DPMS Mini SASS?
- Thread starter Pigman Sr
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Re: DPMS Mini SASS?
<span style="font-weight: bold">D</span>on't <span style="font-weight: bold">P</span>urchase <span style="font-weight: bold">M</span>y <span style="font-weight: bold">S</span>...
Seriously, though, there are so may better options for a Mk12 SPR clone: BCM Mk12 is the first that comes to mind...
<span style="font-weight: bold">D</span>on't <span style="font-weight: bold">P</span>urchase <span style="font-weight: bold">M</span>y <span style="font-weight: bold">S</span>...
Seriously, though, there are so may better options for a Mk12 SPR clone: BCM Mk12 is the first that comes to mind...
Re: DPMS Mini SASS?
People like to bag on DPMS. I guess that is because it doesn't have to cost a fortune to have a gun that shoots. Check out this thread where DPMS fared very well in The 100 yard Semi-auto Shootout. Buyers' remorse by proxy?
People like to bag on DPMS. I guess that is because it doesn't have to cost a fortune to have a gun that shoots. Check out this thread where DPMS fared very well in The 100 yard Semi-auto Shootout. Buyers' remorse by proxy?
Re: DPMS Mini SASS?
my 308 sass flat shoots! as good as can be expected from a gas gun! If you cant hit it with a DPMS you can't hit it at all! They are not the cadilac of gas guns but there are a huge list of builders that are far far worse!
my 308 sass flat shoots! as good as can be expected from a gas gun! If you cant hit it with a DPMS you can't hit it at all! They are not the cadilac of gas guns but there are a huge list of builders that are far far worse!
Re: DPMS Mini SASS?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: hlee</div><div class="ubbcode-body">People like to bag on DPMS. I guess that is because it doesn't have to cost a fortune to have a gun that shoots. Check out this thread where DPMS fared very well in The 100 yard Semi-auto Shootout. Buyers' remorse by proxy? </div></div>
Ya, this and they are the only carbines I've ever seen stop at local 3-Gun matches. Every time it's a DPMS. Same with XD's. Do they run most of the time? Yes. Do they run every time? No.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: hlee</div><div class="ubbcode-body">People like to bag on DPMS. I guess that is because it doesn't have to cost a fortune to have a gun that shoots. Check out this thread where DPMS fared very well in The 100 yard Semi-auto Shootout. Buyers' remorse by proxy? </div></div>
Ya, this and they are the only carbines I've ever seen stop at local 3-Gun matches. Every time it's a DPMS. Same with XD's. Do they run most of the time? Yes. Do they run every time? No.
Re: DPMS Mini SASS?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pete Sake</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: hlee</div><div class="ubbcode-body">People like to bag on DPMS. I guess that is because it doesn't have to cost a fortune to have a gun that shoots. Check out this thread where DPMS fared very well in The 100 yard Semi-auto Shootout. Buyers' remorse by proxy? </div></div>
Ya, this and they are the only carbines I've ever seen stop at local 3-Gun matches. Every time it's a DPMS. Same with XD's. Do they run most of the time? Yes. Do they run every time? No. </div></div>
You've gotta shoot more. I've seen carbines and pistols from
Nearly every major Manufacturer screw up.
I don't have the sass but had a LR260 and it was great.
They are heavy though for a walking around gun.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pete Sake</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: hlee</div><div class="ubbcode-body">People like to bag on DPMS. I guess that is because it doesn't have to cost a fortune to have a gun that shoots. Check out this thread where DPMS fared very well in The 100 yard Semi-auto Shootout. Buyers' remorse by proxy? </div></div>
Ya, this and they are the only carbines I've ever seen stop at local 3-Gun matches. Every time it's a DPMS. Same with XD's. Do they run most of the time? Yes. Do they run every time? No. </div></div>
You've gotta shoot more. I've seen carbines and pistols from
Nearly every major Manufacturer screw up.
I don't have the sass but had a LR260 and it was great.
They are heavy though for a walking around gun.
Re: DPMS Mini SASS?
Mini SASS is one heavy barrel, is reputed to shoot well, DPMS MK12 is a full pound lighter. I know nothing of their complete rifles, but I'd be willing to venture a guess that if you're not betting your life on it daily or shooting against a clock it'll be fine. Don't like it, change it, that's the beauty of the black rifle, the receiver is just a shell, hardly a part that can't be changed in minutes.
Mini SASS is one heavy barrel, is reputed to shoot well, DPMS MK12 is a full pound lighter. I know nothing of their complete rifles, but I'd be willing to venture a guess that if you're not betting your life on it daily or shooting against a clock it'll be fine. Don't like it, change it, that's the beauty of the black rifle, the receiver is just a shell, hardly a part that can't be changed in minutes.
Re: DPMS Mini SASS?
I had one and put several thousand rounds through it. It was a great shooting gun, it's just heavy for a 223.
I had one and put several thousand rounds through it. It was a great shooting gun, it's just heavy for a 223.
Re: DPMS Mini SASS?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Beef</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Mini SASS is one heavy barrel, is reputed to shoot well, DPMS MK12 is a full pound lighter. I know nothing of their complete rifles, but I'd be willing to venture a guess that if you're not betting your life on it daily or shooting against a clock it'll be fine. Don't like it, change it, that's the beauty of the black rifle, the receiver is just a shell, hardly a part that can't be changed in minutes. </div></div>
these threads are always funny...MANY people shoot against the clock with DPMS and THOUSANDS bet their lives on them every day.
my first AR was a DPMS sweet 16, was mainly my hang over the door rifle for taking out bad critters
that made their way onto the property. when I sold it it had around 15k rounds through it, mostly tula and wolf, hardly ever got cleaned, but was damn accurate and never had a malfunction. never replaced any parts.
I have owned 13 DPMS rifles in several calibers, all were very accurate and all were 100% reliable.
I currently bet my life and the lives of others every day on a DPMS 16" HBAR as well as a miniSASS in 6.8SPCII.
my patrol rifle (the HBAR) has seen around 10K rounds so far, has been through a few competitions, several carbine classes running upwards of 1000rds a day (uselly of tula or wolf), as well as SWAT school.
it has never had a malfunction.
yes, EVERY MFG has guns that will occasionaly have a problem. I was at an advanced carbine class this spring.
4 DPMS 2 BM's and 4 colts.
the only rifles to have problems were the colts. including a broken bolt.
you would have to go 3 counties over to find a LE agency that is NOT carrying a DPMS AR.
but no, you go ahead and tell me how a reliable, accurate AR used by so many LE agencies is just a
toy...
Patrol rifle
MiniSASS rides in the trunk
what a DPMS bolt looks like after about 600rds of TULA...still no malfunctions...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Beef</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Mini SASS is one heavy barrel, is reputed to shoot well, DPMS MK12 is a full pound lighter. I know nothing of their complete rifles, but I'd be willing to venture a guess that if you're not betting your life on it daily or shooting against a clock it'll be fine. Don't like it, change it, that's the beauty of the black rifle, the receiver is just a shell, hardly a part that can't be changed in minutes. </div></div>
these threads are always funny...MANY people shoot against the clock with DPMS and THOUSANDS bet their lives on them every day.
my first AR was a DPMS sweet 16, was mainly my hang over the door rifle for taking out bad critters
that made their way onto the property. when I sold it it had around 15k rounds through it, mostly tula and wolf, hardly ever got cleaned, but was damn accurate and never had a malfunction. never replaced any parts.
I have owned 13 DPMS rifles in several calibers, all were very accurate and all were 100% reliable.
I currently bet my life and the lives of others every day on a DPMS 16" HBAR as well as a miniSASS in 6.8SPCII.
my patrol rifle (the HBAR) has seen around 10K rounds so far, has been through a few competitions, several carbine classes running upwards of 1000rds a day (uselly of tula or wolf), as well as SWAT school.
it has never had a malfunction.
yes, EVERY MFG has guns that will occasionaly have a problem. I was at an advanced carbine class this spring.
4 DPMS 2 BM's and 4 colts.
the only rifles to have problems were the colts. including a broken bolt.
you would have to go 3 counties over to find a LE agency that is NOT carrying a DPMS AR.
but no, you go ahead and tell me how a reliable, accurate AR used by so many LE agencies is just a
toy...
Patrol rifle
MiniSASS rides in the trunk
what a DPMS bolt looks like after about 600rds of TULA...still no malfunctions...
Re: DPMS Mini SASS?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: hlee</div><div class="ubbcode-body">People like to bag on DPMS. I guess that is because it doesn't have to cost a fortune to have a gun that shoots. Check out this thread where DPMS fared very well in The 100 yard Semi-auto Shootout. Buyers' remorse by proxy? </div></div>
Okay...I <span style="font-style: italic">was</span> being a smart-ass with the first part of my reply... kinda figured I'd get a rise from some of the DPMS guys
But on a completely serious note I just don't understand why people continue to buy tier 3 product when you can get tier 1 (legitimate mil-spec, individual HPT & MPI testing - not batch tested, properly staked carrier keys and castle nuts...etc. etc. etc.) at or near the same price. DPMS might not be "bad" but you can definitely do better without spending much if any more (in my experience absolutely <span style="text-decoration: underline">no</span> more) especially when we're talking about an SPR clone.
Do yourself a favor and shop around (see note about tier 1 above) before you plunk down your hard-earned $$$. I'm confident you'll find a better overall value. Of course all that's just my humble opinion; as with everything in life YMMV!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: hlee</div><div class="ubbcode-body">People like to bag on DPMS. I guess that is because it doesn't have to cost a fortune to have a gun that shoots. Check out this thread where DPMS fared very well in The 100 yard Semi-auto Shootout. Buyers' remorse by proxy? </div></div>
Okay...I <span style="font-style: italic">was</span> being a smart-ass with the first part of my reply... kinda figured I'd get a rise from some of the DPMS guys
But on a completely serious note I just don't understand why people continue to buy tier 3 product when you can get tier 1 (legitimate mil-spec, individual HPT & MPI testing - not batch tested, properly staked carrier keys and castle nuts...etc. etc. etc.) at or near the same price. DPMS might not be "bad" but you can definitely do better without spending much if any more (in my experience absolutely <span style="text-decoration: underline">no</span> more) especially when we're talking about an SPR clone.
Do yourself a favor and shop around (see note about tier 1 above) before you plunk down your hard-earned $$$. I'm confident you'll find a better overall value. Of course all that's just my humble opinion; as with everything in life YMMV!
Re: DPMS Mini SASS?
carrier key is staked, I prefer the blue locktight on the castle nut and have never had one come loose, just as good at staking. individual testing is not necissary with modern mass production of parts the odds of one part out of a tested batch being bad is astronomical. besides even with all the shooting of differant AR's I have been around the ONLY bolt I have ever seen break was on a colt (HPT&MPI tested!) no, there is nothing "better" about a colt then a DPMS.
carrier key is staked, I prefer the blue locktight on the castle nut and have never had one come loose, just as good at staking. individual testing is not necissary with modern mass production of parts the odds of one part out of a tested batch being bad is astronomical. besides even with all the shooting of differant AR's I have been around the ONLY bolt I have ever seen break was on a colt (HPT&MPI tested!) no, there is nothing "better" about a colt then a DPMS.
Re: DPMS Mini SASS?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: overkill</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> individual testing is not necissary with modern mass production of parts the odds of one part out of a tested batch being bad is astronomical. </div></div>
Look I'm not here to fight; I respect that you've had good results with your DPMS. I'll accept that, but at least be intellectually honest with yourself. The statement above just isn't accurate. Batch testing is better than <span style="font-style: italic">no</span> testing… but you’re giving way to much credit to “modern mass production”. You might argue batch testing is "good enough" but please don't try to make the argument that it’s as good as individual testing (or that individual testing is unnecessary), especially when you don't have to pay more to get individually tested product. A far more accurate statement would be: With batch testing the odds of catching a single bad part are 'astronomical'.
As for staked carrier keys if DPMS is staking now I stand corrected, I acknowledge it’s been a while since I've field-stripped a DPMS AR. Of the ones I have seen first-hand not one had a properly staked carrier key. I'd at least advise the OP to check-out the staking (or lack thereof) on the rifle he's considering.
Edit: I did some checking and it appears that DPMS does (now) stake their carrier keys, albeit with somewhat mixed results. To quote one (understandably perturbed) owner: "<span style="font-style: italic">Just got a DPMS BC group today. Only half of the key is staked and the other side half-assed. Someone needs some training with the tool...</span>" I'd still want to see it for myself if I were considering a purchase.
I recognize the above example is anecdotal but all I'm saying here is that you don't get those kind of reports about Colt, BCM, Daniel Defense, etc. Spend <span style="font-style: italic">your</span> money where it suits <span style="font-style: italic">you</span>!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: overkill</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> individual testing is not necissary with modern mass production of parts the odds of one part out of a tested batch being bad is astronomical. </div></div>
Look I'm not here to fight; I respect that you've had good results with your DPMS. I'll accept that, but at least be intellectually honest with yourself. The statement above just isn't accurate. Batch testing is better than <span style="font-style: italic">no</span> testing… but you’re giving way to much credit to “modern mass production”. You might argue batch testing is "good enough" but please don't try to make the argument that it’s as good as individual testing (or that individual testing is unnecessary), especially when you don't have to pay more to get individually tested product. A far more accurate statement would be: With batch testing the odds of catching a single bad part are 'astronomical'.
As for staked carrier keys if DPMS is staking now I stand corrected, I acknowledge it’s been a while since I've field-stripped a DPMS AR. Of the ones I have seen first-hand not one had a properly staked carrier key. I'd at least advise the OP to check-out the staking (or lack thereof) on the rifle he's considering.
Edit: I did some checking and it appears that DPMS does (now) stake their carrier keys, albeit with somewhat mixed results. To quote one (understandably perturbed) owner: "<span style="font-style: italic">Just got a DPMS BC group today. Only half of the key is staked and the other side half-assed. Someone needs some training with the tool...</span>" I'd still want to see it for myself if I were considering a purchase.
I recognize the above example is anecdotal but all I'm saying here is that you don't get those kind of reports about Colt, BCM, Daniel Defense, etc. Spend <span style="font-style: italic">your</span> money where it suits <span style="font-style: italic">you</span>!
Re: DPMS Mini SASS?
a couple of my DPMS BCG's
and really? colt, BCM and the others NEVER have ANY problems?
EVERY MFG has a bad part or rifle go out occasionally, and they always will as long as they are built by humans. check out AR15.com and there are always a few about every brand in the first few pages. yes, there uselly are more about DPMS rifles then say colt, but given that DPMS ships several orders of magnitude more rifles per year then colt, i would say that the rate of great rifle to manufacture defect is the same if not better for the DPMS vs a colt.
a couple of my DPMS BCG's
and really? colt, BCM and the others NEVER have ANY problems?
EVERY MFG has a bad part or rifle go out occasionally, and they always will as long as they are built by humans. check out AR15.com and there are always a few about every brand in the first few pages. yes, there uselly are more about DPMS rifles then say colt, but given that DPMS ships several orders of magnitude more rifles per year then colt, i would say that the rate of great rifle to manufacture defect is the same if not better for the DPMS vs a colt.
Re: DPMS Mini SASS?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: overkill</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Beef</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Mini SASS is one heavy barrel, is reputed to shoot well, DPMS MK12 is a full pound lighter. I know nothing of their complete rifles, but I'd be willing to venture a guess that if you're not betting your life on it daily or shooting against a clock it'll be fine. Don't like it, change it, that's the beauty of the black rifle, the receiver is just a shell, hardly a part that can't be changed in minutes. </div></div>
these threads are always funny...MANY people shoot against the clock with DPMS and THOUSANDS bet their lives on them every day.
my first AR was a DPMS sweet 16, was mainly my hang over the door rifle for taking out bad critters
that made their way onto the property. when I sold it it had around 15k rounds through it, mostly tula and wolf, hardly ever got cleaned, but was damn accurate and never had a malfunction. never replaced any parts.
I have owned 13 DPMS rifles in several calibers, all were very accurate and all were 100% reliable.
I currently bet my life and the lives of others every day on a DPMS 16" HBAR as well as a miniSASS in 6.8SPCII.
my patrol rifle (the HBAR) has seen around 10K rounds so far, has been through a few competitions, several carbine classes running upwards of 1000rds a day (uselly of tula or wolf), as well as SWAT school.
it has never had a malfunction.
yes, EVERY MFG has guns that will occasionaly have a problem. I was at an advanced carbine class this spring.
4 DPMS 2 BM's and 4 colts.
the only rifles to have problems were the colts. including a broken bolt.
you would have to go 3 counties over to find a LE agency that is NOT carrying a DPMS AR.
but no, you go ahead and tell me how a reliable, accurate AR used by so many LE agencies is just a
toy...
</div></div>
For clarification, I did not say don't buy that P.O.S., DPMS are plagued with problems and unreliable, anywhere, said I had no experience with their complete rifles.
My point was that the typical civilian, is not terribly likely to run ANY AR that functions for the first few mags to the point where they have reliabilty issues if they clean it, look at it and lube it occassionally. Reasonable maintenance and inspection can prevent most issues that would show in few hundred round session. If this fits the OPs plans he'll probably be perfectly happy, and if he isn't then he can change parts at will until he is.
I am glad yours have served you well and you have confidence in them. Just because an agency, including mil, issues it does not mean something is the best or neccesarily even good. I personally have observed few ARs malfunction in my presence and fewer still have part failures, the design at this point is fairly sound.
Competition is a game, you only stand to lose points, how many top level competitors run any brand box stock other than in classes requiring it?
Personally if I were regularly carrying a rifle into harm's way I would want one I personally had thousands of malfunction free rounds thru as you do OR a weapon built with parts made and assembled to or exceeding a spec based on reliability and performance and not production costs by a company with a solid reputation for quality and reliabilty, ideally a combination of the two, because anything mechanical can fail and a roll mark isn't a guarantee.
I personally don't own a single "tier 1" receiver, and only a few "tier 1" or "mil-spec" parts, I've had one broken bolt around the 5k mark, and had I been a little better about inspecting it probably wouldn't have ruined a range day coming early in the first mag of the day. Other than mag issues that's been it. Because of the bolt I buy HP/MPT bolts now, a few dollars for peace of mind, it probably wouldn't have shown anything on a bolt that lasted 5k though. I certainly don't think every AR must be Colt, DD, BCM, LMT, LWRC, etc etc.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: overkill</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Beef</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Mini SASS is one heavy barrel, is reputed to shoot well, DPMS MK12 is a full pound lighter. I know nothing of their complete rifles, but I'd be willing to venture a guess that if you're not betting your life on it daily or shooting against a clock it'll be fine. Don't like it, change it, that's the beauty of the black rifle, the receiver is just a shell, hardly a part that can't be changed in minutes. </div></div>
these threads are always funny...MANY people shoot against the clock with DPMS and THOUSANDS bet their lives on them every day.
my first AR was a DPMS sweet 16, was mainly my hang over the door rifle for taking out bad critters
that made their way onto the property. when I sold it it had around 15k rounds through it, mostly tula and wolf, hardly ever got cleaned, but was damn accurate and never had a malfunction. never replaced any parts.
I have owned 13 DPMS rifles in several calibers, all were very accurate and all were 100% reliable.
I currently bet my life and the lives of others every day on a DPMS 16" HBAR as well as a miniSASS in 6.8SPCII.
my patrol rifle (the HBAR) has seen around 10K rounds so far, has been through a few competitions, several carbine classes running upwards of 1000rds a day (uselly of tula or wolf), as well as SWAT school.
it has never had a malfunction.
yes, EVERY MFG has guns that will occasionaly have a problem. I was at an advanced carbine class this spring.
4 DPMS 2 BM's and 4 colts.
the only rifles to have problems were the colts. including a broken bolt.
you would have to go 3 counties over to find a LE agency that is NOT carrying a DPMS AR.
but no, you go ahead and tell me how a reliable, accurate AR used by so many LE agencies is just a
toy...
</div></div>
For clarification, I did not say don't buy that P.O.S., DPMS are plagued with problems and unreliable, anywhere, said I had no experience with their complete rifles.
My point was that the typical civilian, is not terribly likely to run ANY AR that functions for the first few mags to the point where they have reliabilty issues if they clean it, look at it and lube it occassionally. Reasonable maintenance and inspection can prevent most issues that would show in few hundred round session. If this fits the OPs plans he'll probably be perfectly happy, and if he isn't then he can change parts at will until he is.
I am glad yours have served you well and you have confidence in them. Just because an agency, including mil, issues it does not mean something is the best or neccesarily even good. I personally have observed few ARs malfunction in my presence and fewer still have part failures, the design at this point is fairly sound.
Competition is a game, you only stand to lose points, how many top level competitors run any brand box stock other than in classes requiring it?
Personally if I were regularly carrying a rifle into harm's way I would want one I personally had thousands of malfunction free rounds thru as you do OR a weapon built with parts made and assembled to or exceeding a spec based on reliability and performance and not production costs by a company with a solid reputation for quality and reliabilty, ideally a combination of the two, because anything mechanical can fail and a roll mark isn't a guarantee.
I personally don't own a single "tier 1" receiver, and only a few "tier 1" or "mil-spec" parts, I've had one broken bolt around the 5k mark, and had I been a little better about inspecting it probably wouldn't have ruined a range day coming early in the first mag of the day. Other than mag issues that's been it. Because of the bolt I buy HP/MPT bolts now, a few dollars for peace of mind, it probably wouldn't have shown anything on a bolt that lasted 5k though. I certainly don't think every AR must be Colt, DD, BCM, LMT, LWRC, etc etc.
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