Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

[dreamlander]

As I sit and wait for LWRC to finally get a repr to me I stare at all the .308 win loading materials sitting on my shelf and want to put them to use. So I have decided to buy a budget bolt gun in the mean time (can never have too many guns).
I want something light that can easily be carried around the hills while hunting, I am looking at the $800 price range, synthetic stock, with accuracy being the primary concern.
I have looked seriously at the Savage 16fcss, CZ 550, and Sako 85 ss. I have not used any of these guns, but they all look like good guns for the money. I am kind of leaning toward the Savage, so tell me why not or why to get any of these or other rifles.
thanks

 

[Pete Lincoln]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

Get your self a Howa

Pete

 

[dreamlander]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

Howa looks like another good choice, but why Howa over the others?

 

[bozochu]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

Get an 700 sps for under 600...then look around for a used HS precision stock and bed it yourself or choose different stock as your budget allows...

 

[glock63]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

Remmy 700 LTR in .308? Should be able to be had for around your price.

 

[tolson68]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

Cabelas is advertising a Savage 10 with a Choate tactical or Savate 12 Varminter for $649. Remmy SPS Tac is another good option, but the factory stock leaves a bit to be desired. You can pick up a Choate tactical for about 200 delivered or a McMillan or HS take off stock for near the same price ($250???). Howa isn't bad either.

 

[Red_SC]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dreamlander</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Howa looks like another good choice, but why Howa over the others? </div></div>

The silky smooth bolt throw is magicilicious.

I'd say Rem 700 LTR, or Howa.

 

[dreamlander]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

I have learned a couple things here, Remington's website is terrible. Can't find much for specs on their rifles, and no mention of LTR, can anyone give me a weight? The savage 10 rifles are a bit heavy I would like to stay under 8 pounds.
I see Howa sells just actions and barrels. Seems like a viable option, what are some good stocks that would fit on the Howa?
thanks for info so far

 

[darrenk75b]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

Both McMillan and Manners make stocks for the Howa

 

[mark4567]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

Savage 10 fcp $626 here and if you want to go a little higher you can get them with either HS or McMillan stocks from the factory

 

[flyboy]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

Tikka T3 or sako for the weight.

 

[srv656s]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

When i got into this a few years ago, I went with the Remington 700 series and was happy I did so. Lots of things made for the 700 and lots of options.

I can't speak to the other options in the list, but I'd recommend you consider the 700 at least.

 

[sr15match]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dreamlander</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have learned a couple things here, Remington's website is terrible. Can't find much for specs on their rifles, and no mention of LTR, can anyone give me a weight? The savage 10 rifles are a bit heavy I would like to stay under 8 pounds.
I see Howa sells just actions and barrels. Seems like a viable option, what are some good stocks that would fit on the Howa?
thanks for info so far </div></div>


http://www.remingtonle.com/rifles/700.htm

 

[Unsichtbar]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

If CDNN still has FN PBR barreled actions to $399. complete but no stock they have worked great, a friend of mine and I bought 14 for his training facilty.

 

[Doc1911]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

Just so you know microsuck (www.atwelltactical.com) had a Remington 700 SPS in 308. $489 plus shipping to your FFL. (MSRP is $639). Sale

 

[E3C3H3O3]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

I'd go with the rem 700 LTR, like said before in other posts, it has a ton of options to add on later. Nothing against Howa though, had one in 300 win mag and loved it.

 

[el gordo2]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

As a light weight hunting rifle for appx $300, the Marlin XS7 in 308 Win. I am sure with handloads you could find a good shooting combo.

 

[macman2564]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

I'd go the Tikka route. Very accurate and very light. Should fit the bill pretty well.

 

[Pete Lincoln]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

With the Howa or the Tikka you get a better rifle than with the Remington.
in the case of the Howa.

better extractor,
integral recoil lug
one piece bolt and handle
factory barrels tend to be of higher quality
simple to field strip
tunable reliable trigger.
3 position safety that locks the bolt closed

in the case of the Tikka
better extractor,
very nice and smooth bolt travel
factory barrels tend to be of higher quality
tunable reliable trigger.


The Howa currently has more aftermarket tuning accessories available than the tikka, but that is changing as we develope things for both.

Savage make a great rifle for the money, as do Tikka and Howa.

I'd pick one of the 3 over a remington every day of the week.

Of the 3 i'd pick the Howa.Its got so many features included, has enough after market parts for upgrading and if you combine the factory barreled action with a decent stock you end up with a rifle that is reliable and accurate. But then you can say that about the Tikka too.

Personaly, i would pick a Tikka T3 or Howa 1500 in one of our RCS chassis over a Sako TRG any day of the week. But you are wanting a hunting rifle.

Howa 1500 barreled action, in a Hogue, Tom Manners, McMillan, B&C, Wild Dog or whatever better than factory stock, with a little bedding, trigger tuning. check the crown, check the lugs for contact, and you will have a genuine 1/2 MOA rifle.

that would be possible with the Tikka, but there aren't many stock upgrade options for it.

Pete

 

[toyfreak]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

I was told that the Savage is very easy to work on. I haven't done anything to mine yet but the fact that i can change the barrel my self influenced my decision.
One gun, multiple calibers.

 

[Hummer]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

I would go with the Tikka hands down as the magazine feeds reliably. A lot of highpower shooters are buying them now and converting them to heavy barrels for competition.

As a rule of thumb consider it this way which is to use the knowledge of hundreds/thousands as compaired to a few opinions.

1. The No 1 bolt rifle at the National Matches was the 1903 Springfield and rightly so as there has never been a more reliable rifle ever fielded by US. They had the field from the early 1900s to 1950 or so. There is a drawback to them when shooting left hand rapid fire but can be overcome with practice. I shoot left hand and have been to this rodeo. Parts are cheap and plentiful. Parts being plentiful is the name of the game.


2. The No 2 bolt rifle at the National Matches has been the Mod 70 Winchester for years. At least the last 55 years.

3. The Remington 40X and 700s I have seen at Camp Perry can be counted on your fingers in rapid fire matches as they can be a real bitch to load in rapid fire. Yes I have two 40Xs and several 700s.

NOTE: There are those that will argue "Well the Marine Corps went to the 700 and the Army uses the 700. Fact is when the Marine Corps wanted Sniper Rifles only Remington submitted a bid.
The Marine Corps wanted Mod 70s as this is what the entire Marine Corps bolt gun team used for years and they won hundreds of matches with them. It was the first rifles they sent to Nam as sniper rifles. They were entirely happy with Mod 70 but Winchester chose not to bid so they were stuck with the M40 which was a disaster with the scope system supplied. Don't be fooled into thinking well so and so bought this so it must be best. Gov't procurement specs are for rifles of certain caliber, weight range, performance requirements. They cannot be advertised that they must be made in New Haven, must have claw extractor, must have one piece bolt etc as it is illegal to spec such.

Now you are talking cheap, the cheapest way I would say go is to find a 1903 Springfield and have it rebarreled to 308 with a barrel configuration you like. For a little heavier sporter I use a No 5A barrel configuration which gives stiffness but not weight. Barrels come in 26" lengths which is what I personally use but you can have the front end bobbed at installation.

(When I worked at the Army Small Cal Lab I conducted a survey and the question was if you were going to be going some place bad and you wanted a rifle with complete reliability what would you choose and every last man said 1903 Springfield was their first choice.)

Next would be the Mod 70 done the same way.

If you want a turnkey operation go with the Tikka and when the barrel goes rebarrel with a 5A barrel or do as below.

I fell into a bunch of 03A3 receivers a few years back and I have been slowly (read very slowly) barreling them up and Thursday and Friday of this past week I started building what I refer to as a Swamp Gun. Started out with a 26" heavy barrel (No 7) that had a couple thousand rounds on it but still does fine and I decided it was a go. As with all bolt guns you need to square the front the action and I have my own threading theory to get the bore center line of the barrel and the action as straight as possible. Note: the industry has a standard that will allow one half the diameter of the striker offset and most strikers on medium case heads are .060" or so diameter, thusly they will allow a .030" offset for primer strike. If they didn't there would be one hell of a lot of scrapped receivers. The bench rest boys learned long ago that most action threads are not square with the bore center line and they take great pains to achieve a dead center striker hit. Sometimes they have their receivers rethreaded to square the threads to achieve this.

First I cut off the threads and maybe 1/2" so the barrel would be rethreaded and end of chamber would be in new rifling.I left the barrel full configuration for about 10" in front of receiver and then made a step down and turned it .840" almost to the muzzle. Why .840"? A Weaver scope base for a Thompson Contender Super 14 will fit that barrel very nicely at the .840" section and mounts with four screws. I think this is a No 10 base and sells for like 9.00???

Next I will mount a NC Star pistol scope with Weaver High rings and I'll have a el cheapo Scout Rifle. Scope, rings, mount maybe 70.00. I have done four others like this and the little NC Star Pistol scope is just fine for 6" steel plates at 300 yards. On E silouettes 600 yards is just fine.
Best thing about these scopes if you are going into the bad lands have an extra scope with mounts pre zeroed and transport in a 2" PVC pipe so if something happens to you first scope you have a backup.
If you want you can mount open hunting sights on the barrel.

For a stock I will use "C" stocks someone cut off to sporterize that I have picked up over the years. If I come into some play money I will most likely get a laminated stock from Richards as such would be almost unbreakable in the woods.

This is the cheapest and most reliable combo I have ever come up with. It may not be pretty but there is a saying in the South:
"If it won't run, make it pretty." Mine run, pretty they are not.

 

[ranger1183]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

Hummer,

Excellent post! Do you have any pictures of this type of rifle? I'd really be interested in "how-to" pictures of a rebuild in progress. Also, what do you do about re-tempering the action for strength? Is that something you do? If so, how?

 

[z71rat]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

Another plug for the Savage 10FPLE...

DK

 

[dreamlander]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

Thanks for all the info. Kind of funny I had already narrowed it down to Tikka or Howa before reading your post Pete.
I am either getting the Tikka t3 tactical or Howa 1500 standard barrel with a Manners or B&C stock.
I like the Tikka because it is ready to go, has detachable magazines, weaver rail, adjustable trigger, and is right at 8 pounds. Looks like I could get one for around $1200, which I could do, but a little higher than I like.
I like the Howa because I could get just the action and barrel and put a nice stock on it, stay at 8# range with a standard barrel or 10# with a heavy barrel. I don't think I need a heavy barrel since my hunting applications should only call for one shot at a time. How much better would cold shot accuracy be with the heavy barrel? Also even with a nice stock I should be able to stay around the $900 range.
I also I have never bedded an action in a stock before. Do most people glass bed these stocks? I guess that will be my next research topic.
Well this is what it has come down to for me. I got some time, so I will think on this for a bit, but if anyone has anything to add please do so.

 

[krummarine]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

I'll be posting a Savage 12 in .260 soon. right up your alley...

 

[dreamlander]

Re: Budget bolt .308, decisions, decisions

Sorry being .308 win is a necassary part.
I think I have made my decision. Didn't realize it before but I can get the Tikka t3 varminter, heavy barrel, 8#, for under $750. I guess I don't understand the tactical costing almost twice as much just for a picatinny rail, adjustable cheek, and threads for a suppressor. Seems like a lot of bang for the buck so I am going to get the varminter.