Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

[Amerigo]

I just ordered a B&C Medalist 5 fully-adjustable, but am now wondering if I should return it and just go for the McMillan A5 fully adjustable. I have some photography equipment I could sell to make up the difference in cost.

I've read all the posts on here saying that the B&C feels like cheap plastic compared with the Mac - but will a Mac really tighten my groups up? Will I actually see a difference in my shooting? Or will I just be really cool because my gun is running the best stock?

FYI - my current build is for long-distance target shooting, and I'd love to compete F-class. No hunting.

 

[Napsters]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

Most people will not be able to tell the difference. If you are rough on your stuff McMillan will handle it. B&C should take most reasonable bumps. Best advice I can give you is try to get your hands on both and see which you like better.

 

[Goin'Hot]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Amerigo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've read all the posts on here saying that the B&C feels like cheap plastic compared with the Mac - but will a Mac really tighten my groups up? Will I actually see a difference in my shooting? Or will I just be really cool because my gun is running the best stock?</div></div>

It really comes down to comfort. The two stocks "look" similar but they will feel totally different. They both are fully adjustable. I've had both and I prefered the feel of the McMillan stock. Not because it was "cooler" but because the grip angle was more correct for my build. I know it's said here ALL THE TIME, but it's true. The best thing you could do, would be to lay behind one of each and see how they fit YOU.

 

[Wyfox]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

I have several Mcmillan and HS Presicion stocks, both are good quality and have different feels and options. The biggest difference is the aluminum bedding block in the HS, there is pros and cons to that. Go with the HS and give it a try I'm sure you'll like it.

Like goin hot states if you could try them both you could be positive on what you want.

 

[sawman556]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

I'm not knocking B&C but McM and Manners are in a different class. The A-5 is tough to beat with Badger/Surgeon bottom metal and pillars. There are also some really good chassis systems on the market if you start moving towards the 1k mark. I don't plan on selling my A-5 but I'm really liking my Whiskey 3.

If money is an issue there nothing wrong with running a B&C. How well you bed your action is the most important part.

 

[echo3]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

Stocks are a very personal sort of choice to a degree. One will subjectively like the feel of one or another.

I LOVE McMillian. They have a feeling of solidity that help me tie into the rig.

 

[Roy Thorne]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

I love my McMillan A4. Very solid and hard and heavy.

 

[bdw0469]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

I switched from a laminate to a McM A5. Couldn't be happier. Although it took a while to find one in stock. I bought from McM specials page. "IF" I ever build another rifle It will get a McM. There is a reason they cost more... and they are worth it

 

[NOMAD]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

I was a long time MCM user owning 7 of them. Once Manners Stocks came online I got my first one and now I have been switching over to them.

I really love the T4A with the KMW check piece as well as the Mini Chasis options they offer.

Stock turnaround time is also faster then MCM.

Both stocks are rugged and dependable but the great customer service and faster delivery time and options makes Manners a better option for me.

 

[Emilio]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

Yes.

 

[GardDog]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

Find someone local to you who has one and get behind it to see if you can tell a difference. To me, McMillan is worth the extra bucks.

 

[turbo54]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

There is definitely something more "solid" about a McM or Manners over the B&C. Hard to put my finger on exactly what it is...but when you simply knock on it, you can tell. When you're behind it, and lean in to load the bipod, you can feel it.

That said, there's nothing wrong with a B&C. My Savage has been rocking the A3 for years, and it's been great. For $200(ish), it's a great value. However, I know the whizz-bang adjustable A5 is a lot more money. I don't think I'd pay over ~$350 for one - otherwise I'd get the McM.

 

[TRAAV]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

I like my A5 B&C alot. Im not sure I dont like them better than the McM. The only thing I dont care that much for is the forearm.

 

[Amerigo]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

Thanks for the replies everyone. One thing that is difficult is that I don't know anyone with any of these stocks, and the stores around me like BassPro, Cabelas, or Scheels don't have this kind of thing (not that I know of). So I can't really try any of them out.

A lot of people have mentioned that a Manners or Mac feel more "solid" than the B&C. I can definitely appreciate having "solid" feeling gear. But this rifle will be babied beyond belief, so I'm not concerned about "ruggedness" per say.

Does anyone feel that the "solidness" of a Manners or Mac translates into better groups? Lets say I was able to try both stocks out, and the B&C fit me better than a Mac - would my accuracy be affected at all by going with the B&C?

 

[Goin'Hot]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

The only reason that any of these would group better is IF it allowed you to be more consistant and comfortable. There is nothing magical about any of these stocks.

 

[Amerigo]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Goin'Hot</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The only reason that any of these would group better is IF it allowed you to be more consistant and comfortable. There is nothing magical about any of these stocks. </div></div>

So I know that el cheapo stocks will flex on you and result in poor accuracy. Is a B&C Medalist out of that "cheap" league? I'm putting 1k into a scope, buying top-notch rings, upgrading my trigger, etc... I just want to make sure I'm not negating any of that by putting a not-so-great stock on it.

But if B&C is past that "cheap" threshold, then I'll probably give it a whirl, and also try to get some range time with Manners and McMillan.

 

[Goin'Hot]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

You won't have to worry about "flex" in the B&C. It has the full length aluminum bedding block and a fiberglass shell. No issues there.

 

[gl51virus]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

I have the B&C Medalist 5 and am very happy with it. I am printing .25 MOA at 200yds through a custom Rem 700 done by PCR. Nothing wrong with this stock at all!

 

[Beef82]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

I've got a B&C light tac A3, not the same but a medalist, it does not feel cheap, unless you consider a hollow buttstock cheap, I feel its a way to cut weight and don't spend my day knocking on it, shooting it there is no discernable flex anywhere. If I grab the barrel and the end of the forearm and squeeze, hard, I can cause some deflection, I cannot make it touch the barrel, nothing one would do while shooting would generate the level of force required. I have an old non medalist that I drug around the mountains and tundra of AK for the better part of 20yrs that has a few finish digs but otherwise still serves admirably, so I think the brand is good, I wouldn't call any brand best too subjective.

Accuracy differences between stock come down to a few things, bedding, which should be moot if you do it rather than relying on the stock out of the box. It free floating the barrel, which should also be moot on any stock designed to do so with your barrel profile and the neccesary rigidity, which all mentioned have. And last and probably most important is how it fits the user, no one not observing you in firing positions can tell you what fits you best.

Really though from what I've observed with just about any aftermarket stock certainly including B&C, but more to the ones with long wait times, if you get it and decide you hate it before inletting or bedding you should have no problem selling it for very little loss. Even bedded to your rifle or inletted for a popular DBM as long as its not destroyed the value won't be effected too much.

 

[BoilerUP]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

I have a Bell & Carlson A2 Medalist on one rifle, and a Manners T2 on another that replaced an A2 Medalist..

The Manners hasn't made my shooting any more accurate than I was with the A2 medalist, but the T2 is *much* more ergonomic, lighter weight, and transmits a bit less felt recoil.

I've got a McMillan A5 on its way to CDI to be inletted, and look forward to comparing the three stocks side-by-side.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

Each has beaten me with ease...

 

[McLarenross]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Each has beaten me with ease... </div></div>
That is a good point too. Are you indian enough to tell the difference in accuracy your stock will make? My $.02 is as long as its bedded well it wont matter what brand is on the stock as far as pure accuracy goes. Fit and comfort though are so personal no one will be able to tell you that in an online forum. I personally have been behind both the B&C and McMillian A5 and both feel about the same to me. I like the feel and ergonomics of ARs so I went with the XLR chassis.

 

[Lochem158]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

I have used Manners, MCM, Bell, and HS, all are great stocks and you will find someone who like each one of the more than the others. I would suggest getting behind all of them before making a final decision. The Manners and MCM would be my recommendation, I have a T4A and sentinel MCM from KMW. I like the feel of the cheek rest better on the MCM. Above all you need to be comfortable on the stock so find the one that fits you best. IMHO

 

[lonely_wolf]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?



I used a enjoyed an HS Precison stock for a long time (HSP stocks are made in a similar fashion as the B&C stocks).

I eventually bought a McMillan and am incredibly more impressed by it. Of course, the statement is a bit misleading. McMillan has a wide variety of styles and options to choose from. It is a custom built stock. I chose a specific stock model, fill type, and added other options to make it absolutely perfect for me. HSP and B&C do not offer this kind of versatility, so they will never be able to compete.

Is the McMillan stronger? I would like to say yes, but only because I paid a lot more for it. Fact is the US Army uses HSP stocks on their M24's. I've also seen many active duty people on the 'Hide post pictures of their work rifles wearing B&C's. This tells me HSP and B&C are plenty strong.

If you like the B&C than buy it and use it, because McMillans (and Manners) are expensive. There is no gain in having a McMillan, if that also equals being broke or in debt.... If you have the cash, then build the perfect stock.

 

[jsthntn247]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

I outshoot everyone at my local range with a Bell and Carlson duramax on a custom built by me savage. The main purpose of a stock is to let the barrel float and keep the action from moving, both of which are accomplised by a good bedding job. I saved the extra money from the stock and put it to load development and range time. I have a McM a3 on my f/tr rig and wouldn't miss a step if I had to swap it for a medalist. If your not dodging shrapnel then you don't need a mcm or manners unless you just want to look cool, but if you can afford it, go for it.

 

[Ianski]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

Your accuracy really is just going to come down to your bedding and pillar set up. a full length aluminum block is going to stiffen up the fore end which is a good thing if you have it free floated and intend to use a bipod.

 

[VKC]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

It depends on you and what ergonomics feels right to you. If you like your current stock, I would stick with you.

Bedding your rifle and truing your action will likely make much more of a difference.

 

[swampbuck]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

I have 1/4 minute rifles on both Mac and HSP. They are all capable of top quality platforms and are used by top quality gusmiths. GA Precision uses B&C stocks for there nontypical hunter. Robert gradous uses alot of MAC and HSP stocks. One more option that you might want to consider are some of the laminate offerings. With clear coat they are just as weatherproof as synthetic and offer a differant look and feel. Check out the Bobby Hart platform on Stocky's Stocks or Precision Rifle and Tool. They are heavy though.

 

[Explorer]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

Do you drive a Honda, a Jeep, a BMW, or a Rolls? We all make our choices based on many factors including needs, preferences, and cost.
B&C are decent stuff and work well; McMillian is in a similar but different field IMHO. Are you trying to cure a problem or just wants? (not that there is anything wrong with desires if you can afford it). I also have some "cheap" laminated stocks that shoot much better than the urban legends give them credit for.
Would more ammo benefit your more than a name brand stock? (PS I have a couple McMillians but probably would benefit from that practive of which I speak but they do basically dominate the benchrest world...)

 

[Aqua Mark]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

If you are in UT see if you can get a ride down to the Vegas match this Saturday and ask the guys if you can get behind their rifles. Sometimes guys come down from as far as SLC to the Vegas match.

There are also 2 matches in Utah listed on this forum June 9.

I personally like the Manners T4A for a traditional feeling stock, and the McRee Precision for the folding AL type with pistol grip.

Here is a pic of my T4A (A stands for the adjustable cheek piece)

http://mannersstocks.com/

http://mcreesprecision.net/

 

[SpinDrift338]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

I've had HS Precision stocks (as mentioned they're similar to the B&C aluminum block bedding style)and now own two rifles each sporting a Mac A5. All quality stocks should hold your rifle in place firmly which will give you your consistency, but the A5's fit perfectly and allow me to drive the rifle to the best of my ability. My rifles flirt with 1/2 to 1/4 moa when I'm managing to do the right thing, easily the best shooting rifles I've had to date. FWIW.

 

[9H_Cracka]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

Shot em both - the B&C is a shitty copy at best.

You are chasing a nickel with a ten dollar bill.

There is no shortage of ankle biters around any top product.

There is McM and Manners, then everything else.

 

[Bayou1535]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

Amerigo, good luck with your decision because I have been trying to figure out the same. My decision is a manners or a mcree and also trying to decide if I want/need a DBM.

 

[AKAce]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

From my old B&C to the current Manners stocks that All my bolt guns live in is the dif between a Twang and a Thud...

As a mechanic sound and feel means alot to me, when you hit the B&C it made a loose twang sound, like a pickle fork. The Dozen or so Manners I have all go THUD. No harmonics.

Does it make a big dif ? I dunno, but if it makes a lil dif it's $ well spent. Lifetime warranty and GREAT Customer Service from Manners keeps me ordering.

Also you have to factor in the price that the Manners will come inletted for whatever DMB you want... the B&C will have to be shipped to someone and pay them to inlet.

 

[Sonic Crack]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: _9H_Cracka</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Shot em both - the B&C is a shitty copy at best.

You are chasing a nickel with a ten dollar bill.

There is no shortage of ankle biters around any top product.

There is McM and Manners, then everything else. </div></div>

well said, altho I personally say Manners, McM then everything else.
I'm just not a fan of the gel finish on the McM altho they do have some interesting camo patterns. Seen one McM camo that looked like carpet padding!

 

[02Silver]

Re: Does a McMillan stock really make a difference?

Not worth it to a lot of people but I finally bought one back in November and now have three. Haven't bought a Manners yet but might for my 257 Roberts.