Failure to fire Eley Ammo in V22

[DIYguy]

Finally made the jump from Base Class and will be shooting OG. Made the road trip to DST Precision and left a lot of my money behind with Troy. Troy had a used Vudoo V-22 barreled action with a 20" MTU barrel he took on trade. Mounted in MPA BA Comp chassis with Gun Candy finish, Triggertech Diamond trigger. Bought (100) each of Lapua Long Range, SK Biathlon, SK Match and SK Rifle Long Range to see what it likes.
Now for the issue. After getting my optic mounted headed off to the range to zero on the new set-up. Still have a brick of Eley Target (Yellow) so wanted to use the cheaper ammo while finding paper and initial zero. Third round goes "click" no bang. Ejected and check head and it shows good pin strike. Out of the next thirteen rounds had two more strikes and no fire. Three failures out of sixteen rounds. Stopped at this point as discovered my Arken EP-5 does NOT have enough downward elevation for 50y zero setting on a 40MOA rail. Still had to hold a full 1.2mil to get close. Different issue, waiting on new 20MOA rail to show up so I can try again.
I know the V-22's are chambered to Lapua rounds which is why I was planning on testing those brands. Is there anything about the V-22 chamber and Eley Target that could cause FTF or did I have a freak three out of sixteen bad rounds?

 

[justin amateur]

Easy answer...take some pliers and pull the bullets, empty on a paper towel.
If there is no primer visible in the brass, it's an Eley problem.

If the primer is visible in the powder but missing from portions of the rim, it's a handling/shipping problem.
Those large green flakes mixed in with the powder are primer chunks knocked loose from the brass.

If primer is still in the rim, then it's either a mechanical issue with the rifle,
or extremely hard brass or a rim that did not cup properly. No void for primer to fill.

 

[ZCOklahoma]

I can’t speak for your specific action, but my Vudoo V22 had problems with Eley ammo as well to the point that I stopped buying it. My CZ ate the same Eley lot like candy.

 

[DIYguy]

Justin, good advice. I did save each of the FTF rounds to compare pin impacts. Now looks like time to pull apart and find out what the inside of a LR round looks like.

 

[littlepod]

Call up Vudoo and get a heavier firing pin spring. If this is an older Vudoo, it probably has an 18# spring which I've found sometimes inconsistent for Eley when it's cold.

 

[Big Timber]

Would it fire if you recocked it and gave it a second hit? I had 2 boxes of tenex that had an average of 2 out of 10 rounds that wouldn't go the first time, but would fire with a second strike.

 

[Defender32]

Follow what @littlepod has stated. Get with Vudoo and buy a set of firing pin springs. You can tune it yourself and make it all work. Eley sometimes has a little harder brass and needs a second hit on the rim. Heavier spring solves it all and typically it will make the Lapua & SK more consistent as well.

 

[deltawiskey]

I had a Timney trigger in a gen 1 Vudoo that wasn't engaging the sear correctly causing some misfires. Changed the trigger and never had another issue!
Contact Vudoo, their customer service is second to none... they will help you out.
DW

 

[GIXXER2000]

No issues in mine. Shot 4 different types of Eley all good.

 

[DIYguy]

Tough to get a good photo but here are the three rounds that FTF. Pin hits look good, haven't torn the rounds apart yet to see if I can tell primer condidtion.

 

[J_D]

I had a Timney trigger in a gen 1 Vudoo that wasn't engaging the sear correctly causing some misfires. Changed the trigger and never had another issue!
Contact Vudoo, their customer service is second to none... they will help you out.
DW

Had the same issue......Xring had a video on this and TT has worked flawless since.

 

[deltawiskey]

Had the same issue......Xring had a video on this and TT has worked flawless since.

Yep, I switched to a TT and never had another problem!
DW

 

[DIYguy]

Tough to tell regarding the primer. Only one round had a piece of primer fall out, others are difficult to tell as orange primer in the bottom reflect brass color.
Regarding age of action, don't think it's very old but don't know actual age Ser# is VGW 45## if others know their # and age for reference. V-22, Two ninety, not Three 60
New Triggertech Diamond, Two stage trigger.

 

[Cowpokey]

I'm not familiar with Arken scopes, but find it odd that you wouldn't be able to get it to zero with a 40moa rail. I didn't see what distance you were trying to get initial zero at, if you posted that detail I missed it. I'm guessing 25 yards was used to "put it on paper"? I think you should still be able to do it with a 40moa rail...I could be wrong. I can understand not wanting to waste SK/Lapua ammo finding zero, but why not test fire some to see if the "failure(s)" disappeared with that ammo, especially when it's been an increasing problem for some folks using Eley...in Vudoo rifles.

I have some Eley Club, Target and SSHP (white box 38gr), haven't put any of that though my Vudoo, so I don't have experience on that to compare/share...but I've put it through three of my Anschutz rifles and haven't experienced any FTF with those. I tried some CCI-SV in my Vudoo, just one box, started getting the "hard to close bolt handle" after the first magazine, so I quit trying to use that and strictly use SK or Lapua in the Vudoo.

Not sure if I've offered any help, but maybe raise some questions for you to ponder? I hope anyway. Good luck with it, hope to hear how you get it working through this.

 

[DownhillFromHere]

Headspace also has tp be considered. Earlier this year, a buddy of mine had failure to fire issues with Eley in his newly-built RimX. Zermatt support told him that some lots of Eley had been found to have thinner rims (by a few thousandths) that had led to FTFs. He switched to another barrel for a number of reasons and the issue disappeared.

Fwiw.

 

[ocabj]

I acquired a Raven Eye Custom thickness gauge because I was curious about Eley and their rims are definitely thinner than Lapua.

 

[Rider47]

My buddy's Vudoo has had ongoing extraction issues with Eley ammo. After multiple attempts at repair, the problem was then thought to be a combination of Eley ammo having a slightly smaller rim diameter (some rounds below specs for 22LR) and the fact that the rifle was originally headspaced with ceracoating on the chamber end face of the barrel which wore off with use creating excess headspace. The combined effect was failed extraction due to excessive headspace and poor grip of the extractors on the smaller Eley rims. Interesting that the above post states Eley rims are also thinner than Lapua. Check your headspace? If off, and as resetting headspace would be difficult due to the extractor grooves location, I would not be surprised if simply reshaping the end of the firing pin such that it does not impact on the edge of the rim would solve the Eley misfiring issue. There is lots of info on how to do this online.

 

[vaguru]

Tough to get a good photo but here are the three rounds that FTF. Pin hits look good, haven't torn the rounds apart yet to see if I can tell primer condidtion.

Those rim strikes are light. Try a heavier firing pin spring. Try your other ammo brands to see if same strike. Firing pin springs do wear out.

 

[deltawiskey]

Call Vudoo, they will fix it.
DW

 

[Hi-NV Shooter]

Those rim strikes are light. Try a heavier firing pin spring. Try your other ammo brands to see if same strike. Firing pin springs do wear out.

I agree they look like more of the pin strike at the rim then just inside where the primer would be.

Lee

 

[DIYguy]

Interesting conversations. My Base gun is a Savage B22. Went with that gun to start with because I have couple other rifles with the MDT ACC chassis and like the chassis. Photo attached of the Savage.
Went through the whole process with the Savage of eight different ammo's and (100) rounds of each. Did my first pass of testing at 50y but didn't wast a lot of time at that distance, lots of ammo's do OK at that distance. 100y tells the tale. Didn't need the full (100) for five of the brands as the groups were horrible, three did better. Ran a bunch more test with the three semifinalist and ended up going with the Eley Target as the cheapest ammo with the best results. Shot a bit with Eley Match as the groups were a bit tighter but for 2-1/2 time the cost was not worth the slight improvement in accuracy.
Shot several matches with the Eley Target and was frustrated at the number of times I had FTF on the clock. Several times I had more that one FTF in a ten round stage and didn't have an extra mag so out of ammo before out of stage. I though it was either the gun or me. Based on what I'm seeing and hearing it seems the Eley has a thinner rim and lighter on the primmer. Still have a full brick of the Eley Target left in my stock.
Waiting on the new 30MOA rail to show up so I get back to the range and keep testing. I'll still try the Eley for a while just to see if I have more FTF before switching the actual ammo and see if the issues go away with the SK.

 

[King_beardsly]

I had a similar issue happen with a RimX I put together, the rim thickness of the eley was just thin enough it was causing a ftf issues every so often and at the same time I had an issue with older SK std+ but that was due to getting knocked around causing primer compound issue. So you could very well by chasing down two different problems that are causing the same issue, which will definitely make for a frustrating endeavor.

 

[DIYguy]

Latest update. Mounted the new 30MOA scope base and off to the club. Ran into a shooting buddy that is a highly competitive shooter with a long history shooting Vudoo. Started off again with the Eley Target and third round, no bang. Had another no bang with that mag of ten. Tried some of his SK Semi-Auto, about third round, no bang. Tried that round in his gun, no problem. Tried another mag of SK Rifle, red box, had one no bang in twenty rounds. Better but still not good. Now working on getting new stronger firing pin spring. Gen2, two 90 bolt.

 

[Rider47]

 

[Silvermachine]

A reference to Bill Calfee, would be good.

 

[DIYguy]

I have to admit, I have not seen that chart before. That's very helpful. I just pulled four of the no bang rounds out of my pocket I saved that weren't fired in the friends gun. Two were Eley and hits definitely looked lite. Two were SK, one looked lite, one looked stronger. All the hits extend past the rim of the case. Looking closer at the impact I'm surprised that the indent tapers from light towards the center and deeper at the rim. Opposite of picture #4.
Will be contacting Vudoo later this morning. Troy of DST Precision said to mention shooting in MN as they might send a new firing pin. Might be in the 70's at the moment in the Great up North but pretty soon it won't be.

 

[accurate obsession]

Vudoo will take care of you.
I have a gen2 from early 2020, all was fine until late last year when I started having light strikes. Progressed rapidly from a couple per hundred to one per magazine. Contacted Vudoo and they replaced all pertinent parts, not a glitch since then.

 

[DownhillFromHere]

I still think headspace should be checked... If you know anyone with a RimX, see if they have the no-go gauge that ships with that action - it works fine with a Vudoo. If your bolt closes on that no-go gauge... there ya go. It could be an easy way to eliminate a potential cause.

 

[DIYguy]

Talked to Vudoo and gave full details. She said my Gen2 probably has a 18# spring, their shipping a 22# spring out today expedited. If the spring doesn't fix the issue they'll take care of it then.

 

[BowChamp]

As others have stated, I'm thinking the stikes are light too.

Here's what the firing pin strikes from my Vudoo rifle looked like, when I received it new from Vudoo.

 

[Rider47]

Silvermachine: I found this somewhere on the net with no source identification. Thank you for providing this - Bill Calfee - duh!

 

[DIYguy]

Successful range trip yesterday. Was able to chronograph (30) SK rifle (red), (30) SK Long Range (black) and (20) Lapua Long Range. Had three no bangs with the Rifle, one no bang with the SK Long Range and one no bang with the Lapua. Saved all the failed rounds and pin strike are way light compared to the above. No surprise, had best group with the Lapua, second best were the SK Rifle.

 

[DIYguy]

Latest range result.
Received the new firing pin spring and installed. Limited time at the range so ran (40) rounds Eley Target as a test. Had (6) no fires out of (40) Not much better than previous. Went back to range next day and ran (40) SK Long Range and had zero no fires, so (40) for (40) with the SK. This means there are still issues but at least the rifle will fire the SK. Out of Lapua at the moment so wasn't able to test but soon as my new order of Lapua and SK Long Range show up will test again. Have a match this Saturday (two days from now) and a lot of work to finalize before trying to compete with this rifle.

 

[wvlapua]

Latest range result.
Received the new firing pin spring and installed. Limited time at the range so ran (40) rounds Eley Target as a test. Had (6) no fires out of (40) Not much better than previous. Went back to range next day and ran (40) SK Long Range and had zero no fires, so (40) for (40) with the SK. This means there are still issues but at least the rifle will fire the SK. Out of Lapua at the moment so wasn't able to test but soon as my new order of Lapua and SK Long Range show up will test again. Have a match this Saturday (two days from now) and a lot of work to finalize before trying to compete with this rifle.

Did you get the misfire issues resolved?

 

[DIYguy]

Yes, Issue resolved. After test firing pin with the new spring I went back to my shop and started over. Took the firing pin assembly apart and screwed the spring tension all the way down to hard stop. Backed the firing pin assembly off just enough for the slot in the assembly to line up and locked. This was on the recommendation of another shooting buddy. He thought the spring not be compressed enough to get the full recoil and he was correct. Been working perfect every since.