Cheating at Local NWPRL match and the consequences

[NLivingston]

So the big news around the precision rifle scene is William Dawson cheating on a self sqauded and scored local match (NWPRL JC Steel match). Penciling himself in for hits he never got and then adamantly denying it until forced to. Now after cheating to try and win a local level match he's been dropped by every sponsor and his name has been drug through the dirt across the sport.

He's also been banned from the NWPRL until 2019 so he threw away everything for a few points at a local level match and the sport is so small that its already got around and he probably wont be comfortable shooting anywhere.

It not worth your name and relationships to try and steal a few points. Dont be a D bag! Have fun and enjoy the sport guys its not that serious!

 

[diverdon]

The way I read the letters from his sponsors they sound like they are at least considering giving him a second chance in 2019 when he gets his eligibility back. Perhaps they hope that by then he will have figured out a method to cheat without being caught.

 

[Shadow knows]

Well..................................sad

 

[Eric32]

all set aside, great photoshop work!

 

[redneckbmxer24]

This reminds me of high school and all the drama/gossip between the girls LOL. Was posting this really necessary to further slam him? If he cheated I'm sure that he's very aware that he fucked up and I'm sure the community already knows or will shortly.

I don't know the guy and have no dog in the fight but there's always two sides to every story. I'm NOT saying he didn't cheat nor am I backing him in any way but your one screenshot of his Facebook post is at least plausible. He claims a spotter called a flip on the target, is this true? Any way to prove it one way or another? What about the hits that he claims he thought he saw splashes? Any way to back it up or confirm they were falsified. Was there not spotters on these stages?

Is there more to the story from first hand witnesses (RO's, spotters, others squadded with him)? If you're going to publicly slander someone you should present some facts to support the claims when doing so.

Furthermore, if the match was self scored/spotted I'm sure he's not the only one who cheated. It's not right and no excuse for him (if he cheated) but it's the truth. There's plenty of dishonest folks in the world and is why matches should be scored by RO's and the MD. I've only ever shot one self scored match and witnessed cheating first hand so I'd never shoot one again just to avoid that entire mess. I've also personally witnessed an instance where others have accused a shooter of cheating when they absolutely were not. Prize tables make people do silly shit sometimes.

 

[Sheldon N]

I was at the match, not in his squad.

It was not a self scored match, but rather a self RO'd match with small squads of around 4 people and your squad mates were supposed to spot and score for you. Not impossible to get your hands on your own score sheet, though how it would get past your squad mates is beyond me. It certainly didn't get past anyone else. The score he claimed to have gotten beat out all the top shooters in the league in tough conditions, and William has never even put up a score remotely close to that in prior matches. He's a mid pack shooter at best.

As to RO and prize tables, this was a small league match which was a long drive for everyone. No way in heck we could come up with 10 RO's. Most of our small matches are self-RO'd and we have no issues. There was no prize table here, just a couple small trophies and league points and bragging rights.

Regardless, this drama was all dealt with already, dirty laundry and all aired out on Facebook group for the league. He's publicly apologized and confessed, including making phone calls to the top shooters and apologizing personally. It's done and over with.

 

[RyanM]

Up in Canada we do not have the ability to get people to RO and score all day at our events so everything is done by the people on the squad, it has worked well so far.

We have squad leaders (the match organizers for the most part - we shoot but our scores are only used to brag to the other match organizers) that try to handle most of it but we get relief help from other people on the squad. I am not quite sure how something like this could happen unless people colluded or there was a pretty big lack of controls over the score sheets.

With so many guys shooting 6mm pills it is occasionally hard to call impacts on targets that are farther away and sometimes the spotters miss things. I try to give the shooter the benefit of the doubt most of the time. All of the prizes that are given out at our matches are done on a random draw so there is no tangible benefit to cheating.

Related (sort of) is the fact that I do not like stage re-shoots. If it is an obstacle/barricade stage running it a second time can really give someone an advantage.

Edited: I should say in Western Canada - Ontario has a sanctioned match that has volunteers but their population is much bigger than out west.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

I was at the match, not in his squad.

It was not a self scored match, but rather a self RO'd match with small squads of around 4 people and your squad mates were supposed to spot and score for you. Not impossible to get your hands on your own score sheet, though how it would get past your squad mates is beyond me. It certainly didn't get past anyone else. The score he claimed to have gotten beat out all the top shooters in the league in tough conditions, and William has never even put up a score remotely close to that in prior matches. He's a mid pack shooter at best.

As to RO and prize tables, this was a small league match which was a long drive for everyone. No way in heck we could come up with 10 RO's. Most of our small matches are self-RO'd and we have no issues. There was no prize table here, just a couple small trophies and league points and bragging rights.

Regardless, this drama was all dealt with already, dirty laundry and all aired out on Facebook group for the league. He's publicly apologized and confessed, including making phone calls to the top shooters and apologizing personally. It's done and over with.

This clarifies a good bit, thanks. If someone is going to run around intentionally spreading gossip and slandering someone it should certainly be backed up. Hopefully William returns with a clear head and no greed to cloud morals. It isn't worth it,


A message to the OP... It's quite clear that you only posted here and in the "don't be these guys" thread to stir the pot. Take a step back dude, most people don't like this drama/gossip bullshit. People do this to have fun, it's not a reality show so "don't be one of those guys" running around like a hormonal teenage girl intentionally starting shit. You're being part of the problem, not a solution.

 

[jbailey]

A message to the OP... It's quite clear that you only posted here and in the "don't be these guys" thread to stir the pot. Take a step back dude, most people don't like this drama/gossip bullshit. People do this to have fun, it's not a reality show so "don't be one of those guys" running around like a hormonal teenage girl intentionally starting shit. You're being part of the problem, not a solution.

+1

Read John 8.7 for a reminder on why.

 

[308pirate]

A message to the OP... It's quite clear that you only posted here and in the "don't be these guys" thread to stir the pot. Take a step back dude, most people don't like this drama/gossip bullshit. People do this to have fun, it's not a reality show so "don't be one of those guys" running around like a hormonal teenage girl intentionally starting shit. You're being part of the problem, not a solution.

I don't see it that way and don't know either how you could guess at the OP's motivation. I see it as letting the rest of the community know where the bad apples are.

This issue may be known locally, and you may be right in that word might get around eventually, but there's nothing wrong with letting the community know some other way besides word of mouth.

I don't have a dog in this fight since I don't compete in PRS matches. I do compete in sporting clays and many of the smaller monthly tournaments are squad-scored much the same as this match was. This problem exists in s clays too and it helps nobody if the cheaters in either sport are not known to everyone.

Lastly, it doesn't look good when someone tries to slam someone else who exposes or publicizes a cheater.

Integrity is EVERYTHING

 

[Jhayesvw]

Would any of you think differently if a person had a pattern of deceit, cheating and lies for personal gain?

If a person had done unscrupulous things multiple times? Or should they still be given another chance?

 

[jbailey]

I think publicly outing the guy is right. But to take all that time to do those graphics of the guy and 'his favorite caliber, a pencil' ... that is teenage girl behavior. Out the guy with the facts but leave all the opinions/mud slinging to yourself.

And as I said:

He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at [him]

 

[diverdon]

Would any of you think differently if a person had a pattern of deceit, cheating and lies for personal gain?

If a person had done unscrupulous things multiple times? Or should they still be given another chance?

In vernacular of today a second chance has come to mean that after expressing some minor regret for being caught, any sanctions resulting from a persons sins should be removed and the sins themselves should be spoken of no further except to prove the meanness of the speaker. I don't see that being fair to any honest shooter.

What about all the previous matches where he may have cheated and moved up in the standings and took prizes and motivation from other shooters. What about people who saw or suspected what he was doing and thought "what a bunch of dirt bags these people are." What about all the prizes this guy has that someone else earned. What if another shooter needed one of those prizes to stay in the game.

I would say that this guy needs to be stripped of every prize he ever earned then ridiculed and forgotten.

 

[PDXGS]

Shocker....cheating by sponsored shooters....just shocking
What a douchebag....unfortunately, probably not the only one wearing colors.
Call him out and ban him- and ban anyone else who cheats. That should thin the herd.

 

[fdkay]

I have seen this behavior at local IPSC and IDPA matches with NOTHING on the line but bragging rights.

Very good response from from Patriot Valley and Prime.
But, if i were at a match and this tool bag was shooting, I would question EVERYTHING scored as a hit.
A man (or woman) doesn't have much in life that will live on after they pass, and integrity (or lack thereof) is one of those things.
Folks will tell you that I'm an asshole, but an honest, ethical one (or so I hope).
You know what they say, suck one dick and you are a cocksucker for life.

 

[diverdon]

I have seen this behavior at local IPSC and IDPA matches with NOTHING on the line but bragging rights.

Very good response from from Patriot Valley and Prime.
But, if i were at a match and this tool bag was shooting, I would question EVERYTHING scored as a hit.
A man (or woman) doesn't have much in life that will live on after they pass, and integrity (or lack thereof) is one of those things.
Folks will tell you that I'm an asshole, but an honest, ethical one (or so I hope).
You know what they say, suck one dick and you are a cocksucker for life.

Yeah, but there is nothing wrong with being a cocksucker, cheaters are skum--not even good enough to suck cock.

 

[Squat]

Not trying to be a jerk but misusing that verse is not helping. Taken literally, no one has any right to say anything about another soul, that include KJU, Al Baghdadi, murders, and rapists. So please don't be using that to justify the fact that someone mentioned a cheater, there is no "well murder is bad so it theft and we should out those criminals......." You want to use that verse? Then apply it daily and dont use it because you are casting stones at people casting stones.
Again coming from Bass fishing where I have seen some big time cheating, the way you police the sport is to show the consquences. If you cheat everyone is going to know who you are and the spotlight of scrutiny will be on you.
yeah this guy is going to have to accept the court of public opinion which is a sight better than 5 years in jail for attempting to defraud $XXXX which is a felony. What am I saying? Well in the last Bass tournament when someone was caught cheating the DA hit him with the FULL cost of first place which was a few grand, in some cases close to 6 figures. Point is for a 2500$ local prize the man lost his freedom, was banned from purchasing a fishing license and lost his ability to own weapons.

So all in all having people look at him with scrutiny is getting off easy and makes him work that much harder, also to have the story of dont be me, but if you do make it right and get back on your horse.