Optics BUYERS BEWARE !!!

[OneShot63]

Just want to get this out there that I have just been scammed by a member that went by brainstodart and his accomplices Don Franks and Gary Wright [email protected] Is where the payment went.
Thought I was purchasing a Spuhr SP-4001 for $350.00, dude sent me pictures with hand written dates and it all look legit. NOT, ripped me off for the cash.
So I just wanted to post up and make sure no one else gets taken for a ride like I did. Remember those names and do not deal with them.
Stay safe everyone and be good, because what comes around goes around and you can’t escape karma it will catch up with you when you least expect it too....
Valuable lessons to be learned, thank goodness is was only $350.00..
Found the dude on FaceBook, his picture was on the PayPal Transaction So it made it fairly easy to locate, also his company Global Special Effects.

Thanks guys and gals...

 

[stello1001]

Be sure to leave feedback stating what happened. If these people are indeed scammers, someone will probably look at the transaction feedback before making a deal. Maybe not everyone will see this thread is all I'm saying.

Sorry this happened to you...

 

[BlazinPond]

Thanks for letting us know. That is appreciated.

I do get upset how here (the Hide) and AR15.com SELLERS in the classifieds push PAYPAL Friends and Family (Only) and DISCREET. You have zero recourse similar to sending a money order. Mounts and scopes Via PP Goods and Services is OK. This is NOT against any PP policy. I wish Admins on both sites reinforced this better. Otherwise, it will never get better. Sorry, rant over.

 

[skyewalker]

Thanks for letting us know. That is appreciated.

I do get upset how here (the Hide) and AR15.com SELLERS in the classifieds push PAYPAL Friends and Family (Only) and DISCREET. You have zero recourse similar to sending a money order. Mounts and scopes Via PP Goods and Services is OK. This is NOT against any PP policy. I wish Admins on both sites reinforced this better. Otherwise, it will never get better. Sorry, rant over.

Be upset all you want. It’s the buyers that figured out how easy it is to rip off sellers via G&S that ruined that option for most of us.

 

[BlazinPond]

Be upset all you want. It’s the buyers that figured out how easy it is to rip off sellers via G&S that ruined that option for most of us.

How so? I do literally hundreds of G&S sales per year. Never a problem.

 

[acudaowner]

not that it will defiantly help you , but your cc company if you used a credit card could go after your money or maybe put a stop payment on the item if the seller did not deliver the goods to you. my bank just got me 60 dollars back from grub hub in la that I never used and pay pal got me 120 back for a product that the seller did not send . I hope one or both companies if you used them are able to get your money back or even a portion of it good luck .

 

[skyewalker]

How so? I do literally hundreds of G&S sales per year. Never a problem.

Good for you. Not going to advertise the multiple ways this can be done on here, we don’t need to give people ideas. Bottom line is, deal with reputable members and never send more money that you can afford to not see again. Also, CC company/bank can help in this particular case.

 

[BlazinPond]

Good for you. Not going to advertise the multiple ways this can be done on here, we don’t need to give people ideas. Bottom line is, deal with reputable members and never send more money that you can afford to not see again. Also, CC company/bank can help in this particular case.

So you've not personally had the issue, but someone you know....sure.

Bottom line, PP G&S you are protected. Friends and family you are not. That is a fact. Thanks for adding all the value you were able to.

 

[Bevo]

So you've not personally had the issue, but someone you know....sure.

Bottom line, PP G&S you are protected. Friends and family you are not. That is a fact. Thanks for adding all the value you were able to.

@skyewalker is correct, there are potential issues for the seller when using G&S. Buyer can report a problem, say they never received item, etc and PayPal will side with them.

Like someone else said, deal with people you trust.

 

[skyewalker]

So you've not personally had the issue, but someone you know....sure.

Bottom line, PP G&S you are protected. Friends and family you are not. That is a fact. Thanks for adding all the value you were able to.

Actually what I said was, that when it comes to new kids on the block like you, I’d never accept G&S from when selling an item. That does not mean I’m trying to scam you, it just means I’ve been on here a minute or two and have done a thing or two and know better than that.

 

[BlazinPond]

@skyewalker is correct, there are potential issues for the seller when using G&S. Buyer can report a problem, say they never received item, etc and PayPal will side with them.

Like someone else said, deal with people you trust.

WIth all due respect, that is simply not true. If you have tracking, PP will side with you. Happened personally to me, multiple times.

 

[skyewalker]

WIth all due respect, that is simply not true. If you have tracking, PP will side with you. Happened personally to me, multiple times.

Im not bashing you, but what we are telling you is that you just don’t know what you don’t know. There are many ways. PP is not seller friendly.

 

[Zuul]

Did you send a money order? I assume the seller has been on the Hide for awhile? I just got ripped off by OpticsandAmmo.com because I wasn’t diligent in google checking them before I ordered, 90% of stuff I’ve bought in the last 2 years has been from Hide vendors and the other 10% was from Midway/Brownells. I guess I needed a refresher on internet purchases, lol. At least I paid with a CC so I can get my cash back but goddamn I’d love to Chuck Norris kick that fucker right upside the head.

 

[BlazinPond]

Actually what I said was, that when it comes to new kids on the block like you, I’d never accept G&S from when selling an item. That does not mean I’m trying to scam you, it just means I’ve been on here a minute or two and have done a thing or two and know better than that.

That odd decision is up to you, even though it doesn't make any sense.
Regardless of my time here on this particular forum, i've likely bought and sold more in PP than 99.99% of most SH members.
Maybe i'm just extremely lucky, but never had an issue that wasn't sided in my favor.

 

[thehun]

Thanks for letting us know. That is appreciated.

I do get upset how here (the Hide) and AR15.com SELLERS in the classifieds push PAYPAL Friends and Family (Only) and DISCREET. You have zero recourse similar to sending a money order. Mounts and scopes Via PP Goods and Services is OK. This is NOT against any PP policy. I wish Admins on both sites reinforced this better. Otherwise, it will never get better. Sorry, rant over.

I always give the option to either send friends and family or G/S...but if paying G/S...the buyer covers fees...99.5% of the time...people send F/F...

 

[BlazinPond]

I always give the option to either send friends and family or G/S...but if paying G/S...the buyer covers fees...99.5% of the time...people send F/F...

Agree. I appreciate when sellers give the option, instead of push F&F only.
Probably because of my experience, i always choose to add 3 or 4% (to pay the fee's) because i know i'm covered and had personal experience where it came in handy.

 

[Ravenyzf-r6]

People have been scammed by buyers who claim there was nothing in the box or only rocks etc. Friends and Family is the best protection for sellers, but even then there is no guarantee. I have had my credit card dispute one and got my money back thankfully. I always request F&F, people that don’t like it are welcome to move on or send a USPs money order.

Thanks for letting everyone know about the scammer and I hope you can get you funds back. In this day and age it should be much easier to get the authorities involved in this stuff.

 

[BlazinPond]

People have been scammed by buyers who claim there was nothing in the box or only rocks etc. Friends and Family is the best protection for sellers, but even then there is no guarantee. I have had my credit card dispute one and got my money back thankfully. I always request F&F, people that don’t like it are welcome to move on or send a USPs money order.

Thanks for letting everyone know about the scammer and I hope you can get you funds back. In this day and age it should be much easier to get the authorities involved in this stuff.

I understand what you're saying.
As a seller YOU WANT people to pay via F&F because you got the money regardless of what you ship or what is in the box.
All the risk is on the BUYER. That's the issue.

This thread started as the OP was the BUYER who likely paid via F&F and HAS ZERO recourse through PP because of that.

The question you should ask is HOW TO CONDUCT A TRANSACTION SUCH THAT THE BUYER AND SELLER ARE BOTH PROTECTED.
Those sellers that say they only want buyers who will ONLY pay via F&F are contributing to the problem.
As such, you are short sighted. Like it or not.

 

[BlazinPond]

View attachment 7375219
Thanks guys and gals...

Since your willing tell more of the story with the seller, how long has it been since seller went silent? Has it been days, weeks or months?
Of course there are plenty of scammers out there, how do you know he wasn't in an accident or in the hospital with a family member who is dying of COVID?
Just curious, not trying to start anything. I'm genuinely interested.

 

[OneShot63]

Since your willing tell more of the story with the seller, how long has it been since seller went silent? Has it been days, weeks or months?
Of course there are plenty of scammers out there, how do you know he wasn't in an accident or in the hospital with a family member who is dying of COVID?
Just curious, not trying to start anything. I'm genuinely interested.

I can share it with you via PM if you like... There is a story to be told, and very highly doubtful that any of the instances you describe are possibilities, doubtful, but not out of the realm of possibility ! It’s been days since the Mount was to be shipped and each day of communication was a promise to ship the next day.

 

[Gatorshark]

What's so hard to understand that PP is not seller friendly? Cone on now. Not gonna get spelled out for you I'm sure.

 

[MCSO1357]

All the noobs shrieking at each other is funny shit. Buy from established members and those with positive feedback.

 

[lash]

Thanks for letting us know. That is appreciated.

I do get upset how here (the Hide) and AR15.com SELLERS in the classifieds push PAYPAL Friends and Family (Only) and DISCREET. You have zero recourse similar to sending a money order. Mounts and scopes Via PP Goods and Services is OK. This is NOT against any PP policy. I wish Admins on both sites reinforced this better. Otherwise, it will never get better. Sorry, rant over.

This site is not here just for you to buy and sell shit. If that’s what you’re looking for, try EBay. I’m sure that your experience will be better...

Frank, who owns and runs this site (and the moderators) gets more than his share of grief from people who think that his sole purpose in life should be to protect them from themselves.

Consider yourselves fortunate that he doesn’t just shut down the PX altogether.

 

[jcmullis2]

Im not bashing you, but what we are telling you is that you just don’t know what you don’t know. There are many ways. PP is not seller friendly.

I was taken for a scope with pp g/s. Never again. I’d rather keep my shit than be fucked out of it by some shit bag. PP isn’t their for the seller regardless of what they say.

 

[BlazinPond]

This site is not here just for you to buy and sell shit. If that’s what you’re looking for, try EBay. I’m sure that your experience will be better...

Frank, who owns and runs this site (and the moderators) gets more than his share of grief from people who think that his sole purpose in life should be to protect them from themselves.

Consider yourselves fortunate that he doesn’t just shut down the PX altogether.

Never said it was. Thanks for assuming.
And... i certainly could care less if there was a classified section or not here.

 

[BlazinPond]

All the noobs shrieking at each other is funny shit. Buy from established members and those with positive feedback.

What's funny is watching people that think they are veterans and know-it-all.... be showed up by someone that has less posts.

 

[BlazinPond]

I was taken for a scope with pp g/s. Never again. I’d rather keep my shit than be fucked out of it by some shit bag. PP isn’t their for the seller regardless of what they say.

No doubt, there is more to the story. I won't ask...

 

[lash]

What's funny is watching people that think they are veterans and no-it-all.... be showed up by someone that has less posts.

It’s “Know-it-all”...

 

[BlazinPond]

It’s “Know-it-all”...

Well done. Value add

 

[Midwest Optics]

I've been selling for over 10 years. Have 100ks of thousands in paypal transactions. Have probably close to 1k feedback among all selling sites and never once have I lost a paypal dispute as a seller. Not saying it can't happen but is very unlikely. All the people crying that paypal only sides with the buyer is either hoping on the bandwagon or there is more to the story most likely

Literally as long as u ship with tracking, cover it with insurance, if its over $750 signature is required, and ship what you are supposed to 99.9% chance paypal will side with you

I've seen people video themselves opening a package to find rocks, tools, a brick, etc and paypal not side with them in the dispute until they appealed it.

If u are that paranoid as a buyer then counter it by video yourself boxing it up and attaching the label

Cause sorry I dont care if u have 100s of transactions and feedback if I dont know u personally or done deals with you in the past im paying the extra 3% to cover my ass. I've been scammed and seen people scammed by guys with over 100 feedback before. Desperate times will make people do shitty things

 

[lash]

Well done. Value add

Oh, a live one! An actual “Know-it-all” who wants to play. Good to have you on board! We don’t get but about three or four a day like you. Thanks for your contribution to the site and for sharing your vast knowledge with us. I am humbled in your online presence.

 

[BlazinPond]

Oh, a live one! An actual “Know-it-all” who wants to play. Good to have you on board! We don’t get but about three or four a day like you. Thanks for your contribution to the site and for sharing your vast knowledge with us. I am humbled in your online presence.

View attachment 7375321

I understand your type.
When you have NOTHING to add (but spell check) trying to change the subject, flex or whatever it is that you 'think' you're doing.
Grow up.

 

[pmclaine]

Is that Gary on the right or left?

 

[TripleOrNothing]

I'm too new here to buy or sell using FF. I'm also too new here to know what comments I can get away with about that picture.

But seriously, that sucks.

 

[BlazinPond]

I've been selling for over 10 years. Have 100ks of thousands in paypal transactions. Have probably close to 1k feedback among all selling sites and never once have I lost a paypal dispute as a seller. Not saying it can't happen but is very unlikely. All the people crying that paypal only sides with the buyer is either hoping on the bandwagon or there is more to the story most likely

Literally as long as u ship with tracking, cover it with insurance, if its over $750 signature is required, and ship what you are supposed to 99.9% chance paypal will side with you

I've seen people video themselves opening a package to find rocks, tools, a brick, etc and paypal not side with them in the dispute until they appealed it.

If u are that paranoid as a buyer then counter it by video yourself boxing it up and attaching the label

Cause sorry I dont care if u have 100s of transactions and feedback if I dont know u personally or done deals with you in the past im paying the extra 3% to cover my ass. I've been scammed and seen people scammed by guys with over 100 feedback before. Desperate times will make people do shitty things

Yes, this ^^

It's quite obvious, the attackers above have little to no first hand experience like we do.
Similar to you, I have 19 years of buying/selling (not my day job either) on various forums w/ over $100k's of PP experience.

I did not come on here to start a fight. I just wanted to learn... since i think i have a pretty good idea of how PP works.
Heaven forbid that i provide my thoughts regarding disappointment in Buyers pushing 'Friends and Family Discretely' to people that are NOT friends nor family and thus NOT protected.

Those that came out with the pitchforks, you should be embarrassed.
Worst case, admit defeat and attempt to learn vs. defend an incorrect assumption.

 

[lash]

So let’s recap, you came into this thread guns a-blazin’ and just know all of the answers. Well, that’s good enough, as we need people with answers. It’s what the site is all about. Then you whine about how it bothers you so much that we allow buyers and sellers to conduct business like adults and caveat emptor.

Thanks for letting us know. That is appreciated.

I do get upset how here (the Hide) and AR15.com SELLERS in the classifieds push PAYPAL Friends and Family (Only) and DISCREET. You have zero recourse similar to sending a money order. Mounts and scopes Via PP Goods and Services is OK. This is NOT against any PP policy. I wish Admins on both sites reinforced this better. Otherwise, it will never get better. Sorry, rant over.

So I pointed out to you that this is not a site for those that need their hand held and it is most certainly not a site dedicated to buyers and sellers and protecting same from themselves.

This site is not here just for you to buy and sell shit. If that’s what you’re looking for, try EBay. I’m sure that your experience will be better...

Frank, who owns and runs this site (and the moderators) gets more than his share of grief from people who think that his sole purpose in life should be to protect them from themselves.

Consider yourselves fortunate that he doesn’t just shut down the PX altogether.

You get snarky and inform me that you don’t care, despite posting about 29 times in this and the other thread, looking a whole lot like you’re trying to ramp up to sell something.

Never said it was. Thanks for assuming.
And... i certainly could care less if there was a classified section or not here.

I, now thinking it’s funny how you care (but don’t care) and find it humorous when you post a big snark pointing out how you are superior to established members, but miss-spell in your snark. Pretty funny, no?

It’s “Know-it-all”...

Now, you have to show how bad you are but have lost your way, so you resort to the 13-year-old girl comment and tell me that I’m immature.

I understand your type.
When you have NOTHING to add (but spell check) trying to change the subject, flex or whatever it is that you 'think' you're doing.
Grow up.

Lololol!!

 

[Kartman]

I can confirm PP leans toward buyers vs sellers. Even with G/S you can lose your money as a seller.

 

[BlazinPond]

So let’s recap, you came into this thread guns a-blazin’ and just know all of the answers. Well, that’s good enough, as we need people with answers. It’s what the site is all about. Then you whine about how it bothers you so much that we allow buyers and sellers to conduct business like adults and caveat emp


So I pointed out to you that this is not a site for those that need their hand held and it is most certainly not a site dedicated to buyers and sellers and protecting same from themselves


You get snarky and inform me that you don’t care, despite posting about 29 times in this and the other thread, looking a whole lot like you’re trying to ramo



I, now thinking it’s funny how you care (but don’t care) find it humorous when you post a big snark pointing out how you are superior to established members, but miss-spell in your snark. Pretty funny, no?


Now, you have to show how bad you are but have lost your way, so you resort to the 13-year-old girl comment and tell me that I’m immature.

Lololol!!

All you've done is ignore the facts and attack at a 'newbie' that you think you're better than because you don't agree with my comment and position.
I certainly didn't come in, guns-a-blazin' when re-reading my first post.

I think you'd be surprised if you actually attempt to add value, attempt to learn and attempt to understand that new members have the potential to add value.
As hard as it might be for you to admit that a newbie may know more than you on a particular subject.

 

[skyewalker]

As a seller YOU WANT people to pay via F&F because you got the money regardless of what you ship or what is in the box.
All the risk is on the BUYER. That's the issue.

This is also factually incorrect, buyers can still get you if they paid F&F even though it gets little trickier for them, still doable though (first hand experience before you ask again). I really don’t know why you’re here arguing with established members about this. We know where you’re coming from, but your knowledge is lacking. I still wish you well and hope you get enough posts on this site to be able to actually sell on here per the rules.

 

[TripleOrNothing]

There has to be a joke about that pic and the guy working for Global Special Effects.

 

[TripleOrNothing]

As a seller YOU WANT people to pay via F&F because you got the money regardless of what you ship or what is in the box.
All the risk is on the BUYER. That's the issue.

☝This is also factually incorrect, buyers can still get you if they paid F&F even though it gets little trickier for them, still doable though (first hand experience before you ask again). I really don’t know why you’re here arguing with established members about this. We know where you’re coming from, but your knowledge is lacking. I still wish you well and hope you get enough posts on this site to be able to actually sell on here per the rules.

Dispute with CC company that's linked to Paypal. Tell them you were scammed.

 

[Twins82]

Hard to tell is that 2 dude or 2 women in that photo

 

[BlazinPond]

As a seller YOU WANT people to pay via F&F because you got the money regardless of what you ship or what is in the box.
All the risk is on the BUYER. That's the issue.

☝This is also factually incorrect, buyers can still get you if they paid F&F even though it gets little trickier for them, still doable though (first hand experience before you ask again). I really don’t know why you’re here arguing with established members about this. We know where you’re coming from, but your knowledge is lacking. I still wish you well and hope you get enough posts on this site to be able to actually sell on here per the rules.

I stand by my position as you have not provided any factual evidence to help me understand how a seller incurs any risk receiving funds via F&F.
Not saying I don't believe you but it doesn't make any sense.

 

[TripleOrNothing]

@brainstodart get in here and explain yourself.

 

[hereinaz]

Put feedback in the feedback section.
Put your complaints and comments about "the system" in the section called "I don't care and shut up with this already".

In all your names, I just donated money to Frank, cause I am grateful he hosts this and putting up with the repetitive and childish crap.

Account upgrades

www.snipershide.com

If you can't handle life without griping about it here, don't do business on the internet. I've NEVER had a single problem with a purchase. If I do, I know it is on me and I will leave feedback and be done with it.

 

[hereinaz]

Put up some love for Frank!

 

[roostercogburn98]

I thought this was a site for the learned shooter not an abortion clinic?

 

[skyewalker]

I stand by my position as you have not provided any factual evidence to help me understand how a seller incurs any risk sending F&F.
Not saying I don't believe you but it doesn't make any sense.

Those that know, know. We certainly aren’t going to educate buyers on here how to get free product. Conduct your transactions as you please and so will the rest of us. I just had to point out the incorrect info you provided. Please don’t take it personally.

 

[Mr. Z]

There has to be a joke about that pic and the guy working for Global Special Effects.

And the name being “brainstodart”. Slow-pitch.

 

[lash]

Put feedback in the feedback section.
Put your complaints and comments about "the system" in the section called "I don't care and shut up with this already".

In all your names, I just donated money to Frank, cause I am grateful he hosts this and putting up with the repetitive and childish crap.

Account upgrades

www.snipershide.com

If you can't handle life without griping about it here, don't do business on the internet. I've NEVER had a single problem with a purchase. If I do, I know it is on me and I will leave feedback and be done with it.

That’s why I keep on paying for the online training access. $18/month to support the site.