Budget Reloading- help please

[Lionsbreath]

Hey everybody, I’m fairly new to precision rifles, (been shooting most my life tho) finally got my rigs set-up .308 and .223 and have been shooting factory ammo only.. Also note that I’m blue-collar on a budget , and I don’t have tons of cash to hurl at the latest and greatest..My questions are : Do I spend money on a 6.5 rebarrel and keep shooting factory match,or get set-up to hand-load for what I have first?? I’m tired of not experiencing the joys and options I would have hand-loading.. Also how relevant are Lee products? (I can’t afford Redding) Lee Classic Cast press, along with Lee dies, shell-holders, maybe not their scales, or powder measures?? Could I reload precision ammo on this set-up? I have experienced hand-loaders that will guide me through the learning process - (excuse the long post, hope it’s in the right section) Thanks

 

[flashhole]

The newer Lee Classic products are great and great value too. I suggest a Lee Classic Turret. Not the older Deluxe system. Lee are also coming out with some new progressives for 2018. If you are looking for volume the new four-station breech lock system is worth a look. On the Lee Classic Turret the turrets change out in a matter of seconds.

A Lee Auto Drum used in conjunction with the riser die is a good turret-mounted powder measure. It comes with both small and large capacity interchangable drums.

You can use just about any quality scale and any decent calipers (not plastic).

You will need some brass prep tools like a case length cutter, deburring tool and primer pocket cleaner. I prefer the Lyman E-Zee trim and champher tools. A step above the Lee system and a lot less expensive than the lathe type trimmers.

Lee dies are good and I especially like their powder through expander dies when used with the Auto Drum. I suggest a Lee Deluxe Die Set inclusive of the neck die that presses the case neck against a mandrel. You may not need to crimp your rifle cases but I find I like a taper crimp die a lot better than the Lee Factory Crimp Die for rifle cartridges.

Not the best picture but shown is a Lee Classic Turret with the Auto Drum mounted on the turret. This is set up for 45-70. Also shown is the Lee Classic Powder Measure in the background. Not necessary if you have the Auto Drum or similar powder drop. I built the stand to make a portable range system.

 

[spife7980]

I think the cast lee is a great value. I might not chose it over a rock chucker though as if you’re patient the chucker goes on sale for about the same price every once in awhile.
I would just shop the sales, rcbs kit on sale plus the rebate promotion now can take 100 off a 300 dollar kit.

You’ll need press, trimmer, powder weighing. Some kits only include 2/3 so just beaware of what else you’ll need to add onto them after the fact. Given the choice between a pocket scale and a beam I would take the beam every time. Getting a chargemaster will be a bit of a luxury but it really is amazing how much less painful the ordeal is with that step automated. I would probably go with the lee lock stud trimmer over a normal lathe unless you get the attachment to put the drill on the lathe trimmer. The lee stud sucks but with some of those nitrile dipped cloth gloves and a drill make it alright, without the drill it’s a bitch. Manually trimming in the lathe is a workout. The worlds finiest trimmers would be really nice and the giraud triway is better yet but that’s getting expensive now but it turns three steps into one really quick step. I don’t mind paying more for something if it means I spend 10% of the time and effort doing that same step. The 90% of my life back is worth it.

 

[isofahunter]

I use a lot of Lee products and have had good results. Keep your eyes peeled deals pop up all the time for all kinds of equipment, new and used.

 

[MtnCreek]

You're going to need a better seater die than lee makes.

 

[HoustonB77]

You might start a want to buy thread. I bet a couple hide members have several perfectly serviceable press's and lot of other tools laying around that they aren't using anymore.

 

[MikeInUtah]

This: "get set-up to hand-load for what I have first". If you are on a budget, I wouldnt suggest a move to 6.5 without understanding your reasoning first.

 

[Caveman0101]

RCBS gets my vote. I'm a chucker. No experience with the Lee stuff.

 

[Lionsbreath]

Thanks for the good info and pics, man I love this forum! It might take awhile but I think I’m gonna start piecing some stuff together or watch for the Rockchucker kit as one of y’all mentioned ( I have lusted over that thing numerous times) I would love to see what I could make my .308 do by hand-loading for it

 

[Lionsbreath]

While the Lee Classic Cast is red, it is USA made-
Is the Rockchucker still made in the USA? I’ve played with both presses, they both feel good I’m a reloading virgin too,tho..

 

[Maddy]

I started out with the Lee Challenger Anniversary reloading starter kit and some Lee and Hornady die sets a few years ago. It got me started pretty cheap. Immediately I was able to produce ammo that was just as good or better than the match ammo I was buying before. My advice is to jump in and get one of the kits to get started. Most of the stuff I've bought since then has made the reloading process easier/quicker but has only improved the quality of my ammo marginally. I now own Lee, RCBS, Hornady, and Lyman dies. They all work for me.

 

[Howland]

A decent press. Single stage is fine.
A die set and shellholder.
Calipers for measuring cases.
A scale. A balance beam is good enough, an automatic scale/powder dispenser is nice but your budget will dictate when. I used an RCBS balance beam for thousands of rounds. It's time consuming when you want your charges exact to the tenth of a grain but it gets the job done. I just got a small Frankfort Arsenal digital scale among a bunch of used equipment I got on Armslist and even that would be fine.
A case cleaner, tumbler is OK.
Components, powder, primers and bullets.
A manual is nice but most powder and bullet manufacturers have it online. I've never used the Lyman reloading manual but many here and elsewhere recommend it for beginners. It's a how-to from start to finish. I attended a free class sponsored by an LGS & Lyman and left with a hand press kit. The class was good, it's the next best thing to an experienced mentor. The kit paid for itself before it finally broke after thousands of rounds, but I was loading mostly straight walled pistol cases. I picked up a Rockchucker when I started bottleneck rifle rounds. It's a great single stage.
At some point you'll realize that using your press for priming is a PITA and you'll get a hand priming tool.
After setup, you should be able to find a load that shoots lights out from your gun. .308 could be 50-75¢ plus the case. You might find a factory load that can't be beat and it might not be match but if you're willing to devote the time to experiment, you can usually equal or better that. It isn't about saving money, it's about finding the best load for your rifle and shooting a lot more on the same budget.

Edited to correct brand of scale to Frankfort Arsenal. New will set you back $30 or so.

 

[Lionsbreath]

Thank y’all again for pointing me in the right direction, I appreciate it

 

[steve123]

You can load really good ammo on a Lee Classic Turret press. I've been loading for rifles that shoot in the .2's with SD's in the 4 to 6 range. It's a good press and the toolheads are just so convenient. For throwing a 80 -90% charge into a beam scale for a final trickle you don't need anything fancy. A basic Lee perfect powder measure works fine.

As far as loading vs. factory ammo, I think there are only a handful of cartridges that you can buy factory ammo for almost what the components cost and it's not worth buying reloading equipment for just that one cartridge...and 6.5Creed is one of them. If you buy in bulk 200rd or 500rd cases you can get it for about .80 -90 cents a rounds. If you sell your once-fired brass for $40 a hundred you're only paying about .40 - 50 cents a rd. If you just buy the components (and figure you get 10 firings out of Hornady brass) your looking at about 50 - 60 cents a rd. That doesn't include any reloading hardware like a press or anything. Or your time.

This is great advice!

When perusing local classifieds I see used reloading stuff really cheap often. There's plenty of old farts that got tired and sell their nice equipment for cheap. Plenty of people that decide reloading isn't for them too.

One good example is when I ran across a Dillon square deal B a couple years ago for $175 with 4 caliber conversion kits. That's about 1/5th of what brand new would have cost.

 

[MakeSawdust]

Lee tools and dies have worked really well for me over the years. I still use the Challenger press and auto prime that came with the kit I bought almost 15 years ago. I have upgraded the scale with an old ohaus 1010 off eBay. With a trickler and a set of check weights I can get charges within 1 kernal of H1000, but it is slow. For hunting ammo I have an old Lyman DPS to drop charges that is much faster but not nearly as accurate. I've been meaning to shoot some at distance. When I first started shooting long range I had about 1 moa of vertical. I have since tracked a lot of that down to neck tension issues. A lot of guys on here have good luck with Chargemasters, so my guess is that being within one kernal makes less difference than I think. Hornady comparators are also nice to set up proper headspace. You can really get by on minimal initial investment and load really good ammo. After that the money is to go faster or eeke out the last little bit of accuracy. I've never had any problem producing ammo that would shoot .5-.75 moa out to 500 yards and a lot of times better than that. All of the expensive stuff and voodoo is guys trying to go from .5 moa down to .0xx or trying to reduce vertical at distance.

 

[B y r o n]

If you're wanting to get into handloading try and figure out how much you can spend. When I got started it was with a simple Lee handloader and plastic face hammer on the garage floor. You'll then need to figure out how you want to clean your brass and later trim it. After beating on cases I upgraded to a used RCBS Jr. press that I still have. Your time and the amount of funds will dictate how and when you can upgrade and although the old stuff still works they are constantly coming out with new equipment. Mechanical is fine and you don't need power for it to work. Powered cost more but does usually speed up the process. Some of it will depend on if you only shoot 20 to 50 rounds a day or you want to burn through 100's. There a tons of online resources but don't forget to buy a few books as well. The early ones didn't have lawyers involved and will normally show higher velocities then what is currently published by the lawyer plagued newer volumes but they will also have the newer bullets and cartridges so there are trade-offs.

Don't forget to enjoy the journey!

 

[tnbowhunter]

I use an rcbs rockchucker press but have used Lee dies for years with no issues. I get good enough accuracy with Lee dies, especially their collet neck die that I often wonder why Ive bought higher priced dies. Seems like I started out with the rock chucker kit when it was on sale at midway or something like that. Then just keep adding to it as I was able to. I still have a very basic set up and can get very good accuracy out several rifles. Local classifieds adds can often land a good deal on a reloading set up as well if you run into someone getting out of it. I often see them around here for sale

 

[XLR308]

I started with a Lee anniversary kit in 1994, it served me well for many years and I got my money out of it and then some. I think I paid about $90 for it back then and still use some of the pieces from it.

 

[Codiekfx400]

Lee equipment is very good no need for anything better to start out. If all your shooting is 223 and 308 and possibly 6.5 creedmoor I would just buy factory ammo. I hand load and it is really expensive to buy all the equipment. And also very time consuming.

 

[Horns8491]

Here's my .02.

Putting a new 6.5 barrel on is the last thing I'd do if I were you. Spend your money on shooting. Almost everybody eventually moves from a 308 to a smaller caliber, if you start shooting competitions. But shooting a 308 will make you a better shooter, not a worse shooter, so I wouldn't be in a hurry to junk that 308 barrel.

I personally enjoy hand loading and I like the challenge of producing accurate, reliable ammo as efficiently as possible. My advice here: buy USED gear... look on the reloading PX on this forum. Lee, RCBS, hornady -- all the single stage presses are fine. I'd skip the turret press. Lee sizing dies are ok. The best is a custom honed Forster full length sizing die. The Lee Collet neck sizing die is the best value in all of reloading. You can find tons of videos on youtube showing how to use it (unless youtube has taken down all the reloading videos). You can probably score a cheap Redding die set, especially for 308. I'd invest in a good competition seating die from Redding or Forster.

 

[tea&jam]

Not specific to the OP, but a question for any budget reloader: Is your rifle's chamber close to "match" dimensions, or is it oversize?

If it is match -or close- proceed with all the great advice above.
If "I don't know..." What does your brass look like after being fired? Is it visibly stretched?
If it's oversize, prioritize getting your barrel set back with a match reamer, or possibly having your rifle rebarreled.

One can reload with an oversize chamber, but it might increase the amount of fire-forming and brass prep you need to do, and shorten the life of your brass. Fixing a bad chamber can pay for itself (for cartridges with long barrel-life) with time and components saved.