Feeding issues with Seekins SP10 6.5

[mkris101]

Having issues with manually cycling Open tip ammo in my SP10. It was sent back to Seekins for repair. It seems to manully cycle better but still have issues with open tip ammo

Seekins replaced the BCG, Buffer spring, polished the feed ramps, check go/no-go and adjusted the gas block. They fired 25 rounds of ELD Match using the mags i sent them with no issues.

I received the rifle back yesterday and still having issues

All Ammo is factory.
American Gunner 140 grain BTHP- recommended by seekins
Winchester 125 grain open tip
Federal Gold Medal 140 grain Sierra Matchking
Hornady 129 gr interlock

All have issues manually cycling or while firing. They seem to jam just under the feed ramp on the right side.

Hornady ELD Match and cheap Sellier & Bellot ball cycle without issues

What gives?? is this normal for a 6.5 SP10?? I have no faith in the rifle

 

[FCS]

Picture of jam would help to clarify the exact FTF issue.

ELD Match cycles fine, S&B ball cycles fine but AG 140 BTHP doesn't cycle?
AG seems to generally run lower velocities, probably a different port pressure / gas volume which could easily cause issues in cycling.

Normal? No.
Gas guns being a little more finicky then bolt gun in terms of feeding? Not uncommon as there are a lot more variables / dynamics at play.

If always jamming up under the right feed ramp, I'd be looking at right side of barrel extension / feed ramp, look at right side of magazine to see if feed lip on that side is holding rd a little lower.
ELD Match has a polymer tip, helps get bullet tip into feed ramp.
Open tip is just that, open with more variability with potential for things to get hung up. Polymer tip and ball (FMJ) don't have that issue, at least not at same level.
129 Interlock is a lead soft point, IIRC, so that can cause an issue as when lead hits it deforms, which takes energy away from getting cartridge up the feed ramp.

I do find it peculiar that ELD Match(what bullet weight?) was used to function test yet AG 140 BTHP is the suggested ammo.

 

[whatsupdoc]

What mags? Have you tried different brand mags?
I know that typically SP10's run AG 140 with no issues with magpul mags.

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

As they say, pictures are worth 1000 words.

 

[mkris101]

ELD Match cycles fine, S&B ball cycles fine but AG 140 BTHP doesn't cycle? -Correct AG 140 jammed feeding manually and while firing (photos attached)

If always jamming up under the right feed ramp, I'd be looking at right side of barrel extension / feed ramp, look at right side of magazine to see if feed lip on that side is holding rd a little lower.- It jams on the right side on all of my mags. 1 pmag and 2 Larua metal mags. open tip will jam even on a manual feed. Seekins also polished the feed ramps

I do find it peculiar that ELD Match(what bullet weight?) was used to function test yet AG 140 BTHP is the suggested ammo.- I was told that they used 140 grain ELD match to test.. I had a conversation with Seekins, he mentioned that AG seem to run the best. They mentioned that they have gotten back sp10's where tReloads can be issues as well.


Gas guns being a little more finicky than a bolt gun in terms of feeding? Not uncommon as there are a lot more variables / dynamics at play.- Agreed but i think that 6.5 creeds are more finicky than a 308. I had a SP10 in 308 and never had any issues

AG seems to generally run lower velocities, probably a different port pressure / gas volume which could easily cause issues in cycling. - Ag is 2690 at the muzzle. Also had problems with Federal Sierra Matchking @140 gr.

I think that there is a possibility of the upper being out of spec

I am seeing the jam on the right side with all my open tip

Photos left side and r before is before it was sent to seekins. still doing the same thing

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

Mind taking a close up pick of mag lip to feed ramp area with and without a round jammed?

In an effort to eliminate factors, do you have another brand of magazine to try?

Is it every round in the mag or just the first ones or last ones?

 

[mkris101]

What mags? Have you tried different brand mags?
I know that typically SP10's run AG 140 with no issues with magpul mags.

Magpul and 2 Larue Metal mags

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

Not an SP10, but here's a 6.5cm AG in a Pmag. Never had a problem.

 

[mkris101]

In an effort to eliminate factors, do you have another brand of magazine to try? - I have 2 Larua's

Is it every round in the mag or just the first ones or last ones? - some work and some don't. no particular order to when they will jam

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

Is it catching on the lip of the barrel extension?

 

[mkris101]

Is it catching on the lip of the barrel extension?
View attachment 7405143

It seems to be.. Seekins said that they polished the feed ramps

 

[mkris101]

Mags loaded with AG

 

[db2000]

I would request they try more than one kind of ammo. Specifically the ones that are hangingup.ir CS is very good and usually thorough but seems if they're only trying ELDM then not thorough enough apparently.

 

[mkris101]

I would request they try more than one kind of ammo. Specifically the ones that are hangingup.ir CS is very good and usually thorough but seems if they're only trying ELDM then not thorough enough apparently.

I sent them an email yesterday to report the continued problem. I plan on requesting that they try other ammo. In my opinion, the only thing that is let to replace is the upper. might be slightly out of spec

 

[mkris101]

Just manually ran 5 rounds through. all were fine.. Ran the same 5 rounds and all jammed. Used the Pmag. The larue's just jammed on all

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

It seems to be.. Seekins said that they polished the 7777777775feed ramps

Is there any wiggle in the mags or can you push them up at all? Sort of looks like the Mags aren't seating fully and leads to a low entry point of the tips of the bullet. Coupled with a slight lip on the feed ramp to reciever.

 

[mkris101]

Is there any wiggle in the mags or can you push them up at all? Sort of looks like the Mags aren't seating fully and leads to a low entry point of the tips of the bullet. Coupled with a slight lip on the feed ramp to reciever.

Funny that you asked that. I was just putting pressure forward and back my pmag. no effect, but I was able to manually cycle some and jam on others, I am actually running up to buy another Pmag rule it out all together

 

[shax2lex]

I haven’t had that happen to me before. I use Pmags. I shoot American gunner too. My problem has been over gassing because the gas set screw came lose. I know you are talking feeding issues but check that too. It can mess up the timing and throw off the feeding.

 

[FCS]

Is it catching on the lip of the barrel extension?
View attachment 7405143

Sure looks to me like that is a catch point. Ideally that would be blended a little better between barrel extension and upper receiver.
2aBaCa asking a great question.

OP, might want to show that to SP, see if they would address that question specifically for you.

I don't see how blending that in yourself would bother SP but they may well take care of it for you.

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

Sure looks to me like that is a catch point. Ideally that would be blended a little better between barrel extension and upper receiver.
2aBaCa asking a great question.

OP, might want to show that to SP, see if they would address that question specifically for you.

I don't see how blending that in yourself would bother SP but they may well take care of it for you.

Yeah, If it were me, as painful as it might be being a fairly expensive production rife I would take a small round file to it and make it a seamless transition.

 

[mkris101]

Just got a brand new Pmag and same issue. It manually cycled 4 rounds then jammed on the 5th on the right side

I well send it back to seekins for them to fix it.

 

[FCS]

Just got a brand new Pmag and same issue. It manually cycled 4 rounds then jammed on the 5th on the right side

I well send it back to seekins for them to fix it.

Definitely an issue of blending between the barrel extension and upper receiver.
I'd send picture (New Pmag.jpg) to Seekins so they can see the exact issue.

I'm confident that Seekins will get that taken care of for you post hast once they see the root cause.

 

[UpSideDown]

There’s nothing like taking a dremel to your new Seekins. Home shop gunsmithing is a YouTube educated career.

 

[db2000]

They'll make it right. Just sucks they dropped the ball not testing various ammo the first time. They cover shipping so that's good but wastes time unfortunately.

 

[whatsupdoc]

Not sure from the images you posted but It looks like the AG ammo tip would make contact with the feed ramp just fine.
If the round is pushed forward from the mag where is the tip when it makes contact with the feed ramp?

Now just to be clear you are getting a jam when MANUALLY CYCLING the rifle correct?
If you just drop the bolt carrier using the release will it strip and chamber a round?

Do they jam when you actually fire the rifle?

The Image you posted Cycle jam.jpg looks like a double feed, that is not a missfeed stopped by bullet failing to properly navigate the feed ramp, did that happen from manually cycling with the charging handle.

 

[mkris101]

The Image you posted Cycle jam.jpg looks like a double feed, that is not a miss-feed stopped by bullet failing to properly navigate the feed ramp, did that happen from manually cycling with the charging handle.- That was a fired round. those rounds were AG 140gr BTHP

Now just to be clear you are getting a jam when MANUALLY CYCLING the rifle correct?- Correct

Do they jam when you actually fire the rifle?- Yes. It is better since I got it back, but it does still jam. Cycle.jpg is from firing. Seekins said they adjusted the gas block

If you just drop the bolt carrier using the release will it strip and chamber a round?- its 50/50 if it will feed or not

 

[FCS]

Not sure from the images you posted but It looks like the AG ammo tip would make contact with the feed ramp just fine.
If the round is pushed forward from the mag where is the tip when it makes contact with the feed ramp?

Now just to be clear you are getting a jam when MANUALLY CYCLING the rifle correct?
If you just drop the bolt carrier using the release will it strip and chamber a round?

Do they jam when you actually fire the rifle?

The Image you posted Cycle jam.jpg looks like a double feed, that is not a missfeed stopped by bullet failing to properly navigate the feed ramp, did that happen from manually cycling with the charging handle.

Looking at “New Pmag” picture, “Feedramp” picture, you still think an OTM or exposed lead bullet is going to feed properly?

 

[mkris101]

The tips on interlock ammo gets destroyed.

 

[bigjake83]

I've shot in my Seekins SP10 6.5CM 123 ELDs, 129 interlock, 130 SMK, 140 ELD, 140 SMK, 147 ELD and 140 Berger Hunting LVD's

Absolutely ZERO! malfunctions, You need to send that rifle into Seekins and tell them to fix it, It shouldn't matter what size projectile you're shooting, If that was the case they should put a disclaimer on their website that their rifles will not operate with various ammo. Call and talk to Matty or Luke and only those two people and I guarantee you your rifle will get fixed.

Find the mag and ammo that is giving you issues and send it in with the rifle.

 

[whatsupdoc]

Looking at “New Pmag” picture, “Feedramp” picture, you still think an OTM or exposed lead bullet is going to feed properly?

I was looking at the Jam1.jpg, looks like it should ride right up the ramp.

 

[bigjake83]

Yo @mkris101 is this a actually pick of your SP10???

 

[FCS]

I was looking at the Jam1.jpg, looks like it should ride right up the ramp.

Pretty sure if you look at other pictures, you'll see why there is an issue.
Clearly the feed ramp on barrel extension is not blended into the upper receiver and is definitely part of, if not all of, the reason for feeding issues.

I agree with bigjake83, the SP-10 should be feeding any / all 6.5 Creed factory ammo w/o issue.

I reiterate, I'm confident that Seekins will remedy the issue. I'd send a copy of the pictures showing feed ramp/barrel extension not being blended in and the 140 OTM ammo jammed into the barrel extension.

 

[FCS]

Yo @mkris101 is this a actually pick of your SP10???

View attachment 7405628

Post #9, picture provided by OP of his upper.

Post #10, expanded / zoomed view provided by 2aBaCa.

 

[bigjake83]

Pretty sure if you look at other pictures, you'll see why there is an issue.
Clearly the feed ramp on barrel extension is not blended into the upper receiver and is definitely part of, if not all of, the reason for feeding issues.

I agree with bigjake83, the SP-10 should be feeding any / all 6.5 Creed factory ammo w/o issue.

I reiterate, I'm confident that Seekins will remedy the issue. I'd send a copy of the pictures showing feed ramp/barrel extension not being blended in and the 140 OTM ammo jammed into the barrel extension.

I was just trying to get to that point with the OP... His Barrel extension is fucked up, that is not the correct Barrel Extension!!

Here is mine...

@mkris101 you need to send that shit back to Seekins and have them give you a new barrel.

 

[Jigstick]

Rat tail file that bitch

 

[FCS]

LaRue

GAP

Home build

All feed any bullet type w/o issue.

Again, I agree with bigjake83 in that the feed ramp / barrel extension is not right in how blended to upper receiver.

 

[bigjake83]

Something tells me this is a older SP10, they went through some growing pains when they first released the SP10 in 6.5CM. This is honestly very unfortunate because it makes Seekins look bad and they are Tier 1 Company and the SP10 is a exceptional rifle in the sub 3K range.

 

[bigjake83]

LaRue
View attachment 7405673

GAP
View attachment 7405674

Home build
View attachment 7405675

Clean your shit fool....lol

 

[FCS]

Clean your shit fool....lol

Why?
Runs 100%, shoots straight and I got better things to do than have spotless upper receivers.

 

[mkris101]

Yo @mkris101 is this a actually pick of your SP10???

View attachment 7405628

Yes it is

 

[mkris101]

Clean your shit fool....lol

You call that dirty??! lol. you should see what happens in the desert!

 

[bigjake83]

You call that dirty??! lol.

That wasn't posted to you.

 

[mkris101]

I was just trying to get to that point with the OP... His Barrel extension is fucked up, that is not the correct Barrel Extension!!

Here is mine...

View attachment 7405638View attachment 7405639View attachment 7405640

@mkris101 you need to send that shit back to Seekins and have them give you a new barrel.

It is going back! based on your photos, it looks smooth. Mine does seem to have a "ledge" at the transition point.. It sucks because it has to go back to seekins again!

 

[FCS]

You call that dirty??! lol. you should see what happens in the desert!

I am in the desert. LOL

All good, I've zero issue with bigjake83 expressing his opinion.

Usually at range every weekend so unless I'm having issues, no real reason for cleaning to bare metal....given available time, priorities.

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

You're supposed to clean them?

 

[hlee]

@bigjake83 what are you using to clean the barrel extension? I’ve ever been able to get in there to my satisfaction..

 

[bigjake83]

@bigjake83 what are you using to clean the barrel extension? I’ve ever been able to get in there to my satisfaction..

Those above pics aren't of a clean chamber I just wiped it out with a rag before I took those photos but these are the tools I use.

(1) Spray chamber with Hoppes carbon cleaner.

(2) Insert Nylon Brunch and carefully use drill to scrub chamber.

(3) rinse with Carb Cleaner, inspect chamber and barrel extension. I use for flashlight and dental mirror. If you still have carbon and gunk in your chamber or behind barrel extension lugs repeat steps 1 & 2. Takes all of 5 mins. Once my chamber is clean and flushed I insert AR Bore guild and start on bore..... NEVER USE DRILL IN BORE OR THROAT OF CHAMBER.

 

[mkris101]

Something tells me this is a older SP10, they went through some growing pains when they first released the SP10 in 6.5CM. This is honestly very unfortunate because it makes Seekins look bad and they are Tier 1 Company and the SP10 is a exceptional rifle in the sub 3K range.

I believe that you are absolutely correct. I bought it used. Original owner said he only had 40 rounds on it and it went to the safe. The BCG it came with had only a single ejector. Skeekins did replaced it to the updated BCG with the double ejector

 

[mkris101]

Contacted Seekins customer service this morning. They are going to pass this up to the QC team to see what to do next. So now we wait