GAP Rifles accuracy - factory or hand loads

[djarecke]

I have a GAP M40A-5 on order slated to arrive this fall and just bought a used GAP from another Hide member (that should be on its way shortly). I've been curious about GAP's accuracy levels that they get from their builds. It seems that everyone gets 1/2" or better with factory match ammo (as per GAPs guarantee), but many of the rifles that I've owned demand EXACTLY "X" grains of powder, with the bullet EXACTLY "X" off the lands, etc. How is it that their rifles are able to gobble up anything and print a 1/2" group, yet other rifles are so picky and finicky? From what I've read, it seems that I could cram some stones from the driveway down the barrel with 43 grains of Varget and still get a 1/2" group.

Is this an accurate observation and what is their secret?

I'm dying to try mine out to see if that's indeed the case!

 

[SWThomas]

They won't digest everything into a 1/2" group. It has to be match ammo and they specify that. There are major differences in bullet construction between match ammo and hunting/plinking ammo. Match ammo is pretty consistent when it comes to charge weight and other weights. At least FGMM is. But I do believe their quality of craftsmanship has the most to do with it. Quality barrels installed properly and anchored into a solid stock will make most novice shooters look good. GAP's rifles are capable of much better accuracy with handloads and in an experienced set of hands.

 

[Aimsmall55]

I've had two Crusaders, one in .308 and one in 6.5 creedmor. The .308 would shoot anything from 155 scenars to 208 amaxs with WAY under 3/8 moa groups. It also shot the FGMM175 ammo very well.
The creedmor is just as accurate. I regularly shoot in the .1's with it and a 140 hybrid. The 140 amax ammo also shot very well.

 

[NevadaZielmeister]

I have a GAP M40A-5 on order slated to arrive this fall and just bought a used GAP from another Hide member (that should be on its way shortly). I've been curious about GAP's accuracy levels that they get from their builds. It seems that everyone gets 1/2" or better with factory match ammo (as per GAPs guarantee), but many of the rifles that I've owned demand EXACTLY "X" grains of powder, with the bullet EXACTLY "X" off the lands, etc. How is it that their rifles are able to gobble up anything and print a 1/2" group, yet other rifles are so picky and finicky? From what I've read, it seems that I could cram some stones from the driveway down the barrel with 43 grains of Varget and still get a 1/2" group.

Is this an accurate observation and what is their secret?

I'm dying to try mine out to see if that's indeed the case!

DJ,

You will find that shooting a GA Precision will beg the question, why did I shoot anything else?

I upgraded from a Remington 700P to this rifle. My 700P had issues with cold bore shots and clean bore shots. It will have a .5 - 1.0 MOA point of impact shift. And then, it would need about 10-15 shoots before things settled down.

With my Hospitaller, it shoots dead on cold bore, clean bore, etc. It is just how well the whole platform is put together, hence the price. You get a quality barrel set in a quality chassis mounted onto a quality stock. Throw in a good trigger and quality optic, you have pretty much alleviated the problems with the rifle and now it is down to you to shoot it correctly. You will have ultimate confidence in the rifle, thus improving your shooting. Far too many people blame their equipment and they never improve. Get the equipment right the first time, and you will always work to improve yourself.

Enjoy that new GAP when it arrives and let us know in this thread when you get it, a range report, and maybe a picture of your HUGE smile after shooting it. Just know that it will take about 50-100 rounds to get the most accuracy. Do not worry if it is 5/8 MOA at 20 rounds. It will break in. Also, be sure to download and adhere to the break-in procedures when you shoot the first 20 rounds. It will help, but I know that there are some who will disagree with me. Whatever.

 

[SWThomas]

DJ,

You will find that shooting a GA Precision will beg the question, why did I shoot anything else?

I upgraded from a Remington 700P to this rifle. My 700P had issues with cold bore shots and clean bore shots. It will have a .5 - 1.0 MOA point of impact shift. And then, it would need about 10-15 shoots before things settled down.

With my Hospitaller, it shoots dead on cold bore, clean bore, etc. It is just how well the whole platform is put together, hence the price. You get a quality barrel set in a quality chassis mounted onto a quality stock. Throw in a good trigger and quality optic, you have pretty much alleviated the problems with the rifle and now it is down to you to shoot it correctly. You will have ultimate confidence in the rifle, thus improving your shooting. Far too many people blame their equipment and they never improve. Get the equipment right the first time, and you will always work to improve yourself.

Enjoy that new GAP when it arrives and let us know in this thread when you get it, a range report, and maybe a picture of your HUGE smile after shooting it. Just know that it will take about 50-100 rounds to get the most accuracy. Do not worry if it is 5/8 MOA at 20 rounds. It will break in. Also, be sure to download and adhere to the break-in procedures when you shoot the first 20 rounds. It will help, but I know that there are some who will disagree with me. Whatever.

They may have revised their procedures since you saw them last. They recommend following that procedure for the first 10 rounds or until copper fouling tapers off. With my new bolt gun, the fouling tapered off after only 3 shots. I still followed the procedure for another 7 shots, but then started shoot 5'ers.

 

[Barney88PDC]

And there may or may not be some people at GAP that may or may not even believe in a break in procedure but just list one so that they don't get 50 phone calls a week about it.

 

[jashmore1234]

I
Is this an accurate observation and what is their secret?

I'm dying to try mine out to see if that's indeed the case!

My Crusader has shot every ammo I've put into it into one ragged hole at 100 yards. The phrase "absolute hammer" seems accurate (excuse the pun). Get ready to be impressed so long as you top it with good rings and glass.

If it doesn't shoot, send it back to GAP and they will make it shoot.


I would love to ask GAP what their secret is, but then they would have to shoot me and they shoot GAP rifles so there is no way they would miss.

 

[Mike]

GAP rifles shoot very well, very consistently (and there are many others that do as well). In the interest of marketing, some builders, rather than being happy building a great rifle, trying get "an edge" and to do this they'll market their rifles as a "X guarantee" that's only available under very specific circumstances.

You will not have a problem getting sub .5 moa groups out of most any MATCH ammo. Good quality hunting ammo will do the same and if you hand load, getting down to the .2's and .3's is not out of the question.

Again, many builders here do the same thing, but the question was about GAP.

 

[nexusfire]

I have shot some of my best groups with AMAX and FGGM. That being said, when you start reloading dont get high expectations at first because there is a learning curve. GAP's, and most custom rifles with quality barrels assembled by a competent person will out shoot most people.

 

[damoncali]

A friend of mine has a GAP rifle and it shoots very well. That said, it is very easy to read unrealistic expectations into such a guarantee. No rifle I have ever seen will be 1/2 MOA with any load (not that GAP claims this - but that's kind of my point). I've got a benchrest rifle that will consistently shoot in the .2's and .3's in the hands of a good shooter. I've also shot 1+MOA groups with that rifle with a load that was just horribly wrong. That hardly makes the smith who built it a hack.

A realistic expectation from a high-end custom (non-benchrest) rifle is to be able to find a load that shoots in the 1/2 MOA range consistently. More than that is a disappointment. Less is a blessing. Under 3/8 MOA requires benchrest skill to even shoot consistently, so take such claims with a grain of salt. Guarantees of 1/4 MOA (which I've seen plenty of) are a joke.

 

[Seandradamus]

Gap = the shiznit
You will loath all your prior rifles unless you have other high end customs
I have 1 gap i shoot 1/2 moa consistently but on 2 occasions I have put 3 bullets in a 30 caliber hole at 200 .01 moa
I could not believe my eyes. I am now beginning the process of my next gap rifle. You will be happy

 

[Aimsmall55]

I once shot a .95" ctc group (10 shots) at 520 yards with my Crusader (6.5 creedmor ). Shiznit is spot on. They are incredible.

 

[SWThomas]

I once shot a .95" ctc group (10 shots) at 520 yards with my Crusader (6.5 creedmor ). Shiznit is spot on. They are incredible.

Holy Chit! That's impressive!

 

[ahhshoot]

I once shot a .95" ctc group (10 shots) at 520 yards with my Crusader (6.5 creedmor ). Shiznit is spot on. They are incredible.

That is awesome, and I am jealous!

 

[MoBoost]

I've had two Crusaders, one in .308 and one in 6.5 creedmor. The .308 would shoot anything from 155 scenars to 208 amaxs with WAY under 3/8 moa groups. It also shot the FGMM175 ammo very well.
The creedmor is just as accurate. I regularly shoot in the .1's with it and a 140 hybrid. The 140 amax ammo also shot very well.

I once shot a .95" ctc group (10 shots) at 520 yards with my Crusader (6.5 creedmor ). Shiznit is spot on. They are incredible.

Please back-up some/any of your claims in our friendly challenge: http://www.snipershide.com/shooting...yard-bolt-action-6group-30round-shootout.html

 

[Aimsmall55]

Here's a few groups



6.5 creedmor with a 140 vld



125 yards

 

[Aimsmall55]

Sorry. Hit the wrong pic ( middle one) That's my .300 win mag with a 230 Berger. Still pretty damned good

 

[Aimsmall55]

6.5 with a 140 vld

 

[Aimsmall55]

Here's what I used to do for fun with my .308 GAP Crusader

 

[The Lawn Ranger]

Outstanding! The only rifle I have ever had that shot close to that was a Gradous/Surgeon in 6.5x47L. I still
regret selling that gun. It was money to 800 yds….

Here's what I used to do for fun with my .308 GAP Crusader

 

[Aimsmall55]

Outstanding! The only rifle I have ever had that shot close to that was a Gradous/Surgeon in 6.5x47L. I still
regret selling that gun. It was money to 800 yds….

Thanks. The MONEY LOAD was 44.5 grains of Varget with a 175 smk at 2.235 to the Ogive. But like I said earlier... It would hammer with ANYTHING I put down the tube. The 208 amax shot unbelievable

 

[supratt96]

Here's a few groups



6.5 creedmor with a 140 vld



125 yards

I would sell one of my kidneys before I would sell a rifle that shot that well, although a good bit of the credit must go to the shooter.

Nice work!

 

[tansinator]

I called bs on one of these Ms boys on shooting a small group at distance and ate my words. The guy was shooting a GAP .308 with a 10x US Optics. He shot 5 shots as fast as you could work the bolt and get back on target and his group was under 2.5 inches at 800 yards. I was impressed to say the least. This was with hand loads.

Eddie

 

[Lazer]

I'm w moboost let's see those 2s an3s in the 100 yd challenge and show the op what he wants to see!

 

[damoncali]

2013 Super shoot (grand daddy of benchrest matches) results: 2013 Super Shoot Results Day 1

If only the 246 competitors (out of 255) that did not average under .250 had bought a rifle guaranteed to shoot under 1/4 MOA with GMM. Would have saved a lot of reloading and headaches.

 

[Mike]

This isn't a benchrest site.

 

[damoncali]

This isn't a benchrest site.

That's exactly my point. This level of accuracy is pure fantasy for regular rifles.

 

[Mike]

That's exactly my point. This level of accuracy is pure fantasy for regular rifles.

That wasn't pointed at you. Just a general reminder for those that get wrapped around the axle about "guarantees" and "accuracy".

 

[damoncali]

That wasn't pointed at you. Just a general reminder for those that get wrapped around the axle about "guarantees" and "accuracy".

Gotcha. And agreed. The sheer amount of technical fuss required to shoot 1/4" groups is draining, and the benfits quickly lost when you get past 200 yards.

 

[rockbox]

My only experience with a gap was a crusader owned by a kid at the nearby gun range. He was doing some load development and regardless of his load, none of his groups were more than a half inch with most looking like one jagged hole. I thought you guys were full of crap until I saw that. Now I want a GAP in the worst way.

 

[djarecke]

Just a general reminder for those that get wrapped around the axle about "guarantees" and "accuracy".

Wrapped around the axle about accuracy? Yeah, that's probably true after a long time spent chasing the "x" ring. But I think it'd be disingenuous for anyone here to say that they enjoy a good old fashion "Maggie's drawers" as much a center mass hit.

Thanks for the feedback, guys. It looks like this GAP is going to be worth every penny!



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Mike]

Yes, wrapped around the axle. Many try to compare their "X" guaranteed rifle against the "Y" guaranteed rifle and it's all a joke. If anyone could shoot the difference at distance there would be a new WR but they can't because of this little thing called "wind".

 

[damoncali]

The dirty secret of long range shooting is that the further you shoot, the less the rifle matters. The inherent accuracy of the rifle gets swallowed up by velocity variations, range uncertainty, and wind. It just doesn't matter unless you're aiming at very small known distance targets (like F class - where having a very accurate rifle at long range can make a small difference). Otherwise? It's more because we can than because we have to. Nothing wrong with that, but knowing that it's not that important helps us focus on what is, which is getting on target.

 

[gstaylorg]

I used to play a lot of golf. I was never very good, but if I could manage even a single 250+ yd drive down the middle during a round, it was worth every penny of my greens fee.

I have several GAP bolt guns that I use in F-TR competitions. I have had pretty good success using these rifles with commercial match ammunition, particularly at the local level. When the wind is bad, my scores aren't always that great, but it's never been the fault of the rifle.

However, when you add good handloads to the equation, it really just becomes sickening. What I used to consider pretty decent groups at 100 yd with commercial match ammo (slightly under half MOA without too much trouble), are what I now expect routinely from rounds that represent sub-optimal charge weight or seating depth during development. When you actually hit the sweet spot, it's not uncommon to see 5-shot groups in the quarter MOA range, sometimes even a little bit less.

Now, I'm not making any claims I can do that "all day long". Nor do I really care one bit whether benchrest or group shooting isn't popular here. For me it's just like making that one killer drive down the center of the fairway; a single ragged hole in the target makes it all worth it. I'm sure I'm not alone in that feeling.

 

[Aimsmall55]

Yes, wrapped around the axle. Many try to compare their "X" guaranteed rifle against the "Y" guaranteed rifle and it's all a joke. If anyone could shoot the difference at distance there would be a new WR but they can't because of this little thing called "wind".

Old thread but I was just reading and came across " wind ". I have to say that that your absolutely correct. Here's 4 at 890 yards. 6.5 creedmor , 140 vld, GAP. 7 to 8 mph winds from 9 o'clock. To put it in perspective , it was switching so much that I held just shy of a mil further left AFTER the scope was dialed in "per say" on windage. Last shot was a result of KNOWING how the wind works.



.308 GAP CRUSADER. 208 AMAX , Lapua brass , varget. 2460 fps. 425 yards.


I WAS SHOCKED!! Especially considering it was a 23" bbl with a 1:11.25 twist. I didn't think it would stabilize it that well. After that I shot a 5 shot group at 525 yards that was just a smudge bigger but = to in moa