Frankford F10 Progressive Press

[GenericBadGuy]

Looks like Battenfield has a 10 Station (?) press coming out under the Frankford Brand called the F10. Check the sample picture. Anyone know anything else about this one? MSRP= $649.99?

Frankford F10 Progressive Press

Frankford Arsenal Frankford Arsenal, Black, 10 Station Press, Optional Case And Bullet Feeder, Case Activated Powder Measure, Spring Loaded Case Locator Buttons, In Line Primer Pocket Swaging 1135898

www.pewlifeaccessories.com

 

[CK1.0]

I can only find renderings like the one posted... it doesn't look like it's real yet.

That said, this past summer I almost replaced my XL750 and bought a Mark7 Evo for its 8 stations in order to make boatloads of awesome pistol ammo without having to cut any corners... it was going to run me ~$3k.

If they can deliver 10 stations for under a grand and it doesn't suck quality-wise, they may have a winner...

 

[GenericBadGuy]

I honestly wish they would hurry up and release information about this and under the Caldwell line the Velociradar.

 

[MarshallDodge]

Is it made in China like most everything else they sell?

 

[GenericBadGuy]

Is it made in China like most everything else they sell?

Yes it will be.

 

[CK1.0]

Is it made in China like most everything else they sell?

I’d bet on it.

Thinking about it, ~$3k is really kind of a bargain for a Mark7 Evo considering where and how it’s made compared to a ton of other crap in this sport of $100+ bags and $3k scopes, etc... lol.

 

[TheOfficeT-Rex]

So the quality of an M press, but with ten stations?

It's priced to compete with a Dillon 750 - does the extra four stations sway anybody from the blue's lifetime warrantee? I'm not sure who the target audience for this is.

 

[GenericBadGuy]

So the quality of an M press, but with ten stations?

It's priced to compete with a Dillon 750 - does the extra four stations sway anybody from the blue's lifetime warrantee? I'm not sure who the target audience for this is.

People who dont want to pay the $2099 for a Dillon 1050 Super or the $3,000 for a Mark 7 Evolution and want to be able to separate their 9mm dies out. Biggest problem with a Hornady LNL AP or a Dillon 750, for example, is that you only have 5 stations to work with. When you use a bullet feeder you end up having to double up on functions with a PTX powder die and/or a combined bullet seater and crimp die. This will be targeted to compete above Hornady and below the Dillon 1050 as I see it.

 

[TheOfficeT-Rex]

Fair.

double up on functions with a PTX powder die

Isn't that SOP on Dillon with the Powder die providing flare while charging the case?

I know practically nothing about the hornady system, other than it's red and auto indexes.

 

[Cascade Hemi]

People who dont want to pay the $2099 for a Dillon 1050 Super or the $3,000 for a Mark 7 Evolution and want to be able to separate their 9mm dies out. Biggest problem with a Hornady LNL AP or a Dillon 750, for example, is that you only have 5 stations to work with. When you use a bullet feeder you end up having to double up on functions with a PTX powder die and/or a combined bullet seater and crimp die. This will be targeted to compete above Hornady and below the Dillon 1050 as I see it.

I'm not combining seating and crimping on my 650. There isn't a single person that is in the market for a Mark7 that is going to look at the Frankford Arsenal press and buy it instead.

 

[GenericBadGuy]

I'm not combining seating and crimping on my 650. There isn't a single person that is in the market for a Mark7 that is going to look at the Frankford Arsenal press and buy it instead.

Do you also not use a powder cop or a lockout die, a case expander die, combine your decapping and sizing? Yeah. That's what I thought.

It's called a substitute product. When you cant afford 10 stations on something more expensive you can choose the lesser costly alternative. Read the last sentence of my post again.

 

[GenericBadGuy]

Fair.

Isn't that SOP on Dillon with the Powder die providing flare while charging the case?

I know practically nothing about the hornady system, other than it's red and auto indexes.

Yes, Dillon does combine these functions also.
With a 10 station press you dont have to combine any press function. You have as much space as you want.

 

[CK1.0]

Dillon is getting squeezed from both ends price-point-wise it would seem...

Honestly though, maybe it's about time..? Not so much to hurt them, but to push them...

I like my XL750 well enough, and with a Mr. Bullet Feeder it makes great pistol ammo faster then I can shoot it up. But, both the XL750 and RL1100 could use more stations... the RL1100 is actually a bigger let-down as a couple of its "stations" aren't really true stations at all... Dillon basically opened the door for the Mark7 Evo and said "Come on in!" by sitting on their hands for far too long...

If FA putting out something like this pushes Dillon to actually/truly update their line a little bit or maybe quickens the pace on Mark7 getting their cheaper cast press going.... then cool.

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

Would make a decent permanent setup for bulk 5.56 or pistol. In line primer pocket swaging is a plus.

 

[Cascade Hemi]

Do you also not use a powder cop or a lockout die, a case expander die, combine your decapping and sizing? Yeah. That's what I thought.

It's called a substitute product. When you cant afford 10 stations on something more expensive you can choose the lesser costly alternative. Read the last sentence of my post again.

10 stations isn't typically important at that pricepoint. Maybe Hornady consumers will be sways but I doubt Dillon consumers will. Based on my experience, there isn't much need to combine decapping and sizing for a reloading operation that produces under 50k rounds a year. When we start discussing product in excess of 50K the pricepoint of the machine is a lot less of an issue.

 

[GenericBadGuy]

10 stations isn't typically important at that pricepoint. Maybe Hornady consumers will be sways but I doubt Dillon consumers will. Based on my experience, there isn't much need to combine decapping and sizing for a reloading operation that produces under 50k rounds a year. When we start discussing product in excess of 50K the pricepoint of the machine is a lot less of an issue.

We get there's brand loyalty. There are a lot more reloaders out there buying Lee single stage presses based on the cost alone. Because at the end of the day the market really is brand agnostic and price sensitive. Obviously there is a huge gap in the low(er) priced end of the market for high station progressive presses as a niche otherwise Battenfield wouldnt be jumping in with Chinese economies of scale.

I for one would like to see a lower priced Mark 7 press or a higher station capacity and higher quality Hornady press. But that's my bias.

 

[GenericBadGuy]

...or maybe quickens the pace on Mark7 getting their cheaper cast press going.... then cool.

What's the rumor on this?

 

[Cascade Hemi]

We get there's brand loyalty. There are a lot more reloaders out there buying Lee single stage presses based on the cost alone. Because at the end of the day the market really is brand agnostic and price sensitive. Obviously there is a huge gap in the low(er) priced end of the market for high station progressive presses as a niche otherwise Battenfield wouldnt be jumping in with Chinese economies of scale.

I for one would like to see a lower priced Mark 7 press or a higher station capacity and higher quality Hornady press. But that's my bias.

I'm not talking about brand loyalty. None of the lower priced progressive machines work very well. Obviously FA thinks there is a market, and there probably is, but it is purely entry level. If you actually need 10 stations you aren't a pricepoint progressive consumer.

 

[GenericBadGuy]

I'm not talking about brand loyalty. None of the lower priced progressive machines work very well. Obviously FA thinks there is a market, and there probably is, but it is purely entry level. If you actually need 10 stations you aren't a pricepoint progressive consumer.

None of them. And you're telling me you aren't a brand homer. K.

 

[CK1.0]

10 stations isn't typically important at that pricepoint. Maybe Hornady consumers will be sways but I doubt Dillon consumers will. Based on my experience, there isn't much need to combine decapping and sizing for a reloading operation that produces under 50k rounds a year. When we start discussing product in excess of 50K the pricepoint of the machine is a lot less of an issue.

I tend to agree.

IMHO with a 650/750 having separate seating and crimping > having a powder cop jobber... On those presses, even running a bullet feeder, it's not difficult to maintain a visual powder check even when moving pretty fast, and one almost has to go out of their way and do something powerfully stupid to make a squib or a double-charge... a visual powder check is actually WAY more difficult on a 1050/1100 and with those it's actually more of a problem.
A 650/750 with a bullet feeder makes producing 1000rds an hour pretty easy... I could probably make enough rounds for most of the year in a weekend and I shoot ~10k-15k pistol rounds a year. If one needs more than that, then the price of jumping up to an Evo isn't really that unreasonable IMO.

What's the rumor on this?

Over on the benos forum guys in the Mark7 threads have been talking about Mark7 supposedly teasing a ~$1000-1500 cast version of an Evo press for about a year now... who knows when/if it'll ever drop... but if it does you're going to start seeing quite a bit more used 1050/1100's for sale...

 

[Cascade Hemi]

None of them. And you're telling me you aren't a brand homer. K.

Please continue telling me about your lock out die and other devices used to prevent double charges. Maybe if any of the other progressive presses on the market worked even half as well as the Dillons you wouldn't need 10 stations to accomplish what is done every day with five. Someone mentioned they thought Dillon is stagnating innovatively and I'd argue the other brands haven't innovated in the first place. Perhaps Hornady, Lee, and now FA should work on a powder thrower that won't allow users to double charge a case so easily?

 

[Cascade Hemi]

I tend to agree.

IMHO with a 650/750 having separate seating and crimping > having a powder cop jobber... On those presses, even running a bullet feeder, it's not difficult to maintain a visual powder check even when moving pretty fast, and one almost has to go out of their way and do something powerfully stupid to make a squib or a double-charge... a visual powder check is actually WAY more difficult on a 1050/1100 and with those it's actually more of a problem.
A 650/750 with a bullet feeder makes producing 1000rds an hour pretty easy... I could probably make enough rounds for most of the year in a weekend and I shoot ~10k-15k pistol rounds a year. If one needs more than that, then the price of jumping up to an Evo isn't really that unreasonable IMO.

Yep. It is fairly easy to tell who has been loading in volume and who hasn't. For anyone that actually needs a 10 station press the $1K is pretty much irrelevant. The priority in a production environment is quality assurance, stoppages, and time. The equipment cost differential is consumed in the first month, if not sooner.

 

[GenericBadGuy]

Please continue telling me about your lock out die and other devices used to prevent double charges. Maybe if any of the other progressive presses on the market worked even half as well as the Dillons you wouldn't need 10 stations to accomplish what is done every day with five. Someone mentioned they thought Dillon is stagnating innovatively and I'd argue the other brands haven't innovated in the first place. Perhaps Hornady, Lee, and now FA should work on a powder thrower that won't allow users to double charge a case so easily?

Please do explain to me the "super duper" level of precision of your Dillon mechanical powder throw that all those other brands cant do.

Do explain to me how great Dillon is again, I just need to know. Its almost like you couldnt be more antagonistic just to shit on another product that hasnt come out and others which you probably haven't owned. You dont understand need vs want. These are all luxury goods no one will die without.

 

[CK1.0]

I'd imagine FA is probably going after guys that maybe have been thinking about dipping their toes into reloading, but maybe haven't pulled the trigger yet and/or maybe aren't comfortable spending Dillon money yet, let alone Mark7 money. With 9mm going for like $100 a box, and all the new gun owners, I bet there's a small f'ing army of them lol.

While most of FA's products are Chinese-made, they don't all suck, some of their stuff is actually pretty good: I dig their primer tool and their new case trimmer, dig my good 'ol Vibra-prime, and have been using their wet tumbler for a long time, no issues, great blue-collar performance-to-price.
If they can manage to turn out a good product here with the press (a MUCH taller order) maybe they'll even get some experienced guys to give them a try, jumping in with a press that offers 10 stations will get them some looks...

 

[GenericBadGuy]

Put a little more succinctly given the opportunity, would I buy a press with 10 stations vs 5? Yes.

I want that conveinence and flexibility. Me personally, I can afford basically anything I want. That's just matter of budget and time. Am I going to buy this? No, probably not. I already have 5 presses but I like variety and Im going to buy a MEC 9000e next.

 

[TheOfficeT-Rex]

I'm willing to bet this isn't aimed at an entry reloader.

Which makes their competition the hornady progressive and the Dillon 750. Assuming it runs reliably, it may compete for people that want more stations and the built in swager. I don't see it as competition to the 1100 or mark7. Guys in the market for those presses are not going to be rolling an FA press...

Now if it comes all set up with casefeed and bullet feed and ready to spit out 9MM from the box, they may find a market niche.

 

[TheOfficeT-Rex]

I'd imagine FA is probably going after guys that maybe have been thinking about dipping their toes into reloading, but maybe haven't pulled the trigger yet and/or maybe aren't comfortable spending Dillon money yet, let alone Mark7 money.

If we assume the price for the FA in the OP is close to correct at $650, you really dont save that much over a Dillon 750 at $600 unless the FA ships with all the gucci extras.

I'm not sure guys "dipping their toes in" are looking at 1100s or Mark7s.

 

[Cascade Hemi]

I'm willing to bet this isn't aimed at an entry reloader.

Which makes their competition the hornady progressive and the Dillon 750. Assuming it runs reliably, it may compete for people that want more stations and the built in swager. I don't see it as competition to the 1100 or mark7. Guys in the market for those presses are not going to be rolling an FA press...

Now if it comes all set up with casefeed and bullet feed and ready to spit out 9MM from the box, they may find a market niche.

That is the big get

Please do explain to me the "super duper" level of precision of your Dillon mechanical powder throw that all those other brands cant do.

Do explain to me how great Dillon is again, I just need to know. Its almost like you couldnt be more antagonistic just to shit on another product that hasnt come out and others which you probably haven't owned. You dont understand need vs want. These are all luxury goods no one will die without.

I never said "precision".

Buy one of the new FA presses and do a review. I have quite a few FA products that are quite good so maybe I'm wrong. Their CoAx knock off is pretty disappointing but perhaps this one isn't.

 

[Gentleman4561]

Anyone buy one?

 

[Jrb572]

I do not think they are for sale yet.

 

[TheOfficeT-Rex]

Midsouth has a preorder, as the X-10 with casefeeder at $999.99.

FA website lists it at $1200, but I'm not seeing a release date.

 

[rdsii640]

I've been a blue Kool-Aid drinker for a long time. With that said, this FA press has me very interested.