Bugnut VS shouldered prefit

[Kms33kms]

I’m kind of new to the long range world , I just purchased a defiance tenacity MA with standard bolt face. I was in a Facebook group asking some questions and a gunsmith messaged me and started asking me what I was wanting to do with my custom build. I told him I was intending on buying a shouldered prefit barrel to install to my action. He then told me that he could cut me a barrel and install on my rifle with something called a BUGNUT , and that they were the cool new thing , and that I could have multiple barrels for my rifle and just swap them
Out when needed??? I kind of figured that a person could do the same with shouldered prefits??? And also , I’m having g hard time researching an understanding , but I fell like I read that the bug nut thing , even is used also with prefit barrels??? And if that’s the case why would I need to pay someone to cut and chamber a barrel blank ? My question to y’all is , is this guy correct? And I’d have a better product if I let him cut me a barrel and use a Bugnut ? Or should
I remain on course and just order my proof shouldered prefit? And just to clarify , this guy is not a crook or anything just looking for business , he is locally known and is a good person and he actually competes , so part of me says
To listen to the guy and he may be able
To fit me a barrel that is better than
Just a proof prefit .

 

[akmike47]

It's just a barrel nut like a savage has

 

[EM92wx]

You still have to use a Headspace Gauge to seat it correctly. Its has the advantage, or did at one time, for the barrels to be produced faster. Look at KRG which has a Version of one.

 

[SWgeezer]

a shouldered prefit doesn't use a bug nut or any other nut. It is just threaded on tightened and shot...

 

[AllenOne1]

I’m kind of new to the long range world , I just purchased a defiance tenacity MA with standard bolt face. I was in a Facebook group asking some questions and a gunsmith messaged me and started asking me what I was wanting to do with my custom build. I told him I was intending on buying a shouldered prefit barrel to install to my action. He then told me that he could cut me a barrel and install on my rifle with something called a BUGNUT , and that they were the cool new thing , and that I could have multiple barrels for my rifle and just swap them
Out when needed??? I kind of figured that a person could do the same with shouldered prefits??? And also , I’m having g hard time researching an understanding , but I fell like I read that the bug nut thing , even is used also with prefit barrels??? And if that’s the case why would I need to pay someone to cut and chamber a barrel blank ? My question to y’all is , is this guy correct? And I’d have a better product if I let him cut me a barrel and use a Bugnut ? Or should
I remain on course and just order my proof shouldered prefit? And just to clarify , this guy is not a crook or anything just looking for business , he is locally known and is a good person and he actually competes , so part of me says
To listen to the guy and he may be able
To fit me a barrel that is better than
Just a proof prefit .

I don't think using the Bugnut barrel vs the shouldered will give you any more or less accuracy it's just a different way of getting there. Depending on what action you are running and what you intend to do with your gun (barrel swaps) the Bugnut may be right for you.

If you haven't ran into this page it is THE place to start doing your research on the Bugnut.

BugNut

Disclaimer: I don't run the Bugnut on my own rifle because it is a Savage and am using the Savage nut from Northland Shooters Supply.

 

[larryh128]

For many years I shouldered barrels, when I bought an action with Savage threads and was going to spin up a new barrel I immediately was going to shoulder it. A bud of mine who was building rifles way before me told me to barrel nut it. I tried it and haven't looked back, if you're installing your own barrels it's very simple compared to shouldering a barrel. Either way it's necessary to hold the barrel securely but with a barrel nut you don't need an action wrench. It is also very easy to adjust the headspace which I often go tighter than a go gauge for my personal use. There are a multitude of places who offer threaded barrels for either a Savage thread or a Remage set up. I have seen absolutely no difference in accuracy. If I were shooting benchrest, I would shoulder, anything else barrel nut.

 

[Kms33kms]

Ok so here is what I can choose from fellas
PROOF PREFIT BARREL for my tenacity action shipped is $606

The price this gunsmith is asking is
$350 for barrel
$225 for chamber
$100 muzzle threads
$45 for Bugnut
So total $720. And he will use a HAWK HILL 4 groove barrel (which I know is an amazing barrel)

Accuracy and durability wise , which route would you all go?

 

[MK20]

Neither.

Go to:

Criterion Barrels Remage prefit |Northland Shooters Supply

Northland Shooters Supply offers prefit Remage barrels by Criterion barrels that are hand lapped match grade barrels, finished and fully chambered.

northlandshooterssupply.com

You will come out around 450 bucks shipped for a threaded stainless barrel with nut. Probably 500 shipped if you pick up some extra tools from them.

Your gunsmith is making his cut off of you on a job that you can do in your garage if you can follow simple instructions.

 

[Kms33kms]

Neither.

Go to:

Criterion Barrels Remage prefit |Northland Shooters Supply

Northland Shooters Supply offers prefit Remage barrels by Criterion barrels that are hand lapped match grade barrels, finished and fully chambered.

northlandshooterssupply.com

You will come out around 450 bucks shipped for a threaded stainless barrel with nut. Probably 500 shipped if you pick up some extra tools from them.

Your gunsmith is making his cut off of you on a job that you can do in your garage if you can follow simple instructions.

So the criterion barrel will be as accurate as a hawk hill or proof cut rifled barrel? I’m glad you showed me this because it fits my budget more. But if you do t think it will be as accurate as a hawk hill or proof then I’d rather save to get one of the better one

 

[MK20]

Some will say yes, some will say no, some will say criterion is better.

They will shoot better than you can just like the Hawk Hill.

Criterion accuracy?

How are the criterion barrels for accuracy? Thanks

www.snipershide.com

Here is a quick look at another thread. There are more.

 

[MK20]

If you can't shoot 1/2 moa with a criterion, look somewhere other than the barrel first.
Some will shoot 1/4, a bad one will shoot 3/4 and lots of times that is the poor quality of the action showing through, not the barrel, but you have a good action so I expect you will be sub 1/2 moa.

 

[MK20]

Call criterion at 262 628 8749 on Monday and talk to them. Their CS is amazing. Or better yet, call Northland and talk to Jim. He is really good too. You often have to leave him a message but he calls back fast.

 

[Kms33kms]

Ok thanks. And yea I’m not an expert , but with my bergara premier 6.5 prc , I can get right at .5 inch groups at hundred yards , and that’s even with the usual flier. Even with this new custom rifle , I doubt I can do any better than that without handloading ammo

 

[Kms33kms]

Ok so I’m gonna write down here all my current available options and prices , and let you guys tell me which
You would
Personally prefer. Here are my choices Athat’s available

Proof research PREFIT stainless $600 shipped

Bug nut w/ hawkHill barrel custom cut chambered. $720

PVA rock creek PREFIT $700 ish shipped

Straightjacket armory (rock
Creek , benchmark, etc) around $700-$750

Rem-age Criterion prefit $450 ish shipped (also on nss website , it says the criterion with nut is installed with one of they’re heavy duty recoil lugs …. And my tenacity action has an integrated recoil lug already. So how does that work?)

 

[CK1.0]

There is no accuracy difference between using a shouldered barrel versus a barrel that uses a barrel nut. Most seem to prefer a shouldered prefit mostly because it looks cleaner, but a barrel-nut setup does have the advantage of letting one set their own headspace if they want to go a couple thou tighter. I've used both and like both, since I tend to put my barrels on once, and then shoot them until they're cooked before I pull them off, the experience/performance is the same.

If I were planning on spinning different barrels on and off over the barrel's useable lives, then obviously shouldered barrels would be better since the headspace would be more easily repeatable (not having to time the nut back to its same exact spot it was before).

A Bugnut is Southern Precision's (www.bugholes.com) barrel nut, and Greg does great work and doesn't dick around, so as far as barrel-nuts go, some may be as good, but none are probably better.

Also, since it seems you're in danger of being steered off course: as far as barrel maker's steel, don't worry about whether one brand is better than another's for now... According to some of the top engineers at Hornady (so some of the best in the shooting world), one could have a piece of fucking rebar spun up and chambered, and it would shoot just fine (for how long? ...who knows). As long as a barrel is machined correctly and you know how to load for it (or feed it good factory shit), it'll shoot.

I've had barrels from $400 X-Caliber barrel-nut barrels to $900 custom chambered Bartlien's, I'm going on my 3rd Proof SS prefit, they've all been great. I put them on in my garage with a $50 barrel vise, Go-gauge, painter's tape (No-Go gauge), and a torque wrench.

 

[MK20]

Ok so I’m gonna write down here all my current available options and prices , and let you guys tell me which
You would
Personally prefer. Here are my choices Athat’s available

Proof research PREFIT stainless $600 shipped

Bug nut w/ hawkHill barrel custom cut chambered. $720

PVA rock creek PREFIT $700 ish shipped

Straightjacket armory (rock
Creek , benchmark, etc) around $700-$750

Rem-age Criterion prefit $450 ish shipped (also on nss website , it says the criterion with nut is installed with one of they’re heavy duty recoil lugs …. And my tenacity action has an integrated recoil lug already. So how does that work?)

For the money I prefer the criterion.

The criterion will headspace off an action with an integral lug just fine.

 

[Kms33kms]

There is no accuracy difference between using a shouldered barrel versus a barrel that uses a barrel nut. Most seem to prefer a shouldered prefit mostly because it looks cleaner, but a barrel-nut setup does have the advantage of letting one set their own headspace if they want to go a couple thou tighter. I've used both and like both, since I tend to put my barrels on once, and then shoot them until they're cooked before I pull them off, the experience/performance is the same.

If I were planning on spinning different barrels on and off over the barrel's useable lives, then obviously shouldered barrels would be better since the headspace would be more easily repeatable (not having to time the nut back to its same exact spot it was before).

A Bugnut is Southern Precision's (www.bugholes.com) barrel nut, and Greg does great work and doesn't dick around, so as far as barrel-nuts go, some may be as good, but none are probably better.

Also, since it seems you're in danger of being steered off course: as far as barrel maker's steel, don't worry about whether one brand is better than another's for now... According to some of the top engineers at Hornady (so some of the best in the shooting world), one could have a piece of fucking rebar spun up and chambered, and it would shoot just fine (for how long? ...who knows). As long as a barrel is machined correctly and you know how to load for it (or feed it good factory shit), it'll shoot.

I've had barrels from $400 X-Caliber barrel-nut barrels to $900 custom chambered Bartlien's, I'm going on my 3rd Proof SS prefit, they've all been great. I put them on in my garage with a $50 barrel vise, Go-gauge, painter's tape (No-Go gauge), and a torque wrench.

Thank you

 

[308pirate]

Ok so I’m gonna write down here all my current available options and prices , and let you guys tell me which
You would
Personally prefer. Here are my choices Athat’s available

Proof research PREFIT stainless $600 shipped

Bug nut w/ hawkHill barrel custom cut chambered. $720

PVA rock creek PREFIT $700 ish shipped

Straightjacket armory (rock
Creek , benchmark, etc) around $700-$750

Rem-age Criterion prefit $450 ish shipped (also on nss website , it says the criterion with nut is installed with one of they’re heavy duty recoil lugs …. And my tenacity action has an integrated recoil lug already. So how does that work?)

Just fucking buy something already

I can't grasp how some people get vapor lock making simple decisions.

 

[Kms33kms]

Just fucking buy something already

I can't grasp how some people get vapor lock making simple decisions.

Not everybody is experts like you must be , also not everybody is as wealthy as you seem to be to be able to just pick a random barrel without advice and not give a shit whether it’s good or not

 

[Kms33kms]

Just fucking buy something already

I can't grasp how some people get vapor lock making simple decisions.

And to be honest , people like you , who don’t know how to mind their own business , make beginners not even wanna chime in on these forums to learn things , so do us all a favor and keep that lip fuckin zipped unless it involves you

 

[KnowNothing256]

Not everybody is experts like you must be , also not everybody is as wealthy as you seem to be to be able to just pick a random barrel without advice and not give a shit whether it’s good or not

They’ll all shoot great, but I have two preferences that narrow down your list: cut rifling and shouldered prefit.

I’ve done the barrel nut thing and it definitely works, but a shouldered barrel is soooo much faster to install. If you won’t swap the barrel very often, it doesn’t matter. If you will, then prefit all day.

As for the cut rifling (versus button): they can both shoot extremely accurately. However, button rifling introduces more stress into the steel, making it more likely to have bore diameter variations at the muzzle threads and to have POI shift when the barrel heats up. Thicker barrels are less susceptible to the POI shift because they heat up slower and are stiffer, but yeah, for me it’s one less source of potential issues.

 

[Kms33kms]

They’ll all shoot great, but I have two preferences that narrow down your list: cut rifling and shouldered prefit.

I’ve done the barrel nut thing and it definitely works, but a shouldered barrel is soooo much faster to install. If you won’t swap the barrel very often, it doesn’t matter. If you will, then prefit all day.

As for the cut rifling (versus button): they can both shoot extremely accurately. However, button rifling introduces more stress into the steel, making it more likely to have bore diameter variations at the muzzle threads and to have POI shift when the barrel heats up. Thicker barrels are less susceptible to the POI shift because they heat up slower and are stiffer, but yeah, for me it’s one less source of potential issues.

Ok thanks. Are the proof research barrels
All cut rifled?

 

[OREGUN]

Why are people still effing around with barrel nuts? Shouldered prefit all day. WHEN and IF you reach a level where you are tweaking headspace for customization or IF you find yourself dealing with an action that was made like a 1980s r700 (not particularly true in any dimension) then you can use a barrel nut setup to get what you need. In the mean time, just buy a prefit from literally anyone who is selling them and get exactly repeatable headspace every time.

 

[KnowNothing256]

Ok thanks. Are the proof research barrels
All cut rifled?

Ok, if you’re gonna blast people for not being helpful (which did make me chuckle), you better be prepared to pull your weight on the self-directed research. Just my two cents.

 

[Kms33kms]

Ok, if you’re gonna blast people for not being helpful (which did make me chuckle), you better be prepared to pull your weight on the self-directed research. Just my two cents.

Yea , literally after I asked you that question , I googled it and found out for myself. So yea basically just initiating small talk

 

[308pirate]

Why are people still effing around with barrel nuts? Shouldered prefit all day. WHEN and IF you reach a level where you are tweaking headspace for customization or IF you find yourself dealing with an action that was made like a 1980s r700 (not particularly true in any dimension) then you can use a barrel nut setup to get what you need. In the mean time, just buy a prefit from literally anyone who is selling them and get exactly repeatable headspace every time.

Some people have actions for which shouldered prefits don't exist. Some people want to know exactly what they're getting when they install the barrel instead of assuming that every barrel and every action are going to be just so.

Some of us have worked for long enough in mfg to know better.

 

[308pirate]

And to be honest , people like you , who don’t know how to mind their own business , make beginners not even wanna chime in on these forums to learn things , so do us all a favor and keep that lip fuckin zipped unless it involves you

I'll say what I want, where I want, and when I want to. Don't care if you like it or not.

 

[MK20]

I'll say what I want, where I want, and when I want to. Don't care if you like it or not.

You have proven this repeatedly.

 

[Kms33kms]

I'll say what I want, where I want, and when I want to. Don't care if you like it or not.

Keyboard warrior

 

[OREGUN]

308pirate is the smartest person on the hide. Just ask him, he’ll tell you.

 

[OREGUN]

Some people have actions for which shouldered prefits don't exist. Some people want to know exactly what they're getting when they install the barrel instead of assuming that every barrel and every action are going to be just so.

Some of us have worked for long enough in mfg to know better.

Like I said, if and when you have a special use case.

 

[SanPatHogger]

I went with a Criterion barrel and am very happy with it.

 

[308pirate]

Like I said, if and when you have a special use case.

Even if I didn't have a special use case, I'd still use a nut. There are zero downsides to having full control of the dimensions involved instead of trusting they are right.

 

[308pirate]

308pirate is the smartest person on the hide. Just ask him, he’ll tell you.

I know my lane and I'm pretty fucking good at it. If that pisses you of, I ran out of fucks to give yesterday.

 

[Mike Casselton]

Thank you

You can get that Proof shipped to your door for less than $600.

Go to FrontRangePrecision.com
and see if he has the barrel you want in stock.
It'll have a price listed, but that's not the actual dollar amount.
Put the item in your cart and that will be the price you pay for it.

 

[atepointer]

Ok so here is what I can choose from fellas
PROOF PREFIT BARREL for my tenacity action shipped is $606

The price this gunsmith is asking is
$350 for barrel
$225 for chamber
$100 muzzle threads
$45 for Bugnut
So total $720. And he will use a HAWK HILL 4 groove barrel (which I know is an amazing barrel)

Accuracy and durability wise , which route would you all go?

I'm into my 2nd Proof pre-fit for Bighorn and both have been beyond my expectations. So much so I have a 3rd one already ordered from Owen at @Front Range Precision sitting in back of reloading closet. Buddy @Mike Casselton showed me how to swap barrels....actually he did it all, but I'll do the next one...so stupidly simple. I picked mine up when they were sub $500 to my door which still may be the case.....so there's my worthless .015 cents.

I'm not much of a paper puncher/load dev guy as my shooting pals will attest I like to hear 'pew.....tingggggggg' a lot. When I took my 2nd Proof out to pop the cherry I bOaR ciTeD off a target at 100 and just swung out to 800 pronto to let a small pressure test batch go and then started running my exact same batch of Lapua brass from other barrel with bullet at hard jam. Used combat offset/Kentucky windage of about .5mils each rest of day b/c I'm that lazy when I want to shoot steel.

At the end of the day I had 4 bullets left and my buddy Mike said good grief stop being stupid throw some on paper and fix zero stop why don't ya. Needed to tweak windage/elevation a smidge anyway, but this is what an unbroken in Proof with 50 rounds, still yet to speed up completely shot with a smoking hot barrel which MIke and I have been known to do.....on a weekly basis. This is an exceptional group for me I'm the last guy out of our group for shooting best paper groups. Probably best group I've ever shot....hence why I keep pic on phone to prove to myself it was probably a fluke given my usual paper performance. I had a buddy measure it with his app and I think he was quite generous with the edges of the group so don't know that's quite measured that small, but it's still well within my 'i'll take it' zone. I'm sold on Proof. End of campfire songs.

 

[SanPatHogger]

Criterion Barrels Remage prefit |Northland Shooters Supply

Northland Shooters Supply offers prefit Remage barrels by Criterion barrels that are hand lapped match grade barrels, finished and fully chambered.

northlandshooterssupply.com

Depending on where you live there may be people around you that already have the tools to put the barrel on.
If you are near Corpus Christi hit me up. I'd like to drool on a Defiance action anyway. You should get a go and a no-go gauge for your caliber also, they are cheap enough. Some people just buy the one and then space it with scotch tape, I bought both.

 

[TM6]

Ok thanks. Are the proof research barrels
All cut rifled?

Yep, cut, either 4 groove or 5 groove depending on caliber. They do not offer 5r rifling.

TM6

 

[Jmkjr87]

I know my lane and I'm pretty fucking good at it. If that pisses you of, I ran out of fucks to give yesterday.

Gay

 

[308pirate]

Gay

Not as gay as whiteknighting for other men

 

[Jmkjr87]

Not as gay as whiteknighting for other men

Not white knighting, just merely making a observation on how gay u are

 

[Earnhardt]

I've had SPR/BugNuts do 7 BugNut barrels for me.
Greg and Russ are great guys to deal with.
The beauty of the BugNut barrel, is the blazing fast turn around time, and the "Do It Yourself" aspect...
All 7 barrels are very accurate, and you get to choose which barrel/brand/contour you want (if they have it in stock..and they normally do)
On a BugNut barrel, you WILL have to set the headspace, and You SHOULD check headspace on a pre-fit barrel

This is all very easy to do...if you have the know-how. But one problem is, is that there are alot of guys getter into the shooting sports, and think they are do-it-yourselfers...and they are not.

If you are good with tools, and are semi-handy, either a BugNut barrel or Pre-Fit barrel will work for you.

But you SHOULD check head space on the Pre-Fit regardless. And if you don't want to headspace the pre-fit...be my guest... It's your face

 

[308pirate]

Not white knighting

Sure you're not

 

[JustSendit]

Buy the prefit and send it. There’s a reason they’re so popular, it’s because they work. Proof makes good ones, mine have all shot well and I am probably 20 barrels from them in 3 years. But I’ve also bought prefit barrels for impact from a few different smiths and minus 1 barrel that shot like crap, everything else has been very good. I think that speaks to the quality of the blanks and good smiths ability to cut the chamber.

 

[338dude]

I’m kind of new to the long range world , I just purchased a defiance tenacity MA with standard bolt face. I was in a Facebook group asking some questions and a gunsmith messaged me and started asking me what I was wanting to do with my custom build. I told him I was intending on buying a shouldered prefit barrel to install to my action. He then told me that he could cut me a barrel and install on my rifle with something called a BUGNUT , and that they were the cool new thing , and that I could have multiple barrels for my rifle and just swap them
Out when needed??? I kind of figured that a person could do the same with shouldered prefits??? And also , I’m having g hard time researching an understanding , but I fell like I read that the bug nut thing , even is used also with prefit barrels??? And if that’s the case why would I need to pay someone to cut and chamber a barrel blank ? My question to y’all is , is this guy correct? And I’d have a better product if I let him cut me a barrel and use a Bugnut ? Or should
I remain on course and just order my proof shouldered prefit? And just to clarify , this guy is not a crook or anything just looking for business , he is locally known and is a good person and he actually competes , so part of me says
To listen to the guy and he may be able
To fit me a barrel that is better than
Just a proof prefit .

One of the points to buying a custom action is extremely tight tolerances ,order a shouldered pre- fit. If you have a standard action with very loose tolerances, then go with a nut system.

 

[338dude]

Ok so here is what I can choose from fellas
PROOF PREFIT BARREL for my tenacity action shipped is $606

The price this gunsmith is asking is
$350 for barrel
$225 for chamber
$100 muzzle threads
$45 for Bugnut
So total $720. And he will use a HAWK HILL 4 groove barrel (which I know is an amazing barrel)

Accuracy and durability wise , which route would you all go?

Proof

 

[atepointer]

@Kms33kms as a matter of fact my buddy took a borescope to my 1st Proof 6.5 with ~ 3,200 rounds on it yesterday. Maybe @Mike Casselton will chime in on the exact condition or a pic at some point I know he's going shooting this morning, but barrel was not pretty. The day I took it out of service it was still shooting great, but with the round count where it was and having a brand new one sitting in the garage I went ahead and pulled it.

I straight up abused it on more than one occasion. My dad was having a hoot at a the mile berm and in the zone and I let him run probably 25 in a string around the 2,500 round count range barrel was just roasting. I just said who cares this is quality time with my best pal who only gets to shoot seasonally and last trip of the year b/f heading north.... let him roast it I'll buy another. Kept shooting well after that.....just another anecdotal experience on a Proof pre-fit.

 

[Mike Casselton]

Dan treated that barrel like a red-headed step child.
Abuse is a total understatement.
Every time it got too hot to touch, we'd laugh and say fuck it, they'll make more.

I cleaned on that barrel again yesterday for almost three hours. It had been sitting for a couple of months with just a couple of wet patches run through it.
Wore the first brush out with Shooter's Choice and Kroil mix.
Ran the scope through it and it looked surprisingly good, but still had a ton of carbon and copper fouling.

I capped it and filled it with CLR. Let that soak for 20 minutes and cleaned again. Scoped it and then capped and filled again.

The second soak was 30 minutes. Scrubbed and flushed with clean water.

Did the bore scope again and the carbon ring in the chamber area was gone.
The extra soaking in CLR exposed a lot of copper wash in the bore. It also exposed how fire cracked the barrel was. The first 14" from the throat was like a dry lake bed. It tapered off from there and the last 5-6" cleaned up and still looked new...

I'd love to get everything out of it just to see how bad it really is, but it's just not worth the time at this point.

 

[atepointer]

Since I have the current barrel cleaned up we should run that borescope b/f shooting again to see how it looks I'm just over 700 on it.....will be interesting to see how it looks early on.

Have fun out there this morning looks to be perfection

 

[Mike Casselton]

Does the bore brush kinda glide through it or is a bit of effort needed to push it through?


Your old bore brush....