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Re: Big difference in accuracy based on primer bra
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wnroscoe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yes </div></div>
Wow wnroscoe, way to be magnamaus, to answer your question, there is a differance between burn rates on primers. I like the federal bench primers, they seem to be a bit faster. You realy need to chat with chadtrg42, I know he has some big info ok this.
Good luck
Curtis
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wnroscoe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yes </div></div>
Wow wnroscoe, way to be magnamaus, to answer your question, there is a differance between burn rates on primers. I like the federal bench primers, they seem to be a bit faster. You realy need to chat with chadtrg42, I know he has some big info ok this.
Good luck
Curtis
Re: Big difference in accuracy based on primer brand?
Yes and no.
If you have a fully developed recipie, changing the primer is likely to make the recipie shoot worse.
However, if you redevelop the load, ou will likely find that you can achieve another recipie that is every bit as good as the previous one.
That is; a skilled reloader can take practically any powder, any primer, any match grade bullet, and any set of cases and make match grade amunition.
However, the recipie is likely to be different if you change any component--even if you change the lot number on the powder, bullet, or primer.
Yes and no.
If you have a fully developed recipie, changing the primer is likely to make the recipie shoot worse.
However, if you redevelop the load, ou will likely find that you can achieve another recipie that is every bit as good as the previous one.
That is; a skilled reloader can take practically any powder, any primer, any match grade bullet, and any set of cases and make match grade amunition.
However, the recipie is likely to be different if you change any component--even if you change the lot number on the powder, bullet, or primer.
Re: Big difference in accuracy based on primer brand?
How many brands of primers do you have access to at the present time?
If you do not already have a good supply of all those brands then you are not likely to find them all anytime soon.
Pick the brand you have the most of on hand, or the brand that you can get and go from there. All the primers you listed are capable of making accurate ammunition.
How many brands of primers do you have access to at the present time?
If you do not already have a good supply of all those brands then you are not likely to find them all anytime soon.
Pick the brand you have the most of on hand, or the brand that you can get and go from there. All the primers you listed are capable of making accurate ammunition.
Re: Big difference in accuracy based on primer brand?
I have some of all of them on my shelf but I seem to get the lowest ES out of Fed 210M's on my large primer side of things. Several times I have switched from a 215M down to a 210M and watched my ES go to single digit with the same load.
But, with that said it is still about testing.
I have some of all of them on my shelf but I seem to get the lowest ES out of Fed 210M's on my large primer side of things. Several times I have switched from a 215M down to a 210M and watched my ES go to single digit with the same load.
But, with that said it is still about testing.
Re: Big difference in accuracy based on primer brand?
I would disagree that a skilled reloader can take practically any powder, primer or match grade bullet and make match grade ammunition if that is taken to mean all cartridges. Some cartridges are more finicky than others in what powders/primers they shoot well with. The 308 Winchester is felt to be not finicky and yet I've found marked differences in obtainable accuracy with different powders.
Primers can also make a significant difference in accuracy obtainable and which one should be used in a particular case is not always intuitive. For instance, last year there was a Handloader magazine article that compared 308 Winchester accuracy with a multitude of different cases, bullets and primers and the primer that gave the best accuracy even over match primers was the CCI 250 large rifle magnum primer.
In my own shooting, I tried various primers in a 357 Herrett and the CCI 250 primers gave the best accuracy by at least an inch margin at 100 yards over Federal 210M (match) and other primers.
I would disagree that a skilled reloader can take practically any powder, primer or match grade bullet and make match grade ammunition if that is taken to mean all cartridges. Some cartridges are more finicky than others in what powders/primers they shoot well with. The 308 Winchester is felt to be not finicky and yet I've found marked differences in obtainable accuracy with different powders.
Primers can also make a significant difference in accuracy obtainable and which one should be used in a particular case is not always intuitive. For instance, last year there was a Handloader magazine article that compared 308 Winchester accuracy with a multitude of different cases, bullets and primers and the primer that gave the best accuracy even over match primers was the CCI 250 large rifle magnum primer.
In my own shooting, I tried various primers in a 357 Herrett and the CCI 250 primers gave the best accuracy by at least an inch margin at 100 yards over Federal 210M (match) and other primers.
Re: Big difference in accuracy based on primer brand?
Unless you are shooting benchrest, the NOTICEABLE difference various primers may have on a target is most often, unappreciable and insignificant, in my experience. However, they usually deliver velocities that vary among the brands. In loads shown to be good, ascertain primer brand and type and test in your gun. Primer tests have shown a broad spread in pressures and velocities among brands tested. More information can be found in Handloading for Competition, by Glenn Zediker.
Unless you are shooting benchrest, the NOTICEABLE difference various primers may have on a target is most often, unappreciable and insignificant, in my experience. However, they usually deliver velocities that vary among the brands. In loads shown to be good, ascertain primer brand and type and test in your gun. Primer tests have shown a broad spread in pressures and velocities among brands tested. More information can be found in Handloading for Competition, by Glenn Zediker.
Re: Big difference in accuracy based on primer brand?
I answered based my experiences and 1000's of rounds down range in various calibers and numerous primers tested. My reloading practices and test methods are largely based on BR shooting. Groups larger than the mid .2's or scores lower than 197 out of 200 will have you jockying for 2nd place. Most of the suggestions I give are based on that.
<span style="font-weight: bold">You failed to give your caliber of choice so my response was kept short.</span> Share your caliber and we can give you more detailed information.
It seems for me that with the Hogdon Powders of late, the CCI primers are giving the best results. With the IMR powders of past, Federal gave the best results. The WLR & F210M primers run very close to burn rate and given velocities when either is used and most times can be exchanged with each other. Several years ago I performed a velocity and accuracy test using a 7mmRM, 150 grain SGK bullets and H4831. This test was to determine, if only in my mind, if primers really made that big of a difference. The primers tested were the F210M, F215, WLR, WLRM and the Rem 9.5M. The primer that gave the highest velocity also gave the best accuracy, the F210M. This primer beat all others by 50fps and produced .3moa accuracy at 100 yards. The test confirmed what I already knew, primers do and did make a difference. The F210M is the main primer I shot for several years until they became almost extinct. I then switched to the WLR and CCIBR2. The BR2 is a milder primer than the others and requires a bump in the load of .2 to .3 depending on the caliber. My 6XC loves the WLR's while my .260 and 7-300 wsm love the CCIBR2's. My 6 Dasher and 6BR shoots the CCI450's the best although the only other primer I've tested in those rifles has been the F205's with 107SMK's
While testing my 7-300wsm I started with the F215's and quickly came to the realization that they were junk in that particular rifle. I switched to the WLR's with RL-25 and then to the CCIBR2's with H1000, the rest as they say is history.
300 Jarrett loved 84.0 grains of RL-25, F215's and 165 NBT/175SMKs
7mmRM #1 H4350/F215's/150 SGK's
7mmRM #2 H4831/F210M/150SGK
7-300WSM H1000/CCIBR2's/180 Berger vlds
2-.308's H4895/CCIBR2's/175SMK's
6 Dasher & 6BR Varget/CCI450's/Berger 105 vlds
.260 H4350/CCIBR2/130 Berger vlds (hated 210's and WLR's)
6XC H4350/WLR/Berger 105vlds (hated CCI primers)
I answered based my experiences and 1000's of rounds down range in various calibers and numerous primers tested. My reloading practices and test methods are largely based on BR shooting. Groups larger than the mid .2's or scores lower than 197 out of 200 will have you jockying for 2nd place. Most of the suggestions I give are based on that.
<span style="font-weight: bold">You failed to give your caliber of choice so my response was kept short.</span> Share your caliber and we can give you more detailed information.
It seems for me that with the Hogdon Powders of late, the CCI primers are giving the best results. With the IMR powders of past, Federal gave the best results. The WLR & F210M primers run very close to burn rate and given velocities when either is used and most times can be exchanged with each other. Several years ago I performed a velocity and accuracy test using a 7mmRM, 150 grain SGK bullets and H4831. This test was to determine, if only in my mind, if primers really made that big of a difference. The primers tested were the F210M, F215, WLR, WLRM and the Rem 9.5M. The primer that gave the highest velocity also gave the best accuracy, the F210M. This primer beat all others by 50fps and produced .3moa accuracy at 100 yards. The test confirmed what I already knew, primers do and did make a difference. The F210M is the main primer I shot for several years until they became almost extinct. I then switched to the WLR and CCIBR2. The BR2 is a milder primer than the others and requires a bump in the load of .2 to .3 depending on the caliber. My 6XC loves the WLR's while my .260 and 7-300 wsm love the CCIBR2's. My 6 Dasher and 6BR shoots the CCI450's the best although the only other primer I've tested in those rifles has been the F205's with 107SMK's
While testing my 7-300wsm I started with the F215's and quickly came to the realization that they were junk in that particular rifle. I switched to the WLR's with RL-25 and then to the CCIBR2's with H1000, the rest as they say is history.
300 Jarrett loved 84.0 grains of RL-25, F215's and 165 NBT/175SMKs
7mmRM #1 H4350/F215's/150 SGK's
7mmRM #2 H4831/F210M/150SGK
7-300WSM H1000/CCIBR2's/180 Berger vlds
2-.308's H4895/CCIBR2's/175SMK's
6 Dasher & 6BR Varget/CCI450's/Berger 105 vlds
.260 H4350/CCIBR2/130 Berger vlds (hated 210's and WLR's)
6XC H4350/WLR/Berger 105vlds (hated CCI primers)
Re: Big difference in accuracy based on primer brand?
...more information can also be found in Roscoe's post above; do what he says; I know him and he is good at making precision ammunition.
...more information can also be found in Roscoe's post above; do what he says; I know him and he is good at making precision ammunition.
Re: Big difference in accuracy based on primer brand?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Casey Simpson</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...more information can also be found in Roscoe's post above; do what he says; I know him and he is good at making precision ammunition. </div></div>
Thanks for the advice everyone. I've got some WLR primers one the way and will go from there and try others as I can get my hands on them.
Oh, and for the record, I'm starting with .308 and .223.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Casey Simpson</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...more information can also be found in Roscoe's post above; do what he says; I know him and he is good at making precision ammunition. </div></div>
Thanks for the advice everyone. I've got some WLR primers one the way and will go from there and try others as I can get my hands on them.
Oh, and for the record, I'm starting with .308 and .223.
Re: Big difference in accuracy based on primer brand?
In the .308 try H4895 & CCIBR2's if they can be found with the 175SMK's. 41.0 to 42.5 grains. Try the BR4's or F205's in the .223
As said earlier, the WLR's will produce almost the same results as the F210's, they're very close.
In the .308 try H4895 & CCIBR2's if they can be found with the 175SMK's. 41.0 to 42.5 grains. Try the BR4's or F205's in the .223
As said earlier, the WLR's will produce almost the same results as the F210's, they're very close.
Re: Big difference in accuracy based on primer brand?
"are Winchester or Remington or Federal LR primers good for accurate loads? Thanks in advance."
"YES" is the only rational reply. Ditto, CCI. Not a major difference perhaps, they all work, but little things count in obtaining best accuracy.
Sorry, there are no shortcuts or magic components that can be assembled in a 1-2-3-4 step program and, volia, there's the answer. No one can say which of anything will or even might be "more" accurate than another, only testing can do that. And even then, different lot numbers can easily change things.
"are Winchester or Remington or Federal LR primers good for accurate loads? Thanks in advance."
"YES" is the only rational reply. Ditto, CCI. Not a major difference perhaps, they all work, but little things count in obtaining best accuracy.
Sorry, there are no shortcuts or magic components that can be assembled in a 1-2-3-4 step program and, volia, there's the answer. No one can say which of anything will or even might be "more" accurate than another, only testing can do that. And even then, different lot numbers can easily change things.
