if you’re sticking with that. Plus the more expensive calipers helped with sacs comparison guage. I make a slightly different process for virgin fireforming VS already formed.

The primal rights primer helped me alot.
The henderson trimmer is the best of them all (but yeah expensive).

It all adds up and you sure can do it all on a chucker but id skip the sac or area dies for that (just me).

Id spend more on the calipers.

I always used the trickler and manually remove or add grains (im not making money off of it so I take my time).

I sure do get consistent SDs and groups when i focused primer pocket consistency and primer seating.

Finding vv555 in 8 pound jugs is still hard to come by I think. Same with re15.5.

You didn’t mention what caliber did you? Your bullet suggest 6.5 something prc?

 

[richthe1]

A419 dies comes with a .002 mandrel but for the SAC Modular Sizing die, if you want a specific mandrel diameter for the SAC, it's a separate purchase.

The SAC Modular Sizing die neck/shoulder bushing should also be chosen in appropriate diameter if you want to minimally work your brass and that requires knowing total loaded neck diameter or knowing neck wall thickness. If you don't have a loaded cartridge to measure and only have brass, you'd have to measure the neck wall thickness with a tube micrometer. Calipers are not a good tool for neck wall thickness measurements.

With bushing dies and mandrels, there's all sorts of combinations you can play with so it can add up if you're buying a bunch of bushings and mandrels but eventually you'll just settle on a single combo, so it's up to you whether or not you want to spend money and experiment.

A good starting point is select the neck/shoulder bushing diameter that is a 0.003" to 0.004" under loaded neck diameter. This would account for some brass spring back. Example - your loaded neck diameter is .292" (.264 bullet diameter + 2x neck wall thickness of 0.014" = .292), select something like a 289 or 288 bushing + 262 mandrel. Some 6.5 creedmoor brass have neck walls thinner or thicker than 0.014" so be aware that if it's thinner, a 288 bushing might be enough constriction. You might want a 287 or a 286 bushing with the 262 mandrel.

A good gunsmith can chamber a barrel for your specific setup, but you'd typically you need to send in a few dummy cartridges for them to use as reference, that way they know what your seating depth and other parameters are.

Thanks, that’s really helpful - especially your example. I’ll probably get alpha brass, so I could probably reach out to them and get the neck wall thickness and find out what bushing/mandrel pairing based off of that.

Thanks for the gunsmithing tip, too.

 

[richthe1]

I learned NOT to skip anneal process and I would use the rock chucker just as a bullet puller dedicated or dedicated deprimer. For me the turret press zero/amp/sac dies worked good. Basically you don’t need to get area or sac dies for a chucker if you’re sticking with that. Plus the more expensive calipers helped with sacs comparison guage. I make a slightly different process for virgin fireforming VS already formed.

The primal rights primer helped me alot.
The henderson trimmer is the best of them all (but yeah expensive).

It all adds up and you sure can do it all on a chucker but id skip the sac or area dies for that (just me).

Id spend more on the calipers.

I always used the trickler and manually remove or add grains (im not making money off of it so I take my time).

I sure do get consistent SDs and groups when i focused primer pocket consistency and primer seating.

Finding vv555 in 8 pound jugs is still hard to come by I think. Same with re15.5.

You didn’t mention what caliber did you? Your bullet suggest 6.5 something prc?

I’d like to anneal, but the AMP MK II is a little out of my price range right now.

Can you link the calipers you’d recommend?

I stumbled across the ugly reloading primer - looks like a similar concept and more within my budget. Any thoughts on that? https://www.uglyreloadingusa.com/product/pcps-storage-box-price-includes-pcps-tool/

I’m planning on 6.5CM, actually. I’d like to use it for PRS, NRL Hunter, and hunting. I’d prefer to run one caliber for all (6.5CM), as opposed to multiple calibers (6 dasher for PRS, 6.5 PRC for NRL and hunting). This article from Andy Slade got me thinking along those lines:
https://precisionrifleblog.com/2023/12/03/andy-slade-wins-30000-at-2023-ag-cup/
But doing all this research has given me some pause.

 

[XikoPlavi]

I have a CD-8” AXWW mitutoyo

 

[Devildog]

I’d also get a mandrel for setting your neck tension.

https://21stcenturyinnovation.com/buy-online/ols/products/black-nitride-turning-arbor

You'll need and expander die body as well.

https://21stcenturyinnovation.com/buy-online/ols/products/expander-die-body/v/903-GX

FYI Henderson trimmer for the win!

 

[Reformedcitykid]

It seems you’re not averse to spending money for quality, so go for the Ugly PCPS primer over the Frankford Arsenal hand primer. It’s fast, adjustable, precise, and makes priming a breeze. Your hands and sanity will thank you over any sort of priming session of more than a few rounds.

It’s relatively new but pretty universally has glowing recommendations. Search this site and others for user reviews. One of my favorite reloading purchases, can’t recommend it enough!