Bergara Not Popping CCI 250s

[diggler1833]

Maybe somebody has some insight as to why I'm having issues getting CCI 250s to ignite in my relatively new rifle. I do have many years of reloading experience...but that doesn't mean I'm exempt from screwing something up.

Fortunately I've had zero issues with Fed 215s so far, but I had to swap a buddy some bullets for them. It is my temporary "fix" to the problem as I only have a few hundred, but I wonder if I am missing something.

Rifle is a new Bergara Premier Approach in 7mm RM. This is the older model with detachable mag. It shoots in the .5 - .7 MOA range with both bullets and powders I've tried, so accuracy is fine.

My biggest issue is that I'm having about a 25 percent failure rate to ignite CCI 250 primers. I'll list the circumstances so those with more experience than I, can sift through and maybe be able to tell me where I'm off.

- Primers are stored in cool, dry place in my house. I reload for more than a dozen rifles out of this location, and this is the only cartridge/gun that has given me problems.
- Two powders have been tested with similar results. Powder storage is similar to primer storage.
- Primer seating depth is a couple thousandths below flush, mildly firm, but not crushed into the case. I've used two hand priming tools with the same results, but my original RCBS does require some play to get them to seat properly (and why I moved to another).
- Upon disassembly, there was a lot of grease in the firing pin channel with the look and consistency of anti-seize. That was completely removed and the channel/firing pin hole cleaned. I did not re-grease or fill it with oil.
- Firing pin protrusion is .047". If I suspect anything at this point, here is where it is. There is no damage to the pin.
- Firing pin hole and bolt face appear free from defects.
- I replaced the firing pin spring with a Wolff Remington 700...* They ARE NOT the same*...I had to trim the spring to fit, but it is definitely heavier now than the factory. I still have the factory spring and can switch back at any time. This swap made no difference in failure rate.
- I'm using 1x fired FC brass that I purchased, and I am full length resizing before loading. My FL die is bumping the shoulder .004" from my fired brass through the rifle.
- Using my comparator, I'm seeing about .002 to .006" difference from my fired brass to the various 1x fired pieces I've acquired (before FL sizing).
- I have unfortunately never fired factory ammo through this gun. I know that this does not help my cause with warranty work (if needed).

Have I overlooked anything? Right now my biggest suspicion is that the firing pin is perhaps a bit too short. If I am able to find one I'd definitely swap back to the original spring...but I'm not sure if this will fix anything.

Unrelated, this rifle came to me with a barrel that was off-center in the channel, and would contact the stock with very little pressure. I fixed that with a dowel and sandpaper before bedding the action.

Again though, I've got about 20 hassle free rounds through it now using Federal 215s. I'm familiar with with having to go to a Federal primer in our target revolvers for reliable ignition...but not with a factory unmodified bolt gun.

Any insight is appreciated. I may have missed something along the way here too. Thanks.

 

[ShtrRdy]

Well, CCI's do have a harder cup. But I think I would go for the firing pin protrusion. Seems like I read it should be 0.050" to 0.060"?

Are you using brass that has been fired in that chamber and pushing the shoulder back just a few thousandths? Wondering if headspace could be putting the primer out of reach?

 

[Chief_Rick]

Did you try to recock the rifle and see if it would fire with a second primer strike?

Do you have another rifle you could try the cartridges in that didn't go off?

Could it be a bad batch of primers?

 

[celltech]

Your .047" of protrusion should not be the issue. Anything more than ~.035" is actually going too far and wasting firing pin energy. Most Savage's are set from the factory at ~.055" and we tend to make them .035"-.045".

 

[Evintos]

Do you have a picture of the primer indent?

Couple thousandths (0.002") seating depth might not be enough. Depending on primer pocket depth and primer cup height you might need to seat deeper. Assuming CCI 250 is still 0.118" height, Try 0.003" to 0.005" below flush.

 

[diggler1833]

Well, CCI's do have a harder cup. But I think I would go for the firing pin protrusion. Seems like I read it should be 0.050" to 0.060"?

Are you using brass that has been fired in that chamber and pushing the shoulder back just a few thousandths? Wondering if headspace could be putting the primer out of reach?

Good question. I got my initial comparator measurements from cases that actually did fire in my rifle. I use that against measurements on every other piece of 1x fired brass that I bought. I got a case sent to me in a batch that I ordered that was like .017" too short, and it worried me...so I measure every case now before I full length resize as part of my prep.

I did load five rounds with a .005" shoulder bump after FL resizing, and had no issues with the Fed 215 primers. I also did it at .003" with Feds and CCIs and the CCI 250s had a failure while the 215s were fine.

I thought excess headspace too, and that it might allow for too much shock absorbing...but setting up the FL die to manufacturer specs gives me only a .005 bump from my fired cases.

 

[diggler1833]

Did you try to recock the rifle and see if it would fire with a second primer strike?

Do you have another rifle you could try the cartridges in that didn't go off?

Could it be a bad batch of primers?

On about three of the ~12 misfires I have been able to get ignition on a second strike.

Unfortunately no other rifle to shoot these in. Primer craters look just as good as the fired rounds.

Maybe it is a bad batch of primers? I didn't really find much on that in my interwebs search.

 

[diggler1833]

Do you have a picture of the primer indent?

Couple thousandths (0.002") seating depth might not be enough. Depending on primer pocket depth and primer cup height you might need to seat deeper. Assuming CCI 250 is still 0.118" height, Try 0.003" to 0.005" below flush.

Thanks for the info and graph. I did try seating a few from 'flush to crush' essentially. I did see a larger indent on the primers that were more flush...but ignition issues were similar.

I know flush may result in the primer seating more when it is struck...potentially resulting in misfire, and crush may cause issues with the compound...resulting in the same.

These are a couple of duds from testing primer seating depth. Hopefully the photo works.

 

[ShtrRdy]

Wow, the firing pin hits in that picture sure look good. Are those a double strike?

 

[diggler1833]

Wow, the firing pin hits in that picture sure look good. Are those a double strike?

I think almost all of my failures were struck multiple times.

Here is a CCI 250 that popped on the first try (only one strike):

 

[diggler1833]

Maybe it is just a bad batch of primers? I guess I probably shouldn't blame the rifle yet like a moron. I wish I did have another rifle to put them through.

 

[spife7980]

Get some data on the actual primer depth measurements. Know for sure, this is the first place I would check.
Awesome pics courtesy of primal rights

Depending on the tool your suspected "crush" could just be the tool travel stopping short. I was just encountering that with my old lee primer.

 

[diggler1833]

Get some data on the actual primer depth measurements. Know for sure, this is the first place I would check.
Awesome pics courtesy of primal rights
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Depending on the tool your suspected "crush" could just be the tool travel stopping short. I was just encountering that with my old lee primer.

That's a pretty solid idea to see where I'm at, and I think that I'll use that from now on when I find a load a rifle likes, or just to check pockets from now on.

Maybe I have pockets that are too deep, but this isn't a single batch of brass. I haven't found any relief of misfires though from the various primer seating depths that I've used. Like I said, I've loaded groups with primers from flush all the way down to crush and multiple points in between...and out of every five shot group I've never had all five rounds go bang with CCI 250s. I've shot a total of (20) Fed 215s, and all have popped so far.

Thank you for the images though...it is another tool for sure.