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Dealing With Millenial Children

The sad thing is we are seeing this generation enter the work force and wanting the same benefits as the people who have been there 20 years. They go to HR and complain that they have to work the weekends or a shift they don't like because of seniority. They are impossible to deal with and have no work ethic to perform.
 
We have two millennial sons. Both have families and both have successful careers working for the same companies since graduation. Oldest is rearing three boys, the youngest is working on his MBA. I do not take all the credit.

We have friends with millennial kids reared the same as ours. Some are productive members of society, some aren't. You can do all the right things, but you can't make their choices.
 
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Tough love....

Cheers,

Sirhr
 
I formulated my opinion by way of personal experience. I am on the early side of gen-X and I have millennials that work for me, 2 of 4 siblings that are millennial's, and a son that is early gen-Z. No way to get all of it in here, so I will take a quick stab at it.

Mostly I blame the boomers (notice how I did that [grin] ). They raised a bunch of latchkey kids that had to figure things out on their own. Way less structure than they (boomers) grew up with, so we (I) simply expect everyone (gen-X) to be able to figure things out on their own. We got told something, we heard it but maybe did not believe it, found it to be true and paid the consequence. We also did whatever we could to keep from making that same stupid move. Nobody to cry to - parents out at the clubs, too tired from fighting with each other, out working, on vacation, whatever. Venting to friends required getting them to pick up the phone or walking/riding your bike/driving (depending on age) to see if you could find them. By the time you got there you calmed down, thought about it, and did not have much to say.

Now, the millennial experience. People being, well, people, we do tend to 'correct' the things. Boomers left gen-X to go figure it out, no shoulder to cry on, helmet? WTF is that?, trophy? you sucked too much - try harder next time. Naturally the gen-X crowd does the opposite. Enter the Helicopter parent, wipe your nose, no riding without a helmet, everyone gets a trophy. When a millennial gets pissed at a gen-X parents or the parent has the rare "sorry, that is just how it it is moment," the millennial grabs the wonderful 3x5 texting machine, keyboard, or parents keys and now has an entire globe to complain to, who in return will tell them how cheated they were and how right they are to be upset.

Gen-X took on way too much responsibility to show-up their boomer parents, and millennials coddle each other. The divide could not be bigger. The best thing for a millennial is their parents to truly stop aside, and for them to work for someone that knows what the heck they are doing, does not micro-manage, and puts a crap load of responsibility on them (the millennial). Even working for a boomer is a bad idea. They are at the stage in life where talking and feelings matter (grandparent syndrome). Absent this, millennials rarely figure it out.

The TLTR is whomever they work for needs to dump a crap load of responsibility on them, hold them to it so they feel the ownership, and their parents need to say "yup, sounds like you better pick up that rope and pull" rather than the I'm sorry, here is your trophy crap.
 
We have two millennial sons. Both have families and both have successful careers working for the same companies since graduation. Oldest is rearing three boys, the youngest is working on his MBA. I do not take all the credit.

We have friends with millennial kids reared the same as ours. Some are productive members of society, some aren't. You can do all the right things, but you can't make their choices.
Your results are more common in flyover country.

R
 
Your results are more common in flyover country.

R

Got lucky in Florida.

I think it has little to do with location. We have friends who are very successful. They reared two millennial daughters who had everything they desired...but, their parents demanded good grades, they had chores, deeply involved in the church, etc. One is a doctor, the other works with disabled children and has three adopted kids.
 
My oldest is in college . 2nd computer science . Works the majority of every weekend in a hotel as a bartender to get money . I pay His fees and he covers the rest . Gives him respect for hard work and nothing coming free . My youngest is 15 .. His pocket money is dependent upon gown many Chores he does every week .

Both great kids and no bull shit . If I say no to them they don’t ask again .
 
Veer, here's a question for you. Does your son know what actual 'work' is? Have you gotten him to actually dig a sizeable hole in the yard with a single shovel? Minimum length/width/depth requirements in a limited time-frame? By himself?

My point being, if he were to actually be required to actually accomplish said task, and THEN be paid the value of said task (we all know that is very minimal expense considering inverse expenditure of effort) then he might grasp what "pay" is deserved and earned differences.

Just a suggestion, but the way thoughts are conceptualized by so many delusional masses is absolutely slanted compared to reality. A definite "re-alignment" and/or "calibration of brains" needs to happen, in a general sense.

Run with that.

And, on a whole other note, with a totally different tangent of a similar topic, there will be a PM coming to you very shortly. I promise you that.
 
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In my opinion kids that have grown up having it easy have no idea how to fight or figure things out on their own. Struggles and discipline breed toughness! As a coach that has felt with kids over 30 yrs, I have seen kids change for the most part in the mental and physical toughness. Also their abilility to focus has changed! As a parent of 3, my kids are way better kids than I was, just not the things as I eluded to above.
 
What's interesting is I hear the above statements from every parent I have ever dealt with. They all say THEIR kid would never be like that but in FACT......they are....including mine. Mine had to learn the lessons the hard way and is a much better person for it and sees his millennial counterparts in his new found light.
 
The sad thing is we are seeing this generation enter the work force and wanting the same benefits as the people who have been there 20 years. They go to HR and complain that they have to work the weekends or a shift they don't like because of seniority. They are impossible to deal with and have no work ethic to perform.

This is exactly what I’ve been dealing with at work. It’s seniority based but you can’t tell that to the new kids because they say seniority isn’t “fair”. The new kids have figured out if they run to managers and tattle about anything, some senior people can get fired. It’s to the point that anyone with 8 years or more is now avoiding the new kids as much as possible and only talking to them when necessary and only about work related tasks.
 
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They (Millennials) have been raised in a world that is changing so fast that many of the "old" rules simply will not apply to them nor the solutions to classic problems. The world and the workplace and our social culture has changed in ways that have made the old tried and true solutions and ethics that have existed literally for thousands of years obsolete.

There are jobs for everyone (jobs galore) but many of them, most of them, don't pay a living wage....the cost of health care, homes, and needed accessories (like phones, cars, and laptops) in relationship to what people actually earn makes it impossible for some to get medical treatment, live in a decent place, or get transportation that helps them get a better job. Multi million dollar business and stock deals can be executed via a cell phone. Information flow and technology is reinventing it so fast that a really good plan is sometimes obsolete in seconds. The Media and our Politicians have been paid and are owned by people with more money and love of power over our lives than at any time in history - never have so few owned such a large part of the resources. Literally .01% own more than 90% below them. Add to this that America is in the midst of a Civil War (cold war so far) and it's no wonder they do not repond to the same stimulus nor follow the "old tried and true" which is now gone never to return.

Some Millenials are not gonna play by the old rules that are obsolete and not working for them. Some of them are gonna be very different from what we perceive as "normal" cause normal has shifted and will keep shifting now.

I'm 63 by the way.

VooDoo
 
I will provide an example of how this affects the real world and why you statement about a changing world and old tied and trued solutions doesn't really hold water. (No disrespect intended)

From and engineering standpoint we are hiring these millennials right out of college and they are being coached that they have the new technology and superior way to do things. So what do we see, reinventing the same problems into products that we saw 10 years ago. They should all have to read a book of failures for the first year they are in the work force and not be allowed to touch anything! JMHO!

And oh by the way.....they want top pay at the start!
 
theres times i have to have some of the men ride in the back of the big truck, unless there are chicks in the cab, i only role two deep.
this one particular time, i say load up and when i climb into truck, my right hand man wasnt there, seated there was a temp who was alot older than my guy...
i asked what the fuck he was polluting the cab of my truck for and where was my homeboy, idiot thought because of his age he got shotgun...
no
no
nooooo
i told fuck knuckle to get in the bed of the truck as he did not have seniority, and before i told him, my fucking way or the highway, i think he maybe a little thought he was going to argue...ah hahahaha
that young kid that jumped back in my truck, because he did have the motts, seniority,looked a couple inches taller...
 
I will provide an example of how this affects the real world and why you statement about a changing world and old tied and trued solutions doesn't really hold water. (No disrespect intended)

From and engineering standpoint we are hiring these millennials right out of college and they are being coached that they have the new technology and superior way to do things. So what do we see, reinventing the same problems into products that we saw 10 years ago. They should all have to read a book of failures for the first year they are in the work force and not be allowed to touch anything! JMHO!

And oh by the way.....they want top pay at the start!

I interviewed a twenty-something fresh off his BS degree. Within the first 10 minutes he called me a graybeard, said his professors told him to expect +$85k walking in the door, and that he expected to have my job in 5 years (I was a Director at the time). I smiled at him and said "allow me to show you what young, arrogant, and stupid pays" and walked him out.
 
T

There are jobs for everyone (jobs galore) but many of them, most of them, don't pay a living wage....

McDonald's (et al) jobs were never intended to provide a living wage for a baby momma with three kids from different fathers. Those jobs for HS kids or working your way through college or a trade school so you can earn a living wage and have children. You see an adult working at McD's it's most likely because they have zero ambition.
 
The sad thing is we are seeing this generation enter the work force and wanting the same benefits as the people who have been there 20 years. They go to HR and complain that they have to work the weekends or a shift they don't like because of seniority. They are impossible to deal with and have no work ethic to perform.

And sadly, from my experience, a lot of companies are giving it to them!!!!
 
my company recently hired a kid....2ish. he couldnt stay awake long enough to learn anything.

for me, this is the exception rather than the rule.

i have 2 boys, 17 and 15. the older boy has brought many of his friends over-every one of them has a job and are wonderful young people.

the up and coming generation are really quite something. most 20-30 years olds i have met seem pretty limp in comparison.
 
They (Millennials) have been raised in a world that is changing so fast that many of the "old" rules simply will not apply to them nor the solutions to classic problems. The world and the workplace and our social culture has changed in ways that have made the old tried and true solutions and ethics that have existed literally for thousands of years obsolete.

There are jobs for everyone (jobs galore) but many of them, most of them, don't pay a living wage....the cost of health care, homes, and needed accessories (like phones, cars, and laptops) in relationship to what people actually earn makes it impossible for some to get medical treatment, live in a decent place, or get transportation that helps them get a better job. Multi million dollar business and stock deals can be executed via a cell phone. Information flow and technology is reinventing it so fast that a really good plan is sometimes obsolete in seconds. The Media and our Politicians have been paid and are owned by people with more money and love of power over our lives than at any time in history - never have so few owned such a large part of the resources. Literally .01% own more than 90% below them. Add to this that America is in the midst of a Civil War (cold war so far) and it's no wonder they do not repond to the same stimulus nor follow the "old tried and true" which is now gone never to return.

Some Millenials are not gonna play by the old rules that are obsolete and not working for them. Some of them are gonna be very different from what we perceive as "normal" cause normal has shifted and will keep shifting now.

I'm 63 by the way.

VooDoo

I respectfully have to disagree. There are plenty of living wage jobs out there. But, they don't pay very well in the beginning, and most are unwilling to suck it up, and work their way up. They want it, and they want it now (lack of patience). They also want to be able to afford the luxuries of life from day one. Latest smart phone, latest clothes, latest year vehicle...and they believe it is okay to expect this (entitlement). Add to this, is their lack of empathy. COMPLETE lack of empathy. They think nothing of the YEARS it has taken people to work their way up to afford "the extras" (coincidentally referred to as "the necessities" by these Millennials). It's all "me", "my" and "mine" (narcissism), not "we" or "us".

Blaming politicians, the changing technology and social media is (in my mind) a cop out. This is all of our faults for allowing this bullshit to persist, or worse, rescuing our kids from themselves instead of letting them fail. I have two kids. The oldest was a handful...total Millennial attitude and a hot temper to go with it. Well, not unlike us in our day, he thought he knew better, and so out the door he went (he ended up with me after his mother, my ex, had had it). He's been on his own now for a couple of years and it's been interesting seeing how much he learned when he couldn't cajole, manipulate or game the system (amazing what happens when you miss a few meals, or get sick and tired of sleeping on someone's couch). Well, (thank God) the light bulb finally went fucking "click". He's doing better these days; not where I'd like to see him, but he's getting his head screwed on straight finally. My second, well, she is the quiet one. The proverbial anti-millennial. Is she still young and immature? Yep. But she's actually quite considerate, and thoughtful, which leads me to believe that just those two traits can go a long f'ing way in making life less hard. Course corrections with her have been much easier. No logic as to why one is one way, and the other is the other way. Just the way it is I suppose.

BLUF: Kids don't come with instructions, and each kid needs their own dose of reality, responsibility and support. Sometimes even if that "support" is the lack of it ("Fly monkeys, fly!"). There's almost always work available. It may not be the work you want, but its the work that's available. You take what you can get, and then leap frog from there. You never know, you may find an occupation you never considered, and find you are quite good at it, and someone is willing to pay handsomely for you to perform it.

This generation just lacks patience, empathy and is too wrapped up in themselves. I'm not a religious person, but I do find it ironic that most religions preach exactly what this generation is lacking. Perhaps there's a lesson there for people to ponder. Even if you aren't a "true believer", religion has it's place for our children, if for no other reason than to teach humility, empathy, patience and so on. I for one, despite not being a church goer or bible thumper, am damned sure glad my parents made it known "You will attend church every week until you leave this home. When you leave you are free to do as you wish, but until then you will attend." I don't attend church now, but am damned glad my parents made me do so when I was a child. I only wish my ex had done the same with my children. I think it would've saved everyone a lot of headaches...
 
Jesus this thread. Makes me think about all the hell I put my parents through. I'm sympathetic to your plight but things tend to turn around when children turn into functional adults. How you foster that transition determines whether you have a relationship with your kids later in life.
 
Jesus this thread. Makes me think about all the hell I put my parents through. I'm sympathetic to your plight but things tend to turn around when children turn into functional adults. How you foster that transition determines whether you have a relationship with your kids later in life.

I remember the boomers, who followed the gen xer's advise (rather than their fellow boomers) making claims like

"Well the kid will figure it out on their own. I dont have to do anything at all."
"Wine is good for the baby, 1 glass a day cures heart disease and cancer and alzheimers."
"All children are infallible, they won't remember a thing, memory is a social construct! We just have to wait it out! (while also doing nothing). "
"Money solves all problems - let's just throw a psychiatrist at him (while doing nothing at home), and it will work; after-all, science (marketing) has "discovered" all these new "disorders" and drugs to conveniently cure them for (from) us."
" All children are the same as how they were imagined in the 1600s - they are "little adults" who have literally volumetrically/functionally fully matured brains that just need to be instilled with morals. They need "discipline" and shit. If it doesn't work, it's their problem, NOT MINE"

My parents.

I see the same narrative in each generation: "I dont have to do anything if i feel any negativity at all, after all, any sign of my negativity means i must be doing something right. Therefore it's their problem."

This trend is traceable to pre-Greek times. Read some fucking history of philosophy books if you doubt it.
 
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my company recently hired a kid....2ish. he couldnt stay awake long enough to learn anything.

for me, this is the exception rather than the rule.

i have 2 boys, 17 and 15. the older boy has brought many of his friends over-every one of them has a job and are wonderful young people.

the up and coming generation are really quite something. most 20-30 years olds i have met seem pretty limp in comparison.


2 year olds do sleep a lot :ROFLMAO:
 
I have two millennials. They had to work for everything they have have. One learned easy and one learned hard. But both did learn thank goodness. So now Dad (me) gets to go to the range while they run the business. So I love millennials.

Now don't get me wrong they are not without issues. But their issues are no worse than mine were. :)
 
This is exactly what I’ve been dealing with at work. It’s seniority based but you can’t tell that to the new kids because they say seniority isn’t “fair”. The new kids have figured out if they run to managers and tattle about anything, some senior people can get fired. It’s to the point that anyone with 8 years or more is now avoiding the new kids as much as possible and only talking to them when necessary and only about work related tasks.
I remember when I graduated from my apprenticeship an opportunity of a lifetime presented itself.
I started working for the largest crane rental company in the united states, I soon became jealous of the senior operators.
It made me want to work harder to gain the right to become one of them, the elite.
I soon realized that the only way I was going to make the older guys accept me was paying my dues,putting my time in learning the job before I killed someone.
I spent my first five years being mentored and working under the guidance of those guys,learning who they were,learning my rite of passage.
After my first five years I started going out on my own.
I can remember many times I talked to the older guys when I had a problem.
After 31 years I retired this year,during my time I can say that we policed ourselves pretty good,we had to.
However,I did notice towards the end things changed where people were constantly throwing people under the bus and it makes me wonder if it was my fualt for not mentoring someone properly before passing the torch.
Why can't kids see the value of something earned?
 
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Seriously?

Yes, he is probably serious. I remember my first $60k a year job and I had to work my ass off getting there besides having help from Uncle Sam and two degrees. Had to fight for it tooth and nail. A lot of it depends on the field. 1 out of every 3 engineers for example are getting jobs so my pops tells me. That’s 33%. That’s a terrible rate. Now this was under the Obama years so I expect it’s better now with trump in office but you get my point.
 
Yes, he is probably serious. I remember my first $60k a year job and I had to work my ass off getting there besides having help from Uncle Sam and two degrees. Had to fight for it tooth and nail. A lot of it depends on the field. 1 out of every 3 engineers for example are getting jobs so my pops tells me. That’s 33%. That’s a terrible rate. Now this was under the Obama years so I expect it’s better now with trump in office but you get my point.

I can say that is not the case these days, but yeah, I hear you. I started as an engineer (lowest level) at $40k a year back in the late 90's. It was barely enough to live off of here in SoCal (especially with a monthly child support bill). That being said, I worked my way up, and am fairly comfortable these days. But what many miss, or neglect to understand is that it took me 20 years to move up the ranks to where I am today. And it sure didn't "just happen" based on time in grade or seniority.

Like I tell both my kids "Find the job that nobody wants to do, do it better than anyone else, and then train a replacement." Also "Never turn down the weird, off the wall assignments. You'd be surprised where they end up."
 
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I can say that is not the case these days, but yeah, I hear you. I started as an engineer (lowest level) at $40k a year back in the late 90's. It was barely enough to live off of here in SoCal (especially with a monthly child support bill). That being said, I worked my way up, and am fairly comfortable these days. But what many miss, or neglect to understand is that it took me 20 years to move up the ranks to where I am today. And it sure didn't "just happen" based on time in grade or seniority.

Like I tell both my kids "Find the job that nobody wants to do, do it better than anyone else, and then train a replacement." Also "Never turn down the weird, off the wall assignments. You'd be surprised where they end up."

Exactly! Hard work and time pays off. I’m still not where I want to be financially but I’m probably about topped out in my field, at least in this area. But, I still go and do my best everyday. Only way I’m probably making more is to start doing something else but then it would be a pay cut and working my way up again. Since I’m approaching 40 I want to avoid that lol, if I can. But you get what I mean. What really chaps me is these kids getting out of school and instantly wanting to make $100k a year. And some of them are actually getting it, which is astounding to me.
 
Both my wife and I work (She's the big deal, I am not). We have a lady that comes and cleans every other week. We pay her $140 to clean the house. It takes her about 2.5 hours, so I assume she does two or three per day ever week day. It was very hard to get her through a referral. She has more request than time.
If we say she works 5 days a week, and does just two houses per day (working 5 hours) that's $72,000 a year. A living wage? That's cleaning houses. Her husband has a small landscaping business. He probably does better than she does. These are the working "poor"? Yea, they turn to. That's what you do if you don't want to actually be poor.

That's totally unskilled though high attention to detail work. When she's done the house is clean to my standards. I doubt it would be much cleaner if I cleaned it myself, and I'm a bit of a freak.
 
I see fewer and fewer youth with a desire to prove to themselves, family, or world that they are self sufficient productive members of society.
The youth today seem to lack, or choose to ignore the understanding of goals, therefore are lost on the implementation of earning and achieving. They won't put efforts forward of the incentive i.e. "If you want me to do that, you need to pay me first." If the incentive isn't guaranteed, they lose interest altogether. There is no concern for the skills or abilities learned in the process. No apparent concern for consequence of their actions or inaction. "You pay for what you don't know" doesn't sway their safety net/entitled perspective. The easiest choice is always taken. There will always be someone that consoles them when the worlds pressure is too much.

Goals and Consequences didn't appear to be visible concerns to my teenage offspring. I didn't see a flicker of light until my son decided to take a friend up on an offer to volunteer at a soup kitchen. Up to and after this point he did not have a goal or destination in life. However, after helping those that couldn't/wouldn't provide for themselves, he saw what he didn't want to become. Kind of a polarizing example. He wasn't drawn to something, so he Thankfully found something to push away from.
He's now focused on a career in the Boy's and Girls Clubs, helping youth, not as a youth member.
 
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Both my wife and I work (She's the big deal, I am not). We have a lady that comes and cleans every other week. We pay her $140 to clean the house. It takes her about 2.5 hours, so I assume she does two or three per day ever week day. It was very hard to get her through a referral. She has more request than time.
If we say she works 5 days a week, and does just two houses per day (working 5 hours) that's $72,000 a year. A living wage? That's cleaning houses. Her husband has a small landscaping business. He probably does better than she does. These are the working "poor"? Yea, they turn to. That's what you do if you don't want to actually be poor.

That's totally unskilled though high attention to detail work. When she's done the house is clean to my standards. I doubt it would be much cleaner if I cleaned it myself, and I'm a bit of a freak.

Good post, but you are assuming they both have all days and everyday filled up. That may not always be the case. Even if it is it’s never guaranteed. However, it does illustrate the point that if you want it and work hard there are ways to make money. I personally would love to have one of these cleaning people but I don’t trust many people to be in my house, alone. For me, I’m not super rich but I do alright and it’s guaranteed money. Most days I sit around and get paid for being on the hide, or training or photographing something or watching Netflix and YouTube lol. Plus I work from home. Took many many years to get to that point tho.

P.S. my wife is the big deal at my house to. I am gaining on her tho but I get the luxury of what I said above while she busts her ass.
 
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Veer, here's a question for you. Does your son know what actual 'work' is? Have you gotten him to actually dig a sizeable hole in the yard with a single shovel? Minimum length/width/depth requirements in a limited time-frame? By himself?

My point being, if he were to actually be required to actually accomplish said task, and THEN be paid the value of said task (we all know that is very minimal expense considering inverse expenditure of effort) then he might grasp what "pay" is deserved and earned differences.

Just a suggestion, but the way thoughts are conceptualized by so many delusional masses is absolutely slanted compared to reality. A definite "re-alignment" and/or "calibration of brains" needs to happen, in a general sense.

Run with that.

And, on a whole other note, with a totally different tangent of a similar topic, there will be a PM coming to you very shortly. I promise you that.

Sean you make an excellent point . The sense of entitlement of today said kids is a pain in the ass !
 
I remember acting up in school and the teacher calling in my father , who showed up in the middle of class to whoop up on me in plain view of everyone I also remember that was the last time I never did anything like that again my father told the teacher he was only too happy to either do it him self or to give her the permission to do that for any reason she needed , at any time . Looking back i can smile about it knowing what i did was stupid . my action had consequences that hurt my but . I deserved it I knew it and I'm thankful for the discipline and care it showed while at the time i could not see it as a good thing , It taught me a lot.
 
I'll give my 2c since I'm generally lumped into the "worthless people to hire" category.

I'm 25, no higher education, started my own welding business at age 20. Have a nice house, 3 new cars, wife, kid on the way, Yada Yada. So I guess I'm a little different

Started working when I was 14/15 in a retail store my mom's friend owned where we were the only 2 people in the store. I earned a $100 gift card every month. I honestly believe it's that experience that shaped my entire future. I learned there how to speak to adults, take care of my responsibilities, develop a work ethic, etc.

I see a pretty good mix of how people I grew up with are turning out. I'd say one of the biggest problems my generation has is instant gradification. How could we not though? We were raised where everything we wanted was like that. Needed to know the answer to something? Ask jeeves, then Google. Don't Want to watch commercials? Dvr got you. Listen to the song you want? Pull it on up. Right here right now was almost always how things were accomplished it so many aspects of our lives growing up. Then we reach college and we are told if you get this degree you are going to make 100k/year. During college you can goof as much as you want and live to your own schedule. Uncle Sam will even front the bill if you dont Want to work. Sadly after we graduate we come to the very harsh reality that the working world does not work like that.

Next major problem is communication. My entire generation grew up with instant messaging, texting, etc. This was our main form of communication. We pioneered this. We were the lab rats. Uncomfortable conversations were almost exclusively done over some type of electronic messaging. So many people my age have no idea how to hold a conversation outside of messaging. We posted our entire lives online and were constantly reaffirmed in our social media echo chambers.

Last problem that was most likely the nail in the coffin is that we were the snowflake generation. We had to be protected, wear your helmet, you can do anything, you can't fail, everyone gets a prize.


TLDR a lot of my generation was doomed to final and learn very harsh lessons we had no way to be prepared for.