Ever wonder why there's a drug problem?

[Maggot]

Try big pharma and the doctors they own.
----------------------------------
[h=1]Ohio shocker: 793 million opioid drug doses prescribed in one year[/h]
Jun6by Jon Rappoport
Ohio shocker: 793 million opioid drug doses prescribed in one year

Here’s why zombies are real

by Jon Rappoport

June 6, 2017

The state government of Ohio has filed a lawsuit against five drug companies: Teva, Allergen, Johnson & Johnson, Purdue, and Endo.

The suit accuses these companies of unlawful marketing practices that have led to Ohio’s opioid addiction “problem.”

Here’s the big one: the suit states that, in 2012, a staggering 793 million doses of opioid drugs were prescribed to Ohio citizens. That translates to an average of 68 pills for each person in Ohio.

The suit accuses the drug makers of conspiring to influence opinion leaders and various medical groups. This marketing blitz resulted in deceptive treatment guidelines, false information delivered at medical conferences, and misleading “science” articles—all designed to minimize the dire effects of opioids.

Well, yes, these painkillers (e.g., OxyContin) do kill pain. In the process, they also creation addiction and turn minds to mush.

Apparently, Ohio is pretty much in a collective trance state. We’re talking Zombification. 793 million opioid doses in one year.

Don’t forget the doctors who prescribe the drugs. As a group, they can’t care about their patients’ state of mind. Just load people up to the eyeballs with chemical pacification.

If you think this over-prescription epidemic corresponds to the actual amount of physical pain Ohio citizens are experiencing, think again. The drugs are obviously being handed out for other reasons: to sustain and feed addiction; to “treat depression”; to “manage dissatisfaction with life.” In other words, drug companies are promoting an ongoing profit bonanza for themselves. The human consequences don’t matter.

Keep in mind that drug companies pour advertising money like water into television programming—including the news.

The effects of the news and the effects of opioid drugs are a marriage made for the ages.

They both deliver hypnosis.

What a marvelous coincidence, right? Contemplate it.

Just so happens that the news, with its outright lies, useless information overload, misdirection, omissions of vital facts, lack of context, refusal to investigate deep scandals, cultivation of Voices of Authority, attention-span shortening, and various other strategies designed for trance-induction and mental passivity…join together with an opioid chemical brain sledgehammer that wipes out the possibility of rational thought.

Both brought to you by your friend, Big Pharma.

 

[vh20]

Keep in mind that drug companies pour advertising money like water into television programming—including the news.

The effects of the news and the effects of opioid drugs are a marriage made for the ages.

Both brought to you by your friend, Big Pharma.

Can you give an example of an advertisement for an opioid drug on the news, or otherwise?

 

[diverdon]

They seem to be looking for the biggest number they can find. How many of those doses went to terminal cancer paitents and others whose lives would have ended in unbearable pain. There are a lot of legit uses for opioids, and I think most doctors try to do what is best for their paitents.

 

[Maggot]

Don, Im the first to agree there are legitimate uses for opioids in pain management. I have a prescrition for some that I use when it becomes intolerable.

But this is widespread. This was not the first of these articles. West Virginia has the same problem a does Florida.

This quote is in the middle of the article

"A searing report over the weekend by the Charleston, W.Va., Gazette-Mail documented the trail of shipments of painkillers to West Virginia’s economically depressed southern coalfields — places like tiny Kermit, population 392, which received shipments of nearly nine million highly addictive and potentially lethal hydrocodone pills to a single pharmacy over a two-year period. "

-----------------------------------
ow West Virginia Became Ground Zero for the Opioid Epidemic

By Eric Pianin

Experts have cited many factors trying to explain why West Virginia has been hardest hit by the opioid addiction crisis that has swept the country over the past decade, killing 33,091 Americans in 2015 alone.

Economic despair, widespread unemployment, inadequate mental health facilities and a sense of isolation in communities scattered throughout the rugged, mountainous coal state may have all contributed to the widespread abuse of OxyContin, oxycodone and other powerful prescription painkillers, experts say.

Related: The 20 Most Expensive Prescription Drugs in America

West Virginia has the highest rate of deaths from drug overdoses of any state. Between 2011 and 2013, West Virginia suffered from a rate of 33.5 drug overdoses per 100,000 people, compared to a national average of 13.4 deaths, according to a report by the non-partisan Trust for America’s Health and the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation.

However, there is another more insidious explanation for what went terribly wrong in West Virginia: Unscrupulous drug manufacturers and out-of-state wholesalers bombarded West Virginia with huge supplies of these highly addicting drugs. This tidal wave of painkillers on pharmacists’ shelves allowed many physicians to freely prescribe the drugs at the behest of their patients and fueled an underground market of illicit drug sales.



A searing report over the weekend by the Charleston, W.Va., Gazette-Mail documented the trail of shipments of painkillers to West Virginia’s economically depressed southern coalfields — places like tiny Kermit, population 392, which received shipments of nearly nine million highly addictive and potentially lethal hydrocodone pills to a single pharmacy over a two-year period. Mingo County, where Kermit is located, has the fourth-highest prescription opioid death rate of any county in the United States.

In neighboring Wyoming County, where shipments of OxyContin have doubled in recent years, the county’s overdose death rate leads the nation, with 54.6 per 100,000. “One mom-and-pop pharmacy in Oceana received 600 times as many oxycodone pills as the Rite Aid drugstore just eight blocks away,” according to the newspaper’s report.

Related: How Big Pharma Lobbyists Make the Opioid Crisis Worse

During the past six years, major drug wholesalers flooded the state with 780 million hydrocodone and oxycodone pills, while 1,728 West Virginians suffered fatal overdoses on those two painkillers, according to the Gazette-Mail investigation. West Virginia has 1.84 million residents, ranking 38th in population nationally.

The deluge of drugs was the equivalent of an astounding 433 pain pills per resident of the state, according to the report. And those shipments were apparently made without raising the suspicions of state public health and regulatory officials or triggering the intervention of federal drug enforcement officials.

More than half of all the pain pills coming into the state were provided by three pharmaceutical drug wholesalers -- McKesson Corp., Cardinal Health and AmerisourceBergen. For more than a decade, those distributors ignored rules to report suspicious orders for controlled substances to the state board of pharmacy, the newspaper charged.

Moreover, the board of pharmacy failed to enforce those same rules, while turning a blind eye to tiny pharmacies in southern counties that ordered absurdly large amounts of pain killers, far more than could possibly be needed by patients in such small communities.

Related: The U.S. War on Drugs in Afghanistan Is an $8 Billion Failure

McKesson and the other wholesalers insist they were doing nothing wrong, but simply meeting the demands of licensed pharmacies. They argue that since pharmacies were filling the prescriptions of licensed doctors, the pills never should have gotten into the hands of addicts or black market dealers unless unscrupulous physicians wrote illegal prescriptions.

John Saia, McKesson’s general counsel, said in a letter to the newspaper last week that the doctors who write the prescriptions and the pharmacists who fill them are “in a better position to identify and prevent the abuse and diversion of potentially addictive controlled substances” than the wholesalers.

Major drug companies that manufacture the painkillers also have worked to frustrate government enforcement. A joint investigation by the Center for Public Integrity and the Associated Press earlier this year found that major drug companies frequently lobbied state legislatures across the country to resist legal restrictions on their drugs, such as OxyContin, Vicodin and Fentanyl.

In fairness, federal authorities weren’t totally asleep at the switch. As the opioid epidemic raged throughout West Virginia and other Appalachian states over the past decade, the U.S. Drug Enforcement Administration has gone after companies distributing millions of highly addictive pills, The Washington Post reported in late October.

Related: US Death Rate From Heroin and Opioid Abuse Rages Out of Control

While some distributors cooperated with federal authorities and tipped them off to irregularities in purchases, many others resisted. The investigation was subsequently dropped or curtailed beginning in 2013 after senior DEA officials and some members of Congress ordered a shift in enforcement emphasis, the newspaper reported.

Among 13 companies that had been targeted for the probe were McKesson, Cardinal Health and AmerisourceBergen, which together control 85 percent of all prescription drug distribution in the U.S.

 

[Alphatreedog]

This explains the heroin OD problem plaguing the Country as well as Meth , Crack , Wet and Weed .
All makes sense it's big Pharma's fault .

 

[vh20]

McKesson and the other wholesalers insist they were doing nothing wrong, but simply meeting the demands of licensed pharmacies. They argue that since pharmacies were filling the prescriptions of licensed doctors, the pills never should have gotten into the hands of addicts or black market dealers unless unscrupulous physicians wrote illegal prescriptions.

John Saia, McKesson’s general counsel, said in a letter to the newspaper last week that the doctors who write the prescriptions and the pharmacists who fill them are “in a better position to identify and prevent the abuse and diversion of potentially addictive controlled substances” than the wholesalers.

Major drug companies that manufacture the painkillers also have worked to frustrate government enforcement. A joint investigation by the Center for Public Integrity and the Associated Press earlier this year found that major drug companies frequently lobbied state legislatures across the country to resist legal restrictions on their drugs, such as OxyContin, Vicodin and Fentanyl.

As a person with a DEA license to prescribe these drugs, the first two paragraphs above are absolutely true in that, unless someone is stealing them and selling them black market (which has to be reported to the DEA if stolen), they all go out the pharmacy through a legal Rx. These are Sched. II drugs, which means the Dr. can't call it in, he has to write a script on a physical piece of paper, maximum supply of one month, and NO refills (i.e. the patient has to come get another physical piece of paper again if he is to continue on the drug). Every single pill is counted, and logged in to log books, and then logged out to who/when/where/how many/etc. when prescribed. Blaming the drug companies for "flooding the market" with shipments is ridiculous in my opinion. It can't go out the door of a pharmacy without a prescription and log book entry, no matter how many truckloads the pharmacy has in the safe (double-locks required to store them, too). The article proposes that supply increases demand, but did not do anything to explain how that works, because it can't as far as I can reckon. The problem (which I readily acknowledge) has to be at the pharmacy or prescriber-level, or either there is black market sale from theft (but that has to be reported, so I'm not sure how widespread that is).

The third paragraph makes no sense to me. Why lobby state legislatures when all of the laws are Federal (DEA)? More red herring crap.

As to my earlier point about the tons of advertising they are supposedly spending on TV, I don't know if it is actually illegal to advertise these drugs or not, but I can't recall ever seeing an advertisement for a Sched. II drug. I'm not saying they don't exist, but will say that accusation is false.

 

[Maggot]

As a person with a DEA license to prescribe these drugs, the first two paragraphs above are absolutely true in that, unless someone is stealing them and selling them black market (which has to be reported to the DEA if stolen), they all go out the pharmacy through a legal Rx. These are Sched. II drugs, which means the Dr. can't call it in, he has to write a script on a physical piece of paper, maximum supply of one month, and NO refills (i.e. the patient has to come get another physical piece of paper again if he is to continue on the drug). Every single pill is counted, and logged in to log books, and then logged out to who/when/where/how many/etc. when prescribed. Blaming the drug companies for "flooding the market" with shipments is ridiculous in my opinion. It can't go out the door of a pharmacy without a prescription and log book entry, no matter how many truckloads the pharmacy has in the safe (double-locks required to store them, too). The article proposes that supply increases demand, but did not do anything to explain how that works, because it can't as far as I can reckon. The problem (which I readily acknowledge) has to be at the pharmacy or prescriber-level, or either there is black market sale from theft (but that has to be reported, so I'm not sure how widespread that is).

The third paragraph makes no sense to me. Why lobby state legislatures when all of the laws are Federal (DEA)? More red herring crap.

As to my earlier point about the tons of advertising they are supposedly spending on TV, I don't know if it is actually illegal to advertise these drugs or not, but I can't recall ever seeing an advertisement for a Sched. II drug. I'm not saying they don't exist, but will say that accusation is false.

I dont see the ads on TV but I suspect they are pushed in medical journals or mags that prescriber's receive. As to the post above yours, it doesnt explain the meth/crack/heroin problem, but it certainly enlightens this portion of it. Which does go back to Pharma/Doctors giving opioids for things like depression.

 

[Veer_G]

Can you give an example of an advertisement for an opioid drug on the news, or otherwise?

Yo, baby, victimology, like, embrace it, dig?

 

[CypressJeff]

It's also the guns fault, not the person holding it.

 

[Slash0311]

From a law enforcement point of view, I saw more drug users and "seekers" than most people. I literally saw one guy go to 4 different emergency rooms in one night trying to score. These users know how to play a game. File a report someone "stole" their meds, take that report and get an early re-fill. I know they're lying but they know how to game the system. ​​Who knows how they get hooked (points in the original post) but they'll lie, cheat, and steal to get more and our system lets them do it.

I don't see this lawsuit going too far. Can't really blame a product if it's misused. Can't blame McDonald's for fat people. Can't blame Coca-Cola for litter on the sides of the roads. Can't blame Coors for drunk stupid people in bars... Oh wait, but we do try and blame gun manufacturers for what owners do.

 

[Maggot]

From a law enforcement point of view, I saw more drug users and "seekers" than most people. I literally saw one guy go to 4 different emergency rooms in one night trying to score. These users know how to play a game. File a report someone "stole" their meds, take that report and get an early re-fill. I know they're lying but they know how to game the system. ​​Who knows how they get hooked (points in the original post) but they'll lie, cheat, and steal to get more and our system lets them do it.

I don't see this lawsuit going too far. Can't really blame a product if it's misused. Can't blame McDonald's for fat people. Can't blame Coca-Cola for litter on the sides of the roads. Can't blame Coors for drunk stupid people in bars... Oh wait, but we do try and blame gun manufacturers for what owners do.

No you cant blame Coke for idiots that rot their teeth but its a different situation when those who are entrusted with caring for health care hand this stuff out like candy for any ailment. Im not saying there arent a host of other reasons. But if you live in W.Va. and are out a job because the mine closed, youve got 4 hungry children and a wife thats pregnant, and your depressed and having problems there, Oxycodone is not the solution and if its being prescribed widely for that, its abuse at the provider level. And why are the providers giving it out...lobbyists from big pharma tell them its good. Much the same as prescribing ritalin for the kids that have behavioril problems when a good talking to or paddling might get the message across.

 

[Tucker301]

There are issues at many levels.
When I was in the hospital recovering from having my stents inserted I told the night nurse I had a slight headache and would appreciate a couple of Tylenol.
Her response was that I was already cleared for opioids and that she'd be more than happy to bring me those.
Half of me was in disbelief and the other wasn't surprised.
I politely told her that the Tylenol would suffice.

 

[hlee]

The number of doses per resident is a very big number- but it is essentially meaningless. A more useful number would be the number of people prescribed these drugs (not the number of prescriptions) as a function of the population. A breakdown of dosage and duration of pain management treatment as a function of the underlying condition would also be useful. The author uses the doses per resident because it is huge.

Hell, when I had ACL surgery I was prescribed Vicodin every 4 hours for 1 month. How many pills is that? I used about 6.

As to the question of advertising, it does not need to be directed at the end of line consumer to be effective. More effective advertising is directed at the prescriber via journals and face to face sales rep interaction. Embedding the message in the prescriber means fewer necessary points of contact with the advertising, and that the person giving the medical advice (the physician, not the patient) has received the message the drug company wants them to hear. As a consumer, who are you going to trust; a spokesperson on TV, or your physician? Don't fool yourself, the vast amount of "knowledge" a physician has about a drug comes directly from a pharmaceutical company.

 

[hlee]

No you cant blame Coke for idiots that rot their teeth but its a different situation when those who are entrusted with caring for health care hand this stuff out like candy for any ailment. Im not saying there arent a host of other reasons. But if you live in W.Va. and are out a job because the mine closed, youve got 4 hungry children and a wife thats pregnant, and your depressed and having problems there, Oxycodone is not the solution and if its being prescribed widely for that, its abuse at the provider level. And why are the providers giving it out...lobbyists from big pharma tell them its good. Much the same as prescribing ritalin for the kids that have behavioril problems when a good talking to or paddling might get the message across.

Behavioril, from the makers of Ritalin...

 

[MtnCreek]

I've known some people that were hurt and then lived the rest of their life on disability and pain meds. IMO, their only disability was their addiction to pain meds.

 

[boomer81]

All drugs shoud be legal and taxed the fuck out of. if you use no welfare or govt funding. If someone wants to get high at home it should be legal. You step out in public and fuck up harsh severe penalties and fines you high and kill someone you die. But your never gonna stop it. they kill people and chop off hands and fill prisons world wide and it does not even make a dent in it.

I work at a ice prison facility. Its 99% mexicans 2000 mexicans facility. Every week 50 go out 50 come in. The war on drugs is antiquated thinking. All you have to do is look at prohibition. It leads to gangs like capone just like el chapo.

Im clean and sober and ive fought my share of demons. I am the farthest thing from a liberal. You want to stop this shit then you have to kill its value. Cause the people who use are gonna use and kill themselves are gonna do it regardless. Let darwin do his thing. I know people who do more stupid shit on jack daniels than they ever did on pot or pain killers. Most people on that shit just sit and drool

 

[Maggot]

The number of doses per resident is a very big number- but it is essentially meaningless. A more useful number would be the number of people prescribed these drugs (not the number of prescriptions) as a function of the population. A breakdown of dosage and duration of pain management treatment as a function of the underlying condition would also be useful. The author uses the doses per resident because it is huge.

Hell, when I had ACL surgery I was prescribed Vicodin every 4 hours for 1 month. How many pills is that? I used about 6.

As to the question of advertising, it does not need to be directed at the end of line consumer to be effective. More effective advertising is directed at the prescriber via journals and face to face sales rep interaction. Embedding the message in the prescriber means fewer necessary points of contact with the advertising, and that the person giving the medical advice (the physician, not the patient) has received the message the drug company wants them to hear. As a consumer, who are you going to trust; a spokesperson on TV, or your physician? Don't fool yourself, the vast amount of "knowledge" a physician has about a drug comes directly from a pharmaceutical company.

You pretty much nailed in in your last paragraph.

I agree that the numbers are likely skewed to make a point but still...thats a lot of narcotics.

And like yourself when I had surgery I took about 6 of the dilaudids they gave me. That shit plugs you up big time.

 

[vh20]

Hlee:

Yes, they advertise to the Drs. But this is what I was addressing - the article in the OP states:

"Keep in mind that drug companies pour advertising money like water into television programming—including the news. The effects of the news and the effects of the opioid drugs are a marriage made in heaven"

That's utter BS. They advertise meds on TV, but not those (that I am aware). Also, I don't think opioids are prescribed for depression legally either, but my patients are all animals so it wouldn't apply. What I do know is that if I did 1/10 of the things these articles are claiming these Drs are doing, DEA would have my butt in a New York minute and I'd be posting from jail.

 

[Rthur]

This explains the heroin OD problem plaguing the Country as well as Meth , Crack , Wet and Weed .
All makes sense it's big Pharma's fault .

Both side of this are at fault.

R

 

[hlee]

Hlee:

Yes, they advertise to the Drs. But this is what I was addressing - the article in the OP states:

"Keep in mind that drug companies pour advertising money like water into television programming—including the news. The effects of the news and the effects of the opioid drugs are a marriage made in heaven"

That's utter BS. They advertise meds on TV, but not those (that I am aware). Also, I don't think opioids are prescribed for depression legally either, but my patients are all animals so it wouldn't apply. What I do know is that if I did 1/10 of the things these articles are claiming these Drs are doing, DEA would have my butt in a New York minute and I'd be posting from jail.

I think we agree on the major points. I don't think I have ever seen a TV commercial for an opioid, nor do I think they are prescribed for depression. But, new articles have never made errors of fact- either intentional or otherwise- so what do I know.

But, I know a pharmacist who is heavy into body building. He and another pharmacist- somehow- prescribe each other anabolic steroids. I don't know the particulars, so don't try to correct me on the mechanism, but I do know that they get their steroids from each other and fly under the radar. Ask Rush Limbaugh how difficult it is to get a physician to prescribe oxy. There are 1000s of physicians in this country. The one's writing "bad scripts" can easily hide- physician and pharmacist are two of the most (if not the two most) trusted professions in this country.

 

[supercorndogs]

There are issues at many levels.
When I was in the hospital recovering from having my stents inserted I told the night nurse I had a slight headache and would appreciate a couple of Tylenol.
Her response was that I was already cleared for opioids and that she'd be more than happy to bring me those.
Half of me was in disbelief and the other wasn't surprised.
I politely told her that the Tylenol would suffice.

When I injured my back, I was offered opioid pain killers by every doctor I saw for two years. Several of them gave me their card,"in case I changed my mind." When I would decline.

The medicine is worse than the sickness. I think your mind will bring back that pain to get its fix. It is not that I think there aren't people who need it, but it is offered to many who don't. I am sure if you follow the trail of pills, you would find plenty of people that got hooked on a prescription, then started to circle the drain. I have seen several. I find syringes every where now days.

 

[fdkay]

Years ago, my daughter was having extreme back pain due to pregnancy.
The doctor prescribed her hydro-codone.
Luckily, I talked to her while she was waiting for the Doctor to finish and told her to refuse it.
He did change the script to tylenol 3 which is a bit better, I don't think she ever took it.
Goddamned "doctors" trying to get both my daughter and unborn grandson hooked on opiates.
Whatever happened to the Hippocratic Oath?
As a cop, we deal with folks that are addicted to hydrocodone, xanax and methadone ALL the time

 

[oneshot86]

everyone get ready for the heroin...
it just hit full force around here

 

[Alphatreedog]

The ppoid pill issue actually has another side which is that doctors and ERs are afraid to prescribr pain med . Seven years ago while training for a big Jiu Jitsu tournament I was rolling withe the #1 super heavy weight in the world. . I underestimated his speed and while doing a sweep he folded me in half backward . My left ankle , knee , hip and lower back all had soft tissue damage and I was in agony . Couldn't even walk . The hospital told me to take Motrin . I'm not an addict and will never be and I was friggin pissed . I've broken and torn enough shit to consult for the average Phd . One of the Docs at my family Doctor's office calls me the Orthopede because I no the courses of tretment and rehab for a fuck ton of related injuries . I won't touch Oxycoton , Percocet or Oxycodone. but when my shit is really busted up I don't think that 4 or 5 vicadin are uncalled for . Some. Healthcare Proffesionals now are afraid to prescribe and people legitimately suffer as a result . When I tell the ER my pain number is an 8 or a 9 it is the average person's incoherent with pain .

 

[Maser]

There was once a time where soda contained cocaine and phencyclidine was sold as an aspirin in drug stores.

 

[Maggot]

There was once a time where soda contained cocaine and phencyclidine was sold as an aspirin in drug stores.

And paragoric contained opium.

 

[spaniel]

As a person with a DEA license to prescribe these drugs, the first two paragraphs above are absolutely true in that, unless someone is stealing them and selling them black market (which has to be reported to the DEA if stolen), they all go out the pharmacy through a legal Rx. These are Sched. II drugs, which means the Dr. can't call it in, he has to write a script on a physical piece of paper, maximum supply of one month, and NO refills (i.e. the patient has to come get another physical piece of paper again if he is to continue on the drug). Every single pill is counted, and logged in to log books, and then logged out to who/when/where/how many/etc. when prescribed. Blaming the drug companies for "flooding the market" with shipments is ridiculous in my opinion. It can't go out the door of a pharmacy without a prescription and log book entry, no matter how many truckloads the pharmacy has in the safe (double-locks required to store them, too). The article proposes that supply increases demand, but did not do anything to explain how that works, because it can't as far as I can reckon. The problem (which I readily acknowledge) has to be at the pharmacy or prescriber-level, or either there is black market sale from theft (but that has to be reported, so I'm not sure how widespread that is).

The third paragraph makes no sense to me. Why lobby state legislatures when all of the laws are Federal (DEA)? More red herring crap.

As to my earlier point about the tons of advertising they are supposedly spending on TV, I don't know if it is actually illegal to advertise these drugs or not, but I can't recall ever seeing an advertisement for a Sched. II drug. I'm not saying they don't exist, but will say that accusation is false.

As usual, Maggot, you've got barely two brain cells to scratch together on the subject and ignorant ones at that, but it doesn't prevent you from posting.

My wife is a provider, and has been on the front lines of this problem for going on 20 years.
1) The dependent population (think inner cities and Medicaid) has had a corner on this scam for years. There is no test to prove someone does or does not have pain. So they learn to game the system and teach your friends. As the post above, these people go to the ERs DAILY complaining of pain. The providers can a) consume valuable time and resources needed for patients in actual need of care to try and prove or find a reason to deny narcotics, or b) write a script for 5 pills and move the moochers out of the queue and deal with patients in actual need.

How would you handle this situation? My wife started by resisting, but after patient care suffered, she toes the line and moved the mooches out with the 5 pills, paid for by Uncle Sam.. Since they do this every day, it adds up.

2) The feds have forced providers to assess pain and medicate it. Even if patients do not complain of pain, providers are obligated to seek out a pain diagnosis and, if obtained, medicate it.


It's crazy that people seem to place incredible trust in their physicians, but then think that they are complete pawns to "pharma marketing" and are powerless to control their own decisions in prescribing pain medications, which as described above, are tightly controlled.

 

[supercorndogs]

As usual, Maggot, you've got barely two brain cells to scratch together on the subject and ignorant ones at that, but it doesn't prevent you from posting.

My wife is a provider, and has been on the front lines of this problem for going on 20 years.
1) The dependent population (think inner cities and Medicaid) has had a corner on this scam for years. There is no test to prove someone does or does not have pain. So they learn to game the system and teach your friends. As the post above, these people go to the ERs DAILY complaining of pain. The providers can a) consume valuable time and resources needed for patients in actual need of care to try and prove or find a reason to deny narcotics, or b) write a script for 5 pills and move the moochers out of the queue and deal with patients in actual need.

How would you handle this situation? My wife started by resisting, but after patient care suffered, she toes the line and moved the mooches out with the 5 pills, paid for by Uncle Sam.. Since they do this every day, it adds up.

2) The feds have forced providers to assess pain and medicate it. Even if patients do not complain of pain, providers are obligated to seek out a pain diagnosis and, if obtained, medicate it.


It's crazy that people seem to place incredible trust in their physicians, but then think that they are complete pawns to "pharma marketing" and are powerless to control their own decisions in prescribing pain medications, which as described above, are tightly controlled.

Seems like you just explained how they are not controlled at all, but are given out for convenience..

 

[Redmanss]

Sounds like Ohio spilled hot coffee on itself while smoking a Marlboro. Everyone else is suing evil "Big Pharma" for 9+ figures, why not them too?

View attachment 6462612

I think the better solution is to get rid of both opioids outside inpatient hospital care, right along with banning Narcan too. The problem on the streets will solve itself from there.

 

[308pirate]

Sounds like Ohio spilled hot coffee on itself while smoking a Marlboro. Everyone else is suing evil "Big Pharma" for 9+ figures, why not them too?



I think the better solution is to get rid of both opioids outside inpatient hospital care, right along with banning Narcan too. The problem on the streets will solve itself from there.

+1

 

[308pirate]

As usual, Maggot, you've got barely two brain cells to scratch together on the subject and ignorant ones at that, but it doesn't prevent you from posting.

My wife is a provider, and has been on the front lines of this problem for going on 20 years.
1) The dependent population (think inner cities and Medicaid) has had a corner on this scam for years. There is no test to prove someone does or does not have pain. So they learn to game the system and teach your friends. As the post above, these people go to the ERs DAILY complaining of pain. The providers can a) consume valuable time and resources needed for patients in actual need of care to try and prove or find a reason to deny narcotics, or b) write a script for 5 pills and move the moochers out of the queue and deal with patients in actual need.

How would you handle this situation? My wife started by resisting, but after patient care suffered, she toes the line and moved the mooches out with the 5 pills, paid for by Uncle Sam.. Since they do this every day, it adds up.

2) The feds have forced providers to assess pain and medicate it. Even if patients do not complain of pain, providers are obligated to seek out a pain diagnosis and, if obtained, medicate it.


It's crazy that people seem to place incredible trust in their physicians, but then think that they are complete pawns to "pharma marketing" and are powerless to control their own decisions in prescribing pain medications, which as described above, are tightly controlled.

+1

I've gotten much the same info from a close friend who is a hospitalist physician in one of OH's largest cities.

Oh well, the tinfoil-hat wearing ignorant will ignorate.

 

[pmclaine]

Can you give an example of an advertisement for an opioid drug on the news, or otherwise?

They don't advertise for the opiod but apparently if you cant take a dump because opiods have put your intestines to sleep those drugs are advertised on TV with their "humorous" commercials of people walking around with shit paper stuck on the heel of their shoe while observed longingly by the backed up opiod user.

Pretty gross statement on our society that its profitable to advertise drugs for opiod induced constipation on prime time TV.

Big pharma is only part of the problem. That is what gets the regular person hooked. The guy that breaks his ankle roofing and than his doctor gives him a six month supply of vicodin or whatever. It needs to be a couple pills to get you through the first 48 to 72 hours, than its time to nut up and endure the pain.

Sure pain management is necessary for healing without inducing other issues but it has to be more controlled than "take these when it hurts".

The bigger problem is the illegal drug trade.

The gov of NH made a comment that his drug problems in NH are the result of drug trafficking in MA and he mentioned a specific city as well insinuated new immigrants to the country could be profiting.

Well that caused a shit storm because he is "insensitive" and the MA rino gov doubled down on blaming bad medical policy in need of reform.

About three weeks ago the Boston PD identifies Dominicans specifically of running the heroin/fentanyl trade. The dealers are on tape laughing about "Americans" dying from OD. A bunch were arrested a week or so ago in the city that the NH gov identified as causing the problem.

Everyone learned about opium and its medical limitations after the Civil War. To think this is new or innocent is dumb.

It seems law enforcement knows exactly where the illegal trade comes from but dealing with that is more a political matter than a legal matter. Meanwhile people die while common sense and politics refuse to agree.

Addicted Americans are controlled Americans. Drug "treatment" programs create more government jobs that put people on the tit seeking to remove more money from the economy. Now the coming rage is safe drug consumption places to allow users a "safe space" to shoot up. Awesome a senior or Vet cant get an appointment to see a doctor but junkies will get a red carpet ride into the "safe space" drug zone.

The whole problem goes away by understanding one word "RESPONSIBILITY".

 

[Maggot]

Seems like you just explained how they are not controlled at all, but are given out for convenience..

Exactly.

As has been suggested, ths only real solution is to legalize it all and let Darwin sort it out. Anything less is in violation of the Declaration of Independence and its supporting documents, the Constitution and Bill of Rights.

But self righteous fools have very short vision and less 'brain cells' than a rock, unable to see the simple facts when laid in front of them.

 

[pmclaine]

Exactly.

As has been suggested, ths only real solution is to legalize it all and let Darwin sort it out. Anything less is in violation of the Declaration of Independence and its supporting documents, the Constitution and Bill of Rights.

But self righteous fools have very short vision and less 'brain cells' than a rock, unable to see the simple facts when laid in front of them.

Ill go for complete legalization if it goes hand in hand with RESPONSIBILITY.

That will never happen.

Instead we will have growth of government by the creation of the National Agency of Drug Treatment.

Everyone is willing to accept the poorly written Mein Kampf was Hitlers blue print for operation but they cant understand that the ominously well written Brave New World and 1984 are the plans of our current batch of tyrants.

 

[Maggot]

Ill go for complete legalization if it goes hand in hand with RESPONSIBILITY.

That will never happen.

Instead we will have growth of government by the creation of the National Agency of Drug Treatment.

Everyone is willing to accept the poorly written Mein Kampf was Hitlers blue print for operation but they cant understand that the ominously well written Brave New World and 1984 are the plans of our current batch of tyrants.

You got it brother. Im in the midst of re reading Brave New World right now. Frightening.

 

[fdkay]

All one has to do is peruse the number of "pain clinics" in an area.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wGZEvXNqzkM

 

[spaniel]

Seems like you just explained how they are not controlled at all, but are given out for convenience..

That is a mis-statement. They ARE controlled, but the control is loose as far too many scripts are written. The problem is why the scripts are written. This is a combination of perverse government mandates and incentives for physicians. "Big Pharma" is a convenient scapegoat for the ignorant, except a) these drugs are not made/marketed by "Big Pharma", as in actuality they are not all that profitable compared to real "Big Pharma" drugs, but by smaller companies with more limited marketing pockets, and b) the issue is at the point of prescription. You can't at the same time place your trust in your doctor and say they have your best interests in mind, then at the same time say they are spineless imbiciles at the mercy of Big Pharma marketing.

The real question is, why are the scripts being written? In the case of "pain clinics" there is clearly a profit motive. In the case of ERs and Medicaid, there is gov't pressure and an inability to prove people aren't in pain, and a need to move them along and deal with REAL patients.

So yeah, they ARE regulated. But given out like candy. Funny, eh?