FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

R

RoosterShooter

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Feb 11, 2011
590
1
48
Kentucky
#1
This is just a courtesy note to you fellow reloaders who reload .45 ACP brass.

I loaded up my Dillon this morning with 1000 brass of once fired Federal 'Champion' (Red Box) 45 ACP that I fired over the past few weeks.

After several hours of crushed primers, and endless tech support with Dillon ....... I found out ONE alarming problem.


Federal is using <span style="text-decoration: underline"><span style="font-weight: bold">SMALL PISTOL PRIMER POCKET 45 ACP Brass</span></span> in most of their WAl-Mart Champion Ammo!

I just thought I'd give you all a heads up so that you didn't waste your time and money on wasted primers like I did.

I heard of Federal using SP Primer Pockets in some of their Military ammo, and that it was beginning to enter the scene. However, I didn't know they had began utilizing it in the civilian market. It would have been nice to know!
 
#3
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: G.Ruff</div><div class="ubbcode-body">???? You couldn't tell the difference by looking at them? </div></div>

Some people are too busy reloading to open their eyes
laugh.gif



Smart-assed comment aside, they have been using small primer pockets in some of their cases for years. The difference in size is obvious if you look at the pockets, and the cases are more than serviceable for plinking ammo. I use the hell out of it for bowling pin matches.
 
#5
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

Your tag line is a little misleading. It is not a problem to use small pistol primers in .45 ACP it is a problem that you are not separating your brass. This is human error not manufacturers error. Big difference in my opinion
 
#6
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

Were they all small primers or some large and some small in the same lot? I say there was no need for this post whatsoever. Federal does not have a problem. You made a huge mistake by not inspecting your brass and if you can't tell the difference from a large pocket and a small pocket you have no business reloading. The fact that you had to call Dillon tech support makes me wonder where you learned to reload. Lay blame where it belongs and take responsibility for your own mistakes.
 
#8
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

Say what you will, but this is the first time I have heard of Federal doing this. Sure, I have heard about it in Military Surplus ammo, but not in civilian ammo that is sold at major retail chains.

Maybe I didn't make my post perfectly clear, and that is my fault.

Some of the brass has large primer pockets, and some were small. After picking up several hundreds of cases, on my own personal range where I am the only shooter, I only look at 2 or 3 of them to see if there is anything out of the ordinary. I don't look at every single piece of brass, and analyze what type of primer pocket it has! Waste of time!

Again, I had no idea that Federal was selling ammunition to the public that was of the small primer variety. Had I known that this ammo was a mixed lot of small and large primers intermixed, I wouldn't have bothered with it.

In speaking with several individuals in the shooting industry about this issue this afternoon this brings a whole new question into play.

How does Federal pass this ammo as a SAAMI spec ammo since the industry standard for .45 ACP since the mid 1960s has been a Large Pistol Primer case?
 
#9
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

Did you load your magazines or did someone load them for you. Seriously...nothing stuck out to you when you opened the box of ammo? You handled every piece at least twice and noticed not one odd primer. I find it hard to believe there was large and small primers just mixed willy nilly in the boxes of ammunition and that it was all the same lot number and the same maker.
 
#10
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ridgeback80</div><div class="ubbcode-body">After several hours of crushed primers!!!!!!! lol REALLY! </div></div>

My thoughts also. I find these from time to time when I push the lever to prime and it doesnt feel right - meaning I can't feel the primer lead into the pocket. Even the first time I came across one I didnt crush/hurt the primer... I admit I have crushed a few though trying to prime brass with a military crimp.

Anyway... To the OP: We appreciate the heads up and I think we all suggest you pay a little more attention, as well as use a little more finesse while manufacturing/remanufacturing ammo. Best of luck.
 
#11
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

"After several hours of crushed primers, and endless tech support with Dillon"

Goodness. And that's something Federal is responsible for?
 
#12
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RoosterShooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

How does Federal pass this ammo as a SAAMI spec ammo since the industry standard for .45 ACP since the mid 1960s has been a Large Pistol Primer case? </div></div>

Because SAAMI could give a rats ass less what kind of primer they use. SAAMI spec just means it's within the cartridges pressure limits, and case dimensions. Doesn't have a thing to do with the primer.
 
#13
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RoosterShooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Had I known that this ammo was a mixed lot of small and large primers intermixed, I wouldn't have bothered with it.</div></div>

Are you certain that large and small were mixed in the same lot? As far as I know, the Champion line has been all small for quite some time. I know all of the last four cases of .45 I bought dating back to November were all small primer and, if you Google, there are a ton of reports back to the beginning of the year on the Champion line coming with small primers. Can't seem them mixing in the same lot.

According to my distributor, several manufacturers are moving to small primers and he suspects that eventually all .45 factory ammo will have small primers.
 
#14
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

I am certain they were mixed in the same lot.

Now, whether I got a box or 3 in a case that was LP and the others were SP, I have no way of knowing. Before heading out to my range, I usually dump 4 or 5 boxes in a gallon bucket, and, at that point, they are all mixed in together.

The thing that threw me off about the SP .45 ACP is that I had never heard of it being implemented in civilian ammo. Also, to further compound the issue, I was having a problem with my priming system flipping primers on 5.56 loading several weeks ago. I assumed I had the problem fixed, and that is why I never thought to check the primer pockets on the 45 ACP. Had I had a flawless priming system up to the point of the issue, I might have thought of it. However, I was in the current mindset that it was my priming system. I know it was somewhat simple minded for me to not check the primers, but I had issues with my system in the past.

See my point?
wink.gif
 
#15
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RoosterShooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

I assumed I had the problem fixed, and that is why I never thought to check the primer pockets on the 45 ACP.

See my point?
wink.gif
</div></div>

Nope, sorry. Still don't see any reason the SP brass shouldn't have been spotted, other than you just didn't take the time to look your brass over. Brass inspection (ncluding primer pockets) is a must for any reloader, and any caliber from the smallest handgun to the largest magnum rifles. If you can't take 10 minutes to look over a batch of brass, you need to stop now before you hurt yourself or someone else.

Even if the SP and LP brass was in the same box of 50, this problem is in no way Federals fault. Federal wasn't pulling the handle on your press.
 
#17
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RoosterShooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am certain they were mixed in the same lot.</div></div>

Looking at it from purely a manufacturing standpoint....I would have to see this to believe it.
 
#18
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

Well from the standpoint of the original post. EVERY ONE BE CAREFUL!!!! LAPUA MAKES 308 WIN BRASS WITH SMALL PRIMER POCKETS!!!

I just ordered 500 pcs of 45 acp brass from another hide member. Although it took me a while I sat down and counted/inspected each round. Not that I didn't trust the guy, but he was dealing with thousands of pieces of different brass. I would be stupid to trust that he inspected each round prior to packaging and shipping them to me. I'd rather take the time to do that than have 1 round go wrong and detroy my pistol.
 
#19
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Savage 10fp</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well from the standpoint of the original post. EVERY ONE BE CAREFUL!!!! LAPUA MAKES 308 WIN BRASS WITH SMALL PRIMER POCKETS!!!

I just ordered 500 pcs of 45 acp brass from another hide member. Although it took me a while I sat down and counted/inspected each round. Not that I didn't trust the guy, but he was dealing with thousands of pieces of different brass. I would be stupid to trust that he inspected each round prior to packaging and shipping them to me. I'd rather take the time to do that than have 1 round go wrong and detroy my pistol. </div></div>

This is obviously very thorough and good. Personally, it doesn't scare me in the least to only perform a quickie inspection of handfuls of 45 brass at a time before loading it. It is a low pressure cartridge, and experience (not JUST mine, either) indicates that you'll get a split neck before a case rupture.

If I were loading .40 or .357sig, I would not be saying this.
 
#20
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Savage 10fp</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well from the standpoint of the original post. <span style="color: #FF0000">EVERY ONE BE CAREFUL!!!! </span>LAPUA MAKES 308 WIN BRASS WITH SMALL PRIMER POCKETS!!!

I just ordered 500 pcs of 45 acp brass from another hide member. Although it took me a while I sat down and counted/inspected each round. Not that I didn't trust the guy, but he was dealing with thousands of pieces of different brass. I would be stupid to trust that he inspected each round prior to packaging and shipping them to me. I'd rather take the time to do that than have 1 round go wrong and detroy my pistol. </div></div>

So are you saying this can happen to me? People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw rocks kind of advice? Well I can assure you that this will NEVER happen to me. I have followed basic rules of reloading for the better part of 30 years now and this type of thing cannot happen in my loading room no matter how many different sized primer pockets are in my bucket of brass and I assure you my 45 brass is mixed primers.
I don't know what the point of this post is yet unless it is to advertise the OP's inept loading practices. It was intended to warn the massses that Federal ammo has mixed sized primers running in the same lots and boxes. Well I am gonna lay it out for you to play it out, that is a lie and I don't believe it, until I see proof beyond some random post by a newb reloader, about how he wasted his reloading day on phonecalls and failure because the Federal ammo he had decided to use run him up on a stump. Did I already tell you I have no use nor patience for folks who try to blame someone else for their ineptitude?
IF YOU FAIL TO NOTICE WHETHER A PRIMER IS SMALL POCKET OR LARGE IT IS YOUR FAULT..not Lapua's not Federal's not Winchester's not.......
 
#21
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

Speer, CCi Blazer (brass case) have small primers also. It sucks to have to separate brass but it goes pretty quick after a few minutes, you get used to diferrence in size.
cheers.
 
#22
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

"I can assure you that this will NEVER happen to me."

Well it did happen to me...one time, years ago. Really wasn't to hard to figger out, I didn't have to call anyone else to tell me what happened. And I didn't break my Lee AutoPrime before getting the message that the primer wasn't going in normally.
 
#23
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

"I can assure you that this will NEVER happen to me."

Well it did happen to me...one time, years ago. Really wasn't to hard to figger out tho and I didn't have to call anyone else to tell me what happened. I didn't even break my Lee AutoPrime before getting the message that the primer wasn't going in normally.
 
#26
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

It's nothing to worry about. You're just oblivious to what you're doing when reloading. Had several KBs this year I take it as well?

lol


I separate my 45 ACP brass by headstamp and then primer size. You just need two different charges depending on primer size. Although if I get factory 45 I get Winchester.
 
#27
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: armorpl8chikn</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Savage 10fp</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well from the standpoint of the original post. <span style="color: #FF0000">EVERY ONE BE CAREFUL!!!! </span>LAPUA MAKES 308 WIN BRASS WITH SMALL PRIMER POCKETS!!!

I just ordered 500 pcs of 45 acp brass from another hide member. Although it took me a while I sat down and counted/inspected each round. Not that I didn't trust the guy, but he was dealing with thousands of pieces of different brass. I would be stupid to trust that he inspected each round prior to packaging and shipping them to me. I'd rather take the time to do that than have 1 round go wrong and detroy my pistol. </div></div>

So are you saying this can happen to me? People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw rocks kind of advice? Well I can assure you that this will NEVER happen to me. I have followed basic rules of reloading for the better part of 30 years now and this type of thing cannot happen in my loading room no matter how many different sized primer pockets are in my bucket of brass and I assure you my 45 brass is mixed primers.
I don't know what the point of this post is yet unless it is to advertise the OP's inept loading practices. It was intended to warn the massses that Federal ammo has mixed sized primers running in the same lots and boxes. Well I am gonna lay it out for you to play it out, that is a lie and I don't believe it, until I see proof beyond some random post by a newb reloader, about how he wasted his reloading day on phonecalls and failure because the Federal ammo he had decided to use run him up on a stump. Did I already tell you I have no use nor patience for folks who try to blame someone else for their ineptitude?
IF YOU FAIL TO NOTICE WHETHER A PRIMER IS SMALL POCKET OR LARGE IT IS YOUR FAULT..not Lapua's not Federal's not Winchester's not....... </div></div>

My bad next time I'll lay on the sarcasm a little stronger.Its ok buddy.
 
#28
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RoosterShooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
After several hours of crushed primers, and endless tech support with Dillon ....... </div></div>

Hours? You sure you didn't mean seconds?
 
#29
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

Lets not forget: all of us Dillon customers pay a hefty premium for these products, BECAUSE they have such a good warranty and will work with you endlessly to get your problems hashed out.

I'm very glad some of my dollars went towards funding the "endless" tech support this guy needed.
 
#30
Re: FEDERAL Brand .45 ACP !!! WARNING !!!

well I can say that yes they do sale both in small and large.my son went to buy some fed loads and he saw that something wasn't the same.so I looked at the two dofferent boxes of the same and saw it.yeap two different primers one had small one had large.just told him to buy what he had bought the most of.so he got the ones with large primers.

so yes I think he didn't see the difference in the two or three boxes he dumped into the bucket.so I guess he was caught off gard when he went to loading them back.not trying to choose a side here but se both sides.I am sure he will look for now on.but think he was nice enough to share his run in with use.their are some new guys that just might not be as quick as the rest of us to see these things.

well thats my 2 cents worth
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

N
First Timer Help! LR Hunting 308 Handloads
Replies
44
Views
938
JerkyFreak
JerkyFreak
L
Reloading Equipment Reloading clearout: Forster .308 Win Bench Rest Die Set $89, RCBS Universal Hand Priming Tool $35
Replies
16
Views
1K
LR-Enthusiast
L
TXRattler07
LMT Bent Firing Pin
Replies
6
Views
370
RUTGERS95
RUTGERS95
Snuby642
45 acp loading expertice needed
Replies
25
Views
1K
Snuby642
Snuby642
B
Reloading Equipment SOLD Federal Brass 6.5 Creedmoor Brass "once fired" 350 pieces $90
Replies
0
Views
220
BLC3
B
Top Bottom
Back
Home
Forums
Merch
Alerts